A cap on executive compensation for corporations

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Zebo

Elite Member
Jul 29, 2001
39,398
19
81
A lot of Mythology of Wealth in this thread -some are beyond help and utterly indoctrinated with a modern day 'right of kings' - I prefer to allow people to decide what society should look and constitution allows it. Tax them at 95% or limit it or do nothing whatever you feel serves the publics interest.
 

shrumpage

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2004
1,304
0
0
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage

I think your car is too expensive, you should have to drive a metro LS.

Your house is too big, no more then 3 bed rooms at 2200 sq foot.

47" is too big for a tv, the should be no more then 42."

Piecing your tongue serves no purpose, plus can lead to medical problems, it should be banned.

I think you make too much money, 1 million take home is enough for anybody.

Nice fallacies. Of course the issue being rasied to keep people from buying 47" TV's.

When you plug in the real facts - the drain on the economy concentrated wealth causes - it sounds a lot different.

'Owning 2,000 media outlets and having monopolies in markets is too much. You have to let others own some too for diversified ownership'. Oh the outrage!

'Having $5 billion and owning private planes and yachts and two sports teams, you have to pay an extra $100 million a tear in taxes for relief for other taxpayers.' Oh the outrage!

'Sucking hundreds of millions out of money for incenting an hiring others because you stacked the compensation board is too much. You get a 1/3 pay cut'. Oh the outrage!

Why are you so concerned only with CEO's and not the the other 99.99% of people at all?
I'm NOT concerned about the CEO's thus i want to leave them alone.

If someone wants to spend 10k on a plasma TV, instead of a myriad of other products, i don't care. Do i think its wastful and unnecessary, and can the money be used for something else? sure. But its not my money.

If a company feels it should pay X amount on a CEO benefit or pay check - i don't care. Oh boy so and so got payed 400 million running billion dolllar company, what is 400 million in federal, state and local taxes? Where do they put the money dont pay taxes on
So where is this money going then? Is sitting under the CEO's mattress, or is it at a minium sitting in a bank?

If its in a bank, it is still in the economy, if its invested, its still in the economy. If the company buys a jet, who does that benefit? The jet company for one, and all the workers they pay. The pilots they hire to fly the jet, along with the crews the maintain it, the airports where they pay the fees to store and land the plane, the list goes on.

I think you should give all your money beyond $24,000 a year to charity. That way it can be put to better use in society. I on the other hand believe people should be allowed to be as smart or as stupid with money as they see fit.
 

SamurAchzar

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2006
2,422
3
76
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage

I think your car is too expensive, you should have to drive a metro LS.

Your house is too big, no more then 3 bed rooms at 2200 sq foot.

47" is too big for a tv, the should be no more then 42."

Piecing your tongue serves no purpose, plus can lead to medical problems, it should be banned.

I think you make too much money, 1 million take home is enough for anybody.

Nice fallacies. Of course the issue being rasied to keep people from buying 47" TV's.

When you plug in the real facts - the drain on the economy concentrated wealth causes - it sounds a lot different.

'Owning 2,000 media outlets and having monopolies in markets is too much. You have to let others own some too for diversified ownership'. Oh the outrage!

'Having $5 billion and owning private planes and yachts and two sports teams, you have to pay an extra $100 million a tear in taxes for relief for other taxpayers.' Oh the outrage!

'Sucking hundreds of millions out of money for incenting an hiring others because you stacked the compensation board is too much. You get a 1/3 pay cut'. Oh the outrage!

Why are you so concerned only with CEO's and not the the other 99.99% of people at all?

These are excellent times for the borderline-commies like you to rear their heads, in the shadow of the mob-lynch against the rich. But then, the American economy, for all its shortcomings, is still world's best, and the people who built it are in Forbes, not P&N.
Sure, the mob would love to tax them to death. Why not? They are all thieves, right? And surely, every cent the government gets is wisely spent (it is if you ask Blackwater).

I'm not against taxation, it just should have some economical rational other than "Oh the outrage!". Lets see how the populism of your kind works out in Venezuela.

Grow the fuck up.

 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: shrumpage
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage

I think your car is too expensive, you should have to drive a metro LS.

Your house is too big, no more then 3 bed rooms at 2200 sq foot.

47" is too big for a tv, the should be no more then 42."

Piecing your tongue serves no purpose, plus can lead to medical problems, it should be banned.

I think you make too much money, 1 million take home is enough for anybody.

Nice fallacies. Of course the issue being rasied to keep people from buying 47" TV's.

When you plug in the real facts - the drain on the economy concentrated wealth causes - it sounds a lot different.

'Owning 2,000 media outlets and having monopolies in markets is too much. You have to let others own some too for diversified ownership'. Oh the outrage!

'Having $5 billion and owning private planes and yachts and two sports teams, you have to pay an extra $100 million a tear in taxes for relief for other taxpayers.' Oh the outrage!

'Sucking hundreds of millions out of money for incenting an hiring others because you stacked the compensation board is too much. You get a 1/3 pay cut'. Oh the outrage!

Why are you so concerned only with CEO's and not the the other 99.99% of people at all?
I'm NOT concerned about the CEO's thus i want to leave them alone.

If someone wants to spend 10k on a plasma TV, instead of a myriad of other products, i don't care. Do i think its wastful and unnecessary, and can the money be used for something else? sure. But its not my money.

If a company feels it should pay X amount on a CEO benefit or pay check - i don't care. Oh boy so and so got payed 400 million running billion dolllar company, what is 400 million in federal, state and local taxes? Where do they put the money dont pay taxes on
So where is this money going then? Is sitting under the CEO's mattress, or is it at a minium sitting in a bank?

If its in a bank, it is still in the economy, if its invested, its still in the economy. If the company buys a jet, who does that benefit? The jet company for one, and all the workers they pay. The pilots they hire to fly the jet, along with the crews the maintain it, the airports where they pay the fees to store and land the plane, the list goes on.

I think you should give all your money beyond $24,000 a year to charity. That way it can be put to better use in society. I on the other hand believe people should be allowed to be as smart or as stupid with money as they see fit.

Your level of oversimplifying makes it difficult to even respond - it's like talking to someone about a military invasion who refers to it in terms of personal gun rights.

Your comments just reflect a lack of any awareness of issues from systemic corruption to concentration of wealth.

And you don't even pay attention to what is said; when I poiont out your error is comparing this to very small issues, you respond by doing the same more.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: SamurAchzar
[These are excellent times for the borderline-commies like you to rear their heads,

You're hysterical and not very honest.

What it's really time for is more of the same, ignorant, misguided hot air the righties are always quick to spew. And it should be ignored like always.

But then, the American economy, for all its shortcomings, is still world's best, and the people who built it are in Forbes, not P&N.

Ah yes, the ideological worship of the rich - the constant pattern we see as the weak who enable the 'strong man' to abuse speak up (see fascism, see Stalin supporters, etc.)

And now for the predictable straw man, since you don't have any clue what the liberals are saying, as you foam at the mouth trying to speak for them.

Sure, the mob would love to tax them to death. Why not? They are all thieves, right? And surely, every cent the government gets is wisely spent (it is if you ask Blackwater).

Stop the idiocy and wasting my time much less yours. Not a word of your blather is true.

I'm not against taxation, it just should have some economical rational other than "Oh the outrage!". Lets see how the populism of your kind works out in Venezuela.

That actually puts you a step ahead of even worse ideologues who are just 'against taxes'.

'Oh the outrage' is not the rationale (yes, there's an e on thw word), it was a facetious reference to the reaction of *your* side.

In fact, there are rationales for this, but you're too busy mouthing your Rush Limbaugh channeled idiotic rant against the left about 'they're all crooks' to notice that.

You can't begin to judge the policies in Venezuela because of your ridiculous level of ignorance. What do you know of the challenges they face and the limited options?

Grow the fuck up.

Irony of the week already being awarded, you get the monthly award.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,592
87
91
www.bing.com
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
126
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.
 

spidey07

No Lifer
Aug 4, 2000
65,469
5
76
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Keep trying to make everybody equal communist. You're beliefs failed, it doesn't work.

Or get a freaking job and rise to the top.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,592
87
91
www.bing.com
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.
 

SamurAchzar

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2006
2,422
3
76
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: SamurAchzar
[These are excellent times for the borderline-commies like you to rear their heads,

You're hysterical and not very honest.

What it's really time for is more of the same, ignorant, misguided hot air the righties are always quick to spew. And it should be ignored like always.

But then, the American economy, for all its shortcomings, is still world's best, and the people who built it are in Forbes, not P&N.

Ah yes, the ideological worship of the rich - the constant pattern we see as the weak who enable the 'strong man' to abuse speak up (see fascism, see Stalin supporters, etc.)

And now for the predictable straw man, since you don't have any clue what the liberals are saying, as you foam at the mouth trying to speak for them.

Sure, the mob would love to tax them to death. Why not? They are all thieves, right? And surely, every cent the government gets is wisely spent (it is if you ask Blackwater).

Stop the idiocy and wasting my time much less yours. Not a word of your blather is true.

I'm not against taxation, it just should have some economical rational other than "Oh the outrage!". Lets see how the populism of your kind works out in Venezuela.

That actually puts you a step ahead of even worse ideologues who are just 'against taxes'.

'Oh the outrage' is not the rationale (yes, there's an e on thw word), it was a facetious reference to the reaction of *your* side.

In fact, there are rationales for this, but you're too busy mouthing your Rush Limbaugh channeled idiotic rant against the left about 'they're all crooks' to notice that.

You can't begin to judge the policies in Venezuela because of your ridiculous level of ignorance. What do you know of the challenges they face and the limited options?

Grow the fuck up.

Irony of the week already being awarded, you get the monthly award.

All these words and not even a tiny, single coherent reference to what's at hand. Little to be expected from someone who quotes himself in his signature. Anyway, come up with a any meaningful message and then we perhaps could avoid the mutual waste of time.


 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Keep trying to make everybody equal communist. You're beliefs failed, it doesn't work.

Or get a freaking job and rise to the top.

Koslowski? Ruiz? Fuld? Prince? Lay? Nardelli? Wagoner? Grasso?

None of them deserved huge paychecks. None of them were the "top". They got there by sucking dicks and having their dick sucked.

Only a complete idiot would think that the CEO pay scale is a "free market" where the "best" rise to the top.
 

SamurAchzar

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2006
2,422
3
76
Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Keep trying to make everybody equal communist. You're beliefs failed, it doesn't work.

Or get a freaking job and rise to the top.

Koslowski? Ruiz? Fuld? Prince? Lay? Nardelli? Wagoner? Grasso?

None of them deserved huge paychecks. None of them were the "top". They got there by sucking dicks and having their dick sucked.

Only a complete idiot would think that the CEO pay scale is a "free market" where the "best" rise to the top.

Isn't it always like that? The mediocre, persistent, get-along-with-everybody types get to the top. It's like that in the armed forces, it's like that in politics and it's like that in management positions. There are some stars though.

I think no one has answered the question of "who is served" here. Is it for the sake of the shareholders? Lessening economical gaps between rich and poor? Revenge? What's the deal?


 

BigDH01

Golden Member
Jul 8, 2005
1,631
88
91
Originally posted by: Train
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.

I think most liberals recognize that instead of being static, wealth has been moving drastically from the working and middle classes to the upper classes. I don't know a single liberal that thinks wealth is "static."

Natural economies hardly exist. Most modern economies and societies use currency as a measure of value.

Actually, we advanced to less than 50% agr worldwide through a variety of economic paradigms. Capitalism is actually a rather recent invention and did not exist through much of human history.
 

alphatarget1

Diamond Member
Dec 9, 2001
5,710
0
76
Originally posted by: Mxylplyx
I think even the most ardent capitalists, like myself...

Playing the devil's advocate:

Isn't CEO getting paid more and more, getting golden parachutes just the ultimate end result of capitalism? If you look at it strictly from a capitalism perspective, they're not doing anything "wrong", they're merely looking out for themselves.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,592
87
91
www.bing.com
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: Train
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.

I think most liberals recognize that instead of being static, wealth has been moving drastically from the working and middle classes to the upper classes. I don't know a single liberal that thinks wealth is "static."

Natural economies hardly exist. Most modern economies and societies use currency as a measure of value.

Actually, we advanced to less than 50% agr worldwide through a variety of economic paradigms. Capitalism is actually a rather recent invention and did not exist through much of human history.


jeeze, heres another one. Capitalism = Natural economy.

If the all the govts and banks of the world dissolved tomorow, guess what kind of economy would INSTANTLY exist?? Yep, Capitalism, it would NATURALLY appear.

And you just demonstrated that you DON'T understand the "wealth is not static" fact. Because you still assume that for someone to gain, someone else must lose (the "transfer of wealth" myth), which requires a zero sum game. Just google "wealth is not static", read just about anything on the first page, they break it down pretty basic in easy terms to understand. Do that before you come back here and post. It will only take a few minutes.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
Originally posted by: SamurAchzar
Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Keep trying to make everybody equal communist. You're beliefs failed, it doesn't work.

Or get a freaking job and rise to the top.

Koslowski? Ruiz? Fuld? Prince? Lay? Nardelli? Wagoner? Grasso?

None of them deserved huge paychecks. None of them were the "top". They got there by sucking dicks and having their dick sucked.

Only a complete idiot would think that the CEO pay scale is a "free market" where the "best" rise to the top.

Isn't it always like that? The mediocre, persistent, get-along-with-everybody types get to the top. It's like that in the armed forces, it's like that in politics and it's like that in management positions. There are some stars though.

I think no one has answered the question of "who is served" here. Is it for the sake of the shareholders? Lessening economical gaps between rich and poor? Revenge? What's the deal?

Lotta different reasons. Society benefits by not having to bail out companies because CEOs chase short-term profits for short-term benefits. Shareholders pay a lot less. Many others.
 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
Originally posted by: Train
Originally posted by: BigDH01
Originally posted by: Train
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.

I think most liberals recognize that instead of being static, wealth has been moving drastically from the working and middle classes to the upper classes. I don't know a single liberal that thinks wealth is "static."

Natural economies hardly exist. Most modern economies and societies use currency as a measure of value.

Actually, we advanced to less than 50% agr worldwide through a variety of economic paradigms. Capitalism is actually a rather recent invention and did not exist through much of human history.


jeeze, heres another one. Capitalism = Natural economy.

If the all the govts and banks of the world dissolved tomorow, guess what kind of economy would INSTANTLY exist?? Yep, Capitalism, it would NATURALLY appear.

And you just demonstrated that you DON'T understand the "wealth is not static" fact. Because you still assume that for someone to gain, someone else must lose (the "transfer of wealth" myth), which requires a zero sum game. Just google "wealth is not static", read just about anything on the first page, they break it down pretty basic in easy terms to understand. Do that before you come back here and post. It will only take a few minutes.

And we want "natural capitalism" why?
 

SamurAchzar

Platinum Member
Feb 15, 2006
2,422
3
76
Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Originally posted by: SamurAchzar
Originally posted by: LegendKiller
Originally posted by: spidey07
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
If liberals ever comprehend the simple fact that wealth is not static, then they would drop this entire socialism charade.

If wealth WAS static, we'd still be stuck in the hunter/gatherer economy.

If conservatives ever understood that liberals are way ahead of them, and that their precious little pearl about wealth not being static is well understood and that they're the ones who are clueless on economics, then they would stop advocating the worst sort of debunked policies based on the lies of propaganda they've been fed.

But no, their believing liberals are not aware wealth is not static keeps them imprisoned.

Keep trying to make everybody equal communist. You're beliefs failed, it doesn't work.

Or get a freaking job and rise to the top.

Koslowski? Ruiz? Fuld? Prince? Lay? Nardelli? Wagoner? Grasso?

None of them deserved huge paychecks. None of them were the "top". They got there by sucking dicks and having their dick sucked.

Only a complete idiot would think that the CEO pay scale is a "free market" where the "best" rise to the top.

Isn't it always like that? The mediocre, persistent, get-along-with-everybody types get to the top. It's like that in the armed forces, it's like that in politics and it's like that in management positions. There are some stars though.

I think no one has answered the question of "who is served" here. Is it for the sake of the shareholders? Lessening economical gaps between rich and poor? Revenge? What's the deal?

Lotta different reasons. Society benefits by not having to bail out companies because CEOs chase short-term profits for short-term benefits. Shareholders pay a lot less. Many others.

What you describe is very valid, but IMHO better remedied through refining current supervision and reward mechanisms, that will be accepted by all parties.


 

LegendKiller

Lifer
Mar 5, 2001
18,256
68
86
Originally posted by: SamurAchzar


What you describe is very valid, but IMHO better remedied through refining current supervision and reward mechanisms, that will be accepted by all parties.

Personally, I'd love to see fractional voting of shares, not to mention required notification of the exact pay package BEFORE it gets voted on, requiring a 3-month lead time for dissemination, followed by an actual vote.

On top of that, any bonus pay has to be locked in trust for at least 10 years. If performance declines significantly because of short-term manipulation, pay would be deducted from the trust.
 

shrumpage

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2004
1,304
0
0
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage

I think your car is too expensive, you should have to drive a metro LS.

Your house is too big, no more then 3 bed rooms at 2200 sq foot.

47" is too big for a tv, the should be no more then 42."

Piecing your tongue serves no purpose, plus can lead to medical problems, it should be banned.

I think you make too much money, 1 million take home is enough for anybody.

Nice fallacies. Of course the issue being rasied to keep people from buying 47" TV's.

When you plug in the real facts - the drain on the economy concentrated wealth causes - it sounds a lot different.

'Owning 2,000 media outlets and having monopolies in markets is too much. You have to let others own some too for diversified ownership'. Oh the outrage!

'Having $5 billion and owning private planes and yachts and two sports teams, you have to pay an extra $100 million a tear in taxes for relief for other taxpayers.' Oh the outrage!

'Sucking hundreds of millions out of money for incenting an hiring others because you stacked the compensation board is too much. You get a 1/3 pay cut'. Oh the outrage!

Why are you so concerned only with CEO's and not the the other 99.99% of people at all?
I'm NOT concerned about the CEO's thus i want to leave them alone.

If someone wants to spend 10k on a plasma TV, instead of a myriad of other products, i don't care. Do i think its wastful and unnecessary, and can the money be used for something else? sure. But its not my money.

If a company feels it should pay X amount on a CEO benefit or pay check - i don't care. Oh boy so and so got payed 400 million running billion dolllar company, what is 400 million in federal, state and local taxes? Where do they put the money dont pay taxes on
So where is this money going then? Is sitting under the CEO's mattress, or is it at a minium sitting in a bank?

If its in a bank, it is still in the economy, if its invested, its still in the economy. If the company buys a jet, who does that benefit? The jet company for one, and all the workers they pay. The pilots they hire to fly the jet, along with the crews the maintain it, the airports where they pay the fees to store and land the plane, the list goes on.

I think you should give all your money beyond $24,000 a year to charity. That way it can be put to better use in society. I on the other hand believe people should be allowed to be as smart or as stupid with money as they see fit.

Your level of oversimplifying makes it difficult to even respond - it's like talking to someone about a military invasion who refers to it in terms of personal gun rights.

Your comments just reflect a lack of any awareness of issues from systemic corruption to concentration of wealth.

And you don't even pay attention to what is said; when I poiont out your error is comparing this to very small issues, you respond by doing the same more.

I use examples where money is wasted, and can be but to better use, vaguely defined by someone's sense morality. I didn't shift topic to monloplistic control over a market like you did, apples and oranges. I actually stuck with the topic.

You don't even pay attention to what is said; when I point out your error is comparing this to very small issues, you respond by doing the same more.

lets see i gave the example of 400 million dollars being paid to one person who is a CEO - sounds like i address your issue specifically. BUT you ignored all of my points:

1. Where the money actually resides, it remains int he economy, just not to the people you feel it should.

2. You completely ignore the fact when a company buys something such as an jet , something you used as an example - what and where that money goes.

3. You are citing the greater good of society, where do you draw the line. You decided it was the CEO making millions. While I feel you are no better then him and should all be capped at a certain point, and allow your money to be used by others, for the greater good of course.

So instead of hiding insults and accusing me of ignoring your argument, why don't you man up and address the issues I raised.
 

gingermeggs

Golden Member
Dec 22, 2008
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Originally posted by: yllus
Originally posted by: gingermeggs
Intellectual discrimination is a justification for renumeration scales.
- what is the greatest surgeon in the world, without a hygienic theatre to operate in ?
That surgeon is only as good as the guy whom mops the floor or the patient dies of a secondary infection, but wait we can pay managers to kick his ass into line!
The scale is natural, it's been perverted by self-interest and childish greed- On all levels!

No, the surgeon is not only as good as the guy who mops his operating room's floor. He's as good as his intelligence, multiple years of education and continued refreshing of his skills keep him.

The other guy is as good as his ability to hold out his arms and grasp a stick with a wet sponge glued to the end.

Let's not get silly and start believing that the compensation of rocket surgeons and grave diggers should be equal because they both go home tired. "Intellectual discrimination" is the dumbest phrase I've read in a long time.

Excessive executive pay is a real problem, and their shareholders are ignored if they protest against it occurring (previous thread on topic).

Finally, I doubt that excessive pay is a problem that can be solved through legislation - it's a cultural issue mostly isolated to the United States.

The Usa is the top of the pyramid....yesss

Silly!
Whats how this has grown to where it is- thru the progressive dumbing down of the mainstream education system.
Why would a board member want to change the status quo, when many are paid 6digit salaries for 11, 4hour meetings in a year?
It is classist and the majority of shareholders in so many companies today don't hold any real power and don't really understand whats in that companies best interests long term, many are there for nothing greater then a quick buck ; If they did they would be able to stop the robber baron collective(owning over 51%) which is siphoning off money to other companies whom they own entirely, usually faux consultancy businesses or legal practices, that's their "talent" and lest we forget about political party contributions.
- its all good at the country club.
what's your handicap at Huntington ol'boy?

Any country that had/have a working examples against this fraudulence was bought out or knocked out by those same capitalist barons. Australia is a prime example of such behavior.
It would be silly to let people have comparison's that expose the reality of the situation.
I'd like to hear what you think in 2010.
 

gingermeggs

Golden Member
Dec 22, 2008
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Originally posted by: shrumpage
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: shrumpage

I think your car is too expensive, you should have to drive a metro LS.

Your house is too big, no more then 3 bed rooms at 2200 sq foot.

47" is too big for a tv, the should be no more then 42."

Piecing your tongue serves no purpose, plus can lead to medical problems, it should be banned.

I think you make too much money, 1 million take home is enough for anybody.

Nice fallacies. Of course the issue being rasied to keep people from buying 47" TV's.

When you plug in the real facts - the drain on the economy concentrated wealth causes - it sounds a lot different.

'Owning 2,000 media outlets and having monopolies in markets is too much. You have to let others own some too for diversified ownership'. Oh the outrage!

'Having $5 billion and owning private planes and yachts and two sports teams, you have to pay an extra $100 million a tear in taxes for relief for other taxpayers.' Oh the outrage!

'Sucking hundreds of millions out of money for incenting an hiring others because you stacked the compensation board is too much. You get a 1/3 pay cut'. Oh the outrage!

Why are you so concerned only with CEO's and not the the other 99.99% of people at all?
I'm NOT concerned about the CEO's thus i want to leave them alone.

If someone wants to spend 10k on a plasma TV, instead of a myriad of other products, i don't care. Do i think its wastful and unnecessary, and can the money be used for something else? sure. But its not my money.

If a company feels it should pay X amount on a CEO benefit or pay check - i don't care. Oh boy so and so got payed 400 million running billion dolllar company, what is 400 million in federal, state and local taxes? Where do they put the money dont pay taxes on
So where is this money going then? Is sitting under the CEO's mattress, or is it at a minium sitting in a bank?

If its in a bank, it is still in the economy, if its invested, its still in the economy. If the company buys a jet, who does that benefit? The jet company for one, and all the workers they pay. The pilots they hire to fly the jet, along with the crews the maintain it, the airports where they pay the fees to store and land the plane, the list goes on.

I think you should give all your money beyond $24,000 a year to charity. That way it can be put to better use in society. I on the other hand believe people should be allowed to be as smart or as stupid with money as they see fit.

Lichtenstein, swiss banks and other vulture societies.
 

shrumpage

Golden Member
Mar 1, 2004
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Lichentstein, offers low tax rate for corporations and individuals. If other countries offered the same or lower tax rate, I'd bet they would go there.

Swiss Banks - offer security and privacy, but i bet you complain about the patriot act.
 

Craig234

Lifer
May 1, 2006
38,548
350
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Originally posted by: Train
Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.

Drivel. The propaganda is evident in your own use of the jargon 'natural economy', as you parrot it. That is propaganda, at least a reference to it.

The answer to how our economy has evolved away from agriculture is a large topic about which you add nothing, and about which you disprove nothing in what I said.

You have a child's level opposition to 'socialism'. You fail it appears to me to clearly even have any idea that socialism is not a boolean attribute, how our society is and isn't socialist.

There's an old saying that a little knowledge is dangerous. You personify it.

Your rantings about the economic situation if all government disappeared is more drivel.

Want to know what would happen? Power, never staying in a vacuum, would be obtained by people organizing into groups to dominate others, as they always have.

Your 'acpitalism' would be you being put into slavery, or robbed, or indentured into combat, at the point of a gun by a superior force. Period.

Over very long periods of time, society would re-invent itself as it has before, as societies stabilize and the same economic lessons are re-learned - oppression of labor versus rebellion of labor. Just maybe at some point in time, freak circumstances would again occur leading the powerful to re-create democracy and labor rights could expand.

There's nothing new under the sun here, and nothing good about the fantasy system you worship.

As for your tiny littlepoint bout wealth not being static, I'll repeat what I've said before here:

Wealth has both static and non-static aspects. At anymoment, the wealth has a static distribution - it is a certain amount in certain people's hands. It's non-static over time - it plays a role of incenting various behaviors among other things, which in turn cause various levels and types of productivity.

In a balanced economy, wealth is partially concentrated, and used to incent productivity. As you unbalance the economy one way, productivity is less incented and falls. As you unbalance the economy the other way, the wealth is overly concentrated and too many resources are in too few hands and less available for incenting productivity, used for misguided priorities to serve the few wealthy, and there is more suffering and less productivity benefitting society. See any oligarchy for examples.

Your tiny little point adds nothing to the discussion; it simply imprisons you by making you say liberals don't know wealth isn't static as you refuse to learn much.
 

Train

Lifer
Jun 22, 2000
13,592
87
91
www.bing.com
Originally posted by: Craig234
Originally posted by: Train
Natural economies are not propaganda. If you really understood, you wouldnt spew complete garbage.

How do you think we advanced from a 100% agriculture species to now less than 50% agr worldwide? It wasnt socialism.

Drivel. The propaganda is evident in your own use of the jargon 'natural economy', as you parrot it. That is propaganda, at least a reference to it.

The answer to how our economy has evolved away from agriculture is a large topic about which you add nothing, and about which you disprove nothing in what I said.

You have a child's level opposition to 'socialism'. You fail it appears to me to clearly even have any idea that socialism is not a boolean attribute, how our society is and isn't socialist.

There's an old saying that a little knowledge is dangerous. You personify it.

Your rantings about the economic situation if all government disappeared is more drivel.

Want to know what would happen? Power, never staying in a vacuum, would be obtained by people organizing into groups to dominate others, as they always have.

Your 'acpitalism' would be you being put into slavery, or robbed, or indentured into combat, at the point of a gun by a superior force. Period.

Over very long periods of time, society would re-invent itself as it has before, as societies stabilize and the same economic lessons are re-learned - oppression of labor versus rebellion of labor. Just maybe at some point in time, freak circumstances would again occur leading the powerful to re-create democracy and labor rights could expand.

There's nothing new under the sun here, and nothing good about the fantasy system you worship.

Sooo.. if the govts and banks disapeared tomorow, what WOULD exist? What would be the natural economy? And how would it be anything other than capitalism?

Your dodge proves the real delusions here.