anyone gonna git kindle fire?

[ponyo]

I don't buy it, if Google were so excited about this, they'd have relaxed their GAPPS restrictions for massive exposure on this device.

I'm thinking these will be the most popular tablets in short order, and honestly, I expect sales to eclipse the iPad in a year or so.

I think Amazon just killed "Android" tablets...

App development will be for the forked version of Android. Sure they can make them for Google's Android market, but if Google Android tablets continue to sell poorly, why bother? And if these devices kill the Google Android tablets, thats less incentive to develop for it...

Or maybe instead of killing "Android" tablets, it jump starts it instead. iPad has absolutely killed Android tablets with no tablet gaining any traction against it. Maybe Fire is the device that turns the tide and encourages Android tablet adoption over the iPad. Amazon leads and shows how to compete with Apple. Google, HTC, Samsung improve and follow.

 

[jpeyton]

I believe that someone linked to a source that placed the BoM at $180 for the Kindle Fire, but that does not include assembly costs, shipping costs, warehousing costs, and fixed costs such as any money spent developing the device.

Remember that Amazon has an unmatched warehouse/shipping/distribution network. Their costs in that regard will be much lower than the competition. The Fire was largely based off the design of the BB Playbook, so hardware development costs were low. The BoM is less than $180, given than the Fire has no 3G radio, no extraneous ports/card slots, no cameras/mic, 8GB memory, and didn't strive to be the "thinnest" or best in any particular category.

 

[ponyo]

Theoretically it could. And if it does, it's a clear signal to Google that simply selling a "tablet" isn't good enough without rich media services/content behind it. It would also be a signal to Google that Android in its current incarnation works well on phones, but needs a revamped UI to work well on tablets.

Lower prices, more variety, and stronger competition. It's exactly what the tablet market and Android needs right now. The bottom line is that nobody has made a significant dent in the dominance of the iPad, and Amazon is the first company to try a significantly different approach from all other Android tablet makers.

You're on a roll. :thumbsup: You and I are on the same page.

 

[Pliablemoose]

Or maybe instead of killing "Android" tablets, it jump starts it instead. iPad has absolutely killed Android tablets with no tablet gaining any traction against it. Maybe Fire is the device that turns the tide and encourages Android tablet adoption over the iPad. Amazon leads and shows how to compete with Apple. Google, HTC, Samsung improve and follow.

By selling tablets with a profit margin of 5%?

Did any of you take Econ in college?

Amazon just shot the Android tablet market in the head, gangster style.

 

[jpeyton]

The distinction being that if it is a loss leader, then Amazon is going to go bananas when someone tries to hack it.

Amazon is an intelligent company. I think they've conceded the fact that the Fire will be rooted/ROM'ed in short order. They'll lock down the device enough to deter the casual user, but they know that no amount of deterrence will keep their device completely safe from being hacked.

The reality is that a very, very small number of people actually root/ROM their Android devices. XDA Developers has 360,000 active members total, and Android activates 600,000 devices PER DAY.

 

[ponyo]

By selling tablets with a profit margin of 5%?

Did any of you take Econ in college?

Amazon just shot the Android tablet market in the head, gangster style.

You mean like netbooks and PCs? I still see laptops and desktop PC being made. Asus, Acer, Toshiba, Samsung all still made computers last I checked. Samsung still makes appliances.

I've always said any business where you're not losing money is good business.

 

[jpeyton]

By selling tablets with a profit margin of 5%?

Did any of you take Econ in college?

Amazon just shot the Android tablet market in the head, gangster style.

The PC/laptop/netbook market has existed for years on razor thin margins. If there is a profit to be made, someone will make it.

And as of right now, anyone wanting a larger screen, cameras, video/voice-chat, more memory, 3G/4G data, etc. will not be satisfied with the Kindle Fire.

However, if Amazon releases a "Hollywood" 10-inch tablet next year with all of those features for around $299-$349, I think EVERYONE in the hardware game needs to watch out (Apple included). Google can still rest safe while banking millions of extra AdMob impressions daily.

 

[Pliablemoose]

The PC/laptop/netbook market has existed for years on razor thin margins. If there is a profit to be made, someone will make it.

And as of right now, anyone wanting a larger screen, cameras, video/voice-chat, more memory, 3G/4G data, etc. will not be satisfied with the Kindle Fire.

However, if Amazon releases a "Hollywood" 10-inch tablet next year with all of those features for around $299-$349, I think EVERYONE in the hardware game needs to watch out (Apple included). Google can still rest safe while banking millions of extra AdMob impressions daily.

So, if that's all true, why hasn't it worked yet?

Why is the tablet market the iPad market?

 

[jpeyton]

Great article on Amazon, the Fire, and how the company is comfortable with thin-margins and knee-capping it's competition:

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-...-as-service-not-tablet-in-ipad-challenge.html

 

[theeedude]

Amazon has huge advantage in that it can cross subsidize this tablet with media sales and advertising. But I wouldn't rush to call it Android killer. Guess who else can cross subsidize a tablet with media sales and advertising? Google itself.
What it may very well do is put hardware only tablet manufacturers who don't have such cross-subsidy potential on the ropes. They would have to make a profit competing with the razor blade model while only selling the razor itself and have its competitor profit off selling the blades. Unless Google comes up with a way to kick back some of the media and advertising profits back to the device manufacturer, the Google Android tablet ecosystem will narrow itself down to just Google/Motorola itself.

 

[dwell]

Hitler hears about the Kindle Fire

 

[Pliablemoose]

Hitler hears about the Kindle Fire

LOL, that was great, thanks dwell

 

[Pliablemoose]

Amazon has huge advantage in that it can cross subsidize this tablet with media sales and advertising. But I wouldn't rush to call it Android killer. Guess who else can cross subsidize a tablet with media sales and advertising? Google itself.
What it may very well do is put hardware only tablet manufacturers who don't have such cross-subsidy potential on the ropes. They would have to make a profit competing with the razor blade model while only selling the razor itself and have its competitor profit off selling the blades. Unless Google comes up with a way to kick back some of the media and advertising profits back to the device manufacturer, the Google Android tablet ecosystem will narrow itself down to just Google/Motorola itself.

Amazon can subsidize these things with physical goods sales too, Amazon currently sees 20% of all of it's sales made on tablets already, and sees a massive bump in all sales during people's lunch hours...

 

[sciwizam]

Looks fast enough..

http://gizmodo.com/5844742/video-of-the-amazon-kindle-fire-in-action-up-close

 

[poofyhairguy]

Sure they can make them for Google's Android market, but if Google Android tablets continue to sell poorly, why bother?

Because the exact same app they submitted for the Amazon market they can also submit to the Google Market?

Except for a few apps that Amazon seems to be paying the developers to keep exclusive, submitting the same app to both stores increases the possibility of increased revenue with little effort.

In fact this device is WAY better for Google than the Nook Color because the apps are Android native and there isn't different development just for the one device. Unlike Nook's app market, the Amazon Market is targeted to all Android devices. It is the same reason Amazon makes a Kindle app for iPads, while they also sell Kindles and now Fires. Amazon is about making money on content wherever they can.

I don't see Amazon leaving that revenue stream alone...

Why not? Amazon wants to sell content and media. They don't seem to care about ads outside of for their own offerings. Google on the other hand seems to hate the media companies. They seem to barely care about selling apps! It is a match made in heaven.

It seems you have fallen into the Apple Trap that unless you rule your platform with an Iron Fist and milk every dime possible out of it then it is not worth doing!

 

[Mopetar]

I don't buy it, if Google were so excited about this, they'd have relaxed their GAPPS restrictions for massive exposure on this device. . . . I think Amazon just killed "Android" tablets.

Here's an interesting take that makes a case that this has much deeper consequences than Android for Google. Essentially the author argues that the Silk browser allows Amazon to gather the same kind of information that Google wants to gather while denying Google access to that information.

Or maybe instead of killing "Android" tablets, it jump starts it instead. iPad has absolutely killed Android tablets with no tablet gaining any traction against it. Maybe Fire is the device that turns the tide and encourages Android tablet adoption over the iPad. Amazon leads and shows how to compete with Apple. Google, HTC, Samsung improve and follow.

Doubtful. The other manufacturers don't have app stores, music stores, and book stores that allow them to subsidize the cost of their devices. It's also likely that the Fire line will continue to diverge from mainline Android as time goes on, though to what extent this occurs is difficult to predict.

The Fire doesn't use Honeycomb and depending on how locked down Google keeps their source code, it's possible that it never will. Eventually Amazon may be forced to extend their version of the source code in order to implement new features. They may also go the same route as Apple and tune their code for a specific set of hardware.

Remember that Amazon has an unmatched warehouse/shipping/distribution network. Their costs in that regard will be much lower than the competition. The Fire was largely based off the design of the BB Playbook, so hardware development costs were low. The BoM is less than $180, given than the Fire has no 3G radio, no extraneous ports/card slots, no cameras/mic, 8GB memory, and didn't strive to be the "thinnest" or best in any particular category.

It's probably just easier to consider warehousing, shipping, and distribution as a fixed cost as Amazon does so much of it that even if they're not storing or shipping a Kindle Fire, they'd have just sold/stored/shipped something else.

The best estimates I can find for the Playbook BoM are slightly above $200. That makes $180 slightly on the high end in terms of raw materials. 3G radios and baseband chips aren't that expensive. People just think they are because Apple and other companies have been charging an arm and a leg for them. Add in the manufacturing costs and it's probably pretty close to $180.

 

[badb0y]

Hitler hears about the Kindle Fire

LOL

"Samsung's so far up Apple's ass, they could have detected Steve Jobs' pancreatic cancer years ago"

 

[ViRGE]

Amazon is an intelligent company. I think they've conceded the fact that the Fire will be rooted/ROM'ed in short order. They'll lock down the device enough to deter the casual user, but they know that no amount of deterrence will keep their device completely safe from being hacked.

I guess it's also a question of what Amazon expects. If it's a loss leader, will it still be meaningfully open or locked down Apple-style? I think that will determine Amazon's response. It won't impact most people, but an open device is going to make the hardcore geek crowd happy, and that's good PR.

 

[Mopetar]

Amazon has huge advantage in that it can cross subsidize this tablet with media sales and advertising. But I wouldn't rush to call it Android killer. Guess who else can cross subsidize a tablet with media sales and advertising? Google itself.

That's not Google's business model. They're most interested in letting everyone else do the heavy lifting, building the hardware, usually for little profit, while they collect user data to improve their ad targeting. If they go down the route of subsidizing hardware, they'll just annoy their other partners.

On another note, it will be curious to see how long it takes for Apple and Microsoft to go after Amazon, or more curious if they decide not to go after them at all.

 

[Kingbee13]

On another note, it will be curious to see how long it takes for Apple and Microsoft to go after Amazon, or more curious if they decide not to go after them at all.

I think this will put Amazon in the clear, at least from Microsoft

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2010/feb10/02-22msamazonpr.mspx

 

[Fire&Blood]

Let's wait for the Fire to actually hit the market before assuming it either buries Android or skyrockets over the ipad (chances are it won't do either of those things)

It looks like a neat device, personally I would rather get a Touchpad over it, for Android experiments.

 

[theeedude]

That's not Google's business model. They're most interested in letting everyone else do the heavy lifting, building the hardware, usually for little profit, while they collect user data to improve their ad targeting. If they go down the route of subsidizing hardware, they'll just annoy their other partners.

That is their preferred business model. But if that is threatened by Amazon's subsidized hardware, they have the fallback option of subsidizing Motorola hardware with google ads and media sales.

 

[preslove]

So, if that's all true, why hasn't it worked yet?

Why is the tablet market the iPad market?

The cheapest MSRP 10" android tablet is $400, which is put out by a company with poor brand recognition. If Amazon put one out at $300, it would be a whole new ball game.

 

[shortylickens]

Saw it on Amazon the other day. Looks pretty damn sweet for 200 bucks. If its as nice as it seems, this may be my new Android device. I have no doubt there will be rooting instructions on the interwebs very soon.

 

[Dulanic]

This has the possibility of adding to Amazon's bargaining power also. The more digital content they sell and the larger marketshare they have, the larger their bargaining chip is with the creators of said content. While that may not have a specific $ amount value, it is valuable to amazon.