Anbyone else offended by the Coke commercial

[Orignal Earl]

I get the goosebumps when I watch the new timmies commercial

Tim Hortons Good Ol' Hockey Game featuring Sidney Crosby

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yXE_p_1Squg&desktop_uri=/watch?v=yXE_p_1Squg

Eh? Eh?
That rocks

 

[berzerker60]

Yep, yep... I know... thinking that the US's pre-1965 immigration policy, which was calculated to maintain a European culture and demographic make-up was a safer strategy for the health of the country than what we have now instantly makes you a full on goose-stepping, sieg heiling, cross-burning Hitler-KKK type.

Pre-1965 immigration policy was absolutely built on psuedo-scientific racist principles and xenophobia, yes.

Would a Japanese man who worries about the idea of throwing open their borders be human garbage?

He would be xenophobic, and if his reasons for worrying were about the racial composition of the country, he would be racist. There are lots and lots of racist, xenophobic Japanese people, so it would not be surprising. He wouldn't be 'human garbage' necessarily, but definitely a much worse person than if he accepted that race doesn't make anyone better or worse.

Or are these sorts of misgivings and concerns only verboten for the pale face?

Stroke your martyr complex all you want, racism and xenophobia are terrible for everyone but especially heinous from whichever group is in power, whether whites in America, Hutus in Rwanda, or Han Chinese in China.

 

[Tango]

How so?

First of all, NYC themselves seem to say it's about 170 languages, not 800+ but regardless...

http://www.economist.com/node/21528592

But a place on the other side of the world runs it close. The five boroughs of New York City are reckoned to be home to speakers of around 800 languages, many of them close to extinction.

800+ is also the number quoted on Wikipedia...

in what way does it make NYC stronger for tons of languages to be spoken there? I guess maybe it makes it easier to find a translator when you need one... but it is also the reason you'd need one in the first place.

Is Sydney in deep shit?

Is Tokyo?

They are not, and I quote, in deep shit, but they are very far in terms if cultural production. It could not be differently. The mixing of extraordinarily diverse cultures generates that exhilarating atmosphere that you breath each time you are in NYC and that makes such a fertile soil for new ideas to emerge.

All other cities that compare in this, also have the same kind of diversity, although very few in the world compare...

I dunno, it seems to me like there are a lot of cities around the planet where one language absolutely dominates and any presence of other languages is minimal, and almost everyone who speaks them speaks the primary language too. I feel like these cities are doing alright.

Unless you can point out to me the crippling effects of insufficient diversity they're suffering?

It's not crippling. Just not nearly as culturally productive. Why settle for mediocre when you can enjoy outstanding?

Unless of course, you are personally troubled by people different from you...

 

[Geosurface]

Pre-1965 immigration policy was absolutely built on psuedo-scientific racist principles and xenophobia, yes.

Or just a desire to maintain a European population and culture.

You do realize that European peoples are a pretty small fraction of the total human global population right? You don't think they have a right to preserve their identity and genetic distinctness?

He would be xenophobic, and if his reasons for worrying were about the racial composition of the country, he would be racist. There are lots and lots of racist, xenophobic Japanese people, so it would not be surprising. He wouldn't be 'human garbage' necessarily, but definitely a much worse person than if he accepted that race doesn't make anyone better or worse.

The Japanese have the lowest birth rate on the planet. They also have a beautiful and ancient culture. You cannot disconnect the people and their genetics from the culture. They are one. How else can they preserve themselves and their culture than to exercise tight controls on immigration, especially with their low birth rate?

It doesn't have to be about "better and worse" it can just be about preserving genomes which nature took tens of thousands if not hundreds of thousands of years to produce. I believe the loss of those genomes is tragic no matter what group we're talking about.

 

[Geosurface]

Unless of course, you are personally troubled by people different from you...

I'm not troubled by people different from me.

In fact, I have a great deal of fondness and admiration for many cultures I have no personal connection to. Some more than others, but I find things to appreciate from every culture.

I don't really care for the role Islam plays in the world today and the condition of much of the Islamic world, particularly in how they treat women (but also how they treat men frankly) - but this doesn't prevent me from greatly admiring the role that culture played in preserving our history and advancing science. I also think some of the music, architecture, and clothing which has come out of that part of the world is beautiful.

I think Sub-Saharan Africa is pretty much a mess over large portions of it today, but I respect the equilibrium that had been achieved with nature by many tribes and cultures there prior to outside interference and I think a lot of the tribal dances and masks are very cool, and some of the religious belief systems are really interesting. I also respect what appears to be our species' oldest group. Have to have affection for our species' birthplace after all.

I think I've already expressed my admiration for East Asian cultures, and I"ll add India to the list. As well as the Native American cultures in all their manifestations. All of these cultures have had some barbaric practices and deep problems, but so have the cultures of European peoples. All human beings are flawed. All have produced beauty as well.

I actually agree with you that it is cool to have places like NYC where all the various cultures and languages of our species come together in one place and create a fusion.

I just think that each distinct culture and genome should also be preserved and have a homeland which is inviolate. I think the loss of any of them would be tragic. I think those who claim to love diversity should agree.

 

[rudeguy]

I really liked the commercial. I don't see what the problem is. It was beautiful and well done.


Now the singing of America the Beautiful before the game was terrible. The commercial was the song sang in different languages. What they did to it before the game was basically murder.

 

[CanOWorms]

Or just a desire to maintain a European population and culture.

You do realize that European peoples are a pretty small fraction of the total human global population right? You don't think they have a right to preserve their identity and genetic distinctness?

I think your problem is that you think America is a Western nation. We have a Western influence, among others, but it's not Western nor is it European. American has fought countless wars to free itself from Europe.

The desire of America is to maintain an American population and culture, not a European population and European culture.

 

[CanOWorms]

The Japanese have the lowest birth rate on the planet. They also have a beautiful and ancient culture. You cannot disconnect the people and their genetics from the culture. They are one. How else can they preserve themselves and their culture than to exercise tight controls on immigration, especially with their low birth rate?

If the culture is appealing then people will adopt it. Moreover, your culture is not wiped out just because other people are not practicing it with you.

 

[Tango]

I just think that each distinct culture and genome should also be preserved and have a homeland which is inviolate. I think the loss of any of them would be tragic. I think those who claim to love diversity should agree.

We all came out of east Africa. God bless them for not trying to preserve their genome...

P.s. Honestly, when I read about preserving genomes and keeping homeland inviolate it freaks me out a little. No, actually it freaks me out a lot.

Out of curiosity: where do you live?

 

[Geosurface]

P.s. Honestly, when I read about preserving genomes and keeping homeland inviolate it freaks me out a little. No, actually it freaks me out a lot.

Out of curiosity: where do you live?

It shouldn't freak you out at all. If there was a species of hummingbird which had several varieties across the world and something humans were doing was pressing them all into the same small preserve where they were all mixing and threatening the loss of each distinct variety, and some ornithologist said we needed to maintain viable breeding populations of each type so that biodiversity was not lost, you wouldn't be freaked out and you'd probably agree.

I live in Connecticut. Not very far from NYC really.

 

[surfsatwerk]

It shouldn't freak you out at all. If there was a species of hummingbird which had several varieties across the world and something humans were doing was pressing them all into the same small preserve where they were all mixing and threatening the loss of each distinct variety, and some ornithologist said we needed to maintain viable breeding populations of each type so that biodiversity was not lost, you wouldn't be freaked out and you'd probably agree.

I live in Connecticut. Not very far from NYC really.

 

[Tango]

It shouldn't freak you out at all. If there was a species of hummingbird which had several varieties across the world and something humans were doing was pressing them all into the same small preserve where they were all mixing and threatening the loss of each distinct variety, and some ornithologist said we needed to maintain viable breeding populations of each type so that biodiversity was not lost, you wouldn't be freaked out and you'd probably agree.

I live in Connecticut. Not very far from NYC really.

Have you noticed how different people and hummingbirds are? I mean there is a reason why you keep birds in a cage, but you get 30 years in jail if you do the same to a person. Think about it.

How can you resist in Connecticut with such a view? I mean, half of my African friends commute from Connecticut... Your precious genome looks damn endangered in there, if you ask me...

 

[Geosurface]

Have you noticed how different people and hummingbirds are? I mean there is a reason why you keep birds in a cage, but you get 30 years in jail if you do the same to a person. Think about it.

How can you resist in Connecticut with such a view? I mean, half of my African friends commute from Connecticut... Your precious genome looks damn endangered in there, if you ask me...

Do they commute from New Haven and/or Hartford?

Outside of those two cities, Connecticut is very white.

I also have no problem whatsoever getting along with people of other races anyway. I have no animosity toward them whatsoever. You can love your own family without hating the neighbors, and you can prefer that strangers not enter your house without hating them.

When I was in the Navy two of the 5 or so closest friends I made were black.

But yea, Connecticut is pretty white and known for being so.

 

[Jaskalas]

I am a big proponent of pushing English in our country, and across the world.

Maybe as technology to auto-translate matures it will be a non-issue, but for the history of the world many a people have fought and died simply because they could not speak to each other and tribalism ran rampant. I would stamp out this barrier between peoples.

Diversity is a strength of ideas and genetics, not of languages.

 

[Phokus]

I just realized that this is Matt's version of Incorruptible's 'war on christmas' post. Not as stupid, but pretty close. Congrats Matt, you're on Incorruptible's level now!

 

[DominionSeraph]

You've got your automatic protocols of what you yell at someone who trespasses into any territory which has been marked as forbidden

 

[Sheik Yerbouti]

I just realized that this is Matt's version of Incorruptible's 'war on christmas' post. Not as stupid, but pretty close. Congrats Matt, you're on Incorruptible's level now!

:awe:

 

[Orignal Earl]

Do they commute from New Haven and/or Hartford?

Outside of those two cities, Connecticut is very white.

I also have no problem whatsoever getting along with people of other races anyway. I have no animosity toward them whatsoever. You can love your own family without hating the neighbors, and you can prefer that strangers not enter your house without hating them.

When I was in the Navy two of the 5 or so closest friends I made were black.

But yea, Connecticut is pretty white and known for being so.

See, when you say closest friends. You probably mean that you occasionally said hello to them.
If they really were close friends with you, what did they think when you told them you figure they aren't as intelligent as you and more aggressive then you because of their race?

 

[Geosurface]

See, when you say closest friends. You probably mean that you occasionally said hello to them.
If they really were close friends with you, what did they think when you told them you figure they aren't as intelligent as you and more aggressive then you because of their race?

I mean spending time with them extensively when off duty, giving them rides places, playing video games together, talking philosophy etc. I even encouraged one of them to ask out a white waitress he had his eye on, gave him a pep talk, and drove him to her workplace so he could.

I did not have the views I do now, and ironically that same guy hated on his own blackness and I tried to bolster him on it.

If I had the views I do now back then, it wouldn't have caused me to be a douche to anyone.

Does my belief that women have less upper body strength, worse spatial reasoning, and are shorter than men on average mean I can't be friends with any women or feel affection for them? Or that I can't ever hang out with a female without bringing those things up? Of course not. Even if I think those things have implications for certain jobs, that still doesn't mean I hate women.

EDIT: Right after posting this I remembered I was going to try not to respond to Earl anymore. Damn it.

 

[Howard]

I'm getting the feeling that xenophobia is equated to evil. Why?

 

[thraashman]

I'm getting the feeling that xenophobia is equated to evil. Why?

Not evil, just ignorance. But xenophobia often leads to evil acts. Like the Japanese internment during WW2 or the animosity that has existed for a long time between the Chinese and Japanese and ends up with acts like the Rape of Nanking.

 

[sandorski]

Every response to Geo should be in another language. Try Google Translate.

 

[Geosurface]

I'm getting the feeling that xenophobia is equated to evil. Why?

A very good question.

Not evil, just ignorance. But xenophobia often leads to evil acts. Like the Japanese internment during WW2 or the animosity that has existed for a long time between the Chinese and Japanese and ends up with acts like the Rape of Nanking.

Like anything, xenophobia can be taken too far and become harmful. However, it has a place. It's place is to protect a group from threats. One threat a group can face is to lose their territory to other groups. This is why xenophobia evolved to be hard-coded into us. Anyone who thinks they've extinguished theirs is fooling themselves and likely just hasn't yet encountered the situation which would awaken their inner xenophobe.

If a group didn't concern themselves with holding their territory or didn't care about their female members being dragged off by a competing clan, then that group died out and their genome became a tiny remnant in someone else's.

Are these instincts less relevant to our modern world? Certainly. Are they COMPLETELY obsolete? I think not. He who ignores the instincts which forged his species and have defined its entire history, does so at his own peril and is rocking a monstrous ego.

For anyone who thinks xenophobia has no place in any situation, permit me a silly, hyperbolic example. Let's say a spaceship with 10 billion Martians shows up tomorrow wanting to live among us. Let's also say they require 50 lb. of food and 8 gallons of drinking water per day to live. And to top it off, they follow a religion which forbids any sort of work or contribution to our society. Yet, will only move in with our permission. Think xenophobia might have a function there?

 

[sandorski]

A very good question.



Like anything, xenophobia can be taken too far and become harmful. However, it has a place. It's place is to protect a group from threats. One threat a group can face is to lose their territory to other groups. This is why xenophobia evolved to be hard-coded into us. Anyone who thinks they've extinguished theirs is fooling themselves and likely just hasn't yet encountered the situation which would awaken their inner xenophobe.

If a group didn't concern themselves with holding their territory or didn't care about their female members being dragged off by a competing clan, then that group died out and their genome became a tiny remnant in someone else's.

Are these instincts less relevant to our modern world? Certainly. Are they COMPLETELY obsolete? I think not. He who ignores the instincts which forged his species and have defined its entire history, does so at his own peril and is rocking a monstrous ego.

For anyone who thinks xenophobia has no place in any situation, permit me a silly, hyperbolic example. Let's say a spaceship with 10 billion Martians shows up tomorrow wanting to live among us. Let's also say they require 50 lb. of food and 8 gallons of drinking water per day to live. And to top it off, they follow a religion which forbids any sort of work or contribution to our society. Yet, will only move in with our permission. Think xenophobia might have a function there?

Nyní se snaží ospravedlnit xenofobii? Pěkný.

 

[Vic]

Every response to Geo should be in another language. Try Google Translate.

Google Translate never gets the grammar right.