As England Turns...

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Socio

Golden Member
May 19, 2002
1,732
2
81
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Yeah, England is definently going to hell, we really should build concentration camps and take your advice about 'dem dere musulims wit their nukular weapons centrifuges.

The day you get to lecture me about letting muslims take over is the day you roll back the fucking Iraq war (that had nothing to do with terrorism, WMD's or Muslims) and step back to Afghanistan, before that you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.

Here I am going to help you with that veil of denial, this is an 8 part video with 6 to 8 minute segments, it is very educational and very informative. You get a nice history of Islam and Europe and a good explanation as to why ?England is definitely going to hell? so to speak and not just them either today.

If it does not give you pause you are either Muslim or just not paying attention.

Jihad in Europe:
part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9SI_yEkwr4
part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcZDH-HHUaw
part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ztk7eyBfiE
part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRo2o2Qk3HE
part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL32JIZu5DM
part 6: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg5-DLd8yac
part 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBezZEmIS34
part 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1pjPeiL_7U

 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Yeah, England is definently going to hell, we really should build concentration camps and take your advice about 'dem dere musulims wit their nukular weapons centrifuges.

The day you get to lecture me about letting muslims take over is the day you roll back the fucking Iraq war (that had nothing to do with terrorism, WMD's or Muslims) and step back to Afghanistan, before that you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.

Here I am going to help you with that veil of denial, this is an 8 part video with 6 to 8 minute segments, it is very educational and very informative. You get a nice history of Islam and Europe and a good explanation as to why ?England is definitely going to hell? so to speak and not just them either today.

If it does not give you pause you are either Muslim or just not paying attention.

Jihad in Europe:
part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9SI_yEkwr4
part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcZDH-HHUaw
part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ztk7eyBfiE
part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRo2o2Qk3HE
part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL32JIZu5DM
part 6: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg5-DLd8yac
part 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBezZEmIS34
part 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1pjPeiL_7U

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists, not the pretend to be terrorists that the US invaded Iraq over, that is why i'm posting this at all.

And i'm trough a link so slow that watching any of that would be frame by frame by 20 seconds, IOW, i can't.

I thought i gave you a FUCKING clue about the US needing to get back into Afghanistan but obviously you didn' t even get that.
 

yours truly

Golden Member
Aug 19, 2006
1,026
1
81
when did a muslim ever hurt any of you xenophobes?

back to the original post, there about 5 regular churchgoers in england! haha thats a joke, but seriously, uk church going numbers are dwindling to nothing, theyre empty.

england is a very cosmopolitan nation. there are synagoges, gurdawaras, mosques, churches, temples, etc everywhere here.

we're a very tolerant and liberal nation..
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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Besides, it's not like i've not seen worse, i've seen the vids of christian kids screaming bloody murder to the infidels in some movies on youtube.

See i don't give a flying FUCK what Muslims want and i don't give a flying FUCK what Christians want, i really couldn't care less, our laws has the same basis as yours and it's NOT like they will change.

And it really doesn't matter how much propaganda you put forth, the laws just don't change.

Did you know that Britian has a problem with honor killings and wife cuttings, 100% of all of the 16 cases or honor killings are Indians, Hindu Indians, it has to do with culture, 100% of the wife cuttings (an indian tradition) are made by Indians, Hindu Indians.

If you'd ask me which religion we really have a problem with today, which religion doesn't give a fuck about our law, it would be Hinduism.

But to take the time to understand such a thing you'd have to think and read and that is clearly beyond your capacity.

BTW, Europe != GB any more than America = US, this should be obvious.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
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Originally posted by: hopeless74
when did a muslim ever hurt any of you xenophobes?

back to the original post, there about 5 regular churchgoers in england! haha thats a joke, but seriously, uk church going numbers are dwindling to nothing, theyre empty.

england is a very cosmopolitan nation. there are synagoges, gurdawaras, mosques, churches, temples, etc everywhere here.

we're a very tolerant and liberal nation..

Well, they shoot at me and i don't blame Muslims living in the US and England for it, it must be some... well i don't know.

And you are right about England, in fact if you want to see where the world comes together, go to London.
 

yours truly

Golden Member
Aug 19, 2006
1,026
1
81
yea i love london, born and raised. fantastic city. lots of people hate it..

get ur arse back to england in one piece john.

thanks
 

superstition

Platinum Member
Feb 2, 2008
2,219
221
101
See i don't give a flying FUCK what Muslims want and i don't give a flying FUCK what Christians want

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists

I thought i gave you a FUCKING clue about
You're starting to sound like a cartoon. Please tone down the rhetoric and stick to making clean points.
We're a daft bunch, we believe in shit like

You know where we got that from? From what the USA used to stand for? No, not really, you have never embraced freedom unless

you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.
Again.
 

DarkThinker

Platinum Member
Mar 17, 2007
2,822
0
0
Originally posted by: Socio
...
Jihad <<has been used as acts of jihad terrorism,

Has been used....same as in "the US presidency has been used to curb people's freedoms....)

such as the Madrid bombings, or the London bombings, the Towers in New York and I believe the Islam?s foundational texts also sanction acts of jihad martyrdom, i.e

Martyrdom as in you go fight for your country and land then die while doing your duty? What or who doesn't sanction it? Or did you mean going to a place full of civilians with barely any of them carrying a weapon and then killing them all? That I would like you to go find me a verse in the Quran where God commands Muslims to kill civilians that do no harm to them. Show me please...

. suicide bombers which kill untold innocents and whom are held in the highest esteem for doing so.

By whom? By Muslims who are suffering atrocities from the other side? Of course they do, they saw enough to go crazy.

It is also used in the persecution of infidels and non believers even justifying genocides.

If anyone was in a position to commit genocides in history, then it was the Muslims....show me were are those places in the world were Muslims committed genocides upon helpless civilians.

It also makes it very clear as to why there are no ?moderate? Muslims and very few Muslims ever speak out against such atrocities because all Jihad even the most heinous is an obligatory duty in Islam on every Muslim.

You are ridiculous sir..I have explained to you what it means....you just took that definition and ran with it to make your own version....maybe, just maybe the rest of the Muslims feel they have no obligation to do anything?? Tell me, tell me what you have done about the atrocities that the Bush administration has inflicted upon the Iraqi people? SQUAT...why should an Iraqi for instance rise to your defense...?

1000+ civilians killed, thousands others lost jobs and got injured and disabled....all thanks to us and our "Ally"....do you expect one of those guys that lost their houses, families and friends to stand up and defend those who attack the cause of it? Why should he? Who came to his defense?
[/quote]

Also from what I understand Muslims are allowed to hide their true beliefs in 2 situations:

A-In case of fearing persecution
B-In case of gaining something for Islam

Something to remember when dealing with Muslims and trying to determine if they are really peaceful or using A, or B, or both.

So? If some bearded guy twice your size with a turban on his head came out of no where in the middle of the night and put a sword about a meter long to your neck and said
"I will kill every non-Muslim I run into...are you a heathen?"
I bet all I have, after you get done pissing your pants....you would be reciting the first verse of the Quran in no time just to live to see another day.

And I'll tell you something else to remember for the rest of your life:
69Now Peter was sitting out in the courtyard, and a servant girl came to him. "You also were with Jesus of Galilee," she said.

70But he denied it before them all. "I don't know what you're talking about," he said.

71Then he went out to the gateway, where another girl saw him and said to the people there, "This fellow was with Jesus of Nazareth."

72He denied it again, with an oath: "I don't know the man!"

73After a little while, those standing there went up to Peter and said, "Surely you are one of them, for your accent gives you away."

74Then he began to call down curses on himself and he swore to them, "I don't know the man!"

That's Peter himself, Saint Peter for the Christians here,....is he considered as some kind of untrustworthy hypocrite for trying to save his own life when he couldn't do a thing about Jesus himself? I wonder...

A definition I agree with for Jihad

Islam Suicide Bombings

* Suicide is forbidden. "O ye who believe!...
[do not] kill yourselves, for truly Allah has been to you Most Merciful. If any do that in rancour and injustice, soon shall We cast him into the Fire..." (Qur'an 4:29-30).
* The taking of life is allowed only by way of justice (i.e. the death penalty for murder), but even then, forgiveness is better. "Nor take life - which Allah has made sacred - except for just cause..." (17:33).
* In pre-Islamic Arabia, retaliation and mass murder was commonplace. If someone was killed, the victim's tribe would retaliate against the murderer's entire tribe. This practice was directly forbidden in the Qur'an (2:178-179). Following this statement of law, the Qur'an says, "After this, whoever exceeds the limits shall be in grave chastisement" (2:178). No matter what wrong we perceive as being done against us, we may not lash out against an entire population of people.
* The Qur'an admonishes those who oppress others and transgress beyond the bounds of what is right and just. "The blame is only against those who oppress men with wrongdoing and insolently transgress beyond bounds through the land, defying right and justice. For such there will be a chastisement grievous (in the Hereafter)" (42:42).
* Harming innocent bystanders, even in times of war, was forbidden by the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). This includes women, children, noncombatant bystanders, and even trees and crops. Nothing is to be harmed unless the person or thing is actively engaged in an assault against Muslims.


 

Jaskalas

Lifer
Jun 23, 2004
35,918
10,250
136
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: superstition
When did this topic become "As America Turns"?

Well, it is about the American crossroads, the suggestion the OP makes is that limiting religious freedom for ONE faith will ensure freedom.

If your concept of religious freedom includes imposing religious law and backing it up with violence then that can go to hell. Violence and imposition ensure the removal of freedom. The removal of that violence and imposition is what ensures freedom.

I'd like to add that I don't care that you're part of the military of a western nation. It is treason to stand up for and defend as "freedom" one religion's right to impose and use violence on a western nation.

*edited
 

yours truly

Golden Member
Aug 19, 2006
1,026
1
81
what exactly do you propose then?

we blow up a few mosques and thin muslims numbers down, ethnic cleansing, genocide.

it takes alot to piss me off, but ur doing a good job.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,805
6,361
126
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: superstition
When did this topic become "As America Turns"?

Well, it is about the American crossroads, the suggestion the OP makes is that limiting religious freedom for ONE faith will ensure freedom.

If your concept of religious freedom includes imposing religious law and backing it up with violence then that can go to hell. Violence and imposition ensure the removal of freedom. The remove of that violence and imposition is what ensures freedom.

I'd like to add that I don't care that you're part of the military of a western nation. It is treason to stand up for and defend as "freedom" one religion's right to impose and use violence on a western nation.

*edited

Repeat after me: Sharia Law only applies to Muslims. Even in Muslim nations, only Muslims are subject to Sharia Laws.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: superstition
When did this topic become "As America Turns"?

Well, it is about the American crossroads, the suggestion the OP makes is that limiting religious freedom for ONE faith will ensure freedom.

If your concept of religious freedom includes imposing religious law and backing it up with violence then that can go to hell. Violence and imposition ensure the removal of freedom. The remove of that violence and imposition is what ensures freedom.

I'd like to add that I don't care that you're part of the military of a western nation. It is treason to stand up for and defend as "freedom" one religion's right to impose and use violence on a western nation.

*edited

Repeat after me: Sharia Law only applies to Muslims. Even in Muslim nations, only Muslims are subject to Sharia Laws.

Man, where the heck did you get that?

I've been to Muslim countries. While Turkey is fairly secular, places like Morroco and Saudia Arabia can be very strict on us non-Muslims. H3ll, I thought I was gonna be killed in Morroco. And if your flying into Saudi Arabia be real careful with any magazines you bring. Don't get caught with booze either.

Fern
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,805
6,361
126
Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: sandorski
Originally posted by: Jaskalas
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: superstition
When did this topic become "As America Turns"?

Well, it is about the American crossroads, the suggestion the OP makes is that limiting religious freedom for ONE faith will ensure freedom.

If your concept of religious freedom includes imposing religious law and backing it up with violence then that can go to hell. Violence and imposition ensure the removal of freedom. The remove of that violence and imposition is what ensures freedom.

I'd like to add that I don't care that you're part of the military of a western nation. It is treason to stand up for and defend as "freedom" one religion's right to impose and use violence on a western nation.

*edited

Repeat after me: Sharia Law only applies to Muslims. Even in Muslim nations, only Muslims are subject to Sharia Laws.

Man, where the heck did you get that?

I've been to Muslim countries. While Turkey is fairly secular, places like Morroco and Saudia Arabia can be very strict on us non-Muslims. H3ll, I thought I was gonna be killed in Morroco. And if your flying into Saudi Arabia be real careful with any magazines you bring. Don't get caught with booze either.

Fern

Sharia Laws are not the whole system of Laws in Muslim countries.
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Originally posted by: sandorski
-snip-
Sharia Laws are not the whole system of Laws in Muslim countries.

No alcohol, no "nudie pics" (really just a People-type magazine with an ad for womens' lingerie), no inappropriate attire for women - these are Sharia law things, no?

Fern
 

Fern

Elite Member
Sep 30, 2003
26,907
174
106
Originally posted by: superstition
See i don't give a flying **** what Muslims want and i don't give a flying FUCK what Christians want

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists

I thought i gave you a ******* clue about
You're starting to sound like a cartoon. Please tone down the rhetoric and stick to making clean points.
We're a daft bunch, we believe in shit like

You know where we got that from? From what the USA used to stand for? No, not really, you have never embraced freedom unless

you can shut the **** up Sinsear.

I changed my ******* view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.
Again.

Looks like somebody shot right passed that stickied thread about "self-moderation" and missed reading it. :p

Fern
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
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Originally posted by: superstition
See i don't give a flying FUCK what Muslims want and i don't give a flying FUCK what Christians want

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists

I thought i gave you a FUCKING clue about
You're starting to sound like a cartoon. Please tone down the rhetoric and stick to making clean points.
We're a daft bunch, we believe in shit like

You know where we got that from? From what the USA used to stand for? No, not really, you have never embraced freedom unless

you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.
Again.

You are cutting and pasting seperate parts of my posts, taking things out of context.

Dishonesty is the worst thing i know.

If you have a problem with me, the mods DO know how to read for themselves so link the thread in a PFI thread or send a PM to the mods but as i have asked others not to, do NOT edit my posts to make it seem like i said something i didn't.
 

Socio

Golden Member
May 19, 2002
1,732
2
81
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Yeah, England is definently going to hell, we really should build concentration camps and take your advice about 'dem dere musulims wit their nukular weapons centrifuges.

The day you get to lecture me about letting muslims take over is the day you roll back the fucking Iraq war (that had nothing to do with terrorism, WMD's or Muslims) and step back to Afghanistan, before that you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.

Here I am going to help you with that veil of denial, this is an 8 part video with 6 to 8 minute segments, it is very educational and very informative. You get a nice history of Islam and Europe and a good explanation as to why ?England is definitely going to hell? so to speak and not just them either today.

If it does not give you pause you are either Muslim or just not paying attention.

Jihad in Europe:
part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9SI_yEkwr4
part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcZDH-HHUaw
part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ztk7eyBfiE
part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRo2o2Qk3HE
part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL32JIZu5DM
part 6: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg5-DLd8yac
part 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBezZEmIS34
part 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1pjPeiL_7U

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists, not the pretend to be terrorists that the US invaded Iraq over, that is why i'm posting this at all.

And i'm trough a link so slow that watching any of that would be frame by frame by 20 seconds, IOW, i can't.

I thought i gave you a FUCKING clue about the US needing to get back into Afghanistan but obviously you didn' t even get that.

I both commend and applaud you for fighting in Afghanistan and hope you stay safe.

I also agree 100% about being in Afghanistan and what we are trying to accomplish there is right and just.

I was just trying to point out that while everyone?s attention is on the Middle East they are flanking us at home.
 

sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,805
6,361
126
Originally posted by: Fern
Originally posted by: sandorski
-snip-
Sharia Laws are not the whole system of Laws in Muslim countries.

No alcohol, no "nudie pics" (really just a People-type magazine with an ad for womens' lingerie), no inappropriate attire for women - these are Sharia law things, no?

Fern

Sharia FAQ

I see I was not entirely accurate. Application of Sharia varies a lot depending on the country. Some countries apply Sharia to all, others only to Muslims.
 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
1,055
0
0
Socio said:

Can?t discredit the logic so try and discredit the poster very imaginative, NOT!

Logic?, what "logic" might that be?...

Assuming that your laundry list of anecdotes, and assorted links, are in fact true - and I won't spend the time searching for all the references, to find out exactly where and how you've manipulated the recap to bolster your delusional argument, - then perhaps you will tell us, for example...

1. If 75% of Muslims in America are willing to go on the record in a poll as having condemned Al Qaeda, how exactly does that justify your Islamophobic delusion that Muslims are taking over America?

2. How does one group of students sanctioned in one university for "desecrating Allah" justify your Islamophobic delusion that Muslims are taking over America?

3. How one British city council banning anything to do with pigs in the workplace justifies your Islamophobic delusion that Muslims are taking over America - or Britain for that matter?

4. How does one Muslim organization in America being an unindicted co-conspirator in one trial justify your Islamophobic delusion that Muslims are taking over America?

5. How does one Muslim trying to establish a training center for Islam in the U.S. justifies your Islamophobic assertion that Muslims are taking over America?

Go ahead, Toss out a few more "ad hominems" and "creeping Islams." Look up a few more Qu'ran quotes, and cherry pick a few more isolated news stories while you're at it.

All the while, it's quite evident to the rest of us that you are simply marinating in your own hatred and fear of Islam.

You've made it clear that your purpose for posting is primarily to express a fear of Islam and Muslims. Fine. You have a phobia, and you're using this forum as a place to express the phobia in its full glory.

Do you really think that a handful of isolated, one-time incidents constitutes "making the case for the "creeping influence of Islam in this country?" You really believe this? Your list is "making the case?" This is actually what you think is a reasonable rationale for your position? Because, geesh, let's admit it - we can find a handful of isolated incidents about anything, group 'em together, and ominously label it a "creeping influence."

Why don't we jump into a debate over the ominous implications of the "creeping influence of Buddhism" or the "creeping influence of Guatemalans." Just like the "evil dangers of electrical tower emanations" are of no concern to those of us not inclined to wear tinfoil hats, your isolated incidents - even when grouped together - don't warrant hysteria and fear in those of us who don't suffer from irrational phobias.

If all your worries, fears, and Islamophobia are justified because of some idiotic thing that a city council did in the UK, plus the homicidal aspirations of isolated criminals, plus the beliefs of a extremely radical yet small minority of Muslims, then you know what - it's truly time to get some help.

In the meantime, get some better examples. Because, if your posts are somehow meant to be instructive, then we can only conclude that the "creeping" infiltrating America is "creeping Islamophobia."

But to me, one really interesting question remains unanswered: what drove you - and those like you - to think this way, to be so irrationally fearful of Islam and Muslims? You have made it clear that his avowed purpose here is as a zealot, warning people about Islam and to "expose" its evils. By nature, this means you are patently unable to discuss facts with any objectivity.
 
Jun 26, 2007
11,925
2
0
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Originally posted by: Socio
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
Yeah, England is definently going to hell, we really should build concentration camps and take your advice about 'dem dere musulims wit their nukular weapons centrifuges.

The day you get to lecture me about letting muslims take over is the day you roll back the fucking Iraq war (that had nothing to do with terrorism, WMD's or Muslims) and step back to Afghanistan, before that you can shut the FUCK up Sinsear.

I changed my fucking view the last few days, get the fuck out of Iraq and GET BACK ON THE WOT that the rest of the fucking civilised world is fighting, you know, THE ONE YOU STARTED.

Here I am going to help you with that veil of denial, this is an 8 part video with 6 to 8 minute segments, it is very educational and very informative. You get a nice history of Islam and Europe and a good explanation as to why ?England is definitely going to hell? so to speak and not just them either today.

If it does not give you pause you are either Muslim or just not paying attention.

Jihad in Europe:
part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9SI_yEkwr4
part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WcZDH-HHUaw
part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Ztk7eyBfiE
part 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRo2o2Qk3HE
part 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LL32JIZu5DM
part 6: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vg5-DLd8yac
part 7: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBezZEmIS34
part 8: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1pjPeiL_7U

Son, i am in Afghanistan, i am fighting REAL terrorists, not the pretend to be terrorists that the US invaded Iraq over, that is why i'm posting this at all.

And i'm trough a link so slow that watching any of that would be frame by frame by 20 seconds, IOW, i can't.

I thought i gave you a FUCKING clue about the US needing to get back into Afghanistan but obviously you didn' t even get that.

I both commend and applaud you for fighting in Afghanistan and hope you stay safe.

I also agree 100% about being in Afghanistan and what we are trying to accomplish there is right and just.

I was just trying to point out that while everyone?s attention is on the Middle East they are flanking us at home.

Son, limiting their freedoms, restricting their rights? We're not Nazis are we?

Integration means they can keep their own identity, religion and culture while knowing fully well that the law in England is UK law, setting up separate courts is a private thing, i know the JHW got a lot of flack for telling children to just forgive their parents when they were raped and these courts are still there in the US.

To me, it's not interesting what they may say in sharia courts, but unlike the US does with JHW courts, admissions will be taped there and they WILL be tried under the rule of law if it is broken.

IOW, these types of courts are just a tradtion, like kissing under the mistletoe, they have nothing to do with the UK law which is steadfast, it's not as easy for us to change laws as it is for you even, yet people worry that our laws will change, while we have a lesser percentage of Muslims than the US where the laws can be changed fairly easily.

Islam is just a religion, it doesn't and as all other religion, it will never have a basis in law, remember that it wast the UK Whigs who founded the laws of freedom of expression, freedom of speech, rights as a human and responsibilities as a human, the conservatives didn't like it much, they just wanted to decide over people and afaik they still do, they want to decide about what lovers can be married, about every females own body and so on, and there are people SUPPORTING them, there are actually people supporting the government taking away the right to love and the right of womens bodies?

Thank god our conservatives don't think so, they are just for less spending and less taxes and let people run their won lives.
 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
1,055
0
0
Originally posted by: superstition
Actually, a rational person sees religion as being the pre-science tool for explaining reality. As such, religion is obsolete and those who promote it are either deluded or opportunistic. A rational person sees all religion as a hindrance to education, and thus a danger to humanity. The degree of danger is the issue, not its existence.

However, some rational people may argue that humans have a biological urge for religion and that it's rational to have some measure of irrationality in society in order to keep morale up. "The opiate of the masses." This can be either a benign viewpoint or an exploitive one. In any case, the anguish caused by not having a pre-defined purpose for existence and a way to escape mortality is something people need to deal with honestly, in my opinion. Delusion, no matter how comforting, really isn't a path toward greater happiness.

The nature of religion is that once a religion is established and huge proportions of the population become members of it, the religion becomes extremely malleable. Christianity began as a religion that espoused forgiving ones enemies and turning the other cheek. Obviously we don't have space here for a full historical recount, but xianity was practiced that way for the first 300 or so years.

I've learned that arguing with Xians about the nature of Xianity is pointless. Anyone can find quotes from the bible to support any interpretation they want to make. Anybody who's tried to engage a serious fundamentalist knows this. In watching debates between practitioners of other religions I've come to the conclusion that this is true for them also.

People who want to practice their religion in a particular way will find some scriptural support for their position and ignore any scriptures that run counter to the way they want to practice it. People are great at selective interpretation.

I think that a big part of the problem with Islam and the Muslim world doesn't have to do with Islam itself, but rather with the fact that, by accident of history, Islam has become the defining characteristic of middle eastern culture. It is what differentiates the Middle East from other regions of the world. This fact has made it easier for fundamentalism, and its creeping drive for theocracy, to take root there. The success of the Enlightenment as a philosophical movement in the west rescued "Christendom" from a similar situation, and created the modern western world that we know today. I remain hopeful that Muslim interaction with the West, and their exposure to western ideas and ways of life, can have a similar impact on the "Muslim World."


 
Jun 26, 2007
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BMW.

Just shut the FUCK up, you didn't get anything right, unless your intention was to prove yourself entirely clueless.
 

BMW540I6speed

Golden Member
Aug 26, 2005
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Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
BMW.

Just shut the FUCK up, you didn't get anything right, unless your intention was to prove yourself entirely clueless.

Heh..How "cute", an internet forum "tough guy". Well, have at it Sparky, the stage is all yours...

 
Jun 26, 2007
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Originally posted by: BMW540I6speed
Originally posted by: JohnOfSheffield
BMW.

Just shut the FUCK up, you didn't get anything right, unless your intention was to prove yourself entirely clueless.

Heh..How "cute", an internet forum "tough guy". Well, have at it Sparky, the stage is all yours...

No, son, i'm an Afghanistan tough guy, but that doesn't help you at all, stop your stupid rambling and provide a fucking proven point and let's lay this to rest.

Ah, you have nothing, well, that was what i fucking said wasn't it you git.
 
Jun 26, 2007
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To prove the point: "I think that a big part of the problem with Islam and the Muslim world doesn't have to do with Islam itself, but rather with the fact that, by accident of history, Islam has become the defining characteristic of middle eastern culture. It is what differentiates the Middle East from other regions of the world."

I don't expect you to get this, but if you do, then don't reply, because i'm getting tired of you, the ME, you mean where the Jews live, where the Christ was born, dead and reborn? Clearly unholy land, right.

You are all like kids who don't want to share, and THAT is the ONLY problem there is in the area.