Question Anyone burn out Ryzen CPU's PCI-E lanes?

[VirtualLarry]

Trying to figure out how common that this is. Trying to diagnose whether I need to replace a mobo, or a CPU.

 

[VirtualLarry]

Did you hold down the power button to clear the caps?

Don't higher-end PSUs have bleeder resistors across the primary caps? Surely, they wouldn't have held a charge for 6hr, would they have?

I highly doubt it's the PSU. It's new, it's high-end (more or less), 10yr warranty, EVGA G1+ 80Plus Gold, 650W. Also, neither of the cards were dead, nor the CPU, just the slot. Which leads me to believe, that it was something on the board, maybe a fuse, maybe not, something died, in the power-delivery to the slot. Or, maybe the modular cable died, but I tried swapping PCI-E cables, and that didn't make a difference.

 

[DrMrLordX]

Don't higher-end PSUs have bleeder resistors across the primary caps? Surely, they wouldn't have held a charge for 6hr, would they have?

They should. But you also have to worry about the caps on the motherboard.

 

[VirtualLarry]

I gave it another shot. This time, I un-plugged EVERYTHING, and left the PSU switched ON in back, and then pressed the POWER button on the front of the case several times. Then I let it set for 10 minutes. Then I hooked it all back up. No dice. So, I removed the card that I had in the primary slot, that didn't appear to be powering on, just as a precaution not to damage the card. (Hopefully not.)

So, now I'm looking for a replacement mobo. Newegg has some Refurb MSI B350 Tomahawk ATX boards for $60 or so.

 

[Shmee]

I would go for B450 boards at this point though.

 

[pf100]

PCIE lanes died with my ryzen 5800x and I have to run it at PCIE3x4 on the GPU slot for it to work. I bought a used ryzen 7 5800x last year for $230 when they were going for $350 new. Gaming performance was horrible and much worse than my previous ryzen 5 3600. I was using an x570 motherboard, so it has pcie4 pcie lanes for the gpu. Turns out after a lot of troubleshooting and hair-pulling that the pcie slot for the gpu was running at pcie 1.1 speed. So I set the gpu slot (PCIE_E1) manually to pcie4x16 and it was still at PCIE 1.1. I then set PCIE_E1 to PCIE3x16 and that fixed my performance problems but then I was running at PCIE 3 but whatever. Fast forward a year and I recently bought a 5800x3d and gave the 5800x to a family member. So I put the 5800x in another system with a B450 motherboard which is PCIE 3 and it worked fine as expected. Then after several boots in the normal course of things it all of a sudden wouldn't show a screen. So I put the gpu in the PCIE 2x4 slot and it worked. Then I forced all the slots to PCIE3x4 and I could put the gpu back in the first gpu slot.

So now, the pc I built for my family member has an rx 5700 xt with a 5800x, but the gpu is running at PCIE3x4 and loses about 10 fps in games like that. I'm going to leave it like that because it's still 10 times better than their previous R9 290X with horrible AMD FX cpu. I hope the cpu doesn't die because I don't need to spend $200 on an 8 core cpu.

 

[Shmee]

Huh, that is odd. I haven't heard of a 5800X having that kind of issue. Seems like it would be rather rare. Now the first 5900X wasn't quite stable, I think that was a core issue. I hadn't heard about PCIe lanes dying in a long time.

 

[MadRat]

Since when did motherboards become exempt from the 90 day warranty mandated by federal rules? Send it back to the manufacturer and demand replacement. They advertise these functions. They imply working PCIE lanes when they do as a bisic function.

Businessperson's Guide to Federal Warranty Law

Table of ContentsState law (the Uniform Commercial Code). Sections 2-314 & 2-315. Section 2-313.Introduction For the full legal texts listed below, consult the supplement to this manual.Understanding the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act

www.ftc.gov

I realize the thread is from 2019. But never hold on to defective hardware like that. You should have done an RMA.

 

[DAPUNISHER]

Huh, that is odd. I haven't heard of a 5800X having that kind of issue. Seems like it would be rather rare. Now the first 5900X wasn't quite stable, I think that was a core issue. I hadn't heard about PCIe lanes dying in a long time.

It was bought used, so who knows what abuse it was subjected to.

@pf100

I would not feel the need to buy them an 8 core CPU if it dies either. A Ryzen 5600 is plenty for a 5700XT.

 

[aigomorla]

INSPECT PINS on CPU people.

Maybe one is bent, or is not making good contact.
Inspect Sockets as well.
Threadripper/EYPC has MASSIVE memory and PCI-e issues if the CPU is not even Torqued properly, and they make you use a special tool to torque it.

But i always resocket the CPU, inspect socket, for bent pins or poor contact.
And many times i have been cursing upset because i realized somehow i bent a stupid pin reseatting the cpu and ruined a 400 dollar + board, unless i can fix it with a magnify glass and high precision tweezers.

 

[Markfw]

INSPECT PINS on CPU people.

Maybe one is bent, or is not making good contact.
Inspect Sockets as well.
Threadripper/EYPC has MASSIVE memory and PCI-e issues if the CPU is not even Torqued properly, and they make you use a special tool to torque it.

But i always resocket the CPU, inspect socket, for bent pins or poor contact.
And many times i have been cursing upset because i realized somehow i bent a stupid pin reseatting the cpu and ruined a 400 dollar + board, unless i can fix it with a magnify glass and high precision tweezers.

Except, I never want to do that on my Genoa's. 6096 pins ????

 

[William Gaatjes]

PCi-express is very electrostatic discharge sensitive. ESD. To prevent ESD sparks damaging the board or the gpu : Please make sure you have proper ESD wristbands and crocodile beaks to connect to the ground plane of the motherboard before placing the gpu. Also complete disconnect the pc from any cable to prevent a ground voltage level elevation effect. You can preferably connect the chassis of the pc which is connected to the GROUND plane of the motherboard through proper ESD cable with (1MegaOhm) to real EARTH (Ground). And then connect your ESD wire connected to your wristband to the Grounded chassis of the pc which of course is also connected to the ground plane of the motherboard. To make sure that the metal parts of the chassis of the pc (the housing, the enclosure) is connected to the groundplane of the motherboard. Use a multimeter. It should be 0 Ohms. Otherwise, connect the ESD wristband and grounding to a ground connection on the motherboard. When placing the gpu , always touch the large metal parts of the gpu, the groundplane. Because that is where the charge will be stored the most as it has the highest surface area. And this way you will level the charge differences between the ground plane of the motherboard and the ground plane of the gpu card out. It takes a second or 2.

Never touch the PCI-express pins as these are ESD sensitive and the PCIexpress pins are impedance tuned during training of the PCI express links. Training is like testing and tuning for making the almost perfect electrical path for the data to pass over to. So, touching these pins may result in ESD damage and therefore reducing PCIexpress performance. PCI express is to a degree fault tolerant and will sent those PCIe datapackages again when CRC is wrong because of datacorruption. And every time a datapacket needs to be resend, is a reduction in useful databandwidth or PCIe bandwidth will happen because now the same packets needs to be send more often instead of only one time for each packet. Think, weird stuttering behavior or lower fps than possbile in almost worst case scenario. Worst case scenario is of course : no image.

One PCIExpress link is in a way a sort of, very fast RS485 line (A differential serial dataline (data+ & data-) and with an OSI layer on top of it. Similar to TCP/IP has CRC checks and USB has CRC checks. USB is also a differential serial link with an osi layer on top of it.

Also make sure the slot is clean an no copper swarfs are present on the pins as these can create short circuits. And burn out the motherboard and gpu.

CRC = "A cyclic redundancy check (CRC) is an error-detecting code commonly used in digital networks and storage devices to detect accidental changes to digital data. Blocks of data entering these systems get a short check value attached, based on the remainder of a polynomial division of their contents. On retrieval, the calculation is repeated and, in the event the check values do not match, corrective action can be taken against data corruption." Like sending the data again after not acknowledging the received corrupt data.

 

[q52]

Oh, and if you get a Ryzen CPU or APU, prefer one with SMT (simultanous multi-threading) Enabled on it. This 1200 has Four cores, and SMT disabled, and ... it bogs down. I'm mining on all four cores, and web browsing, and man, it is a little big sluggish. Whereas my Ryzen R5 1600 wouldn't bog down nearly as much, due to some SMT threads still having CPU time available.

you need to reduce the process priority (`nice` level in Linux) on the mining so that your other processes e.g. browsing dont get throttled by the mining. This will eliminate "bog down" on pretty much all CPU's regardless of their age or performance.

 

[Slender]

PCi-express is very electrostatic discharge sensitive. ESD. To prevent ESD sparks damaging the board or the gpu : Please make sure you have proper ESD wristbands and crocodile beaks to connect to the ground plane of the motherboard before placing the gpu. Also complete disconnect the pc from any cable to prevent a ground voltage level elevation effect. You can preferably connect the chassis of the pc which is connected to the GROUND plane of the motherboard through proper ESD cable with (1MegaOhm) to real EARTH (Ground). And then connect your ESD wire connected to your wristband to the Grounded chassis of the pc which of course is also connected to the ground plane of the motherboard. To make sure that the metal parts of the chassis of the pc (the housing, the enclosure) is connected to the groundplane of the motherboard. Use a multimeter. It should be 0 Ohms. Otherwise, connect the ESD wristband and grounding to a ground connection on the motherboard. When placing the gpu , always touch the large metal parts of the gpu, the groundplane. Because that is where the charge will be stored the most as it has the highest surface area. And this way you will level the charge differences between the ground plane of the motherboard and the ground plane of the gpu card out. It takes a second or 2.

Never touch the PCI-express pins as these are ESD sensitive and the PCIexpress pins are impedance tuned during training of the PCI express links. Training is like testing and tuning for making the almost perfect electrical path for the data to pass over to. So, touching these pins may result in ESD damage and therefore reducing PCIexpress performance. PCI express is to a degree fault tolerant and will sent those PCIe datapackages again when CRC is wrong because of datacorruption. And every time a datapacket needs to be resend, is a reduction in useful databandwidth or PCIe bandwidth will happen because now the same packets needs to be send more often instead of only one time for each packet. Think, weird stuttering behavior or lower fps than possbile in almost worst case scenario. Worst case scenario is of course : no image.

One PCIExpress link is in a way a sort of, very fast RS485 line (A differential serial dataline (data+ & data-) and with an OSI layer on top of it. Similar to TCP/IP has CRC checks and USB has CRC checks. USB is also a differential serial link with an osi layer on top of it.

Also make sure the slot is clean an no copper swarfs are present on the pins as these can create short circuits. And burn out the motherboard and gpu.

CRC = "A cyclic redundancy check (CRC) is an error-detecting code commonly used in digital networks and storage devices to detect accidental changes to digital data. Blocks of data entering these systems get a short check value attached, based on the remainder of a polynomial division of their contents. On retrieval, the calculation is repeated and, in the event the check values do not match, corrective action can be taken against data corruption." Like sending the data again after not acknowledging the received corrupt data.

can damaged pci express line cause jitter judder jagger grainy pixelated blurry display image ? (not caused by display / gpu)

 

[William Gaatjes]

can damaged pci express line cause jitter judder jagger grainy pixelated blurry display image ? (not caused by display / gpu)

I do not think so. PCI-express has fault detection called CRC (cyclic redundancy check) and retries when the CRC is bad. The CRC is a calculation that is send along with the data. The CRC is checked with every PCIe datapacket that is transferred. It does not matter if it may be x1 or x16.
Eventually it will give up and Windows will probably will display a massive error message with a blue screen. This is from memory so bare with me.

Your error kind of remembers alike overclocked gpu or overclocked gpu memory.
please use stock values( The ones the videocard ships with) and try again.

Edit for some more options:
If it does not work, try using gpu clock values and gpu memory clock values, lower than stock values.
And also, sometimes the coolingpaste has gone bad and dried out.
This can also be a fault for GPU card giving distorted images because of heating but the GPU is throttling on GPU clocks and GPU voltage to remain within a certain temperature range (Like 90 degrees celcius maximum temperature).
THan you would need to buy some silver cooling paste and clean and reapply coolingpaste between the GPU and GPU memory, and the heatsink.

 

[Slender]

Thanks for reply!
Unfortunately, this problem occurs for many people after reinstalling the video card / operating system. And there is no solution other than buying a completely new cpu/mobo.
blurbusters forum
im trying to find reason.
that blurry pixelated grainy occurs in bios.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Thanks for reply!
Unfortunately, this problem occurs for many people after reinstalling the video card / operating system. And there is no solution other than buying a completely new cpu/mobo.
blurbusters forum
im trying to find reason.
that blurry pixelated grainy occurs in bios.

Which card has this problem ?
And how old are the cards ?
Are or have they been used for constant bitcoin mining and sold as second hand GPU video cards afterwards ?

Those Forums posts are for me TLDR. Can you please provide the type of card ?

I do remember now that i had this rare condition of my GPU locking up once a month or so. This happened a few years ago.

As it turns out, all one has to do is to disable PCIe powersaving in the power management menu of the control panel of windows.

This can be an issue that is solved easily to many cards from all big companies, may that be Nvidia, Intel or AMD.
PCIe power management is nonsense seeing how often the PCIe hardware is active relative to other hardware.

Also disable USB powermanagement because not every USB device plays nice. Solves many totally random instability issues.

 

[William Gaatjes]

@Slender
There you go, have a looksie if this solves youre issue :

Question - In case your card crashes totally random once every week or every few weeks.

I have posted this a few years ago in the reply section of the Anandtech news item when it was reported AMD videocards based on GCN architecture and newer were crashing randomly and investigation was still going on. And there seemed no clear explanation at the moment. Totally random. I found...

forums.anandtech.com

 

[Slender]

Which card has this problem ?
And how old are the cards ?
Are or have they been used for constant bitcoin mining and sold as second hand GPU video cards afterwards ?

Those Forums posts are for me TLDR. Can you please provide the type of card ?

I do remember now that i had this rare condition of my GPU locking up once a month or so. This happened a few years ago.

As it turns out, all one has to do is to disable PCIe powersaving in the power management menu of the control panel of windows.

This can be an issue that is solved easily to many cards from all big companies, may that be Nvidia, Intel or AMD.
PCIe power management is nonsense seeing how often the PCIe hardware is active relative to other hardware.

Also disable USB powermanagement because not every USB device plays nice. Solves many totally random instability issues.

I made all possible system settings and all available (hidden) bios settings that there could be. I've tried literally everything. This has nothing to do with the display/video card/drivers/system. This problem is visible as day in bios. When the system starts I see the boot logo. Suddenly this boot logo disappears and appears in a lower resolution. This problem has been present on all my PCs for 15 years.

 

[William Gaatjes]

I made all possible system settings and all available (hidden) bios settings that there could be. I've tried literally everything. This has nothing to do with the display/video card/drivers/system. This problem is visible as day in bios. When the system starts I see the boot logo. Suddenly this boot logo disappears and appears in a lower resolution. This problem has been present on all my PCs for 15 years.

Sounds like the bios does not recognize the monitor and defaults to a save resolution all monitors can handle.
If it works fine in windows 10 and later versions. There is no issue.

See post 42 for possible solutions under windows :

Question - In case your card crashes totally random once every week or every few weeks.

I have posted this a few years ago in the reply section of the Anandtech news item when it was reported AMD videocards based on GCN architecture and newer were crashing randomly and investigation was still going on. And there seemed no clear explanation at the moment. Totally random. I found...

forums.anandtech.com

 

[daveybrat]

I made all possible system settings and all available (hidden) bios settings that there could be. I've tried literally everything. This has nothing to do with the display/video card/drivers/system. This problem is visible as day in bios. When the system starts I see the boot logo. Suddenly this boot logo disappears and appears in a lower resolution. This problem has been present on all my PCs for 15 years.

If you've had this problem on ALL of your PCs for the last 15 years then either you're doing something wrong or buying inferior hardware.

 

[Slender]

Sounds like the bios does not recognize the monitor and defaults to a save resolution all monitors can handle.
If it works fine in windows 10 and later versions. There is no issue.

See post 42 for possible solutions under windows :

Question - In case your card crashes totally random once every week or every few weeks.

I have posted this a few years ago in the reply section of the Anandtech news item when it was reported AMD videocards based on GCN architecture and newer were crashing randomly and investigation was still going on. And there seemed no clear explanation at the moment. Totally random. I found...

forums.anandtech.com

Thank you, but im trying all these thing a lot of times.
ALL versions windows are same.
you can find info about that on link #40 post
Can the motherboard store any information about installed components (cpu/gpu/ram) even after clear cmos?

If you've had this problem on ALL of your PCs for the last 15 years then either you're doing something wrong or buying inferior hardware.

seems like that, one guy who find "root" of these issue says that the problem may be in pirated kms keys

 

[WelshBloke]

im trying to find reason.
that blurry pixelated grainy occurs in bios.

Thats just because most MBs render the BIOS at a really low resolution.

They are just now starting to use 1080!

What the heck, my BIOS screen is 1080p now

Asus has upgraded its BIOS screens to 1080p, starting with X870/E motherboards.

www.pcgamer.com

 

[Slender]

Thats just because most MBs render the BIOS at a really low resolution.

They are just now starting to use 1080!

What the heck, my BIOS screen is 1080p now

Asus has upgraded its BIOS screens to 1080p, starting with X870/E motherboards.

www.pcgamer.com

Yes, I understand that the resolution of the internal bios is 1024x768, just imagine that it is 1024x768 and it feels like 640x480. I mean that this problem applies to bios too. So that you can better understand the difference, I asked my friend, who has no problems with his PC, to take a photo of his desktop with the same matrix model.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Yes, I understand that the resolution of the internal bios is 1024x768, just imagine that it is 1024x768 and it feels like 640x480. I mean that this problem applies to bios too. So that you can better understand the difference, I asked my friend, who has no problems with his PC, to take a photo of his desktop with the same matrix model.

When looking at the images, i see no issue. The text is readable. What you describe sounds like what can be an issue is the clock signal, i remember about clock phase. Maybe you can try to change that in the monitor settings of the monitor On Screen menu .

 

[Slender]

When looking at the images, i see no issue. The text is readable. What you describe sounds like what can be an issue is the clock signal, i remember about clock phase. Maybe you can try to change that in the monitor settings of the monitor On Screen menu .

im use xl2566k, that is service menu settings. Inside regular i dont find "clock" any.
Can't you see that my font is blurry and harder to read?
The problem is not just pixelation. The problem is that 360hz / 360 fps does not feel like 360. In the motion of the picture, I see jitter. My mouse and keyboard are slow to respond. The picture is not what it should be. I'm not the only one who experiences this. You can just google pixelation/blurry/grainy and you'll see tens of thousands of threads where the problem has never been resolved. The only solution at the moment is a completely new mobo/cpu, and genuine windows.