Anyone watch the Obamacare Infomercial on ABC?

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: coloumb

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Whooo, so instead of an insurance company telling me I cant have something done, the government gets to tell me me I cant have something done.

And, if you don't like your insurance company, you can switch. If it's the government, we'll, you're stuck.

Switch from what? Most, if not all, insurance companies are in for profit - not to cure your ills - but to make sure you stay sick so they can reap the benefits and watch you die a slow and painful death.

How about Insurance companies concentrate on PREVENTATIVE health care instead?

Am I just missing something about UHC that I've not seen how it works in other countries? Walk in, give them your name and info, receive the care you NEED [rather than the care limited by what insurance pays or what you can afford], and leave the hospital a little bit healthier.

My Canadian friends can't fucking believe the crap we go through just to get "healthy" if we're sick.

Woah, let's take a step off of the crazy train for a minute.

Of course insurance companies are for profit. You can switch to company B if company A isn't meeting your needs. And the profits of company A will go down, requiring them to provide better service to stay competitive and profitable. You won't get competitive pricing/care from the government.

As far as companies wanting you to stay sick, are you serious? The more you go to the hospital, the more it costs them. They want you to be healthy and pay your premiums, period.

Health insurance should be used like car insurance: when something serious and very expensive happens, they help you pay for it. Preventative care, like yearly physicals is up to you.

If the above were true, then explain the existence of UPMC.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: ChunkiMunki
would this be mandatory insurance? Even if it was dirt-cheap I'm sure some folks not paying for insurance now would continue to do so, then if disaster struck, buy a government policy, get an operation or whatnot, then dump the insurance, since there wouldn't be a pre-existing condition clause.

This also gives pause about the new gigantic government program to administer it. If this is TRULY a massive need and a high priority, maybe we should gut our defense spending in half to pay for UHC. If we cannot part with the defense dollar then it truly is not needed that badly.

Defense is in the constitution, health insurance is not. BIG difference.

Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Its the 1st word in probably the most important concept in American politics.

 

[SammyJr]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Whooo, so instead of an insurance company telling me I cant have something done, the government gets to tell me me I cant have something done.

And, if you don't like your insurance company, you can switch. If it's the government, we'll, you're stuck.

Wrong. If the Government is causing you problems, you have your State and Federal Representatives/Senators to call upon. And you can vote them out.

You can't be serious either? So if you're sick you have to wait 2+ years for the next election cycle. No wonder you guys support this crap, you want people to wait forever to receive the care they need.

YOU ARE FREE TO GET YOUR OWN HEALTH INSURANCE TODAY, whatever you want. YOU ARE FREE TO CHANGE AT ANY TIME, whatever you want.

What part of "denied for preexisting conditions" don't you understand?

And do you see old folks or vets dying in the streets because Medicare or the VA refused to treat them?

 

[FerrelGeek]

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: FerrelGeek

Originally posted by: coloumb

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Whooo, so instead of an insurance company telling me I cant have something done, the government gets to tell me me I cant have something done.

And, if you don't like your insurance company, you can switch. If it's the government, we'll, you're stuck.

Switch from what? Most, if not all, insurance companies are in for profit - not to cure your ills - but to make sure you stay sick so they can reap the benefits and watch you die a slow and painful death.

How about Insurance companies concentrate on PREVENTATIVE health care instead?

Am I just missing something about UHC that I've not seen how it works in other countries? Walk in, give them your name and info, receive the care you NEED [rather than the care limited by what insurance pays or what you can afford], and leave the hospital a little bit healthier.

My Canadian friends can't fucking believe the crap we go through just to get "healthy" if we're sick.

My wife's cousin, the Canadian Dr., says their heath system sucks.

My friend, the Canadian, was peeing blood for months before he could finally get to a Dr.; then ahd to wait longer for the tests so the doc could tell whether or not he had cancer or some other illness. The precious Canadian plan of which you laud is nowhere near the great panacea you dream it to be.

ABC is a pathetic shill for Obama. Whatever happened to equal time? To allowing for a dissenting POV? Is it now a sin to question the .gov? Whatever. Just wait until you get what you want. When your precious mommies turn 80 and get sick, the new order will tell her she's too old to bother with - too expensive. So sorry. Bye mommy.

What happens now if someone is in the hospital and their insurance says no? Its a difficult questions so I'm sure you won't answer it, or maybe you ask one of those make-believe doctors in your little story for help. Here is a hint: they die. You see, if you can't afford a lot of treatments now, you will die, and you might even die bankrupt and your surviving family footing the bill.

If you go to the ER in a US hospital, they won't throw you in the street if you don't have insurance, just ask your average illegal Mexican.

And I told you that my story was genuine. If you don't have the wherewithal to believe it, that's not my problem. Obviously, your're the one who doesn't want to acknowledge something that's inconvenient. Typical of liberals.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: FerrelGeek

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: FerrelGeek

Originally posted by: coloumb

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Whooo, so instead of an insurance company telling me I cant have something done, the government gets to tell me me I cant have something done.

And, if you don't like your insurance company, you can switch. If it's the government, we'll, you're stuck.

Switch from what? Most, if not all, insurance companies are in for profit - not to cure your ills - but to make sure you stay sick so they can reap the benefits and watch you die a slow and painful death.

How about Insurance companies concentrate on PREVENTATIVE health care instead?

Am I just missing something about UHC that I've not seen how it works in other countries? Walk in, give them your name and info, receive the care you NEED [rather than the care limited by what insurance pays or what you can afford], and leave the hospital a little bit healthier.

My Canadian friends can't fucking believe the crap we go through just to get "healthy" if we're sick.

My wife's cousin, the Canadian Dr., says their heath system sucks.

My friend, the Canadian, was peeing blood for months before he could finally get to a Dr.; then ahd to wait longer for the tests so the doc could tell whether or not he had cancer or some other illness. The precious Canadian plan of which you laud is nowhere near the great panacea you dream it to be.

ABC is a pathetic shill for Obama. Whatever happened to equal time? To allowing for a dissenting POV? Is it now a sin to question the .gov? Whatever. Just wait until you get what you want. When your precious mommies turn 80 and get sick, the new order will tell her she's too old to bother with - too expensive. So sorry. Bye mommy.

What happens now if someone is in the hospital and their insurance says no? Its a difficult questions so I'm sure you won't answer it, or maybe you ask one of those make-believe doctors in your little story for help. Here is a hint: they die. You see, if you can't afford a lot of treatments now, you will die, and you might even die bankrupt and your surviving family footing the bill.

If you go to the ER in a US hospital, they won't throw you in the street if you don't have insurance, just ask your average illegal Mexican.

And I told you that my story was genuine. If you don't have the wherewithal to believe it, that's not my problem. Obviously, your're the one who doesn't want to acknowledge something that's inconvenient. Typical of liberals.

WWYBYWB?

To tell you again...

"I'll rephrase, are you aware they have emergency rooms? Do you know that if you go in and tell them you are pissing blood they will see you, run tests, and treat you?"

Your friend was not pissing blood for two months waiting to be treated, or he also has a mental retardation problem that probably requires him to have a care specialist he should look into.

 

[ZeGermans]

Originally posted by: Budmantom

Obama and plenty of leftists are willing to let sick Americans rot in the streets waiting in lines for health care.

This doesn't happen. Now people forced to go into bankruptcy so they don't die... that's a different story.

 

[TruePaige]

Originally posted by: ZeGermans

Originally posted by: Budmantom

Obama and plenty of leftists are willing to let sick Americans rot in the streets waiting in lines for health care.

This doesn't happen. Now people forced to go into bankruptcy so they don't die... that's a different story.

Or dying far too early / getting far too sick because of no preventative care at all...

 

[bob4432]

Do you know how much tests/administration of care/hospital stay/ drugs cost?

my last surgery was neurosurgery - tumor inside spinal canal

6 1/2hrs in surgery
2 days in neuro icu
5 days in reg neuro room
all the mris/test/admin leading up to the surgery and after test/follow ups

overall cost from the misc docs/hospitals = ~$75K

don't really know what the insurance paid as these were the full bills everybody sent to me but said do not remit payment, insurance paid it. i probably put out ~$2K not including a lifetime of meds and nerve issues that you just deal w/

this is only 1 of my issues, i know my insurance hates me as i spend out of pocket ~$1K/mo for meds and insurance premiums. i am sure they would rather me just die, don't think a uhc would keep me going as i would be considered a drain on the economy....

 

[Carmen813]

Originally posted by: bob4432

Do you know how much tests/administration of care/hospital stay/ drugs cost?

my last surgery was neurosurgery - tumor inside spinal canal

6 1/2hrs in surgery
2 days in neuro icu
5 days in reg neuro room
all the mris/test/admin leading up to the surgery and after test/follow ups

overall cost from the misc docs/hospitals = ~$75K

don't really know what the insurance paid as these were the full bills everybody sent to me but said do not remit payment, insurance paid it. i probably put out ~$2K not including a lifetime of meds and nerve issues that you just deal w/

this is only 1 of my issues, i know my insurance hates me as i spend out of pocket ~$1K/mo for meds and insurance premiums. i am sure they would rather me just die, don't think a uhc would keep me going as i would be considered a drain on the economy....

How are you a drain on the economy at all? Your are providing doctors, nurses, medical billing personal, MRI technicians, pharmaceutical companies, and a host of other individuals, such as the janitors who cleaned your room, the technicians who prepped the surgical room, and cooks in the hospital kitchen with a job.

The only one losing out is your insurance company. And if you think about it, they have others working to file your claim and handle all the paperwork.

 

[FerrelGeek]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: FerrelGeek

Originally posted by: CitizenKain

Originally posted by: FerrelGeek

Originally posted by: coloumb

Originally posted by: misle

Originally posted by: Slew Foot
Whooo, so instead of an insurance company telling me I cant have something done, the government gets to tell me me I cant have something done.

And, if you don't like your insurance company, you can switch. If it's the government, we'll, you're stuck.

Switch from what? Most, if not all, insurance companies are in for profit - not to cure your ills - but to make sure you stay sick so they can reap the benefits and watch you die a slow and painful death.

How about Insurance companies concentrate on PREVENTATIVE health care instead?

Am I just missing something about UHC that I've not seen how it works in other countries? Walk in, give them your name and info, receive the care you NEED [rather than the care limited by what insurance pays or what you can afford], and leave the hospital a little bit healthier.

My Canadian friends can't fucking believe the crap we go through just to get "healthy" if we're sick.

My wife's cousin, the Canadian Dr., says their heath system sucks.

My friend, the Canadian, was peeing blood for months before he could finally get to a Dr.; then ahd to wait longer for the tests so the doc could tell whether or not he had cancer or some other illness. The precious Canadian plan of which you laud is nowhere near the great panacea you dream it to be.

ABC is a pathetic shill for Obama. Whatever happened to equal time? To allowing for a dissenting POV? Is it now a sin to question the .gov? Whatever. Just wait until you get what you want. When your precious mommies turn 80 and get sick, the new order will tell her she's too old to bother with - too expensive. So sorry. Bye mommy.

What happens now if someone is in the hospital and their insurance says no? Its a difficult questions so I'm sure you won't answer it, or maybe you ask one of those make-believe doctors in your little story for help. Here is a hint: they die. You see, if you can't afford a lot of treatments now, you will die, and you might even die bankrupt and your surviving family footing the bill.

If you go to the ER in a US hospital, they won't throw you in the street if you don't have insurance, just ask your average illegal Mexican.

And I told you that my story was genuine. If you don't have the wherewithal to believe it, that's not my problem. Obviously, your're the one who doesn't want to acknowledge something that's inconvenient. Typical of liberals.

WWYBYWB?

To tell you again...

"I'll rephrase, are you aware they have emergency rooms? Do you know that if you go in and tell them you are pissing blood they will see you, run tests, and treat you?"

Your friend was not pissing blood for two months waiting to be treated, or he also has a mental retardation problem that probably requires him to have a care specialist he should look into.

Yes, I'm aware and so was my friend; he is by no means stupid. My friend had a doctor that he went to as soon as the doc would see him. It took nearly 2 months before the tests were run. Fortunately, the condition wasn't serious and was easily correctable via surgery. That surgery took a good while to sechedule as well.

 

[xchangx]

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: TruePaige

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: TruePaige
Well until you can figure out how people can get insurance, I will take UHC over Private Care.

I'll rephrase, are you aware they have emergency rooms? Do you know that if you go in and tell them you are pissing blood they will see you, run tests, and treat you?

Funny, that's exactly how it is here in the USA.

In Canada they don't take you to bankruptcy court.

Geez, you can't be that stupid can you? What do you mean take you to bankruptcy court?

As in you get a bill so large you go bankrupt?

Don't insult me because you can't realize that people cannot pay a $20k hospital bill.

I have known a LOT of Canadians. Free drugs + care is good.

Have you ever bought any pills out of pocket?

A 30 pill supply (good for a month or two) of Treximet is $759

A 30 day supply of Provigil is $150

Effexor? 90 pills for $392

These are just three common medications. Except for meds that have been in mass production for ~25 years, drugs here are horrendously overpriced and just force many to suffer in the streets.

Do you know how much tests/administration of care/hospital stay/ drugs cost?

How many pharmaceutical companies research and make drugs in other countries? There is a tremendous cost to that, which I think mostly reflects in the cost of the drug. On top of the drug market being a free market, the prices are usually high when they first come out to recoupe the cost of research and then go down after time. And once the patent runs out another company will make the generic version driving the prices even lower.

As far as hospital stay/costs, hospitals are reimbursed based on diagnosis. So if a patient was admitted for a certain type of sugery, Medicare/Medicaid (not sure which one) says that for that type of surgery a patient stay is 4 days and a hospital is paid for that 4 days. If the patient is there longer then the hospital looses money since they are still only getting paid for the 4 days.

There are also administrative costs and equipment costs. Everything in healthcare is more expensive. At my last hospital we paid ~$30,000 for a 3megapixel 21" monitor. We could get the same monitor from another vendor for ~$5,000 however the system we got required that we buy it from them. The CT scanner cost ~$1,500,000, lab machines are roughly $100,000.

So, yeah... there's a lot of money/costs out there.

Sorry, forgot to add:
If you go through the er, you do not have to give them a real SSN (they have no way to validate either) so if you don't pay, the hospital eats the cost. My last hospital had about $8,000,000 in costs that they ate because of this. However if you do choose to have ethics, then you can setup a payment plan with the hospital. It's not like they expect to have cash up front.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: rudder
Here is a break down of the infomericial....

60% Obama talking

Where is the Republican market based fix rebuttal? When the president gives a state of the union address the opposing party gets rebuttal time now.

ABC would not allow it. There were many requests.

 

[CPA]

Originally posted by: Skitzer
You know, it's getting to the point where I just don't care what they do anymore.
Go ahead, insure the 40 odd million who don't have health care ...... I will even help pay for it (within reason).
All I ask is that they leave "my" health care plan alone.
If they decide to force me into a different, less substantial plan I will raise hell.

so, basically, you don't care until it specifically, personally effects you. That's the kind of attitude that allows the snowball to start rolling. Once it does, it's hard to stop.

 

[HeXploiT]

Originally posted by: Rockinacoustic
Charles Gibson tried hard to make counter arguments, but they we're silly generalizations with no specifics. It was mostly just "But Mr. President, isn't government run health-care bad?" etc...

Lol....I love the way you put that.

 

[SammyJr]

Originally posted by: xchangx
How many pharmaceutical companies research and make drugs in other countries? There is a tremendous cost to that, which I think mostly reflects in the cost of the drug.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...armaceutical_companies

About half the top list is not American and are headquartered in countries with UHC.

http://www.nih.gov/

The NIH funds most basic research in this country, without which, the Pharmaceutical firms would not be able to develop new drugs and treatments. The NIH is funded by the Federal Government. Most NIH research takes place in State run Universities.

Our high health insurance and drug prices aren't paying for anything except for flashy advertisements, lobbyists, and worthless executives. The prices could be a lot lower.

 

[xchangx]

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: xchangx
How many pharmaceutical companies research and make drugs in other countries? There is a tremendous cost to that, which I think mostly reflects in the cost of the drug.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...armaceutical_companies

About half the top list is not American and are headquartered in countries with UHC.

http://www.nih.gov/

The NIH funds most basic research in this country, without which, the Pharmaceutical firms would not be able to develop new drugs and treatments. The NIH is funded by the Federal Government. Most NIH research takes place in State run Universities.

Our high health insurance and drug prices aren't paying for anything except for flashy advertisements, lobbyists, and worthless executives. The prices could be a lot lower.

I wonder if there's ever been a break-down on the cost of a drug, interesting though, didn't know about the NIH.

 

[imported_inspire]

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: xchangx
How many pharmaceutical companies research and make drugs in other countries? There is a tremendous cost to that, which I think mostly reflects in the cost of the drug.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...armaceutical_companies

About half the top list is not American and are headquartered in countries with UHC.

http://www.nih.gov/

The NIH funds most basic research in this country, without which, the Pharmaceutical firms would not be able to develop new drugs and treatments. The NIH is funded by the Federal Government. Most NIH research takes place in State run Universities.

Our high health insurance and drug prices aren't paying for anything except for flashy advertisements, lobbyists, and worthless executives. The prices could be a lot lower.

No, Pharma spend more in pharma R&D than NIH. Nice try though.

 

[SammyJr]

Originally posted by: inspire

Originally posted by: SammyJr

Originally posted by: xchangx
How many pharmaceutical companies research and make drugs in other countries? There is a tremendous cost to that, which I think mostly reflects in the cost of the drug.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L...armaceutical_companies

About half the top list is not American and are headquartered in countries with UHC.

http://www.nih.gov/

The NIH funds most basic research in this country, without which, the Pharmaceutical firms would not be able to develop new drugs and treatments. The NIH is funded by the Federal Government. Most NIH research takes place in State run Universities.

Our high health insurance and drug prices aren't paying for anything except for flashy advertisements, lobbyists, and worthless executives. The prices could be a lot lower.

No, Pharma spend more in pharma R&D than NIH. Nice try though.

I said basic research, not pharma research. Pharmaceutical research builds upon basic biology research. We need to know how things like cancer and Alzheimer's works before you can develop drugs to treat the conditions.

Its not like you can just magically develop something like Viagra or Effexor from scratch.

 

[Shallok]

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: TruePaige


Unless you have a pre-existing condition, then you can choose to die in the streets.

P.S. You know you can't declare bankruptcy all the time right? Hope you only ever have one medical emergency.

Some may even go as far as to say every person who stops UHC in this nation is a murderer. I'll leave it at that.

I agree the pre-existing condition stuff needs to be done away with. But no hospital in the US will deny you care. By law they cannot. If somebody dies in the streets by not getting care as you say it is their own damn fault.

Hospitals can and do refuse care in the US all the time. Go by your local hospital and tell them you need a transplant and you don't have any insurance or any way to pay for it. You can get emergency care, which is great if you have chopped off a finger, not so useful if you are in need of dialysis three times a week or chemo treatments.

The simple reality is that in the US you can and will be denied care. Even people with insurance are denied care all the time as their insurance is not sufficient.

 

[dainthomas]

Originally posted by: Shallok

Originally posted by: spidey07

Originally posted by: TruePaige


Unless you have a pre-existing condition, then you can choose to die in the streets.

P.S. You know you can't declare bankruptcy all the time right? Hope you only ever have one medical emergency.

Some may even go as far as to say every person who stops UHC in this nation is a murderer. I'll leave it at that.

I agree the pre-existing condition stuff needs to be done away with. But no hospital in the US will deny you care. By law they cannot. If somebody dies in the streets by not getting care as you say it is their own damn fault.

Hospitals can and do refuse care in the US all the time. Go by your local hospital and tell them you need a transplant and you don't have any insurance or any way to pay for it. You can get emergency care, which is great if you have chopped off a finger, not so useful if you are in need of dialysis three times a week or chemo treatments.

The simple reality is that in the US you can and will be denied care. Even people with insurance are denied care all the time as their insurance is not sufficient.

I thank god every day that my family has TriCare due to me being medically retired from the Navy. We upgraded to Prime (the same coverage active duty gets) for $125 per quarter. Love it.

And no, the government has never one told me which doctor I had to go see. We just call and let them know ahead of time, just like most plans.

 

[theeedude]

Mandating hospitals to treat people in the ER is a form of government mandated universal health coverage, so if you are using that as an excuse against universal health care, you are contradicting yourself.

 

[theeedude]

BTW, if you think public OPTION is not to your liking, you can switch to a private plan with all the bells and whistles you want.

 

[her209]

I missed it because I thought I had set my DVR to pick it up.

 

[cubeless]

Originally posted by: senseamp
BTW, if you think public OPTION is not to your liking, you can switch to a private plan with all the bells and whistles you want.

and when your doctors are compelled to take gov plan folks in some specified ratio so that they are 'fair' in allocating their services you, too, will get to hang with the locals...

 

[theeedude]

What bill is that requirement in?