An explanation of a vote for Kerry

[RobCur]

being a tax payer does not mean you have more privileges then the non tax payer counterpart, actually it's the opposite. it is voluntary but is treated like mandatory. just because you pay taxes does not mean you are part of the government and your opinion does not matter, you are nothing more then a serf who are to serve and to die for their cause.
you have been taught that,
war=peace
slavery=freedom
ignorance=strength

when in truth,
war=destruction
slavery=misery
ignorance=who cares?

slavery comes in the form of taxes, usually very little of it goes to help the poor and the community if any at all. why are most americans in debt? answer: they are enslaved forever till death do they part.

 

[nageov3t]

Originally posted by: slyedog
most of what you wrote is liberal bull shit. the rest is outright lies.

it's all reasonable enough.

I live in Northern New Jersey... a 5 minute trainride away from NYC. pre-9/11, my apartment had a fantastic view of lower manhattan and the world trade center towers. it's near impossible to find someone around here who doesn't know someone who lost a friend or a relative in the attacks. my best friend lost his uncle; my sister lost a friend that she had since they were in high school together.

and most people who were down there that day were pretty tramatized. one of my coworkers was underground in the subway station beneath the trade center when the first plane hit; she spent 2 years in therapy, and I think she still has nightmares about what could have happened if she didn't get out in time. were it not for the fact that I went back to college in 9/1, I'd have been down there with her -- we used to commute together every morning.

 

[amol]

Though I live about 15 miles from Downtown Los Angeles, 2,800 miles away from New York, I still feel for New Yorkers. I also lost someone I know from the horrific events of 9/11; they were on the AA flight from Boston to Los Angeles. Every time I go on the 110 Freeway, right under the US Bank Tower, the Westin Bonaventure, etc (Sure, these aren't HUGE SKYSCRAPERS), I fear that Los Angeles COULD BE the next New York.

I still remember; I was on the 110, and I don't know if it was just me thinking this or if it really happened, but I remember seeing a jumbo 747 over the Staples Center. . . I remember praying for at least 30 minutes!

And yes, I do have people ask me, why did you support Kerry. I give them about 5-8 reasons (depending on who they are), and they don't agree with me. Then I ask them, why do like Bush?

Practically EVERYONE I asked answered, "Because Kerry is dumb."

Psh, what kind of answer is THAT?

 

[miketheidiot]

you can't convince people who don't think, only those who can think can be saved.

 

[Rainsford]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot
you can't convince people who don't think, only those who can think can be saved.

I think you hit the nail right on the head. Who's really willing to listen to all sides and form an intelligent opinion? I think the number if probably less than we would like it to be.

 

[TuxDave]

... nvm... don't want to go into this debate.

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle

of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am writing this
letter because I don't think we know each other.

I think you don't know us. You make a lot of assumptions that could use a little more research.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John Kerry. I used
to live in California, and if I still lived there, I would vote for Kerry. I
used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still lived there, I would vote for
Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those regions.

I am a retired Foreign Service Staff Officer. I live in Alabama. I have lived in NYC and know that it not a place I would want to live. New Yorkers are just too crude.

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think you know me
already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist because I dislike George W.
Bush. You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

I don't attend church and neither do many of my friends in Alabama. I believe in pro-choice, but not as birth control and not paid for by the taxpayer. Most Democratic women I have known had a single very important issue and that was abortion. The best solution to abortion is to make is uneccessary through birth control and care. My wife and I have two children and never had to even consider abortion. Don't play the illness or the rape cards. There simply aren't enough rapes to justify the mad focus on abortion that exists in the liberal camp. This is not an issue of health or human rights. This is an issue of who makes the laws. Judges don't!

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a ?liberal? - - the
dreaded ?L? word - - and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed over evil,
immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But maybe you are still
curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I don't rejoice, I breath a sigh of relief. You had a slimey candidate whose election would have resulted in who knows what disaster for the nation.

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September 11th. I
watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went inside so that I
couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who were inside. I have a friend
who still has nightmares about watching people jump and fall from the Towers. He
will never be the same. How many people like him do you know? People that can't
sit in a restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I used to live in an apartment off Park Avenue. It was across from a joint called the Blazing Inferno. The Puerto Ricans came to the joint every Thursday to make their bulk drug buys. I watched that from my roof. They always had fights - very entertaining. Apartments in NYC suc, living in NYC sucs. You live there voluntarily, making it your problem! For years I plotted escape routes everyplace I went. Now I am retired and don't have to do that anymore. I still do. Hard to break a twenty year old habit. I never whined about it.

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center, which the
government told us is a ?target? of terrorism. Later, we found out they were
relaying very old information, but it was already too late. They had given me
bad dreams again. The subway stop near my office was crowded with bomb-sniffing
dogs, policemen in heavy protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or
exit my office, all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing dog outside
your office?

For twenty years that was my daily life. The embassies have been under threat for decades. You wouldn't know that because, before 911, it hadn't struck close enough to you to be real. Now it is and you whine! I was in San Salvador when the 17 Marines were killed in the restaurant, Mexico City for the earthquake, My best freind had his upper body demolished by the terrorist attack on Nairobi. he doesn't whine. I was in Gulfport when hurricane Camile came through and helped to collect the rotten bodies. Did you try to help with the Trade Centers? I was in La Paz when the Marine house was dynamited and both Bolivian guards were severly injured or killed. I traveled to Cuba lots and armed soldiers always took my passport and ticket.

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My
husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband
should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him,
?Those are our daddy's tools.? How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How
often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I know lots of widows and orphans and none of them got the pay off that the 911 victims did.

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did my parents.
My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I worked my way through
graduate school. I won a full tuition scholarship to law school. All for the
privilege of working 2,600 hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week,
every week, without any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely
leave before 9 p.m. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat dinner
at home. My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more - - once this country
faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social Security. In fact, the
areas of the country that supported Kerry - - New York, California, Illinois,
Massachusetts - - they are the financial centers of the nation. They are the tax
base of this country. How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

I have been working in IT since 1964 and just last year got to the point that I paid $40,000.00 in federal income taxes for the year. You truly make too much money. I went to college when I was 33 years old and worked an IBM territory that was the entire NE part of Alabama. I worked up to 50 hours of O/T per week and did a full load for 3 years and never did finish. My parents were poor and the government didn't help back then. Oh, they did help me. I did that on the GI bill. My last Embassy job, I worked 14 hours a day on the light days. If I had time for lunch, there was no place worth eating in to go to. I was there 18 months before I got a two day weekend. You really have no clue and whine too much!

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for living in
Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But let me tell you how I
see the world: I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I
think we should try to get along with other nations. I see that gay people
exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed to exist, and be treated the
same as other people. I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their
own bodies. Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies. I see that people have awful diseases.

A. I could care less if gays get married. Why should they escape the current corrupt system that administers the law of the womb during divorce proceedings. I would love to see them held legally responsible for something! Awful diseases have been there throughout history. We used to control them through isolation. Think how many thousands of AIDS lives would have been saved by that simple practice. Do you smoke. If you do, you are a part of the problem and not too bright. If you don't, I respect your wisdom. I suppose that the only control over womens bodies that you are referring to is the right to correct a mad night with an abortion. Wouldn't birth control have been so much easier. You play, you pay. If you mess up and need an abortion, I have no issue with that, just don't take money out of my pocket for the procedure if I wasn't there for the event.

Therefore, I think we should enable scientists to try to cure them. I see that
we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld. I see that there
were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

I see that judicial administrative law is OK with RVW, but the constitution is imporatnat for everything else. With the raging profits in the health care industry, where does all the money go. For years, massive research was funded from profits. Why fund stem cell research (which isn't proven) from the taxpayer now. It was stem cell research and taxpayer funding of it that you were reaching for wasn't it?

Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me. It seems so
pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really think voting against
gay marriage will keep people from being gay? Would you really prefer that
people continue to die from Parkinson's disease? Do you really not care about
the Constitutional rights of political detainees? Would you really have
supported the war if you knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more
of our money on health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

Gay marriage, I'm for it - but my reasons don't have lace cuffs. Do you have a cure for Parkinsons? I didn't think so. The political detainees are not subject to our constitution. They were trying to destroy it and if they get into power, that will be the first agenda item for them. I pay for my health care, my job training, and you just spent a paragraph talking about your xray machine. That is terrorism preparedness.

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I love my home
more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside New York City. I first
went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade class, and my mom and dad took
me to the Empire State Building when I was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee
Stadium. I loved living in Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln
Memorial. It is because I love this country so much that I argue with my
political opponents as much I do.

I don't fly an American flag outside my home. I see that as shallow partriotism. I flew it in Vietnam, San Salvador, Mexico City, La Paz, Bogota, Jamaica, Nicaraiga, Costa Rica, Cuba, Ukraine, Canada, Honduras, and several I can't think of on the spur of the moment. I lived in Washington DC for five years. I hated it! Too much traffic!

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in Ohio, and
that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for terrorism
preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and buses every day. I work
in a skyscraper across the street from a ?target.? I have emergency supplies and
a spare pair of sneakers in my desk, in case something happens while I'm at
work. Do you? How many times a month do you worry that your subway is going to
blow up? When you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make
sure everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you dread
beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New Yorker who
doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes, superstitiously praying for
rain so we don't have to relive that beautiful, blue-skied day.

I haven't been safe for my whole life. When I was a kid, it was the water moccasins and allagators. Later it was traffic. Then people shooting at me. Then people blowing up or hijacking airplanes that I may be boarding. For the last few years, it has been the same people trying to blow up the buildings I worked in - same paople! If this is all new to you, you have been truly blessed! The taw truth is that you haven't been truly safe for a good fifteen years and were just too ignorant to know it. 911 shook your world and gave you a view of what many Americans go through on a daily basis.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our friends and
further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of all I feel alienated
from my fellow citizens, because I don't understand what you are thinking. You
voted for a man who started a war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of
the entire world. You voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to
plan has led to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing
into the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden escape
into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war in Iraq. You voted
for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want to love; doesn't
want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want to let women rule their
destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not
enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the
guys. Why did you vote for him? Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order
to persuade us to go to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president
lied about his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperation? Why did you elect a man who did nothing except run
away and hide on September 11?

This is concentrated liberal ignorance coming through the vapors. Bush isn't personable, he is strong! I voted for him because you wanted to elect a candidate who had been a "John Wayne" in Vietnam and you would have trusted the future of our nation to the fool! The best thing he did for the tropops in Vietnam was to only spent 4 months there. Three Purple Hearts in 4 months! There is a message there. I knew boonie rats who spent all of their time in the villes for multiple tours who didn't get even one.

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not survive
this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will never have children,
that I will never grow old and watch the sunset in a backyard of my own. I am
afraid that my career -- which should end with a triumphant and good-natured
roast at a retirement party in 2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and
my colleagues, as we sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary
afternoon. Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

So now you have fear. It is really amazing what a knowledge of reality will bring to you. Welcome to the rest of the world!

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that.

I know what you tried to do and I'm sure glad that fools didn't prevail!

-Anonymous Fellow American



:brokenheart: In hopes for a safer future for all of us.

 

[Darkhawk28]

That was a nice letter Steeple,

As the nephew of a 9/11 survivor (aunt was running for her life out of Tower 7), I think it's quite telling how NYC citizens felt about GWB. You'd think that since he stood on the pile of rubble and stated "They'll all hear from us" and such, that he'd have the full support of those Manhattan folks to "destroy" terrorism. But he didn't, because New Yorkers have a keen sense of the ol' BS meter.

Wait, I know some of you are going to say, NY = liberal = democrat. But that's not the case at all and you know it... NYC mayor = Repub, Gov = Repub, previous NYC mayor = Repub. They took and educated themselves on what GWB was doing and it was DEAD wrong. GWB didn't lose Manhattan by a little bit, it lost about 85% of the vote there.

GWB used 9/11, the biggest political gift in our nation's history, to run a 3-1/4 year "Wag the Dog". Logic would dictate that he would've overwhelmingly had the support of NY'ers. But why didn't he? According to my aunt, NYC folks, naturally, kept more informed about world news than most people. They were aware of GWB picking and choosing intelligence to justify a war in Iraq. They're aware now that GWB had no justification to enter Iraq. They were up-in-arms when GWB pretty much left Afghanistan and the search for Bin Laden. They were aware that the White House outed a CIA agent, which is a treasonous offense (which Novak should go to jail for). They're keenly aware that NYC isn't nearly as safe as it should be. They were disgusted with the RNC for having their convention in MSG and spouting the fear-mongering that they did. They were horrified about the prisons in the abandoned warehouses for people protesting GWB.

But what does my aunt know... she only lives there.

 

[Sultan]

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle

of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am writing this
letter because I don't think we know each other.

I think you don't know us. You make a lot of assumptions that could use a little more research.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John Kerry. I used
to live in California, and if I still lived there, I would vote for Kerry. I
used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still lived there, I would vote for
Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those regions.

I am a retired Foreign Service Staff Officer. I live in Alabama. I have lived in NYC and know that it not a place I would want to live. New Yorkers are just too crude.

"New Yorkers are just too crude."

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think you know me
already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist because I dislike George W.
Bush. You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

I don't attend church and neither do many of my friends in Alabama. I believe in pro-choice, but not as birth control and not paid for by the taxpayer. Most Democratic women I have known had a single very important issue and that was abortion. The best solution to abortion is to make is uneccessary through birth control and care. My wife and I have two children and never had to even consider abortion. Don't play the illness or the rape cards. There simply aren't enough rapes to justify the mad focus on abortion that exists in the liberal camp. This is not an issue of health or human rights. This is an issue of who makes the laws. Judges don't!

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a ?liberal? - - the
dreaded ?L? word - - and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed over evil,
immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But maybe you are still
curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I don't rejoice, I breath a sigh of relief. You had a slimey candidate whose election would have resulted in who knows what disaster for the nation.

"Slimey candidate"

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September 11th. I
watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went inside so that I
couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who were inside. I have a friend
who still has nightmares about watching people jump and fall from the Towers. He
will never be the same. How many people like him do you know? People that can't
sit in a restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I used to live in an apartment off Park Avenue. It was across from a joint called the Blazing Inferno. The Puerto Ricans came to the joint every Thursday to make their bulk drug buys. I watched that from my roof. They always had fights - very entertaining. Apartments in NYC suc, living in NYC sucs. You live there voluntarily, making it your problem! For years I plotted escape routes everyplace I went. Now I am retired and don't have to do that anymore. I still do. Hard to break a twenty year old habit. I never whined about it.

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center, which the
government told us is a ?target? of terrorism. Later, we found out they were
relaying very old information, but it was already too late. They had given me
bad dreams again. The subway stop near my office was crowded with bomb-sniffing
dogs, policemen in heavy protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or
exit my office, all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing dog outside
your office?

For twenty years that was my daily life. The embassies have been under threat for decades. You wouldn't know that because, before 911, it hadn't struck close enough to you to be real. Now it is and you whine! I was in San Salvador when the 17 Marines were killed in the restaurant, Mexico City for the earthquake, My best freind had his upper body demolished by the terrorist attack on Nairobi. he doesn't whine. I was in Gulfport when hurricane Camile came through and helped to collect the rotten bodies. Did you try to help with the Trade Centers? I was in La Paz when the Marine house was dynamited and both Bolivian guards were severly injured or killed. I traveled to Cuba lots and armed soldiers always took my passport and ticket.

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My
husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband
should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him,
?Those are our daddy's tools.? How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How
often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I know lots of widows and orphans and none of them got the pay off that the 911 victims did.

The most cheap statement I have ever heard to make light of the families of the 9/11 victims.

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did my parents.
My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I worked my way through
graduate school. I won a full tuition scholarship to law school. All for the
privilege of working 2,600 hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week,
every week, without any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely
leave before 9 p.m. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat dinner
at home. My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more - - once this country
faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social Security. In fact, the
areas of the country that supported Kerry - - New York, California, Illinois,
Massachusetts - - they are the financial centers of the nation. They are the tax
base of this country. How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

I have been working in IT since 1964 and just last year got to the point that I paid $40,000.00 in federal income taxes for the year. You truly make too much money. I went to college when I was 33 years old and worked an IBM territory that was the entire NE part of Alabama. I worked up to 50 hours of O/T per week and did a full load for 3 years and never did finish. My parents were poor and the government didn't help back then. Oh, they did help me. I did that on the GI bill. My last Embassy job, I worked 14 hours a day on the light days. If I had time for lunch, there was no place worth eating in to go to. I was there 18 months before I got a two day weekend. You really have no clue and whine too much!

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for living in
Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But let me tell you how I
see the world: I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I
think we should try to get along with other nations. I see that gay people
exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed to exist, and be treated the
same as other people. I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their
own bodies. Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies. I see that people have awful diseases.

A. I could care less if gays get married. Why should they escape the current corrupt system that administers the law of the womb during divorce proceedings. I would love to see them held legally responsible for something! Awful diseases have been there throughout history. We used to control them through isolation. Think how many thousands of AIDS lives would have been saved by that simple practice. Do you smoke. If you do, you are a part of the problem and not too bright. If you don't, I respect your wisdom. I suppose that the only control over womens bodies that you are referring to is the right to correct a mad night with an abortion. Wouldn't birth control have been so much easier. You play, you pay. If you mess up and need an abortion, I have no issue with that, just don't take money out of my pocket for the procedure if I wasn't there for the event.

Therefore, I think we should enable scientists to try to cure them. I see that
we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld. I see that there
were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

I see that judicial administrative law is OK with RVW, but the constitution is imporatnat for everything else. With the raging profits in the health care industry, where does all the money go. For years, massive research was funded from profits. Why fund stem cell research (which isn't proven) from the taxpayer now. It was stem cell research and taxpayer funding of it that you were reaching for wasn't it?

Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me. It seems so
pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really think voting against
gay marriage will keep people from being gay? Would you really prefer that
people continue to die from Parkinson's disease? Do you really not care about
the Constitutional rights of political detainees? Would you really have
supported the war if you knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more
of our money on health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

Gay marriage, I'm for it - but my reasons don't have lace cuffs. Do you have a cure for Parkinsons? I didn't think so. The political detainees are not subject to our constitution. They were trying to destroy it and if they get into power, that will be the first agenda item for them. I pay for my health care, my job training, and you just spent a paragraph talking about your xray machine. That is terrorism preparedness.

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I love my home
more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside New York City. I first
went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade class, and my mom and dad took
me to the Empire State Building when I was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee
Stadium. I loved living in Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln
Memorial. It is because I love this country so much that I argue with my
political opponents as much I do.

I don't fly an American flag outside my home. I see that as shallow partriotism. I flew it in Vietnam, San Salvador, Mexico City, La Paz, Bogota, Jamaica, Nicaraiga, Costa Rica, Cuba, Ukraine, Canada, Honduras, and several I can't think of on the spur of the moment. I lived in Washington DC for five years. I hated it! Too much traffic!

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in Ohio, and
that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for terrorism
preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and buses every day. I work
in a skyscraper across the street from a ?target.? I have emergency supplies and
a spare pair of sneakers in my desk, in case something happens while I'm at
work. Do you? How many times a month do you worry that your subway is going to
blow up? When you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make
sure everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you dread
beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New Yorker who
doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes, superstitiously praying for
rain so we don't have to relive that beautiful, blue-skied day.

I haven't been safe for my whole life. When I was a kid, it was the water moccasins and allagators. Later it was traffic. Then people shooting at me. Then people blowing up or hijacking airplanes that I may be boarding. For the last few years, it has been the same people trying to blow up the buildings I worked in - same paople! If this is all new to you, you have been truly blessed! The taw truth is that you haven't been truly safe for a good fifteen years and were just too ignorant to know it. 911 shook your world and gave you a view of what many Americans go through on a daily basis.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our friends and
further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of all I feel alienated
from my fellow citizens, because I don't understand what you are thinking. You
voted for a man who started a war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of
the entire world. You voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to
plan has led to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing
into the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden escape
into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war in Iraq. You voted
for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want to love; doesn't
want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want to let women rule their
destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not
enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the
guys. Why did you vote for him? Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order
to persuade us to go to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president
lied about his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperation? Why did you elect a man who did nothing except run
away and hide on September 11?

This is concentrated liberal ignorance coming through the vapors. Bush isn't personable, he is strong! I voted for him because you wanted to elect a candidate who had been a "John Wayne" in Vietnam and you would have trusted the future of our nation to the fool! The best thing he did for the tropops in Vietnam was to only spent 4 months there. Three Purple Hearts in 4 months! There is a message there. I knew boonie rats who spent all of their time in the villes for multiple tours who didn't get even one.

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not survive
this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will never have children,
that I will never grow old and watch the sunset in a backyard of my own. I am
afraid that my career -- which should end with a triumphant and good-natured
roast at a retirement party in 2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and
my colleagues, as we sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary
afternoon. Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

So now you have fear. It is really amazing what a knowledge of reality will bring to you. Welcome to the rest of the world!

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that.

I know what you tried to do and I'm sure glad that fools didn't prevail!

"...glad that fools didnt prevail"

-Anonymous Fellow American



:brokenheart: In hopes for a safer future for all of us.

My question in light of the above: do we really need to fear people like OBL when we have people like Condor in America?

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle

of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am writing this
letter because I don't think we know each other.

I think you don't know us. You make a lot of assumptions that could use a little more research.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John Kerry. I used
to live in California, and if I still lived there, I would vote for Kerry. I
used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still lived there, I would vote for
Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those regions.

I am a retired Foreign Service Staff Officer. I live in Alabama. I have lived in NYC and know that it not a place I would want to live. New Yorkers are just too crude.

"New Yorkers are just too crude."

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think you know me
already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist because I dislike George W.
Bush. You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

I don't attend church and neither do many of my friends in Alabama. I believe in pro-choice, but not as birth control and not paid for by the taxpayer. Most Democratic women I have known had a single very important issue and that was abortion. The best solution to abortion is to make is uneccessary through birth control and care. My wife and I have two children and never had to even consider abortion. Don't play the illness or the rape cards. There simply aren't enough rapes to justify the mad focus on abortion that exists in the liberal camp. This is not an issue of health or human rights. This is an issue of who makes the laws. Judges don't!

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a ?liberal? - - the
dreaded ?L? word - - and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed over evil,
immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But maybe you are still
curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I don't rejoice, I breath a sigh of relief. You had a slimey candidate whose election would have resulted in who knows what disaster for the nation.

"Slimey candidate"

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September 11th. I
watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went inside so that I
couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who were inside. I have a friend
who still has nightmares about watching people jump and fall from the Towers. He
will never be the same. How many people like him do you know? People that can't
sit in a restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I used to live in an apartment off Park Avenue. It was across from a joint called the Blazing Inferno. The Puerto Ricans came to the joint every Thursday to make their bulk drug buys. I watched that from my roof. They always had fights - very entertaining. Apartments in NYC suc, living in NYC sucs. You live there voluntarily, making it your problem! For years I plotted escape routes everyplace I went. Now I am retired and don't have to do that anymore. I still do. Hard to break a twenty year old habit. I never whined about it.

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center, which the
government told us is a ?target? of terrorism. Later, we found out they were
relaying very old information, but it was already too late. They had given me
bad dreams again. The subway stop near my office was crowded with bomb-sniffing
dogs, policemen in heavy protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or
exit my office, all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing dog outside
your office?

For twenty years that was my daily life. The embassies have been under threat for decades. You wouldn't know that because, before 911, it hadn't struck close enough to you to be real. Now it is and you whine! I was in San Salvador when the 17 Marines were killed in the restaurant, Mexico City for the earthquake, My best freind had his upper body demolished by the terrorist attack on Nairobi. he doesn't whine. I was in Gulfport when hurricane Camile came through and helped to collect the rotten bodies. Did you try to help with the Trade Centers? I was in La Paz when the Marine house was dynamited and both Bolivian guards were severly injured or killed. I traveled to Cuba lots and armed soldiers always took my passport and ticket.

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My
husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband
should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him,
?Those are our daddy's tools.? How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How
often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I know lots of widows and orphans and none of them got the pay off that the 911 victims did.

The most cheap statement I have ever heard to make light of the families of the 9/11 victims.

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did my parents.
My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I worked my way through
graduate school. I won a full tuition scholarship to law school. All for the
privilege of working 2,600 hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week,
every week, without any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely
leave before 9 p.m. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat dinner
at home. My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more - - once this country
faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social Security. In fact, the
areas of the country that supported Kerry - - New York, California, Illinois,
Massachusetts - - they are the financial centers of the nation. They are the tax
base of this country. How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

I have been working in IT since 1964 and just last year got to the point that I paid $40,000.00 in federal income taxes for the year. You truly make too much money. I went to college when I was 33 years old and worked an IBM territory that was the entire NE part of Alabama. I worked up to 50 hours of O/T per week and did a full load for 3 years and never did finish. My parents were poor and the government didn't help back then. Oh, they did help me. I did that on the GI bill. My last Embassy job, I worked 14 hours a day on the light days. If I had time for lunch, there was no place worth eating in to go to. I was there 18 months before I got a two day weekend. You really have no clue and whine too much!

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for living in
Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But let me tell you how I
see the world: I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I
think we should try to get along with other nations. I see that gay people
exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed to exist, and be treated the
same as other people. I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their
own bodies. Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies. I see that people have awful diseases.

A. I could care less if gays get married. Why should they escape the current corrupt system that administers the law of the womb during divorce proceedings. I would love to see them held legally responsible for something! Awful diseases have been there throughout history. We used to control them through isolation. Think how many thousands of AIDS lives would have been saved by that simple practice. Do you smoke. If you do, you are a part of the problem and not too bright. If you don't, I respect your wisdom. I suppose that the only control over womens bodies that you are referring to is the right to correct a mad night with an abortion. Wouldn't birth control have been so much easier. You play, you pay. If you mess up and need an abortion, I have no issue with that, just don't take money out of my pocket for the procedure if I wasn't there for the event.

Therefore, I think we should enable scientists to try to cure them. I see that
we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld. I see that there
were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

I see that judicial administrative law is OK with RVW, but the constitution is imporatnat for everything else. With the raging profits in the health care industry, where does all the money go. For years, massive research was funded from profits. Why fund stem cell research (which isn't proven) from the taxpayer now. It was stem cell research and taxpayer funding of it that you were reaching for wasn't it?

Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me. It seems so
pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really think voting against
gay marriage will keep people from being gay? Would you really prefer that
people continue to die from Parkinson's disease? Do you really not care about
the Constitutional rights of political detainees? Would you really have
supported the war if you knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more
of our money on health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

Gay marriage, I'm for it - but my reasons don't have lace cuffs. Do you have a cure for Parkinsons? I didn't think so. The political detainees are not subject to our constitution. They were trying to destroy it and if they get into power, that will be the first agenda item for them. I pay for my health care, my job training, and you just spent a paragraph talking about your xray machine. That is terrorism preparedness.

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I love my home
more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside New York City. I first
went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade class, and my mom and dad took
me to the Empire State Building when I was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee
Stadium. I loved living in Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln
Memorial. It is because I love this country so much that I argue with my
political opponents as much I do.

I don't fly an American flag outside my home. I see that as shallow partriotism. I flew it in Vietnam, San Salvador, Mexico City, La Paz, Bogota, Jamaica, Nicaraiga, Costa Rica, Cuba, Ukraine, Canada, Honduras, and several I can't think of on the spur of the moment. I lived in Washington DC for five years. I hated it! Too much traffic!

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in Ohio, and
that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for terrorism
preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and buses every day. I work
in a skyscraper across the street from a ?target.? I have emergency supplies and
a spare pair of sneakers in my desk, in case something happens while I'm at
work. Do you? How many times a month do you worry that your subway is going to
blow up? When you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make
sure everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you dread
beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New Yorker who
doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes, superstitiously praying for
rain so we don't have to relive that beautiful, blue-skied day.

I haven't been safe for my whole life. When I was a kid, it was the water moccasins and allagators. Later it was traffic. Then people shooting at me. Then people blowing up or hijacking airplanes that I may be boarding. For the last few years, it has been the same people trying to blow up the buildings I worked in - same paople! If this is all new to you, you have been truly blessed! The taw truth is that you haven't been truly safe for a good fifteen years and were just too ignorant to know it. 911 shook your world and gave you a view of what many Americans go through on a daily basis.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our friends and
further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of all I feel alienated
from my fellow citizens, because I don't understand what you are thinking. You
voted for a man who started a war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of
the entire world. You voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to
plan has led to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing
into the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden escape
into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war in Iraq. You voted
for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want to love; doesn't
want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want to let women rule their
destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not
enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the
guys. Why did you vote for him? Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order
to persuade us to go to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president
lied about his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperation? Why did you elect a man who did nothing except run
away and hide on September 11?

This is concentrated liberal ignorance coming through the vapors. Bush isn't personable, he is strong! I voted for him because you wanted to elect a candidate who had been a "John Wayne" in Vietnam and you would have trusted the future of our nation to the fool! The best thing he did for the tropops in Vietnam was to only spent 4 months there. Three Purple Hearts in 4 months! There is a message there. I knew boonie rats who spent all of their time in the villes for multiple tours who didn't get even one.

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not survive
this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will never have children,
that I will never grow old and watch the sunset in a backyard of my own. I am
afraid that my career -- which should end with a triumphant and good-natured
roast at a retirement party in 2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and
my colleagues, as we sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary
afternoon. Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

So now you have fear. It is really amazing what a knowledge of reality will bring to you. Welcome to the rest of the world!

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that.

I know what you tried to do and I'm sure glad that fools didn't prevail!

"...glad that fools didnt prevail"

-Anonymous Fellow American



:brokenheart: In hopes for a safer future for all of us.

My question in light of the above: do we really need to fear people like OBL when we have people like Condor in America?

Condor's like just proves that letter to be overwhelmingly true.

 

[slyedog]

quoted from gutharius:
===============================================================
[I DEMAND AN APOLOGY AND DELETION OF YOUR COMMENT ON SIMPLE MORAL GROUNDS!
===========================================================

i was taught to always tell the truth and that is what i did. AND WHO IN THE HELL ARE YOU TO
DEMAND THAT I MAKE AN APOLOGY?

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Tylanner
This man seems un-informed on the role of an American President.

Did you read the letter? It was written by a woman.

A very scared and frightened woman which she doesn't realize that fear is what the Bush Regime capitilized on better than the Dems. Bush's Political machine recruited the Fearing Relgious Radicals in rural America into thier camp.

She is a woman that clearly doesn't understand Politics at all.

She doesn't understand how weak feeble minds outside of the major cities can be brainwashed so easily, can't fault her for that since she has never lived in one of these weak minded folk areas.

She would understand if she was one of the many New Yorkers that relocated to some of the weak minded areas like Florida or Alabama, Georgia or Louisiana.

Maybe she'll learn over the next 4 years, maybe more Dems will learn or they will fade away more.

We'll see.

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Tylanner
This man seems un-informed on the role of an American President.

Did you read the letter? It was written by a woman.

hahahahaha

Sorry, I'm just laughing because I just read this comment by Format in the DoI thread...

You know, its kinda hard to take seriously the opinions of those of you that can't even figure out the principle is not a HE. HE is a SHE, and I don't see how anybody that actually READ the OP could have NOT known that. Obviously some of you are just running off at the mouth without even putting forth the effort to see what it is you're talking about.

Am I safe in ASSUMING that Format won't bother to say the same to Tylanner?


:laugh:

 

[Darkhawk28]

Originally posted by: Gaard

Originally posted by: dmcowen674

Originally posted by: Tylanner
This man seems un-informed on the role of an American President.

Did you read the letter? It was written by a woman.

hahahahaha

Sorry, I'm just laughing because I just read this comment by Format in the DoI thread...

You know, its kinda hard to take seriously the opinions of those of you that can't even figure out the principle is not a HE. HE is a SHE, and I don't see how anybody that actually READ the OP could have NOT known that. Obviously some of you are just running off at the mouth without even putting forth the effort to see what it is you're talking about.

Am I safe in ASSUMING that Format won't bother to say the same to Tylanner?


:laugh:

Shhhhhhhhh.... you may distuwb the sweeping neocons.... heheheheheheheheheh

 

[imported_Condor]

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle

of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am writing this
letter because I don't think we know each other.

I think you don't know us. You make a lot of assumptions that could use a little more research.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John Kerry. I used
to live in California, and if I still lived there, I would vote for Kerry. I
used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still lived there, I would vote for
Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those regions.

I am a retired Foreign Service Staff Officer. I live in Alabama. I have lived in NYC and know that it not a place I would want to live. New Yorkers are just too crude.

"New Yorkers are just too crude."

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think you know me
already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist because I dislike George W.
Bush. You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

I don't attend church and neither do many of my friends in Alabama. I believe in pro-choice, but not as birth control and not paid for by the taxpayer. Most Democratic women I have known had a single very important issue and that was abortion. The best solution to abortion is to make is uneccessary through birth control and care. My wife and I have two children and never had to even consider abortion. Don't play the illness or the rape cards. There simply aren't enough rapes to justify the mad focus on abortion that exists in the liberal camp. This is not an issue of health or human rights. This is an issue of who makes the laws. Judges don't!

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a ?liberal? - - the
dreaded ?L? word - - and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed over evil,
immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But maybe you are still
curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I don't rejoice, I breath a sigh of relief. You had a slimey candidate whose election would have resulted in who knows what disaster for the nation.

"Slimey candidate"

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September 11th. I
watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went inside so that I
couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who were inside. I have a friend
who still has nightmares about watching people jump and fall from the Towers. He
will never be the same. How many people like him do you know? People that can't
sit in a restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I used to live in an apartment off Park Avenue. It was across from a joint called the Blazing Inferno. The Puerto Ricans came to the joint every Thursday to make their bulk drug buys. I watched that from my roof. They always had fights - very entertaining. Apartments in NYC suc, living in NYC sucs. You live there voluntarily, making it your problem! For years I plotted escape routes everyplace I went. Now I am retired and don't have to do that anymore. I still do. Hard to break a twenty year old habit. I never whined about it.

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center, which the
government told us is a ?target? of terrorism. Later, we found out they were
relaying very old information, but it was already too late. They had given me
bad dreams again. The subway stop near my office was crowded with bomb-sniffing
dogs, policemen in heavy protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or
exit my office, all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing dog outside
your office?

For twenty years that was my daily life. The embassies have been under threat for decades. You wouldn't know that because, before 911, it hadn't struck close enough to you to be real. Now it is and you whine! I was in San Salvador when the 17 Marines were killed in the restaurant, Mexico City for the earthquake, My best freind had his upper body demolished by the terrorist attack on Nairobi. he doesn't whine. I was in Gulfport when hurricane Camile came through and helped to collect the rotten bodies. Did you try to help with the Trade Centers? I was in La Paz when the Marine house was dynamited and both Bolivian guards were severly injured or killed. I traveled to Cuba lots and armed soldiers always took my passport and ticket.

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My
husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband
should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him,
?Those are our daddy's tools.? How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How
often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I know lots of widows and orphans and none of them got the pay off that the 911 victims did.

The most cheap statement I have ever heard to make light of the families of the 9/11 victims.

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did my parents.
My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I worked my way through
graduate school. I won a full tuition scholarship to law school. All for the
privilege of working 2,600 hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week,
every week, without any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely
leave before 9 p.m. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat dinner
at home. My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more - - once this country
faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social Security. In fact, the
areas of the country that supported Kerry - - New York, California, Illinois,
Massachusetts - - they are the financial centers of the nation. They are the tax
base of this country. How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

I have been working in IT since 1964 and just last year got to the point that I paid $40,000.00 in federal income taxes for the year. You truly make too much money. I went to college when I was 33 years old and worked an IBM territory that was the entire NE part of Alabama. I worked up to 50 hours of O/T per week and did a full load for 3 years and never did finish. My parents were poor and the government didn't help back then. Oh, they did help me. I did that on the GI bill. My last Embassy job, I worked 14 hours a day on the light days. If I had time for lunch, there was no place worth eating in to go to. I was there 18 months before I got a two day weekend. You really have no clue and whine too much!

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for living in
Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But let me tell you how I
see the world: I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I
think we should try to get along with other nations. I see that gay people
exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed to exist, and be treated the
same as other people. I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their
own bodies. Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies. I see that people have awful diseases.

A. I could care less if gays get married. Why should they escape the current corrupt system that administers the law of the womb during divorce proceedings. I would love to see them held legally responsible for something! Awful diseases have been there throughout history. We used to control them through isolation. Think how many thousands of AIDS lives would have been saved by that simple practice. Do you smoke. If you do, you are a part of the problem and not too bright. If you don't, I respect your wisdom. I suppose that the only control over womens bodies that you are referring to is the right to correct a mad night with an abortion. Wouldn't birth control have been so much easier. You play, you pay. If you mess up and need an abortion, I have no issue with that, just don't take money out of my pocket for the procedure if I wasn't there for the event.

Therefore, I think we should enable scientists to try to cure them. I see that
we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld. I see that there
were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

I see that judicial administrative law is OK with RVW, but the constitution is imporatnat for everything else. With the raging profits in the health care industry, where does all the money go. For years, massive research was funded from profits. Why fund stem cell research (which isn't proven) from the taxpayer now. It was stem cell research and taxpayer funding of it that you were reaching for wasn't it?

Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me. It seems so
pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really think voting against
gay marriage will keep people from being gay? Would you really prefer that
people continue to die from Parkinson's disease? Do you really not care about
the Constitutional rights of political detainees? Would you really have
supported the war if you knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more
of our money on health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

Gay marriage, I'm for it - but my reasons don't have lace cuffs. Do you have a cure for Parkinsons? I didn't think so. The political detainees are not subject to our constitution. They were trying to destroy it and if they get into power, that will be the first agenda item for them. I pay for my health care, my job training, and you just spent a paragraph talking about your xray machine. That is terrorism preparedness.

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I love my home
more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside New York City. I first
went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade class, and my mom and dad took
me to the Empire State Building when I was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee
Stadium. I loved living in Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln
Memorial. It is because I love this country so much that I argue with my
political opponents as much I do.

I don't fly an American flag outside my home. I see that as shallow partriotism. I flew it in Vietnam, San Salvador, Mexico City, La Paz, Bogota, Jamaica, Nicaraiga, Costa Rica, Cuba, Ukraine, Canada, Honduras, and several I can't think of on the spur of the moment. I lived in Washington DC for five years. I hated it! Too much traffic!

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in Ohio, and
that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for terrorism
preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and buses every day. I work
in a skyscraper across the street from a ?target.? I have emergency supplies and
a spare pair of sneakers in my desk, in case something happens while I'm at
work. Do you? How many times a month do you worry that your subway is going to
blow up? When you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make
sure everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you dread
beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New Yorker who
doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes, superstitiously praying for
rain so we don't have to relive that beautiful, blue-skied day.

I haven't been safe for my whole life. When I was a kid, it was the water moccasins and allagators. Later it was traffic. Then people shooting at me. Then people blowing up or hijacking airplanes that I may be boarding. For the last few years, it has been the same people trying to blow up the buildings I worked in - same paople! If this is all new to you, you have been truly blessed! The taw truth is that you haven't been truly safe for a good fifteen years and were just too ignorant to know it. 911 shook your world and gave you a view of what many Americans go through on a daily basis.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our friends and
further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of all I feel alienated
from my fellow citizens, because I don't understand what you are thinking. You
voted for a man who started a war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of
the entire world. You voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to
plan has led to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing
into the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden escape
into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war in Iraq. You voted
for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want to love; doesn't
want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want to let women rule their
destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not
enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the
guys. Why did you vote for him? Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order
to persuade us to go to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president
lied about his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperation? Why did you elect a man who did nothing except run
away and hide on September 11?

This is concentrated liberal ignorance coming through the vapors. Bush isn't personable, he is strong! I voted for him because you wanted to elect a candidate who had been a "John Wayne" in Vietnam and you would have trusted the future of our nation to the fool! The best thing he did for the tropops in Vietnam was to only spent 4 months there. Three Purple Hearts in 4 months! There is a message there. I knew boonie rats who spent all of their time in the villes for multiple tours who didn't get even one.

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not survive
this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will never have children,
that I will never grow old and watch the sunset in a backyard of my own. I am
afraid that my career -- which should end with a triumphant and good-natured
roast at a retirement party in 2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and
my colleagues, as we sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary
afternoon. Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

So now you have fear. It is really amazing what a knowledge of reality will bring to you. Welcome to the rest of the world!

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that.

I know what you tried to do and I'm sure glad that fools didn't prevail!

"...glad that fools didnt prevail"

-Anonymous Fellow American



:brokenheart: In hopes for a safer future for all of us.

My question in light of the above: do we really need to fear people like OBL when we have people like Condor in America?

Your focus should be that there are a lot of people like me in America!

 

[Klixxer]

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: Sultan

Originally posted by: Condor

Originally posted by: Steeplerot
I am writing this letter to the people in the red states in the middle

of the country -- the people who voted for George W. Bush. I am writing this
letter because I don't think we know each other.

I think you don't know us. You make a lot of assumptions that could use a little more research.

So I'll make an introduction. I am a New Yorker who voted for John Kerry. I used
to live in California, and if I still lived there, I would vote for Kerry. I
used to live in Washington, DC, and if I still lived there, I would vote for
Kerry. Kerry won in all three of those regions.

I am a retired Foreign Service Staff Officer. I live in Alabama. I have lived in NYC and know that it not a place I would want to live. New Yorkers are just too crude.

"New Yorkers are just too crude."

Maybe you want to know more about me. Or maybe not; maybe you think you know me
already. You think I am some anti-American anarchist because I dislike George W.
Bush. You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

I don't attend church and neither do many of my friends in Alabama. I believe in pro-choice, but not as birth control and not paid for by the taxpayer. Most Democratic women I have known had a single very important issue and that was abortion. The best solution to abortion is to make is uneccessary through birth control and care. My wife and I have two children and never had to even consider abortion. Don't play the illness or the rape cards. There simply aren't enough rapes to justify the mad focus on abortion that exists in the liberal camp. This is not an issue of health or human rights. This is an issue of who makes the laws. Judges don't!

Maybe you are content to think that, to write me off as a ?liberal? - - the
dreaded ?L? word - - and rejoice that your candidate has triumphed over evil,
immoral, anti-American, anti-family people like me. But maybe you are still
curious. So here goes: this is who I am.

I don't rejoice, I breath a sigh of relief. You had a slimey candidate whose election would have resulted in who knows what disaster for the nation.

"Slimey candidate"

I am a New Yorker. I was here, in my apartment downtown, on September 11th. I
watched the Towers burn from the roof of my building. I went inside so that I
couldn't see them when they fell. I had friends who were inside. I have a friend
who still has nightmares about watching people jump and fall from the Towers. He
will never be the same. How many people like him do you know? People that can't
sit in a restaurant without plotting an escape route, in case it blows up?

I used to live in an apartment off Park Avenue. It was across from a joint called the Blazing Inferno. The Puerto Ricans came to the joint every Thursday to make their bulk drug buys. I watched that from my roof. They always had fights - very entertaining. Apartments in NYC suc, living in NYC sucs. You live there voluntarily, making it your problem! For years I plotted escape routes everyplace I went. Now I am retired and don't have to do that anymore. I still do. Hard to break a twenty year old habit. I never whined about it.

I am a worker. I work across the street from the Citigroup Center, which the
government told us is a ?target? of terrorism. Later, we found out they were
relaying very old information, but it was already too late. They had given me
bad dreams again. The subway stop near my office was crowded with bomb-sniffing
dogs, policemen in heavy protective gear, soldiers. Now, every time I enter or
exit my office, all of my possessions are X-rayed to make sure I don't have any
weapons. How often are you stopped by a soldier with a bomb-sniffing dog outside
your office?

For twenty years that was my daily life. The embassies have been under threat for decades. You wouldn't know that because, before 911, it hadn't struck close enough to you to be real. Now it is and you whine! I was in San Salvador when the 17 Marines were killed in the restaurant, Mexico City for the earthquake, My best freind had his upper body demolished by the terrorist attack on Nairobi. he doesn't whine. I was in Gulfport when hurricane Camile came through and helped to collect the rotten bodies. Did you try to help with the Trade Centers? I was in La Paz when the Marine house was dynamited and both Bolivian guards were severly injured or killed. I traveled to Cuba lots and armed soldiers always took my passport and ticket.

I am a neighbor. I have a neighbor who is a 9/11 widow. She has two children. My
husband does odd jobs for her now, like building bookshelves. Things her husband
should do. He uses her husband's tools, and the two little girls tell him,
?Those are our daddy's tools.? How many 9/11 widows and orphans do you know? How
often do you fill in for their dead loved ones?

I know lots of widows and orphans and none of them got the pay off that the 911 victims did.

The most cheap statement I have ever heard to make light of the families of the 9/11 victims.

I am a taxpayer. I worked my butt off to get where I did, and so did my parents.
My parents saved and borrowed and sent me to college. I worked my way through
graduate school. I won a full tuition scholarship to law school. All for the
privilege of working 2,600 hours last year. That works out to a 50 hour week,
every week, without any vacation days at all. I get to work by 9 am and rarely
leave before 9 p.m. I eat dinner at my office much more often than I eat dinner
at home. My husband and I paid over $70,000 in federal income tax last year. At
some point in the future, we will have to pay much more - - once this country
faces its deficit and the impossible burden of Social Security. In fact, the
areas of the country that supported Kerry - - New York, California, Illinois,
Massachusetts - - they are the financial centers of the nation. They are the tax
base of this country. How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

I have been working in IT since 1964 and just last year got to the point that I paid $40,000.00 in federal income taxes for the year. You truly make too much money. I went to college when I was 33 years old and worked an IBM territory that was the entire NE part of Alabama. I worked up to 50 hours of O/T per week and did a full load for 3 years and never did finish. My parents were poor and the government didn't help back then. Oh, they did help me. I did that on the GI bill. My last Embassy job, I worked 14 hours a day on the light days. If I had time for lunch, there was no place worth eating in to go to. I was there 18 months before I got a two day weekend. You really have no clue and whine too much!

I am a liberal. The funny part is, liberals have this reputation for living in
Never-Neverland, being idealists, not being sensible. But let me tell you how I
see the world: I see America as one nation in a world of nations. Therefore, I
think we should try to get along with other nations. I see that gay people
exist. Therefore, I think they should be allowed to exist, and be treated the
same as other people. I see ways in which women are not allowed to control their
own bodies. Therefore, I think we should give women more control over their
bodies. I see that people have awful diseases.

A. I could care less if gays get married. Why should they escape the current corrupt system that administers the law of the womb during divorce proceedings. I would love to see them held legally responsible for something! Awful diseases have been there throughout history. We used to control them through isolation. Think how many thousands of AIDS lives would have been saved by that simple practice. Do you smoke. If you do, you are a part of the problem and not too bright. If you don't, I respect your wisdom. I suppose that the only control over womens bodies that you are referring to is the right to correct a mad night with an abortion. Wouldn't birth control have been so much easier. You play, you pay. If you mess up and need an abortion, I have no issue with that, just don't take money out of my pocket for the procedure if I wasn't there for the event.

Therefore, I think we should enable scientists to try to cure them. I see that
we have a Constitution. Therefore, I think it should be upheld. I see that there
were no weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.

I see that judicial administrative law is OK with RVW, but the constitution is imporatnat for everything else. With the raging profits in the health care industry, where does all the money go. For years, massive research was funded from profits. Why fund stem cell research (which isn't proven) from the taxpayer now. It was stem cell research and taxpayer funding of it that you were reaching for wasn't it?

Therefore, I think that Iraq was not an imminent danger to me. It seems so
pragmatic to me. How do you see the world? Do you really think voting against
gay marriage will keep people from being gay? Would you really prefer that
people continue to die from Parkinson's disease? Do you really not care about
the Constitutional rights of political detainees? Would you really have
supported the war if you knew the truth, or would you have wanted to spend more
of our money on health care, job training, terrorism preparedness?

Gay marriage, I'm for it - but my reasons don't have lace cuffs. Do you have a cure for Parkinsons? I didn't think so. The political detainees are not subject to our constitution. They were trying to destroy it and if they get into power, that will be the first agenda item for them. I pay for my health care, my job training, and you just spent a paragraph talking about your xray machine. That is terrorism preparedness.

I am an American. I have an American flag flying outside my home. I love my home
more than anything. I love that I grew up right outside New York City. I first
went to the Statue of Liberty with my 5th grade class, and my mom and dad took
me to the Empire State Building when I was 8. I love taking the subway to Yankee
Stadium. I loved living in Washington DC and going on dates to the Lincoln
Memorial. It is because I love this country so much that I argue with my
political opponents as much I do.

I don't fly an American flag outside my home. I see that as shallow partriotism. I flew it in Vietnam, San Salvador, Mexico City, La Paz, Bogota, Jamaica, Nicaraiga, Costa Rica, Cuba, Ukraine, Canada, Honduras, and several I can't think of on the spur of the moment. I lived in Washington DC for five years. I hated it! Too much traffic!

I am not safe. I never feel safe. My in-laws live in a small town in Ohio, and
that town has received more federal funding, per capita, for terrorism
preparedness than New York City has. I take subways and buses every day. I work
in a skyscraper across the street from a ?target.? I have emergency supplies and
a spare pair of sneakers in my desk, in case something happens while I'm at
work. Do you? How many times a month do you worry that your subway is going to
blow up? When you hear sirens on the street, do you run to the window to make
sure everything is okay? When you hear an airplane, do you flinch? Do you dread
beautiful, blue-skied September days? I don't know a single New Yorker who
doesn't spend the month of September on tip-toes, superstitiously praying for
rain so we don't have to relive that beautiful, blue-skied day.

I haven't been safe for my whole life. When I was a kid, it was the water moccasins and allagators. Later it was traffic. Then people shooting at me. Then people blowing up or hijacking airplanes that I may be boarding. For the last few years, it has been the same people trying to blow up the buildings I worked in - same paople! If this is all new to you, you have been truly blessed! The taw truth is that you haven't been truly safe for a good fifteen years and were just too ignorant to know it. 911 shook your world and gave you a view of what many Americans go through on a daily basis.

I am lonely. I feel that we, as a nation, have alienated all our friends and
further provoked our enemies. I feel unprotected. Most of all I feel alienated
from my fellow citizens, because I don't understand what you are thinking. You
voted for a man who started a war in Iraq for no reason, against the wishes of
the entire world. You voted for a man whose lack of foresight and inability to
plan has led to massive insurgencies in Iraq, where weapons are disappearing
into the hands of terrorists. You voted for a man who let Osama Bin Laden escape
into the hills of Afghanistan so that he could start that war in Iraq. You voted
for a man who doesn't want to let people love who they want to love; doesn't
want to let doctors cure their patients; doesn't want to let women rule their
destinies. I don't understand why you voted for this man. For me, it is not
enough that he is personable; it is not enough that he seems like one of the
guys. Why did you vote for him? Why did you elect a man that lied to us in order
to persuade us to go to war? (Ten years ago you were incensed when our president
lied about his sex life; you thought it was an impeachable offense.) Why did you
elect a leader who thinks that strength cannot include diplomacy or
international cooperation? Why did you elect a man who did nothing except run
away and hide on September 11?

This is concentrated liberal ignorance coming through the vapors. Bush isn't personable, he is strong! I voted for him because you wanted to elect a candidate who had been a "John Wayne" in Vietnam and you would have trusted the future of our nation to the fool! The best thing he did for the tropops in Vietnam was to only spent 4 months there. Three Purple Hearts in 4 months! There is a message there. I knew boonie rats who spent all of their time in the villes for multiple tours who didn't get even one.

Most of all, I am terrified. I mean daily, I am afraid that I will not survive
this. I am afraid that I will lose my husband, that I will never have children,
that I will never grow old and watch the sunset in a backyard of my own. I am
afraid that my career -- which should end with a triumphant and good-natured
roast at a retirement party in 2035 -- will be cut short by an attack on me and
my colleagues, as we sit sending emails and making phone calls one ordinary
afternoon. Is your life at stake? Are you terrified?

So now you have fear. It is really amazing what a knowledge of reality will bring to you. Welcome to the rest of the world!

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that.

I know what you tried to do and I'm sure glad that fools didn't prevail!

"...glad that fools didnt prevail"

-Anonymous Fellow American



:brokenheart: In hopes for a safer future for all of us.

My question in light of the above: do we really need to fear people like OBL when we have people like Condor in America?

Your focus should be that there are a lot of people like me in America!

The land of the free has become the land of the extremely dense?

Honestly, you are stupid beyond all belief, you will buy any statement as long as it is against something that does not refer to you or your beliefs.

You are against so very many things instead of being tolerant, and the most ironic thing of all is that you consider yourself to be a tolerant man.

If evolution does indeed work, you won't procreate and that makes me smile.

 

[slyedog]

winstonsmith quote:
==================================================================
You probably haven't gotten out of your region much, and being born in the South, I understand the contempt some there have for "Yankees". You probably are quite young and haven't had much life experience. Never been to war. Probably never seen death by violence. People in NY had a big shock, and some of them are still troubled by it. That's understandable. What is curious though is that many with your perspective cry for the war based on 9/11 and how horrible it was, yet when one of those affected states how they feel they are spouting liberal bullshit and lies.
=================================================================
for your information, i spent four years in the us navy. l consider my self lucky because the military
action in korea was ending when i entered the navy. but being aboard ship with around 70% of the men having gone through the korean war, i learned a lot abt wars and how bad they are. i also learned abt
men willing to die for the love of their country. and i despise anyone that is anti-american.
i saw all of the countries in the pacific and south america. also visited the big cities on the east coast
and the west coast. so lib, what branch of the military were you in and what countries did you see
while in the military?

 

[Steeplerot]

Passing through bases is not experiencing them any more then passing through on a greyhound.

 

[Gaard]

Originally posted by: slyedog
and i despise anyone that is anti-american.

You should probably define what this is.

 

[Transistor]

You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

To try to categorize everyone in the "red states" as religious fanatics is very irresponsible. Abortion, gay rights, and religion are not important topics to many Bush supporters. You make way too many assumptions.

How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

Because you think you pay more taxes you think you think you are on some sort of higher ground and should have more of a say-so? Pathetic. Unfortunately for you, the political system doesn't work that way.

I am not safe...

Buy an assault rifle. The stupid ban has been lifted and they are available for your purchase once again.

I am lonely...

Voting for Kerry would have not fixed that problem, however I'm sure Bill Clinton will be glad to help you.

[/quote]I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that. [/quote]

Wow. That was really weak. Blame democracy. America voted and it was the biggest win in over 50 years. Maybe you would feel more secure in Sadam's former regime where people had no choice?

Maybe everyone should have voted the way Osma told us to so that nothing would happen. You sound like you are living in fear. Osma would be proud if he read this. Weak, fearful people like you are the reason terrorism works.

You spew a bunch of BS that you learned from moveon.org and Michael More movies and act like you know the facts. The truth is, you have no idea how the people in the "red states" live their lives or what their values are. You simplify them into a bunch of poor, backwards thinking, religious nuts, and then pretend like you are superior to the rest of the country and you know what's best for America. I'm glad there's a constitution to protect America from people like you.

 

[Farvacola]

I agree with the letter almost too much. It's scary!

 

[Klixxer]

Originally posted by: Transistor

You think that I am immoral and anti-family, because I support women's
reproductive freedom and gay rights. You think that I am dangerous, and even
evil, because I do not abide by your religious beliefs.

To try to categorize everyone in the "red states" as religious fanatics is very irresponsible. Abortion, gay rights, and religion are not important topics to many Bush supporters. You make way too many assumptions.

How much did you pay, Kansas? How much did you contribute
to this government you support, Alabama? How much of this war in Iraq did you
pay for?

Because you think you pay more taxes you think you think you are on some sort of higher ground and should have more of a say-so? Pathetic. Unfortunately for you, the political system doesn't work that way.

I am not safe...

Buy an assault rifle. The stupid ban has been lifted and they are available for your purchase once again.

I am lonely...

Voting for Kerry would have not fixed that problem, however I'm sure Bill Clinton will be glad to help you.

I don't think you are. I don't think you realize what you have done. And if
anything happens to me or the people I love, I blame you. I wanted you to know
that. [/quote]

Wow. That was really weak. Blame democracy. America voted and it was the biggest win in over 50 years. Maybe you would feel more secure in Sadam's former regime where people had no choice?

Maybe everyone should have voted the way Osma told us to so that nothing would happen. You sound like you are living in fear. Osma would be proud if he read this. Weak, fearful people like you are the reason terrorism works.

You spew a bunch of BS that you learned from moveon.org and Michael More movies and act like you know the facts. The truth is, you have no idea how the people in the "red states" live their lives or what their values are. You simplify them into a bunch of poor, backwards thinking, religious nuts, and then pretend like you are superior to the rest of the country and you know what's best for America. I'm glad there's a constitution to protect America from people like you.[/quote]

Unfortunantly you do not see what you are saying.

You walked into a trap. think about it.

 

[Steeplerot]

I just do not think they realize what they are defending anymore.

 

[dmcowen674]

Originally posted by: Gaard

Originally posted by: slyedog
and i despise anyone that is anti-american.

You should probably define what this is.

That's pretty obvious now, the 49% that refused to tow the Bush Regime line.

 

[HVAC]

I voted Republican.

I have a sincerely held religious belief that life starts at conception which places me in direct opposition with the Democratic party's stance on abortion.

It is that simple.

I also happen to fundamentally disagree with the idea of long term welfare. I was adamant about it until I got laid off and went on unemployment for six months. Now I know firsthand that when used as a temporary crutch, welfare is good. But it was painfully addictive for me. I so much enjoyed what amounted to mostly goofing-off on someone else's dime.

As for social security, well, I have mixed emotions. I don't mind it when it seems to me that I am helping to support grandparents and the disabled. I do mind it when I hear that Congress borrows against the money or redirects the funds, etc...

To make a long explanation short, I do not disagree with many liberal ideals for equality, equanimity, and social liberty. I disagree with the need for government to enact or fund them. If there is such a groundswell of support for these ideals, it seems to me that an outlet can be found privately. If on the other hand, there is only minor support for them, let those who burn fiercely for the those causes understand that this world offers limited resources in everything except the tyranny of the majority.

We cannot possibly fund everything.