Antifa / far right groups protesting in Portland this afternoon. What'll happen this time?

[SlowSpyder]

Here's the trouble with your viewpoint. You seem to be under the belief that fascism, white supremacy, or whatever other evil shit mankind comes up with as an excuse to kill each other rises through violence. It doesn't, it rises through long term, sometimes multi-decade slides into acceptability through a continued campaign with the intent to change the groupthink of large percentages of a population, until the idea of doing something horrible seems not-so-horrible. A perfect example is the treatment of immigrants, both legal and illegal in current US society. It's become normalized to demonize them, see them as heinous rapists, job-stealers, lazy, or otherwise ne'er-do-wells which should be punished somehow, doesn't really matter how. As a result, we've had literal children put in cages and while may people care, many others are in favor of even further action, further punishment, further marginalization.

Note, it does not matter who started this, who's team is the big baddy, etc etc. Those are all just distractions. As it is with other products of fascism and supremacists, you glom on a bunch of distractions and points of contentions to at minimum delay how long it is until your shit gets shut down, and ideally to grow your power base enough that you can begin your true work, which is the elimination of those you're trying to marginalize. By the time that day comes, it isn't greeted with gasps of horror, it's greeted with cheers from the 51% of people who think you're in the right.

So as of right now, you're part of the group already cheering, or at least not jeering, the group that's attempting to marginalize a group or groups of people. The people fighting back against that are not fascists, they're fighting back against an enemy of the people. You're on the wrong side of history on this, and history doesn't forget.

No, I don't think the way to solve it is through violence, certainly not causing physical harm to someone just because of their viewpoints, no matter how far gone that viewpoint seems. Do you think someone is going to come around after being physically attacked for having whatever view and being peaceful with it (assuming we are talking about peaceful people not creating violence themselves). Also, you lose all credibility as soon as you go to the faux "children in cages" bs. Can any of you have a discussion without the melodramatic exaggerations being forced into the conversation? I have little doubt that a considerable number of people that have crossed our border illegally are in fact criminals. I'm sure many are decent people that just want a better life too. I see nothing wrong with wanting to vet whom it is we allow in and do our best at accepting those that just want to bring a piece of their culture to our melting pot and have a chance at a better life and filtering out the undesirable criminals. I don't think that is some kind of racist Hitler move, as the left tries so hard to make it out to be.

The left is inventing this "fascism" to be afraid of. This is just the everybody gets a trophy indoctrinated PC crowd not being able to handle Trump winning in 2016. You were programmed to receive Hillary, they all kept telling you Hillary in a landslide, madam president, etc. etc. And here we are several years later and you're still trying to recover from the BSOD you ran into that night when reality didn't line up with what they sold you. So now the left tries to shape reality into what protects their emotional bubble. You are actively arguing it is ok to harm those that you see as having extreme views even if they are being peaceful. Well, we'll get what we deserve.

 

[Viper1j]

You know, deporting someone that is occupying a country illegally isn't the same as taking their personal belongings and sending them to the gas chamber en masse to systematically try and exterminate an entire ethnic group, right?

Hitler ate steak. Trump eats steak! OMG! Proof to liberals Trump IS Hitler reincarnate.

Does kidnapping their children count? Or didn't you know that parents have been deported WITHOUT their kids? I have no doubt that more than a few of them will enf up mopping floors and making beds at Mar A Lago, or some other Trump property.

Except for the cute girls...

He'll be saving those for his... parties.

 

[Amused]

Agents of one of the most progressive cities in the nation are busily punching Nazis just as you want.

Actually, the police force in Portland has a long history of racial bias.

https://www.portlandmercury.com/blo...rs-disproportionally-target-african-americans

https://www.hcn.org/issues/51.3/race-and-racism-racist-policing-plagues-portlands-nightclubs

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/20/portland-police-race-reform-crime

And a history of being sympathetic to white nationalists:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/02/17/us/portland-police-patriot-prayer-texts.html

Even liberal Los Angeles does too.

The police forces tend to attract fascist types, as was more than evidenced by the results of the Plain View Project which showed nearly 1/3 of police had posted racist and bigoted material on social media... and that's just the ones stupid enough to post that shit.

https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/20/us/plain-view-project-police-investigating/index.html

But yeah, run with the narrative that fits your world view...

 

[glenn1]

Actually, the police force in Portland has a long history of racial bias.

So was the Nazi they punched in that video a POC? Looked pretty pale to me but it's hard to tell sometimes nowadays.

 

[Perknose]

So was the Nazi they punched in that video a POC? Looked pretty pale to me but it's hard to tell sometimes nowadays.

Just for you, here's some fine young HS students saluting your brave political stance!

https://www.thedailybeast.com/pacif...e?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning&jwsource=cl

 

[glenn1]

Just for you, here's some fine young HS students saluting your brave political stance!

https://www.thedailybeast.com/pacif...e?via=newsletter&source=DDMorning&jwsource=cl

Dem cities and states lead the way in showing how Nazism is done, Garden Grove CA where that school is went Hillary 58.4% to 35.6% in 2016. But I'm sure you'll be along to punch them straight away, right?

 

[Amused]

Dem cities and states lead the way in showing how Nazism is done, Garden Grove CA where that school is went Hillary 58.4% to 35.6% in 2016. But I'm sure you'll be along to punch them straight away, right?

Deflect deflect deflect!!!

Curiously, you've not answered a single one of the questions I posed here. You've merely posted about irrelevant things and screamed "look over here!" to deflect from the issues at hand.

 

[Amused]

So was the Nazi they punched in that video a POC? Looked pretty pale to me but it's hard to tell sometimes nowadays.

No, you potato, It was an anti-racism protester.

You know, the ones our president said were the bad guys for protesting a white supremacist rally? Those ones.

And look at you. Dancing Like a good little puppet. Supporting fascism and the harassment of people protesting racism rather than denouncing the racists.

 

[Amused]

The shocking facts of this thread:

In Portland, several white supremacist orgs organized an armed rally with the intent to commit violence against counter protesters. They showed up armed and armored.

And there are a few on this board who, at all cost, are attacking ONLY the people who showed up to protest against, and stand up to, a bunch of armed, armored self avowed racists who advocate for the dehumanization, marginalization and murder of all non-christian non-whites, and loss of freedom for everyone else.

ANY rational, moral person would be proud of ANYONE who stood up to such absolute monsters and such a monsterous ideology.

But no. We have people on this board who are so propagandized, the people standing up against Nazis are the bad guys.

No, really.

 

[Victorian Gray]

No, I don't think the way to solve it is through violence, certainly not causing physical harm to someone just because of their viewpoints, no matter how far gone that viewpoint seems. Do you think someone is going to come around after being physically attacked for having whatever view and being peaceful with it (assuming we are talking about peaceful people not creating violence themselves). Also, you lose all credibility as soon as you go to the faux "children in cages" bs. Can any of you have a discussion without the melodramatic exaggerations being forced into the conversation? I have little doubt that a considerable number of people that have crossed our border illegally are in fact criminals. I'm sure many are decent people that just want a better life too. I see nothing wrong with wanting to vet whom it is we allow in and do our best at accepting those that just want to bring a piece of their culture to our melting pot and have a chance at a better life and filtering out the undesirable criminals. I don't think that is some kind of racist Hitler move, as the left tries so hard to make it out to be.

The left is inventing this "fascism" to be afraid of. This is just the everybody gets a trophy indoctrinated PC crowd not being able to handle Trump winning in 2016. You were programmed to receive Hillary, they all kept telling you Hillary in a landslide, madam president, etc. etc. And here we are several years later and you're still trying to recover from the BSOD you ran into that night when reality didn't line up with what they sold you. So now the left tries to shape reality into what protects their emotional bubble. You are actively arguing it is ok to harm those that you see as having extreme views even if they are being peaceful. Well, we'll get what we deserve.

Yep, no fascism here

One of the fine, peaceful folks you're working so hard to enable. Maybe you know good ol' Joe, the organizer of the weekend's little shindig?



in case anyone can't see what the center shirt says

 

[BoomerD]

Yep, no fascism here

One of the fine, peaceful folks you're working so hard to enable. Maybe you know good ol' Joe, the organizer of the weekend's little shindig?

View attachment 9765

in case anyone can't see what the center shirt says

View attachment 9766

I like that last one...reminds me of a particularly fun time in my youth...

 

[Victorian Gray]

I like that last one...reminds me of a particularly fun time in my youth...

I think I know what you're referring to but this is what the t shirt is about, Argentina and Chile.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...s-sentenced-for-deaths-including-popes-friend

https://www.theguardian.com/artandd...death-flights-giancarlo-ceraudo-destino-final

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_flights

 

[Amused]

I like that last one...reminds me of a particularly fun time in my youth...

Nope.

This Glorifies the Chilean dick tater Pinochet's execution of choice for political dissidents.

Fascists idealize fascist dictators who murder people. Go figure.

And people on this board are attacking the people who protest these monsters.

Yeah, really.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Yep, no fascism here

One of the fine, peaceful folks you're working so hard to enable. Maybe you know good ol' Joe, the organizer of the weekend's little shindig?

View attachment 9765

in case anyone can't see what the center shirt says

View attachment 9766

There are some undesirables on the right. What they stand for is way too far and not what I am for in the least. I have no problem disavowing the radicals on my side of the fence. Know why you on the left can't do the same? Because you're all radical today.

 

[Amused]

There are some undesirables on the right. What they stand for is way too far and not what I am for in the least. I have no problem disavowing the radicals on my side of the fence. Know why you on the left can't do the same? Because you're all radical today.

What in the actual fuck do the politics of the people opposing the racists and white supremacists at the white supremacist rally have to do with anything? Why are you not 100% supportive of anyone willing to stand up to nazis?

FYI, I do not consider anyone who counter protested the nazis at the nazi rally to be anything but anti-nazi. Their other politics, whatever they may be, are fucking irrelevant.

So... why are you trying to demonize the people who counter protested nazis? Why are you trying to equate people who protest against nazis, with nazis?

There can be only one reason, and it isn't pretty. I think you know it. So you're trying to "appear" reasonable now.

Too late.

 

[Victorian Gray]

There are some undesirables on the right. What they stand for is way too far and not what I am for in the least. I have no problem disavowing the radicals on my side of the fence. Know why you on the left can't do the same? Because you're all radical today.

you are a lying provocateur/propagandist

 

[SlowSpyder]

What in the actual fuck do the politics of the people opposing the racists and white supremacists at the white supremacist rally have to do with anything? Why are you not 100% supportive of anyone willing to stand up to nazis?

FYI, I do not consider anyone who counter protested the nazis at the nazi rally to be anything but anti-nazi. Their other politics, whatever they may be, are fucking irrelevant.

So... why are you trying to demonize the people who counter protested nazis? Why are you trying to equate people who protest against nazis, with nazis?

There can be only one reason, and it isn't pretty. I think you know it. So you're trying to "appear" reasonable now.

Too late.

Because those people are fascists themselves. They're just too smug or stupid to realize it.

 

[Amused]

Because those people are fascists themselves. They're just too smug or stupid to realize it.

No. They are protesting AGAINST WHITE SUPREMACIST NAZIS.

Why is that a problem for you???

You see the hole you've dug for yourself here. And you're trying very hard to wiggle out of it.

But here is the summation: You oppose the people who oppose Nazis. You oppose each and every counter protester at every Nazi rally.

The ONLY conclusion: You support the Nazis. What other reason could there be for you to stand against the people who oppose the Nazis?

Keep dancing. Maybe if you dance a little faster you can convince others that you oppose Nazis, while simultaneously opposing anyone and everyone else who actively opposed Nazis.

Mods, can we change his name to Schrodinger's Nazi?

Please?

 

[esquared]

No. They are protesting AGAINST WHITE SUPREMACIST NAZIS.

Why is that a problem for you???

You see the hole you've dug for yourself here. And you're trying very hard to wiggle out of it.

But here is the summation: You oppose the people who oppose Nazis. You oppose each and every counter protester at every Nazi rally.

The ONLY conclusion: You support the Nazis. What other reason could there be for you to stand against the people who oppose the Nazis?

Keep dancing. Maybe if you dance a little faster you can convince others that you oppose Nazis, while simultaneously opposing anyone and everyone else who actively opposed Nazis.

Mods, can we change his name to Schrodinger's Nazi?

Please?

It's already StPetersburgSlow.

 

[IJTSSG]

That free speech thing is sure turning out to be a real bitch.

 

[Amused]

That free speech thing is sure turning out to be a real bitch.

No one is this thread has advocated outlawing any speech.

We advocate social shunning and action to make nazism and white supremacy so socially unacceptable, one dare not advocate for it without being shunned and denied employment and if rude enough, smacked in the damn face for what is nothing less than a direct physical threat to millions of religious and ethnic minorities.

Social stigma is a real bitch. While we won't throw you in jail, we will inform your employer and get you fired, get you banned from local businesses, get you banned from social media platforms and make you a complete social pariah.

And if you scream nazi shit in my face I'll consider it a direct physical threat and deck you.

 

[glenn1]

No one is this thread has advocated outlawing any speech.

We advocate social shunning and action to make nazism and white supremacy so socially unacceptable, one dare not advocate for it without being shunned and denied employment and if rude enough, smacked in the damn face for what is nothing less than a direct physical threat to millions of religious and ethnic minorities.

Social stigma is a real bitch. While we won't throw you in jail, we will inform your employer and get you fired, get you banned from local businesses, get you banned from social media platforms and make you a complete social pariah.

And if you scream nazi shit in my face I'll consider it a direct physical threat and deck you.

I guess you fear that your vision of progressive utopia can’t win in the marketplace of ideas so you need to suppress other lines of thought, with violence if need be. “Punch someone for their ideas” is not the statement of a person who believes his own ideas will carry the day.

 

[Greenman]

Thank you for asking the obvious question the others refused to ask.

Now. Right fucking now. Make that ideology so socially stigmatized no one dare vocalize it in public without fear of being utterly shunned by everyone. As it stands they are FAR too bold and have FAR too much tolerance in society and that has resulted in their GROWTH.

This is what we HAD been doing for damn near 50 years... Until this false idea that free speech meant the entitlement to a platform and freedom from being shunned and stigmatized. Until the false equivalency that shunning and deplatforming nazis was somehow identical to nazis.

This used to be called "polite society". Proper manners and a basic respect for others.

 

[SlowSpyder]

No. They are protesting AGAINST WHITE SUPREMACIST NAZIS.

Why is that a problem for you???

You see the hole you've dug for yourself here. And you're trying very hard to wiggle out of it.

But here is the summation: You oppose the people who oppose Nazis. You oppose each and every counter protester at every Nazi rally.

The ONLY conclusion: You support the Nazis. What other reason could there be for you to stand against the people who oppose the Nazis?

Keep dancing. Maybe if you dance a little faster you can convince others that you oppose Nazis, while simultaneously opposing anyone and everyone else who actively opposed Nazis.

Mods, can we change his name to Schrodinger's Nazi?

Please?

Protesting Nazis is fine by me, but fascists protesting Nazis, well, that's kind of a no win situation out of the two. And antifa is quite fascist in their methods and some of their beliefs. I don't see what they want as especially different.

Are you thinking beyond just this moment in regards to what you are saying? That it is ok to get violent with someone if they are too far outside the large moral majority? If you're SURE your way is the right way, the moral way, and their way is the opposite, then it is ok to punch them, because you are SURE you're in the moral right in your thinking? Again, leftists today seem to talk about their politics as if it is a religion, you just ok'd religious violence. You're SURE your god is the right one. Those that are too far away from that god? Hell with them, violence is ok.

Maybe it is just the libertarian in me, but I think that someone is free to believe what they want no matter how much I disagree with it, so long as they aren't harming my or others' rights. That's what America is supposed to be, but the left today doesn't allow for deviation from the hive mind.

 

[Victorian Gray]

Because those people are fascists themselves. They're just too smug or stupid to realize it.

you are a lying provocateur/propagandist