A sample of how 'hard' teachers have it

[ProfJohn]

.How much do YOU think I should be paid?

I don't know what you are worth. The best answer is that you are worth whatever you can make.

But I do know that society can't afford to have you work as a teach for 30 years and then retire at 55 and spend the rest of your life making 70% of your salary. (a figure I found online)

Here an example from Illinois
"The salary of Schaumburg High School business education teacher Martin Barski rose from $91,151 to $142,536 in his final years with District 211, district records show. At 55, Barski retired last year with a pension of about $72,000 ...

55 and going to make $72,000 every year for the rest of his life thanks to tax payers.

Do the math...
Assume the guy worked for 30 years at $72k per year on average after inflation
Now he is retired at 55 and lives for 30 more years at $72k per year

So he will have cost the people of Illinois $144k for every year he taught. No way he could be over paid though.... not at all... to even suggest such a thing would be despicable...

 

[ProfJohn]

Take a look at this report issued by the Beureau of Labor and Statistics. It's a report on teacher work patterns. Pay close attention to hours worked/day, summer work and work taken home.

I think it will take a lot of the air out of PJs "Teachers are a bunch of overpaid lazy sloths" blimp

http://www.bls.gov/opub/mlr/2008/03/art4full.pdf

Not sure you are helping yourself out...

page 53: Persons employed as teach- ers were less likely to work in June, July, and August than during other months of the year.
Page 53: average teacher worked less than 40 hours a week...
Page 54: Thirty percent of teachers worked at home on an average day
Page 55: Teachers employed full time worked 24 fewer minutes per weekday and 42 fewer min- utes per Saturday than other full-time professionals.

So what exactly were you trying to prove? That teachers are less likely to work during the summer, work less than 40 hours a week and work less hours at home than the typical professional... :hmm:

 

[ProfJohn]

My question to Conservatives is why are you so obsessed with teachers and other middle class Americans just trying to get by when fat cat corporations are raping and pillaging this country? Why isn't your anger directed towards them?

Next time I get a pay check I'll look for the line under deductions that says "Corporation"

Or when I go to the store I'll look for the line after 'sales tax' that says 'CEO tax'


And it is not that we are obsessed with them we just them to be paid fair compensation for the work they do verse what we have now where the benefit programs are so generous that they are bankrupting cities and counties and soon states.

 

[mchammer187]

I don't know what you are worth. The best answer is that you are worth whatever you can make.

But I do know that society can't afford to have you work as a teach for 30 years and then retire at 55 and spend the rest of your life making 70% of your salary. (a figure I found online)

Here an example from Illinois
"The salary of Schaumburg High School business education teacher Martin Barski rose from $91,151 to $142,536 in his final years with District 211, district records show. At 55, Barski retired last year with a pension of about $72,000 ...

55 and going to make $72,000 every year for the rest of his life thanks to tax payers.

Do the math...
Assume the guy worked for 30 years at $72k per year on average after inflation
Now he is retired at 55 and lives for 30 more years at $72k per year

So he will have cost the people of Illinois $144k for every year he taught. No way he could be over paid though.... not at all... to even suggest such a thing would be despicable...

142K is a long way from 42K though

http://www.illinoisloop.org/salary.html

Superintendents should not make those figures either

Even more outrageous is

http://images.businessweek.com/ss/09/02/0216_college_pres/1.htm

Highest-Paid Presidents of Public Universities, 2007-08

1. E. Gordon Gee

Ohio State University

Total annual compensation: $1,346,225

Package includes:
$775,000 salary
$225,000 deferred compensation
$36,225 retirement pay
$310,000 performance bonus
Use of house and car
Club dues

 

[trenchfoot]

Compared to what Corp CEO's make, their counterparts in education make pennies to their billions.

 

[sportage]

Oh those damn teachers!!!
I get so sick of driving by the schools and seeing all their Mercedes Benz parked in the teacher only parking lots. And their Lear Jets taking up all the hangar space at the local air port. And the houses... Huge 20 million mansions behind 30 foot cement walls. Those damn rich spoiled teachers.... Just makes me sick!

 

[shortylickens]

The wars were started 7 October 2001 under George W Bush you 65IQ piece of ignorant lying dog shit.

Thats not nice.

And the only thing an IQ score represents is the ability to score well on an IQ test.

 

[Red Dawn]

What is with all the cheap shots??

Can't counter his ideas so you have to make it personal?

Pathetic.

You know you are absolutely right, I let my anger over all the attacks on teachers get the best of me.

 

[MotF Bane]

What is with all the cheap shots??

Can't counter his ideas so you have to make it personal?

Pathetic.

He has no ideas.

 

[alkemyst]

Thats not nice.

And the only thing an IQ score represents is the ability to score well on an IQ test.

As told by mothers of underachievers...

 

[Ausm]

No doubt they put up with a lot of crap. But so do other people with similar paying jobs.

$38k a year being a teacher
or
$38k a year working at McDonalds as a manager

What would you rather do?

I would chose 38K working at McDonald's for this would be the obvious choice.

With the Rights attack on teachers and unions who the hell would want to take a job in this field knowing that you would have no job security while If I work at McDonald's Right Wingers LOVE cheap labor( but HATE the minimum wage because it is way to much fucking money to live on) so I would have unlimited job security.

Fucking Scum

 

[Ausm]

Compared to what Corp CEO's make, their counterparts in education make pennies to their billions.

Funny how the Right demonizes the Middle Class but keep sucking the Corporate cock...

 

[Nintendesert]

Compared to what Corp CEO's make, their counterparts in education make pennies to their billions.

Surely you're not advocating the privatization of our school system?

 

[sm625]

I love how people get so bent over how bad teachers unions are. What hours they actually work is irrelevent. If the contract says that is how much they have to work, then that is how much they have to work. If some teachers do more work it is because they have a freakin conscience, not because the public union is good.

Telling someone to stfu is an admission that they are right and you do not care to debate it.

 

[sarsipias1234]

I went to high school in Chicago Heights Illinois and in Sacramento California.

Chicago Heights had smaller class sizes but most teachers were very uneducated as I knew more than most of my teachers at age 16. I cannot recall one outstanding teacher. I learned nothing new but algebra and geometry the whole 2 years.

Sacramento was worse with class sizes of 40 to 60 students! And the teachers were not only stupid but mean and/or depressed people. The teachers would spend a lot of time talking about themselves in class as well. The teachers seemed very narcissistic to me coming from Illinois. I learned absolutely nothing new from my two years at this school.
The only teacher that impressed me was a new history teacher who didn't have tenure like the other loser teachers.

In short, I received all my education prior to high school and in college.

I have to say that my schools, in Illinois, for grades 1 through 8 were fantastic and had great teachers for most part. I learned A LOT going to these schools.

 

[Paul98]

I went to high school in Chicago Heights Illinois and in Sacramento California.

Chicago Heights had smaller class sizes but most teachers were very uneducated as I knew more than most of my teachers at age 16. I cannot recall one outstanding teacher. I learned nothing new but algebra and geometry the whole 2 years.

Sacramento was worse with class sizes of 40 to 60 students! And the teachers were not only stupid but mean and/or depressed people. The teachers would spend a lot of time talking about themselves in class as well. The teachers seemed very narcissistic to me coming from Illinois. I learned absolutely nothing new from my two years at this school.
The only teacher that impressed me was a new history teacher who didn't have tenure like the other loser teachers.

In short, I received all my education prior to high school and in college.

I have to say that my schools, in Illinois, for grades 1 through 8 were fantastic and had great teachers for most part. I learned A LOT going to these schools.

Do you happen to know if them not teaching much new would have to do with no child left behind? Now days a lot of this has to do with just spending time getting those who are slow or behind up to a "proficient" level. Those who are "ahead" end up getting nothing because that's what the school wants.

If you want to complain about something complain about how our system is setup so that these teachers hands are tied.

 

[postaled]

Its a bit lower here

 

[thraashman]

No point arguing with ProfJohn here. As a conservative he is anti education. Because education creates those who think for themselves. Those who think for themselves don't vote Republican.

 

[bfdd]

Heh...well then I guess you wouldn't gladly do their job for the amount of money they make. I don't blame you, neither would I.

of course I would, I just don't need to now. you guys look way to into things like the word "glad". also her, doing your job correctly and shoveling work are different things. only assholes don't do their work well, whether they enjoy/like it or not.


fellas, it isn't that teachers are paid to little. it's that other professions have ridiculous salaries/pay scales. lets not forget how little accountability there is in teaching. i had an English teacher in high school who threw a girl out of her desk then threw her desk off the 3 story building. didn't get fired, nah he was told to resign. then he went to another school district. I know this because I saw the guy at a starbucks a couple years later and asked him.

 

[Pens1566]

I'm including the 12-month employees but I'm more focused on the Principals and Vice Principals. They clear 100k easily in pay alone. They work during the same time as the teachers and aren't obligated to work during the summer vacation.

This is just not true. The salary part might be depending on area and years of service. Not likely, but possible. The last part is a complete and utter falsehood.

As for PJ, you have no idea what being a teacher is really like.

 

[her209]

This is just not true. The salary part might be depending on area and years of service. Not likely, but possible. The last part is a complete and utter falsehood.

O RLY? I'm basing my information from a family member who works in the HR department of a school district that handles the hiring for all positions in the school district.

 

[JeffreyLebowski]

The guy, while bashing the evil teachers, has no idea.


There is no way in hell that I would teach even if paid what I'm paid now. Not fucking worth it. Anyone who wants to bitch and moan should have to try it once. Just once is all it would take.

Funny....you pay a high school educated mechanic $60 per hour to work on your car but whine like a baby when a college educated (masters degree in many cases) teacher gets paid $35 or more per hour to teach your kids. You, regardless of your sister in law being a teacher, have no fucking idea.

I rarely say this but you've earned a big STFU on this one.

Probably because the guy fixing my car actually gets something done.

Teachers as proven by the terrible graduation rates are not getting as much accomplished.
Sorry, but if you go into any kind of government work, you shouldn't be commanding a high salary. You are working FOR the people. The smart teachers work in the public sector long enough to get the experience and then move to private schools. Teachers at private schools should make whatever the school and parents are willing to pay. As long as they work for the government, they shouldn't have unions, aka, legalized extortion.

 

[Pens1566]

O RLY? I'm basing my information from a family member who works in the HR department of a school district that handles the hiring for all positions in the school district.

Same. My father just retired as a high school principal after 30+ yrs. He worked year round. Every job he ever looked at moving to was year round. Even the grade/middle school ones. On top of that, administrators are required to attend school athletic events. Summer was filled with follow up work from previous year, prep work for coming year. Setting up schedules, etc.. And before you say "yeah, but that's a high school", he just spent 3 weeks as a substitute at a middle school for a principal that was on maternity leave.

It's year round.

 

[postaled]

Same. My father just retired as a high school principal after 30+ yrs. He worked year round. Every job he ever looked at moving to was year round. Even the grade/middle school ones. On top of that, administrators are required to attend school athletic events. Summer was filled with follow up work from previous year, prep work for coming year. Setting up schedules, etc.. And before you say "yeah, but that's a high school", he just spent 3 weeks as a substitute at a middle school for a principal that was on maternity leave.

It's year round.

I know that my middle school principal works year round, and even during the summer is commonly working, FROM the building at 9-10 at night. She is also working most Sundays.

 

[Macamus Prime]

P&N Fingermen are at it again.

You are nothing more than pathetic goons, looking to vilify one of the things which threatens the parties that seek to gain control; education.

I would ask you go teach children, but that means you may have to come in contact with some "ethnics". Go back to your bunkers and re-arrange your canned foods, check your fresh water supply and continue waiting for when "the wall comes down".