AMD Ryzen 5 2400G and Ryzen 3 2200G APUs performance unveiled

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whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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The Ryzen 5 2200G would be a good replacement for my Dad's Haswell Pentium rig which I built back in 2014 for him. Along with a SSD.
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
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The Vega iGPU looks good in isolation next to Intel 'Craphics' ;) but in reality it's still severely underpowered as a 1080P gaming solution IMO. Its good enough for eSports @ 1080P or AAA @ 720P. Still not bad as a 'freebie' iGPU for the average Joe, but any half serious gamer would still be much better served with a cheaper CPU + DDR4 2400/2666 + faster dGPU rather than rely on an iGPU that requires really expensive DDR4 to approach the levels of the slowest dGPU available, a GT`1030. For example, a lowly Pentium G4xxx paired with a GTX 1050, would literally get double the framerates of a 2400G, without the need for DDR4-3200+ RAM.

The comparisons with the i5 8400 + GT1030 is just silly because no one in their right mind would pair such a low end GPU with a 8400. A good rule of thumb in a gaming system is to spend twice as much on the GPU as the CPU, NOT the other way around ($200 CPU, $100 GPU?!)

In a nutshell, if you ONLY intend to game on integrated graphics, and 4C is enough for your usage, then Ryzen 2000 blows Intel out of the water, which is no surprise at all.

What would make these APUs really interesting is if Hybrid Crossfire worked, enabling you to couple the integrated Vega GPU with a future low end Vega dGPU to increase gaming performance.
 

sirmo

Golden Member
Oct 10, 2011
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For example, a lowly Pentium G4xxx paired with a GTX 1050, would literally get double the framerates of a 2400G, without the need for DDR4-3200+ RAM.
You're still spending more money for an inferior solution (would not be buying a dual core in 2018). Vega iGPUs offer decent CPU performance since they are unlocked.. and the GPU performance is perfectly fine for some on the budget 1080p gaming. Pair it up with a cheap FreeSync monitor (I scored a Lenovo FreeSync monitor on Ebay for $79).. and I doub't you can do any better than that. Sure it's not the premium gaming experience PC is known for, but AdaptiveSync goes a long way in making it an enjoyable experience.

Not to mention you also get the better upgrade path via AM4, or if you just got a discrete GPU later since the CPUs is an unlocked quad core (with SMT on the more expensive model).
 
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AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
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Cheapest 2x 8GB DDR-4 2400MHz = $164

Cheapest 2x 8GB DDR-4 3200MHz = $193

Now lets assume by the time R5 2400G will launch in February 12 there will also be available cheap Intel Socket 1151 motherboards with KabyLake support.

So we will have the following (assuming Motherboard prices are the same for both AM4 / 1151)

Prices taken from newegg today 8th Jan 2018.

Core i3 8100 = $130
2x 8GB DDR-4 2400MHz = $164
GT 1030 2GB = $80

Total = $374


Ryzen R5 2400G = $170
2x 8GB DDR-4 3200MHz = $193

Total = $363


Assuming the Memory price difference remains the same in February, then the Ryzen 5 2400G vs Core i3 8100 + GT1030 is at the same price, with the same performance , with no Meltdown security hardware problems and the ability to upgrade up to 8x Core Ryzen 2 later on.
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
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You're still spending more money for an inferior solution (would not be buying a dual core in 2018). Vega iGPUs offer decent CPU performance since they are unlocked.. and the GPU performance is perfectly fine for some on the budget 1080p gaming. Pair it up with a cheap FreeSync monitor (I scored a Lenovo FreeSync monitor on Ebay for $79).. and I doub't you can do any better than that. Sure it's not the premium gaming experience PC is known for, but AdaptiveSync goes a long way in making it an enjoyable experience.

Not to mention you also get the better upgrade path via AM4, or if you just got a discrete GPU later since the CPUs is an unlocked quad core (with SMT on the more expensive model).
Inferior for what? Video rendering? Content creation? I'm looking at it from a gamers perspective, yes dual core isn't ideal in 2018 but 2C/4T is enough for 60fps when paired with a fast enough GPU, but the Vega 11 iGPU won't hit 60fps @ 1080P unless you run eSports titles.
In isolation, these APUs are good value, but when you take into account 16GB of DDR4-3200 or better (in order to feed the iGPU sufficient bandwith) the costs quickly escalate.

If you want max frames for your buck, these APUs aren't it. For example, if a friend or relative came to me and said, build me something for $300 that can run games well at 1080P, what would I build them? Either a used Sandy/Ivy Bridge era i7 plus a GTX 1050 or better, or a Pentium + GTX 1050 or better if they *must* build something new, even though the older i7s would provide better gaming performance.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,832
3,068
136
You compromise a lot to go for the GTX1050 and remain at the same budget as the Ryzen R5 2400G + 3200MHz memory.

2C 4T vs 4C 8T
slower memory , this will impact performance when you will upgrade to a faster dGPU
Meltdown
Worse upgradability. If you will upgrade to a faster GPU later on, then the 2C 4T Pentium will be obsolete for the faster dGPU.

Yes in numbers (fps) the Pentium + 1050 will be faster but the R5 2400G with FreeSync monitor will be as playable or perhaps even better(same Image Quality Settings).
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
Cheapest 2x 8GB DDR-4 2400MHz = $164

Cheapest 2x 8GB DDR-4 3200MHz = $193

Now lets assume by the time R5 2400G will launch in February 12 there will also be available cheap Intel Socket 1151 motherboards with KabyLake support.

So we will have the following (assuming Motherboard prices are the same for both AM4 / 1151)

Prices taken from newegg today 8th Jan 2018.

Core i3 8100 = $130
2x 8GB DDR-4 2400MHz = $164
GT 1030 2GB = $80

Total = $374


Ryzen R5 2400G = $170
2x 8GB DDR-4 3200MHz = $193

Total = $363


Assuming the Memory price difference remains the same in February, then the Ryzen 5 2400G vs Core i3 8100 + GT1030 is at the same price, with the same performance , with no Meltdown security hardware problems and the ability to upgrade up to 8x Core Ryzen 2 later on.
If your budget is strictly under $400 with no wriggle room, sure. I think the extra $60 on a GTX 1050 would be the best $60 you could possibly spend on a gaming system at this level, as you are literally paying an extra 15% in total platform cost for a 100% gain in gaming performance. GPU power is absolutely the last thing you want to gimp in a gaming oriented build.

As I said before, if you ONLY intend to game with an iGPU, then the Ryzen 2000 chips are a no brainer. Is it the best way to get maximum fps at a certain budget? No, it isn't.
 

epsilon84

Golden Member
Aug 29, 2010
1,142
927
136
You compromise a lot to go for the GTX1050 and remain at the same budget as the Ryzen R5 2400G + 3200MHz memory.

2C 4T vs 4C 8T
slower memory , this will impact performance when you will upgrade to a faster dGPU
Meltdown
Worse upgradability. If you will upgrade to a faster GPU later on, then the 2C 4T Pentium will be obsolete for the faster dGPU.

Yes in numbers (fps) the Pentium + 1050 will be faster but the R5 2400G with FreeSync monitor will be as playable or perhaps even better(same Image Quality Settings).
Maybe it's the enthusiast in me speaking, but I wouldn't recommend anything less than a GTX 1050 for anyone that is even remotely serious about image quality and framerates at 1080P. Have you actually ever turned down the IQ settings in games to the absolute barest minimums? They are UGLY. Seriously 10 year old games look better. If that is the level someone is content to play at, then more power to them, they have a better tolerance to ugly graphics than I do.
I personally have a GTX 1050 in my SFF rig, if anyone offered me $60 to downgrade to a GT 1030 and literally halve my framerates I would call them all sorts of unmentionable names ;)

As a point of comparison, I do have an older laptop with a GT 940M that is admittedly a bit slower than the Vega 11 iGPU (I'd say closer to the Vega 8) and 1080P gaming on that is a no go. 720P is just about playable with the latest AAA titles, if you can handle 30 - 40fps.
 

AtenRa

Lifer
Feb 2, 2009
13,832
3,068
136
940M (64bit DDR-3) is slower than Desktop GT730 (64bit GDDR-5 and same TMUs/ROPs) which is equal to A10-7870K.

Vega 8 with 3200MHz memory is a lot faster than A10-7870K and Vega 10 at 1500MHz with 3600MHz memory should be faster/equal to GT1030. There are games that are perfectly playable at 1080p 30fps, not all games should/need to be run at 1080p 60fps.
With the help of a Freesync monitor the Vega 10 should provide almost the same playability and gaming experience as a 2C 4T Pentium + GT1050 at 80-90% of the game titles.
 

whm1974

Diamond Member
Jul 24, 2016
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So now with AMD releasing the Ryzen 2000 series CPUs in a few months, Quad cores will now the budget gamers choice for their low cost rigs instead of 2c/4t? Can't wait to see the benchmarks.

At any rate this will be a nice upgrade for those who are still using 2c/2t CPUs in their rigs like my dad is doing.
 

Glo.

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2015
5,083
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You mixed it up a little. It can be either Ryzen mobile APU (with DDR4), or dGPU packaged with HBM2.
The one with HBM2 stack? ;)

Im talking about this one part. It can be either monolithic APU with HBM2, or dGPU with HBM2.
 

USER8000

Golden Member
Jun 23, 2012
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761
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The G4560 is on an EOL platform sadly(great budget CPU though). This is the same platform where the Core i7 CPUs are not cheap and secondhand prices in most of the world are still high and will continue to stay high as they are the best CPUs for the platform,and more and more G4560 owners will want to upgrade over the next few years as games run better on CPUs with more threads.

BTW, Ryzen 3 2200G is only $99:

https://www.pcper.com/files/news/2018-01-07/02_0.jpg

The Core i3 8100 RRP is $117,and the Pentium G4560 RRP is $64. You can't get a G4560 and graphics card combo which will beat a Ryzen 3 2200G overall for $100 in most markets worldwide.

AMD got their sample of the Ryzen 5 2400G to 1675MHZ for the integrated graphics,so it does appear you could also overclock the graphics on the Ryzen 3 and get a good boost in performance.

Even for the CPU part,you are looking at upto a 15% improvement over the Ryzen 3 1200,and single core benchmarks seem ahead of the Ryzen 5 1400:

https://www.pcper.com/image/view/88652?return=node/69029

Yes,the L3 cache is reduced,but there is only one CCX,which might help with certain applications like games for example.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
28,520
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Is the 3dMark Time Spy comparison chart with the i5-8400/GT1030 using stock ram for the AMD APU, or is it using 3600 ram?
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
12,968
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The G4560 is on an EOL platform sadly(great budget CPU though). This is the same platform where the Core i7 CPUs are not cheap and secondhand prices in most of the world are still high and will continue to stay high as they are the best CPUs for the platform,and more and more G4560 owners will want to upgrade over the next few years as games run better on CPUs with more threads.

BTW, Ryzen 3 2200G is only $99:

https://www.pcper.com/files/news/2018-01-07/02_0.jpg

The Core i3 8100 RRP is $117,and the Pentium G4560 RRP is $64. You can't get a G4560 and graphics card combo which will beat a Ryzen 3 2200G overall for $100 in most markets worldwide.

AMD got their sample of the Ryzen 5 2400G to 1675MHZ for the integrated graphics,so it does appear you could also overclock the graphics on the Ryzen 3 and get a good boost in performance.

Even for the CPU part,you are looking at upto a 15% improvement over the Ryzen 3 1200,and single core benchmarks seem ahead of the Ryzen 5 1400:

https://www.pcper.com/image/view/88652?return=node/69029

Yes,the L3 cache is reduced,but there is only one CCX,which might help with certain applications like games for example.
R3 2200G looks like a good value (It's the A8-7600 of the Raven Ridge family).

However, I do wonder how this one will do in the OEM pre-built desktop market vs. sale priced Core i3 + customer (or even factory) added GT 1030.
 

USER8000

Golden Member
Jun 23, 2012
1,527
761
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Is the 3dMark Time Spy comparison chart with the i5-8400/GT1030 using stock ram for the AMD APU, or is it using 3600 ram?
https://www.pcper.com/image/view/88653?return=node/69029
R3 2200G looks like a good value (It's the A8-7600 of the Raven Ridge family).

However, I do wonder how this one will do in the OEM pre-built desktop market vs. sale priced Core i3 + customer (or even factory) added GT 1030.
Looking at the RRP,the Core i3 costs more than the Ryzen 3 2200G($117 vs $99),so unless it is some special deal,it is going to be Core i3 8100 against Ryzen 3 2200G with the same integrated graphics. Even if it was a G4560 PC,a G4560 and GT1030 will cost more unless it is a special deal,and looking at reviews if the PC uses a passive GT1030 it will score lower when compared to one with a fan.
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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R3 2200G looks like a good value (It's the A8-7600 of the Raven Ridge family).

However, I do wonder how this one will do in the OEM pre-built desktop market vs. sale priced Core i3 + customer (or even factory) added GT 1030.
https://www.pcper.com/image/view/88653?return=node/69029


Looking at the RRP,the Core i3 costs more than the Ryzen 3 2200G($117 vs $99),so unless it is some special deal,it is going to be Core i3 8100 against Ryzen 3 2200G with the same integrated graphics. Even if it was a G4560 PC,a G4560 and GT1030 will cost more unless it is a special deal,and looking at reviews if the PC uses a passive GT1030 it will score lower when compared to one with a fan.
The thing about OEM consumer desktops with Intel processors in them is that there are so many of them. Therefore the chance of finding an OEM desktop with Intel rather AMD on sale is so much greater.
 

LTC8K6

Lifer
Mar 10, 2004
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I mean this chart where it says the 2400G scores the same as an 8400+1030 card. What ram was used with the 2400G? There's a note in the bottom right that is cut off.
I don't think you'd need an 8400 for comparison, though. Most likely an i3 will be in that ballpark with a 1030 card. But anyway, I was just wondering about the ram used with the 2400G.

https://www.pcper.com/files/news/2018-01-07/01.jpg
 

IntelUser2000

Elite Member
Oct 14, 2003
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The one with HBM2 stack? ;)

Im talking about this one part. It can be either monolithic APU with HBM2, or dGPU with HBM2.
neblogai has it right.

It's a discrete chip but much more compact because it uses HBM2 rather than GDDR5. Hence Radeon Vega Mobile, not Radeon Vega APU.
 

Insert_Nickname

Diamond Member
May 6, 2012
4,819
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why is AMD keeping the Ryzen 5 1500X and Ryzen 3 1300X?
My guess? L3 cache. 1300X has 8MB, and 1500X 16MB compared with the 2400G/2200G's 4MB L3. The low-end Summit Ridge are salvage dies, so it makes sense to keep them around for that purpose rather then throwing away semi-working dies. Zeppelin is likely still very much in production for Epyc.

That said, I can see why the 1200 and 1400 had to go. They just don't have the frequency to keep up with the Raven dies.

R3 2200G looks like a good value (It's the A8-7600 of the Raven Ridge family).
Only good value? The 2200G is unbelievable value. $99 for a modern 3.7GHz quad core* with a 512SP Vega IGP is absolutely mindblowing. Intel's Pentium/Celeron line-up just got obsoleted overnight.

If AMD really want to drive this home, they could release a budget 2C/4T with 256/384SP for ~$59...

*modern as in got AVX2 extensions. None of that stupid Intel instruction set segmentation.
 

cbn

Lifer
Mar 27, 2009
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Only good value? The 2200G is unbelievable value. $99 for a modern 3.7GHz quad core* with a 512SP Vega IGP is absolutely mindblowing. Intel's Pentium/Celeron line-up just got obsoleted overnight.

If AMD really want to drive this home, they could release a budget 2C/4T with 256/384SP for ~$59...

*modern as in got AVX2 extensions. None of that stupid Intel instruction set segmentation.
I agree it is a good value, but I also know how steeply discounted OEM Intel Core i3 desktops can become.

https://forums.anandtech.com/threads/amd-will-launch-am4-platform-in-march-2016-says-industry-source.2456970/page-14#post-37937094
 
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Glo.

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2015
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neblogai has it right.

It's a discrete chip but much more compact because it uses HBM2 rather than GDDR5. Hence Radeon Vega Mobile, not Radeon Vega APU.
And I do not have that right? Radeon Vega mobile is not in Raven APU? Therefore there cannot exist Vega Mobile with HBM2 in an APU?

You guys are looking at what I have written from completely different angle. If this is APU it will look the same. Vega Mobile is in APUs, by AMD nomenclature.
 

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