Another nasty scene in gymnastics

[nick1985]

the crowd really gave the judges what they needed. 20 minutes of booing. russian guy got screwed.

 

[RagingBITCH]

As much as I wanted the US to just pwn, that was truly unfair. Hamm's performance wasn't close to the same caliber. They both fvcked up on the landing, and Hamm gets a way higher score. What an injustice.

 

[Nitemare]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
As much as I wanted the US to just pwn, that was truly unfair. Hamm's performance wasn't close to the same caliber. They both fvcked up on the landing, and Hamm gets a way higher score. What an injustice.

Hamm should have given him the medal, but that only happens in crappy feel good movies.

 

[mobobuff]

Originally posted by: RagingBITCH
As much as I wanted the US to just pwn, that was truly unfair. Hamm's performance wasn't close to the same caliber. They both fvcked up on the landing, and Hamm gets a way higher score. What an injustice.

Concurance.

 

[jpeyton]

Hamm is a *real* ham; what a charity case, getting two medals he didn't deserve.

Hopefully karma will kick his ass next time.

 

[Garet Jax]

Originally posted by: Vic
I don't understand how people who watch the sport only once every 4 years think they are more qualified to judge than those who have lived and breathed it for most of their lives.

Although I can agree with this in principle, there is something wrong with a sport if what makes the crowd happy isn't what scores the points. Watching a sport like boxing (even though I have never boxed or studied it) I can tell who is doing better in a round most of the time.

 

[waggy]

Originally posted by: jpeyton
Hamm is a fvcking ham; what a charity case, getting two medals he didn't deserve.

Hopefully karma will kick his ass next time.

oh yeah what did hamm do again? did he go and force the judges to FVCK up the scoring on EITHER one? no?

This is not Hamm's fault. this is a case of incompetent judges.


No hamm should not give the medal back. Should the Korean get a medal? YES. but again this is NOT hamms doing it is incompetent judges.

 

[conjur]

Reminds me of some figure skating competition YEARS ago when the crowd catcalled and booed for a long time until the judges revised the score.

The Russian certainly deserved much higher marks given his performance on that bar. And, the fact that Hamm had a similar goof on his landing as the Russian but performed a less difficult routine makes me wonder wtf those judges were thinking.

And Hamm being criticized by media and spectators? Totally uncalled for. He's just an athlete doing his routine. What the judges do is out of his hands.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: Garet Jax

Originally posted by: Vic
I don't understand how people who watch the sport only once every 4 years think they are more qualified to judge than those who have lived and breathed it for most of their lives.

Although I can agree with this in principle, there is something wrong with a sport if what makes the crowd happy isn't what scores the points. Watching a sport like boxing (even though I have never boxed or studied it) I can tell who is doing better in a round most of the time.

Gymnastics is a technical sport. There are hidden nuances and various degrees of difficulty that the average spectator is unlikely to know. One move might look more difficult than another to the untrained eye, but in fact be easier to the skilled, trained athlete.
The judging might be a little crooked, and I've seen some scores I've thought to be questionable, but adjusting the scoring to accomodate the crowd is ridiculous.

And hey, there are bad calls in the NBA and NFL all the time and you don't see people crying international incident there, do you?

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: waggy
oh yeah what did hamm do again? did he go and force the judges to FVCK up the scoring on EITHER one? no? This is not Hamm's fault. this is a case of incompetent judges.

absolutely, he doesn't have any control over the judges. he just did what he could do, which is to perform and wait, just like any other gymnasts out there.

No hamm should not give the medal back. Should the Korean get a medal? YES. but again this is NOT hamms doing it is incompetent judges.

actually no, if you watched the coverage last night, they actually talked about how the judges also screwed up the *penalty* points for the korean (he didn't get penalized for something that he did). so, if his performance were to be re-scored, the starting point will be higher, but his penalty will also be higher, which balanced out the score.

 

[dullard]

Originally posted by: saxguy
actually no, if you watched the coverage last night, they actually talked about how the judges also screwed up the *penalty* points for the korean (he didn't get penalized for something that he did). so, if his performance were to be re-scored, the starting point will be higher, but his penalty will also be higher, which balanced out the score.

Not quite balanced. He should have started +0.1 higher, but gotten a -0.2 deduction. Thus a rescore would give him even lower points. It wouldn't even balance.

 

[cronos]

Originally posted by: dullard

Originally posted by: saxguy
actually no, if you watched the coverage last night, they actually talked about how the judges also screwed up the *penalty* points for the korean (he didn't get penalized for something that he did). so, if his performance were to be re-scored, the starting point will be higher, but his penalty will also be higher, which balanced out the score.

Not quite balanced. He should have started +0.1 higher, but gotten a -0.2 deduction. Thus a rescore would give him even lower points. It wouldn't even balance.

yeah, i wasn't sure about the exact deduction points

thanks for clarifying, apparently his score is going to be even lower. heh..

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: rbloedow
After watching the repeat coverage of the event - it's totally evident that the Russian was better than Hamm, he deserved 2nd place. His whole performance was nearly perfect, and the judges were all gawking about how the Russian had just made gymnastics history with his routine. It was truly phenomenal - the only visible mistake was his dismount where there was a hop on the landing.

I disagree. You're going by your emotions just like the audience did.

You may stand up and cheer wildly during an action packed movie, but that same movie would be totally disregarded by critics. The high bar is the same. The Russian did ONLY release moves and was lacking in ANY technical skills like Hamm's two reverse one handed swings.

In skateboarding, if one guy did nothing but high-flying spins and flips, he'd lose. There are boring technical requirements like grinds you HAVE to do to make the routine complete. Same with the pommel horse...they ALWAYS have to do that stupid rocking scissors thing in the middle even though they could be doing something more flashy...it's a technical skill.

 

[Thraxen]

You may stand up and cheer wildly during an action packed movie, but that same movie would be totally disregarded by critics. The high bar is the same. The Russian did ONLY release moves and was lacking in ANY technical skills like Hamm's two reverse one handed swings.

Ummm... but Tim Daggett, one of the commentators, vehemently disagreed with the score as well. You guys are acting it was just the crowd and that the judges are the only ones who know what they are talking about. BTW, this is from Daggett's bio on the NBC website:

Athens is Tim Daggett's fourth Olympic assignment as gymnastics analyst for NBC. Over the course of the last decade, Daggett has established himself as one of the leading authorities on the sport, covering events such as the World Gymnastics Championships and the U.S. Olympic Trials. Daggett also has worked events for ESPN and Prime Ticket. As a competitor, Daggett's "10" on high bar at the 1984 Olympics clinched the first-ever gold medal for the U.S. men's team that upset gold medal favorite China. He later added a bronze medal in the pommel horse competition, and fought through a series of injuries to become the American Cup all-around champion in 1985 and the U.S. national champion in 1986

I'd say he is qualified.

 

[Ryan]

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: rbloedow
After watching the repeat coverage of the event - it's totally evident that the Russian was better than Hamm, he deserved 2nd place. His whole performance was nearly perfect, and the judges were all gawking about how the Russian had just made gymnastics history with his routine. It was truly phenomenal - the only visible mistake was his dismount where there was a hop on the landing.

I disagree. You're going by your emotions just like the audience did.

You may stand up and cheer wildly during an action packed movie, but that same movie would be totally disregarded by critics. The high bar is the same. The Russian did ONLY release moves and was lacking in ANY technical skills like Hamm's two reverse one handed swings.

In skateboarding, if one guy did nothing but high-flying spins and flips, he'd lose. There are boring technical requirements like grinds you HAVE to do to make the routine complete. Same with the pommel horse...they ALWAYS have to do that stupid rocking scissors thing in the middle even though they could be doing something more flashy...it's a technical skill.

I think you're discounting the amount of technical skill required to do releases he did.

 

[HeroOfPellinor]

Originally posted by: rbloedow

Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

Originally posted by: rbloedow
After watching the repeat coverage of the event - it's totally evident that the Russian was better than Hamm, he deserved 2nd place. His whole performance was nearly perfect, and the judges were all gawking about how the Russian had just made gymnastics history with his routine. It was truly phenomenal - the only visible mistake was his dismount where there was a hop on the landing.

I disagree. You're going by your emotions just like the audience did.

You may stand up and cheer wildly during an action packed movie, but that same movie would be totally disregarded by critics. The high bar is the same. The Russian did ONLY release moves and was lacking in ANY technical skills like Hamm's two reverse one handed swings.

In skateboarding, if one guy did nothing but high-flying spins and flips, he'd lose. There are boring technical requirements like grinds you HAVE to do to make the routine complete. Same with the pommel horse...they ALWAYS have to do that stupid rocking scissors thing in the middle even though they could be doing something more flashy...it's a technical skill.

I think you're discounting the amount of technical skill required to do releases he did.

Not at all. But if that's ALL you practice cause it's ALL you do, then I suspect after a few years, you'd be pretty good. Meanwhile, other guys are working on technical skills and form as well as their release skills, so it would make sense that their release skills wouldn't be as spectacular.

Personally, I was more outraged by that Greek kid winning gold on the rings when there were two others who had noticeably better routines...Nemy and Checci.

 

[Aharami]

Originally posted by: isekii

Originally posted by: rbloedow
After watching the repeat coverage of the event - it's totally evident that the Russian was better than Hamm, he deserved 2nd place. His whole performance was nearly perfect, and the judges were all gawking about how the Russian had just made gymnastics history with his routine. It was truly phenomenal - the only visible mistake was his dismount where there was a hop on the landing.

Hamm didn't have a clean landing either. The judges are really biased.

i agree. both Nemov and Hamms did a little hop on their landings...but Nemov's routine was far better than Hamm's. Nemov was originally scored 9.312 or something but Hamm got 9.8something. really biased and unfair!!

 

[HamSupLo]

at least the asian guy didn't get screwed this time :thumbsup:

anyways, olympic judging is full of bullsheeeeeeet

 

[SuperTool]

Lots of people won olympic medals, including Nemov 12. Not many people had the fans stop the competition for 10 minutes to rally on their behalf. So I think it's a fitting retirement party for him

 

[Ninjja]

Originally posted by: Squisher

Originally posted by: digitalsm

Originally posted by: CanOWorms

Originally posted by: digitalsm
Whats more interesting is the two ties. 1 and 2 were tied and 3 and 4 were tied, both Hamms came out on the losing end of the tie breakers.

What's the procedure for a tie breaker? Do they do a new event?

They dont do another round. Im not sure how they do it they havent quite elaborated on how they do it.

I believe I heard that they go to score cards and the person who had the least amount of markdowns wins the tiebreaker.

that's kind of right. They go to the score care and the person who has the higher number of high scores goes ahead.

 

[911paramedic]

This is the worst judging I have seen, they have made mistakes in gymnastics, fencing, diving, and a few others that have cost people medals.

It's tragic.

 

[maziwanka]

The competition resumed only when Nemov, "Sexy Alexei" to his legion of admirers, waved to his fans and gestured to them to allow the sporting action to continue.

thats the best line of the article. i didn't watch the event in question, but it seems like the blame should definately fall on the judges. I agree with Waggy's comments above...

 

[Stojakapimp]

is it just me, or did it seem like Hamm's routine was 10 seconds long? It was good and all, but not nearly as technically difficult as the other routines, plus it seemed a lot shorter.

Judges should be replaced by robots

 

[conjur]

Originally posted by: Aharami

Originally posted by: isekii

Originally posted by: rbloedow
After watching the repeat coverage of the event - it's totally evident that the Russian was better than Hamm, he deserved 2nd place. His whole performance was nearly perfect, and the judges were all gawking about how the Russian had just made gymnastics history with his routine. It was truly phenomenal - the only visible mistake was his dismount where there was a hop on the landing.

Hamm didn't have a clean landing either. The judges are really biased.

i agree. both Nemov and Hamms did a little hop on their landings...but Nemov's routine was far better than Hamm's. Nemov was originally scored 9.312 or something but Hamm got 9.8something. really biased and unfair!!

Nemov's first score was 9.725...they only bumped it up to 9.762 which was still below 9.787 which was scored by the two competitors before him.

 

[gourmettea]

IMHO Gymnastics...Diving....anything with a subjective judge is not a true SPORT......because it can never be truly fair......there are no points scored...no finish line....only standards of judging...