TanisHalfElven
Diamond Member
yup its SO freaking ugly. and so closed. wtf no pdfs.
the sony reader and the illiad are far superir deivces in every way.
and the sony is so sexy.
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Amazon Kindle E-Book Reader gets official
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yup its SO freaking ugly. and so closed. wtf no pdfs.
the sony reader and the illiad are far superir deivces in every way.
and the sony is so sexy.
TanisHalfElven
Diamond Member
the sony reader has a battry life that last days and days and days and days on end. i know cuz i have one. its rated at 7500 page turns. thats what a true E-ink device is. no this fugly POS that doesn't last long becasue of bad electronics.
TanisHalfElven
Diamond Member
thats what i'm saying. it should be possible to have the almost infinite battery life of e-ink display.to be able to turns of the electronics.
edit.
i did not know it was possible to turn it off. thats great
that still doesn't fix the fact that that.
1. no pdf support. conversion while nice is not the ideal thing ever, and especcialy when every other reader supports it nativly.
2. ugly ugly ugly. ebook readers are great because of the small size. i cann keep my sony in my bck pocket (with it cover on). this thing is huge by comprision.
i only amazon had come up with a better device. honestly i'm actually scared this will push ebooks into oblivion instead of actually making them common.
DaveSimmons
Elite Member
This is a book reader, not a web tablet or laptop.
Battery life is comparable to the Sony reader if you turn off the wireless except when buying books or getting converted docs by email.
You can also convert docs yourself to mobipocket format and load them up via USB. Read Project Gutenberg, Baen free library, etc.
Black & white is fine for books. e-Ink displays work like paper, you read using reflected light, just like real books. Books don't have backlighting either.
It's a little bit ugly but the keyboard will be great for searching reference materials. I'd love to have this for using gamefaqs guides with games, especially playing console games in my living room away from the PC.
If I were still in college I'd love to replace a heavy stack of math and computer texts with one 10 oz reader.
I did a tiny bit of browsing of Kindle titles for a couple of SF authors that I like:
- one Kindle version was just $1 off the $17 hardcover, but the paperback isn't even scheduled yet.
- another Kindle was $6 off the $16 hardcover, the paperback will not be out until March.
- another Kindle was $7, the paperback was out for $8.
I don't have room for all of the books I own now, and I have a few boxes that I need to give to charity or put in the free stuff forums now.
Kindle seems like a good way to save $1-10 per book compared to hardcover, get the books months to a year sooner than paperback, use less closet space, and help the environment (no dead trees and fossil fuel to ship them around).
I haven't ordered one yet, and at $400 I might wait for version 2.0, but it seems like a decent book reader.
Battery life is comparable to the Sony reader if you turn off the wireless except when buying books or getting converted docs by email.
You can also convert docs yourself to mobipocket format and load them up via USB. Read Project Gutenberg, Baen free library, etc.
Black & white is fine for books. e-Ink displays work like paper, you read using reflected light, just like real books. Books don't have backlighting either.
It's a little bit ugly but the keyboard will be great for searching reference materials. I'd love to have this for using gamefaqs guides with games, especially playing console games in my living room away from the PC.
If I were still in college I'd love to replace a heavy stack of math and computer texts with one 10 oz reader.
I did a tiny bit of browsing of Kindle titles for a couple of SF authors that I like:
- one Kindle version was just $1 off the $17 hardcover, but the paperback isn't even scheduled yet.
- another Kindle was $6 off the $16 hardcover, the paperback will not be out until March.
- another Kindle was $7, the paperback was out for $8.
I don't have room for all of the books I own now, and I have a few boxes that I need to give to charity or put in the free stuff forums now.
Kindle seems like a good way to save $1-10 per book compared to hardcover, get the books months to a year sooner than paperback, use less closet space, and help the environment (no dead trees and fossil fuel to ship them around).
I haven't ordered one yet, and at $400 I might wait for version 2.0, but it seems like a decent book reader.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Sure:
1. No backlight: I think this is dumb. If you're going to improve on an existing technology, I think it should have improvements - why no built in light? There's not even a book light on top. This is dumb.
2. Battery life: 30 hours with Wifi on, a Week with Wifi off. Even it was only a day period, I have no problem plugging it in. I plug my phone in at night, how hard is it to plug an E-book in?
3. Color: Novels aren't in color, why should E-books be? This is a BOOK replacement, i.e. Black & White. Again that begs the question though, why not improve upon an existing technology? From what I understand, E-Ink is just barely coming out with color technology and from what I've seen it doesn't look all that great. In time there will be color, but not for awhile.
4. Price: I agree. Since you're not paying for paper, ink, and distribution costs, the books should be a lower price - at least 50%. I think that this would be a major incentive to buy an E-Book reader. Why would I buy an actual book for $10 when I can buy the electronic version for half the cost, $5? That's a very strong arguement. The question right now is, why would I buy an actual book for $10 when I can buy the same electronic book for $10? Weak arguement. Although a lot of older titles are less than $10, it doesn't make much sense for you to pay the same amount for people who don't care about (1) consolidating their library electronically or (2) getting a book whenever, wherever, to switch over to the electronic version.
As far as the design goes, I think it's horrifically ugly. But it's an ebook, so who cares - I don't need it to look pretty. In person in looks much better, but still...(1) it's ugly, (2) it's white - it's going to get dirty. I think that Amazon should release two versions for the next edition: (1) a better-looking Kindle 2.0 and (2) a Color Kindle in Legal size for reading textbooks, magazines, children's books, etc.
Also foghorn67, I'm not defending it or naysaying it either way. I just think it's cool and I'm sharing it with Anandtech. No need to get touchy about it 🙂
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
My Kindle arrived today! Initial impressions: (going to be critical for this)
1. I hate the button layout so far. I want to hold it like a book, but there are large buttons on each side that prevent me from doing that. I keep turning the pages accidentally. It's hard to pick up without hitting one of the Previous/Next buttons.
2. The weight is perfect. Not heavy, but not ridiculously light. It is very light though.
3. No noise - no fans, no running sounds. The buttons are kind of clicky though.
4. No heat - cool to the touch.
5. After owning an iPhone for a few months, the lack of a touchscreen is annoying. The manual controls seem excellent so far, however. There is a scroller bar on the right that you use with the scroll wheel; it's a little hard to line up sometimes because it doesn't highlight which line you're on. Luckily the font is big enough that you can tell pretty quickly.
6. It looks better in person than it does in photos. A lot better. But it's still ugly.
7. White - it's dirty already. No kidding.
8. The keyboard is unobtrusive, surprisingly. I would have thought it would have gotten in the way. Nope.
9. The screen reminds me of a TI-83 graphing calculator, only slower. It's kind of annoying to wait. I'm used to fast, fast, fast. It's more noticeable when you're on the online bookstore - it's like the ebook itself is going slow, when it's really the connection. Granted it's extremely fast, but since it's not "instant" it feels slow.
10. The screen has glare, despite what Amazon says. It's a BIG shine, not like the glossy laptop shine. Sitting by the living room window, I have to angle it to get the dull glare off.
11. The screen itself looks great Very readable. Surpringly not computer like. I don't think I've ever seen E-Ink before. It looks very good.
12. Lack of a backlight or reading light is already annoying. It's dark outside and I only have my computer light on...it's like reading a regular book - no light, no reading.
I'm going to test out some PDFs and other document files. If it fails that test, I'm not sure if I'm going to keep it. The large buttons are really bugging me because it changes the way I would normally hold a book in my hands. It's more like holding an iPhone with two hands, so that you don't hit the Previous/Next buttons.
So those are my critical initial impressions. The screen is amazing, but it has a few drawbacks. More later!
1. I hate the button layout so far. I want to hold it like a book, but there are large buttons on each side that prevent me from doing that. I keep turning the pages accidentally. It's hard to pick up without hitting one of the Previous/Next buttons.
2. The weight is perfect. Not heavy, but not ridiculously light. It is very light though.
3. No noise - no fans, no running sounds. The buttons are kind of clicky though.
4. No heat - cool to the touch.
5. After owning an iPhone for a few months, the lack of a touchscreen is annoying. The manual controls seem excellent so far, however. There is a scroller bar on the right that you use with the scroll wheel; it's a little hard to line up sometimes because it doesn't highlight which line you're on. Luckily the font is big enough that you can tell pretty quickly.
6. It looks better in person than it does in photos. A lot better. But it's still ugly.
7. White - it's dirty already. No kidding.
8. The keyboard is unobtrusive, surprisingly. I would have thought it would have gotten in the way. Nope.
9. The screen reminds me of a TI-83 graphing calculator, only slower. It's kind of annoying to wait. I'm used to fast, fast, fast. It's more noticeable when you're on the online bookstore - it's like the ebook itself is going slow, when it's really the connection. Granted it's extremely fast, but since it's not "instant" it feels slow.
10. The screen has glare, despite what Amazon says. It's a BIG shine, not like the glossy laptop shine. Sitting by the living room window, I have to angle it to get the dull glare off.
11. The screen itself looks great Very readable. Surpringly not computer like. I don't think I've ever seen E-Ink before. It looks very good.
12. Lack of a backlight or reading light is already annoying. It's dark outside and I only have my computer light on...it's like reading a regular book - no light, no reading.
I'm going to test out some PDFs and other document files. If it fails that test, I'm not sure if I'm going to keep it. The large buttons are really bugging me because it changes the way I would normally hold a book in my hands. It's more like holding an iPhone with two hands, so that you don't hit the Previous/Next buttons.
So those are my critical initial impressions. The screen is amazing, but it has a few drawbacks. More later!
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
I just bought an E-book by Terry Brooks that I'm going to start reading tonight. The buying process is very easy - type in the name of the book or author you're searching for, click the Buy button and select a method of payment, and voila - the book is in your hand. Major annoyance: no dedicated Store button. You have to go into a sub-menu to access it. Extremely stupid since the main draw of this product is to allow you easy access to Amazon's electronic book service. But the book looks great. Be back later 🙂
If you have any specific questions, just ask and I'll try to answer as best I can.
If you have any specific questions, just ask and I'll try to answer as best I can.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Okay, I haven't even spent 5 minutes reading with this thing and already the buttons are driving me bananas. It's just about impossible to adjust your grip without thinking without hitting one of the large, stupid buttons. It's EXTREMELY frustrating. The right side has a large Next and small Back button that would function perfectly if I could only disable the buttons on the left side, since at least the ones on the right side have a small gap for my fingers to grip the book between the buttons and the screen. This alone could be a reason I return it :|
The reason I was super interested in the Kindle was the library access - it's Amazon, for crying out loud! Sony's collection dwarfs in comparison and from all accounts doesn't handle importing PDFs and other files too well. iirc they both use the same screen, so it really boils down to service. Amazon's service is great, but so far their reader stinks. My two big problems are (1) the large, stupid buttons and (2) the glare on the screen. The glare isn't nearly as big of an issue as the buttons though.
The screen is VERY comfortable to read on, I like it a lot actually.
The reason I was super interested in the Kindle was the library access - it's Amazon, for crying out loud! Sony's collection dwarfs in comparison and from all accounts doesn't handle importing PDFs and other files too well. iirc they both use the same screen, so it really boils down to service. Amazon's service is great, but so far their reader stinks. My two big problems are (1) the large, stupid buttons and (2) the glare on the screen. The glare isn't nearly as big of an issue as the buttons though.
The screen is VERY comfortable to read on, I like it a lot actually.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
Some more thoughts:
The service is great, the screen is great, the design is terrible. My hands are already cramping up from holding it. It's very awkward to hold. It's too large to hold comfortably for a long period of time in one hand, and almost too small to hold with two hands. I can't hold it on the sides because there are giant buttons there. Aside from the buttons, one of the big reasons the ergonomics are bad is because it's a vertical design. Books are a horizontal design because you're reading two pages (widescreen), not one page (vertical screen). When I hold the book horizontally, it's much more comfortable. Too bad it doesn't rotate like the iPhone!
The case is a cheap piece of junk. It doesn't fit very well with the book (the back of the Kindle is angled and the case isn't) and the case doesn't willingly bend backwards, plus the corners that hold it in are like felt-covered cardboard or something and they bend easy. Oh and you have to lock the Kindle before you put it in or you'll press the big buttons so many times you'll lose you're place if you dont. There's no dedicated lock button either - you have to press a two-key combination to lock it.
Who designed this thing? 😕 Great concept, poor implementation. I want to like it so much, but the hands-on usability is disgusting. I have to baby it to use it without hitting a button. If I try to hold it by the bottom, there are two volume keys there that click every time I brush them. I can't hold it by the top because there isn't enough room. The top should sport the volume buttons as well as a hold button. The Previous/Next buttons should be at the top and another set above the keyboard towards the bottom, so that I can grip it from the side. This thing is so great but the ergonomics are so stupid 😛
The service is great, the screen is great, the design is terrible. My hands are already cramping up from holding it. It's very awkward to hold. It's too large to hold comfortably for a long period of time in one hand, and almost too small to hold with two hands. I can't hold it on the sides because there are giant buttons there. Aside from the buttons, one of the big reasons the ergonomics are bad is because it's a vertical design. Books are a horizontal design because you're reading two pages (widescreen), not one page (vertical screen). When I hold the book horizontally, it's much more comfortable. Too bad it doesn't rotate like the iPhone!
The case is a cheap piece of junk. It doesn't fit very well with the book (the back of the Kindle is angled and the case isn't) and the case doesn't willingly bend backwards, plus the corners that hold it in are like felt-covered cardboard or something and they bend easy. Oh and you have to lock the Kindle before you put it in or you'll press the big buttons so many times you'll lose you're place if you dont. There's no dedicated lock button either - you have to press a two-key combination to lock it.
Who designed this thing? 😕 Great concept, poor implementation. I want to like it so much, but the hands-on usability is disgusting. I have to baby it to use it without hitting a button. If I try to hold it by the bottom, there are two volume keys there that click every time I brush them. I can't hold it by the top because there isn't enough room. The top should sport the volume buttons as well as a hold button. The Previous/Next buttons should be at the top and another set above the keyboard towards the bottom, so that I can grip it from the side. This thing is so great but the ergonomics are so stupid 😛
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
The screen is amazing, I love it. It looks great! Absolutely no complaints about the screen other than the dull glare from lights, which isn't too hard to fix (angle it a bit differently). I read some complaints of having black text on a gray screen, but I looked at some of my novels and they are mostly printed on a newspaper-colored paper, so it's about the same. The E-Ink screen is more gray and the text isn't black black, but it does have a good contrast to it. I do think that E-Ink is easier on the eyes than printed novel paper. I do a lot of reading and I wear glasses, so this could be a major difference in reading for me. Also the font size adjustment is simply awesome. I bumped up the font size to what looks like about 14-point font and it's SO easy to read, I feel like I'm reading a grandma book!
I'm slowly getting the hang of the large buttons as well. Because the Kindle is so light, you don't have to grip it like you would a book to keep the pages from flipping back towards the middle. It's definitely a different "holding" experience and it's going to take me some time to get used to. Honestly though it really bugs me. I wish they had designed it differently. In fact, here's my wishlist so far for Version 2.0:
1. Widescreen: Vertical reading is the way of the past. I know they're trying to emulate the book, but it's easer to hold when it's flipped horizontally. You might want to consider an OLPC - although it doesn't use E-ink, it does use a technology similar to it plus has color as well as computery functions.
2. Backlight or reading light. Either one would work, although a backlight would probably remove the glare issue.
3. Better button placement. If you've been reading my impressions so far, you know how much I hate them. Easy access? Yes. Terrible positioning? Definitely.
And that's about it! Touchscreen would be nice but isn't essential - the existing controls are easy enough to figure out and use.
I'm slowly getting the hang of the large buttons as well. Because the Kindle is so light, you don't have to grip it like you would a book to keep the pages from flipping back towards the middle. It's definitely a different "holding" experience and it's going to take me some time to get used to. Honestly though it really bugs me. I wish they had designed it differently. In fact, here's my wishlist so far for Version 2.0:
1. Widescreen: Vertical reading is the way of the past. I know they're trying to emulate the book, but it's easer to hold when it's flipped horizontally. You might want to consider an OLPC - although it doesn't use E-ink, it does use a technology similar to it plus has color as well as computery functions.
2. Backlight or reading light. Either one would work, although a backlight would probably remove the glare issue.
3. Better button placement. If you've been reading my impressions so far, you know how much I hate them. Easy access? Yes. Terrible positioning? Definitely.
And that's about it! Touchscreen would be nice but isn't essential - the existing controls are easy enough to figure out and use.
The eyestrain is really a big turn off point for the electronic readers. I used to read a lot. First, I did try to read on pocket pc, the small screen & my eyes get blurry after a few hours. That is a big :thumbsdown: I then brought a table pc to mainly used for my reading. It couldn't hold the charge and my eyes still get watery/blurry after a few hrs of reading on it. Another :thumbsdown: If this thing eliminate eyestrains, I might get it after the price come down some more. $400 still too much for just a reader.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
I can safely say it eliminates eyestrain. The contrast is excellent and there's no backlight, plus you can adjust the font size. As far as price goes, Amazon said don't expect a price drop. I suspect that's mainly because of the lifetime wireless service that comes with it. Verizon charges $45/month for EVDO in my area, so this would pay for itself in less than a year if it had a separate data plan.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
A couple articles that talk about the Sony reader and the Kindle:
http://ap.google.com/article/A...ky2q8OyXOF7-QD8T27I3G0
http://www.news.com/8301-10784...9-7.html?tag=nefd.only
One points out that the Sony does landscape mode but mangles PDFs. Bummer. Also points out that the Wireless switch is a bad idea because he forgets to turn it off and only gets a day or two of battery life instead of a week. Good point - this could have been a software switch.
http://ap.google.com/article/A...ky2q8OyXOF7-QD8T27I3G0
http://www.news.com/8301-10784...9-7.html?tag=nefd.only
One points out that the Sony does landscape mode but mangles PDFs. Bummer. Also points out that the Wireless switch is a bad idea because he forgets to turn it off and only gets a day or two of battery life instead of a week. Good point - this could have been a software switch.
Kaido
Elite Member & Kitchen Overlord
The Kindle hooked up to my Mac easily and flawlessly. It shows up like a regular drive and you can drag and drop files effortlessly. I messed around with The Gutenburg project a bit; the TXT file showed up but the HTML file didn't. The TXT file had a weird line break every other line, so it's not perfect. Newspapers and Magazines are really cool; the format is RSS-feed style - header plus a summary, which you can use the scrollwheel to click on and jump to the article. The only thing I use newspapers for is my grill and magazines next to the john, so maybe this will turn things around for me. I'm not even going to bother with blogs, I think paying for blogs is ridiculous. The entire concept of a blog is that it's free publishing. First off, it should be easy enough to program your own feed to use on the Kindle's web browser; second, I'm sure there will be a hack shortly that will grab the feeds you want and download them as text files or pre-formatted HTML files to the Kindle's drive. Think AppTapp but for your Kindle, not iPhone.
I'm still on the fence about keeping it. Overall I really like it, but the button placement is still killing me. I may fabricate a padded grib cover to slide over the left buttons so that I can hold it easier, as well as integrate an LED light or something. I also hope someone comes out with a software hack to reprogram the buttons to do different functions - I'd like the Back button on the right side to be a Previous button and then disable the left buttons on the left side. Oh and the included leather-ette case is absolutely worthless. I want a dock to drop it in at night, as well - they have one for the Sony reader, so I imagine there will be one for the Kindle soon, otherwise I'll have to make myself one. I'm kind of liking the white now, it helps brighten the screen and also kind of fades away when you're reading. I REALLY like the E-Ink screen - a lot! It's great.
I'm still on the fence about keeping it. Overall I really like it, but the button placement is still killing me. I may fabricate a padded grib cover to slide over the left buttons so that I can hold it easier, as well as integrate an LED light or something. I also hope someone comes out with a software hack to reprogram the buttons to do different functions - I'd like the Back button on the right side to be a Previous button and then disable the left buttons on the left side. Oh and the included leather-ette case is absolutely worthless. I want a dock to drop it in at night, as well - they have one for the Sony reader, so I imagine there will be one for the Kindle soon, otherwise I'll have to make myself one. I'm kind of liking the white now, it helps brighten the screen and also kind of fades away when you're reading. I REALLY like the E-Ink screen - a lot! It's great.
I used one today. Some thoughts
1) The design actually looks quite a bit better in real life. Pictures make it look like your grandma's calculator. When held in hand it looks a lot more sexy.
2) The screen quality is amazing. You can read it just fine in direct sunlight and in dark areas - basically the quality is exactly the same as a book.
3) Despite all the claims, I wouldn't even consider using it for internet browsing.
All in all, I think this is just the first step, I'll suspect the second generation of these devices will be a lot more useful.
1) The design actually looks quite a bit better in real life. Pictures make it look like your grandma's calculator. When held in hand it looks a lot more sexy.
2) The screen quality is amazing. You can read it just fine in direct sunlight and in dark areas - basically the quality is exactly the same as a book.
3) Despite all the claims, I wouldn't even consider using it for internet browsing.
All in all, I think this is just the first step, I'll suspect the second generation of these devices will be a lot more useful.
Exactly correct. Plus, a spare battery is only another $20.
You can check for Sprint coverage in your area.
Pliablemoose
Lifer
Heh, I love it, you know a product is going to tank when an entire forum of early adopters say it's a piece of crap.
I think it's a joke, and Bezos is on crack.
They'll sell a few, but I can's see them taking off.
If I had to read e-books, I'd buy an iPhone or a tablet PC.
There's an idea, Amazon should have come up with a folding tablet PC that opened like a book and had pages on both sides, functioned as a cell phone/PC/PDA/GPS.
I think it's a joke, and Bezos is on crack.
They'll sell a few, but I can's see them taking off.
If I had to read e-books, I'd buy an iPhone or a tablet PC.
There's an idea, Amazon should have come up with a folding tablet PC that opened like a book and had pages on both sides, functioned as a cell phone/PC/PDA/GPS.
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