Evidently planetJ did not say that itunes is a synthetic benchmark.
What planetJ said is that the Intel compiler is almost not used in windows applications, but it is very used in synthetic benchmarks, which are biased.
Evidently planetJ did not say that itunes is a synthetic benchmark.
What planetJ said is that the Intel compiler is almost not used in windows applications, but it is very used in synthetic benchmarks, which are biased.
Synthetic benchmarks are already skewed and perform as a poor proxy of reality anyways, that compilers are making them even less realistic hardly undermines their situation as being more or less worthless to begin with.
Take SiSoft Sandra. I could not care less whether it has been compiler optimized for Intel, AMD, Via, my socks, your kitchen hutch, etc...it is a worthless benchmark suite from the outset, biased or not by the specific compiler employed.
It is data that essentially answers no questions. Worthless data generated with questionable means and for questionable purposes. So why waste time digging any further into it than that?
I never said it was a good comparison. Goodness gracious. If you insist: the A10-4600M goes for about $600 in a laptop. There's a laptop from Dell with an i5-3337U for $600.The i5 wins in every CPU task and the A10 wins in every GPU task.Why we compare the FX8350 to Core i5 ?? because of similar price.
Why we compare A10-5800K to Core i3 ?? Because of similar price.
Why we compare HD7970 to GTX680 ?? Because of similar price.
Why we compare HD7790 to GTX650 Boost ?? Because of Similar Price.
Why we compare A10-4600M to Core i7 HD4000 ??? Because we compare Flagships
This forum has more AMD fanboys than AMDzone's entire active member count.
Yes, right after listing iTunes and Cinebench as examples of programs compiled with ICC, therefore strongly implying that he's listing them as examples of synthetic benchmarks...
AtenRa
Lifer
- Feb 2, 2009
- 14,003
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I really don't get why comparing comparable TDP-rated products has now become such a big deal when we just spent the past many weeks as a community arguing over the fact that TDP is not computed or specified in the same way by both companies
So we aren't allowed to hold AMD's feet to the fire in scrutinizing the relevance of their 125W TDP spec for Piledriver in comparison to Intel's 77W TDP spec for Ivy Bridge, but we are expected to scrutinize Anand's reviews on the basis that he didn't coordinate the review of two products with synchronized (but tirelessly argued to not be comparable) TDP spec values...
Am I the only one seeing this pattern and fallacy?
IDC we are only talking about TDP in Laptops because it plays a significant role in performance. An Intel 35W HD4000 doesnt have the same performance as an Intel 45W or even 55W HD4000. That is because the 35W part has lower frequency, less Cache and reduced number of CPU Cores. Not only that, but there is a significant price difference between the top end Intel 45/55W and the top end AMD/Intel 35W products.
We like to see the highest Intel 55/45W CPU in the review but we also would like AT to include the Intel 35W part in order to compare the two 35W AMD and Intel products at the same price as well.
Also,
I find it highly misleading that Intel deliberately uses the same model name (HD4000) for the entire product line when the performance is not the same. The average consumer doesnt know that HD4000 DOESNT perform the same with every CPU that carries it.
Intel misleads the consumer by using the name HD4000 with the 17W parts as well as with the 55W CPU models. There is a huge performance difference between the 55W and 35W parts as shown here, I can only imagine what the 17W performance will be.
One year now and nobody have ever said anything about it, if AMD was using a single name for the entire product line they would be thousands of low suits against them for misleading the customers.
Core i7 3940XM 55W HD4000
Core i7 3630QM 45W HD4000
Core i5 3210M 35W HD4000
Core i3 3217UE 17W HD4000
AMD A10-4600M 35W HD7660G
AMD A10-4655M 25W HD7620G
AMD A4-4355M 17W HD7000G
AtenRa
Lifer
- Feb 2, 2009
- 14,003
- 3,362
- 136
That is what i want to see in a review, same priced products competing for supremacy.
AtenRa
Lifer
- Feb 2, 2009
- 14,003
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- 136
Still waiting for a cogent argument as to why I should give a rip why Intel is faster than AMD. I couldn't care less about compilers or all the other whining. I only care about value. And the same is true for everyone else buying a computer.
To me, these excuses sound like this: "Well, of course John is a better basketball player than Peter. It's not a fair comparison, because John is 6'10" and Peter is only 6'1". If you remove that 'unfair advantage', they're about equal."
And another point is worth bearing in mind: Intel is the market leader. AMD has to do more than equal Intel in performance, it needs to beat Intel in performance, if it's to have significant success. It's not even close.
To me, these excuses sound like this: "Well, of course John is a better basketball player than Peter. It's not a fair comparison, because John is 6'10" and Peter is only 6'1". If you remove that 'unfair advantage', they're about equal."
And another point is worth bearing in mind: Intel is the market leader. AMD has to do more than equal Intel in performance, it needs to beat Intel in performance, if it's to have significant success. It's not even close.
As said ad nauseam SB IGP based laptops will be outdated
long before Llano based ones , so much for intel s superior
CPU perfs if the whole plateform is garbage...
Since 2000 i had mainly laptops , 5 in total.
CPU was never important in life cycle length but GPU was
and still is.
tweakboy
Diamond Member
When were they out of gear ? AMD / ATI ,,,,, There are for folks who cant afford a nice i7 with a high end geforce. gl
AMD ATI is the best bang for your money but will never ever be faster and as good as intel.
remember cyrix,
maybe in 5 years AMD will dissapear due to ATIs actions and what not.
However going AA route is botched. Their programming team is still run by interns since 1996. thx gl
AMD ATI is the best bang for your money but will never ever be faster and as good as intel.
remember cyrix,
maybe in 5 years AMD will dissapear due to ATIs actions and what not.
However going AA route is botched. Their programming team is still run by interns since 1996. thx gl
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Not getting the point. What matters today is what I can buy today. Some new Intel product coming out in 12 months and some new AMD product in 8 months is absolutely meaningless, because I can't upgrade my laptop. And products don't become obsolete the second new products are announced.
I'm building a box for my son right now, and I did consider AMD because budget is an issue. But I just don't see the value proposition. I'm going to need a video card anyway, because if I don't get one, he'll very quickly find things that the AMD IGP can't handle. And if I don't care about the IGP, I don't see any reason to buy AMD.
I'm building a box for my son right now, and I did consider AMD because budget is an issue. But I just don't see the value proposition. I'm going to need a video card anyway, because if I don't get one, he'll very quickly find things that the AMD IGP can't handle. And if I don't care about the IGP, I don't see any reason to buy AMD.
And how much time it will perform adequatly considering
the evolution , average people generaly hope that it will
last them as long as possible unless they have boatloads
of money to throw in what is ultimately not a primary
concern in a household life , not everyone is a PC enthusiast.
The same amount of time regardless of what Intel or AMD does in the future.
I buy a computer today, it is based on today's value proposition. If in 12 or 24 months my current machine isn't fast enough, then I will buy in 12 or 24 months based on the value proposition then.
At no time do I give a crap about how much time elapsed between the previous generation and what I can buy now. It is 100% irrelevant.
What is irrelevant is your understanding of the consumer market ,
and no , Intel and AMD IGP based laptops will not last the same
amount of time.
and no , Intel and AMD IGP based laptops will not last the same
amount of time.
inf64
Diamond Member
- Mar 11, 2011
- 3,884
- 4,692
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I say it once again. There is only one AMD notebook model in the market with a substantial integrated-GPU lead over Intels HD4000: A10-4600M
This model is not available as iGPU notebook only, it is always coupled with a dedicated GPU. All other A8, A6, A4 models are not faster than a decent HD4000. They play in the same league. Most AMD fans are not aware of that. Your generalisation is not true.
Customer: "I like your 2014 model car better than the other one I was looking at. It's more powerful and a better value."
Salesman: "Great! I'll get the paperwork started..."
Customer: "Unfortunately, I can't buy it."
Salesman: "Er.. why?"
Customer: "Well, because when you guys put out your 2013 models, they were replaced by 2014 models faster than your competitor's. So if I get a 2014 from them, it will last longer."
Salesman: "????"
Salesman: "Great! I'll get the paperwork started..."
Customer: "Unfortunately, I can't buy it."
Salesman: "Er.. why?"
Customer: "Well, because when you guys put out your 2013 models, they were replaced by 2014 models faster than your competitor's. So if I get a 2014 from them, it will last longer."
Salesman: "????"
Actually, personal insults are the indication that someone is short on arguments. Like, say, calling someone "retarded".
The point was, and continues to be, that nobody shops for anything based on how long ago the previous generation was released. It's utter nonsense.
The point was, and continues to be, that nobody shops for anything based on how long ago the previous generation was released. It's utter nonsense.
I think what he's trying to say is that AMD will last you much longer on a notebook, especially with their superior IGP, than Intel & generally on avg people don't replace their computing devices unless they absolutely need to or they're enthusiasts !
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