Are we there yet? Anybody still in doubt that a Trump Presidency is a national disaster?

[TheVrolok]

President Trump feels your pain. Quit voting if you think it is so unfair.

Quite an insightful post. Really demonstrates your critical thinking ability.

 

[SMOGZINN]

I thought that was Obama hate? Maybe in your mind it's anybody that hates a Democrat, but doesn't extend to the people that hate Republicans? Hypocrisy much?

It is hate in general that clouds the mind and precludes rational thought. I don't hate republicans. I don't hate Trump. I just think he is not suited to leading a country. I think he does not have the temperament for diplomacy, the strength character for military command, or enough altruism to put his country before his personal gain.

 

[buckshot24]

Quite an insightful post. Really demonstrates your critical thinking ability.

You liked that? Big states can't override the rest of the country for a reason and nobody was going for the most national votes so it really is a meaningless metric. Trump won the voters that both candidates were trying to convince.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

It is hate in general that clouds the mind and precludes rational thought. I don't hate republicans. I don't hate Trump. I just think he is not suited to leading a country. I think he does not have the temperament for diplomacy, the strength character for military command, or enough altruism to put his country before his personal gain.

Good point, too bad so many on the left in here can't follow your lead.

 

[TheVrolok]

You liked that? Big states can't override the rest of the country for a reason and nobody was going for the most national votes so it really is a meaningless metric. Trump won the voters that both candidates were trying to convince.

What is the reason?

 

[buckshot24]

What is the reason?

For what?

 

[TheVrolok]

For what?

You mentioned "a reason."

 

[buckshot24]

You mentioned "a reason."

Oh, I did. The reason is so a less diverse large state can't override the rest of the country. Which is what would have happened in this cycle.

 

[thraashman]

You liked that? Big states can't override the rest of the country for a reason and nobody was going for the most national votes so it really is a meaningless metric. Trump won the voters that both candidates were trying to convince.

If we broke up California into individual states with a population the size of Wyoming (the state with the highest electors to population ration), and then gave each of the new California states the 3 electors that Wyoming has, it would account for 198 electors instead of the 55 it now does. People in California don't vote for a specific President simply because they live in California. People are individuals. The PEOPLE chose Hillary, the system chose Trump. People aren't voting for the President of just their state, that's called a governor. The idea that in a national vote that someone from a small population state gets their vote counted higher is just insane. If a person got to vote twice and get them both counted you'd scream to the high heavens about voter fraud. Well someone in Wyoming's vote is effectively counted more than 3 times more than someone in California. The 13 least populated states that Trump won are Wyoming, North Dakota, Alaska, South Dakota, Montana, Nebraska, West Virginia, Idaho, Utah, Kansas, Arkansas, Mississippi, Iowa. They combine for 59 electors, 4 more than California. California has 13 million more people than those 13 combined states. That'd be like if instead of having an electoral college we let some people vote multiple times but we let people in those 13 states vote 3 times but only let people in Cali vote twice. It's a fucking stupid system.


Edit: If anyone wants to answer a better question, help me figure out how I got roped in to arguing with the stupidest member of ATP&N...

 

[Moonbeam]

Yep. I was honestly naive about the portion of Americans who either believe all the "fake news" or just don't care. I'm dismayed.

There is actually something that might strike you as even more amazing than that, at least if you could take it in, and that is that what I have been here since 1999 explaining to be the source of this madness you're so surprised just captured the Presidency. And there seems to be almost nobody, even now, who sees it, a fact, however, I am loathe to admit, must remain entirely inevitable. And that fact is that the madness we see out there isn't what needs to be beaten back because the actual source of that madness is within each of us and it's name is self hate. It is only that source of the madness that we have any chance to cure. So we fix nothing because we fear to face the real issue, that we and not the 'other' is the problem.

As the ship sinks lower and lower into the water perhaps some will wake up. It only requires that we die to the ego.

It is so obviously simple. Beauty and ugliness are in the eye of the beholder. That simply means that the beauty or ugliness we see is within your own eyes. We are our own eyes so we are what we see. When we demonize the other we project out there the hate we have for ourselves. So simple, so obvious, and yet we will not see it for what it is. It is our hatred of our own lives that gives us wonders like Trump.

 

[TheVrolok]

Oh, I did. The reason is so a less diverse large state can't override the rest of the country. Which is what would have happened in this cycle.

Well let's clarify things.. Large? I assume you mean by population and not land mass as there are plenty of large sized states that hardly have a diverse population. Now what exactly do you mean diverse? I'm guessing you mean by party registration, because certainly California is significantly more diverse culturally, ethically, etc than any number of the "Middle US" white Christian states.

So what you're really saying is that you're just glad the liberals were grouped together in the same state and the electoral college mitigates the popular number in this case. Which is fine, just be up front about what you mean.

 

[buckshot24]

If we broke up California into individual states with a population the size of Wyoming (the state with the highest electors to population ration), and then gave each of the new California states the 3 electors that Wyoming has, it would account for 198 electors instead of the 55 it now does. People in California don't vote for a specific President simply because they live in California. People are individuals. The PEOPLE chose Hillary, the system chose Trump. People aren't voting for the President of just their state, that's called a governor. The idea that in a national vote that someone from a small population state gets their vote counted higher is just insane. If a person got to vote twice and get them both counted you'd scream to the high heavens about voter fraud. Well someone in Wyoming's vote is effectively counted more than 3 times more than someone in California. The 13 least populated states that Trump won are Wyoming, North Dakota, Alaska, South Dakota, Montana, Nebraska, West Virginia, Idaho, Utah, Kansas, Arkansas, Mississippi, Iowa. They combine for 59 electors, 4 more than California. California has 13 million more people than those 13 combined states. That'd be like if instead of having an electoral college we let some people vote multiple times but we let people in those 13 states vote 3 times but only let people in Cali vote twice. It's a fucking stupid system.

That's the way it is because that is the way the founders set it up. We are a collection of states that elect the president, the people have never voted directly for president. I suggest you get used to it because it isn't changing any time soon. Wondering, what other power of the states are you wanting to remove?

 

[buckshot24]

Well let's clarify things.. Large? I assume you mean by population and not land mass as there are plenty of large sized states that hardly have a diverse population. Now what exactly do you mean diverse? I'm guessing you mean by party registration, because certainly California is significantly more diverse culturally, ethically, etc than any number of the "Middle US" white Christian states.

So what you're really saying is that you're just glad the liberals were grouped together in the same state and the electoral college mitigates the popular number in this case. Which is fine, just be up front about what you mean.

To be honest, I'm electoral college argued out. Maybe another time.

 

[Moonbeam]

To be honest, I'm electoral college argued out. Maybe another time.

Translated this means that buckshot has has playing out the joke he dishonestly calls an argument to the point it's no longert offering sufficient ego reward for the effort.

 

[buckshot24]

Translated this means that buckshot has has playing out the joke he dishonestly calls an argument to the point it's no longert offering sufficient ego reward for the effort.

No, it means I'm tired of arguing for the EC.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

Translated this means that buckshot has has playing out the joke he dishonestly calls an argument to the point it's no longert offering sufficient ego reward for the effort.

Since we're on the subject of honesty, just what prompted you to make such a comment pray tell?

 

[Jhhnn]

Oh, I did. The reason is so a less diverse large state can't override the rest of the country. Which is what would have happened in this cycle.

California is probably our most diverse state by any metric you could name.

 

[werepossum]

Just to nit pick a bit but Hillary got nearly as many votes as did Obama in 2012 and that's not insignificant.

That being said, one could argue that in a few key areas and demographics she was not able to get out the vote but it would be a stretch to say she was a horrible candidate.

Not a horrible candidate? She lost to Donald Trump. Donald Trump! What better definition for horrible candidate could exist?

It is hate in general that clouds the mind and precludes rational thought. I don't hate republicans. I don't hate Trump. I just think he is not suited to leading a country. I think he does not have the temperament for diplomacy, the strength character for military command, or enough altruism to put his country before his personal gain.

Well said. Unfortunately our big two parties decided to put for a turd sandwich and a giant douchebag, and Americans decided that at least a giant douchebag wouldn't be more of the same old shit. And in response, people like myself said "Screw you guys, I'm going home" and voted for the pothead, who at least is a moral person and was an excellent governor.

There is actually something that might strike you as even more amazing than that, at least if you could take it in, and that is that what I have been here since 1999 explaining to be the source of this madness you're so surprised just captured the Presidency. And there seems to be almost nobody, even now, who sees it, a fact, however, I am loathe to admit, must remain entirely inevitable. And that fact is that the madness we see out there isn't what needs to be beaten back because the actual source of that madness is within each of us and it's name is self hate. It is only that source of the madness that we have any chance to cure. So we fix nothing because we fear to face the real issue, that we and not the 'other' is the problem.

As the ship sinks lower and lower into the water perhaps some will wake up. It only requires that we die to the ego.

It is so obviously simple. Beauty and ugliness are in the eye of the beholder. That simply means that the beauty or ugliness we see is within your own eyes. We are our own eyes so we are what we see. When we demonize the other we project out there the hate we have for ourselves. So simple, so obvious, and yet we will not see it for what it is. It is our hatred of our own lives that gives us wonders like Trump.

Die to the ego? That's freakin' hilarious from the guy who insists everyone not marching in lockstep with him is insane. Dude, you have THE ego on these boards.

Perhaps one day you'll at least understand how amusing it is to see you juxtapose "That simply means that the beauty or ugliness we see is within your own eyes" and "When we demonize the other we project out there the hate we have for ourselves" with your complete meltdown over Trump's election.

 

[dainthomas]

California is probably our most diverse state by any metric you could name.

Republicans use California to trigger their mouth-breathing base. Even though, as you pointed out, it's one of the most culturally diverse states. As well as economically successful. But they always leave that part out when they're droning on about evil librul policies like letting the gays marry.

 

[Jhhnn]

Not a horrible candidate? She lost to Donald Trump. Donald Trump! What better definition for horrible candidate could exist?

She was a successfully maligned candidate. Repubs have been honing their skills since Jimmy Carter.

 

[nakedfrog]

Translated this means that buckshot has has playing out the joke he dishonestly calls an argument to the point it's no longert offering sufficient ego reward for the effort.

You say that like he does this often!

 

[Moonbeam]

Since we're on the subject of honesty, just what prompted you to make such a comment pray tell?

I placed a bet with myself that I could rekindle his interest. Now in his state of exhaustion he has told us twice how tired he is. I did so because I was honestly certain he wasn't honestly tired.

I think that were he honest he would say, "I enter threads taking a turn I don't like so I begin to bray like a donkey, becoming thereby, as braying donkeys are wont to do, the center of attention. The threads here are littered with his donkey shit. But that's just my 'honest' opinion.

 

[Moonbeam]

You say that like he does this often!

In the post following yours before I even read yours.

 

[buckshot24]

I placed a bet with myself that I could rekindle his interest. Now in his state of exhaustion he has told us twice how tired he is. I did so because I was honestly certain he wasn't honestly tired.

I think that were he honest he would say, "I enter threads taking a turn I don't like so I begin to bray like a donkey, becoming thereby, as braying donkeys are wont to do, the center of attention. The threads here are littered with his donkey shit. But that's just my 'honest' opinion.

If you were honest you would admit to eating paint chips.

 

[TastesLikeChicken]

Bill and Obama have once in a lifetime political charisma levels; pretty much nobody else even comes close.

The reality is Hillary got more than enough votes. The election basically hinged on a peculiarity of the electoral college which played to the strength of Trump in riling up low edu white race resentment. That's an inescapable reality of the data for all who can understand the world quantitatively.

And the Democrats, in their arrogance, forgot to include those "low edu" voters in their planning while Trump didn't?

So who is the smart one there?

btw, the Dems typically pull in the "low edu" votes from the inner city voters. I bet you don't look down your pointy nose at those voters, do you, which shows what a schmuck you are.