$35,000 Tesla Model III Is Coming In 2017

[Pantoot]

In the end, I went with Solid Black, Performance AWD, Aero Wheels, and Enhanced Auto Pilot.

Awesome, congrats!
Waiting is (almost) the hardest part!

 

[ponyo]

In the end, I went with Solid Black, Performance AWD, Aero Wheels, and Enhanced Auto Pilot. Now, I know mentioning "Performance AWD" without the "Performance Upgrade Package" will probably garner some weird looks, but there were two reasons... or maybe three...

1. Temperature. The Michelin 4S High Performance Summer tires in the Performance Upgrade Package are limited in their temperature range. When looking them up on Tire Rack, it specifically states that if the tire gets below 20F, that they need to be warmed up to 40F before use, or it could damage the tire. Now, I do live in the south-east, but it does get cold here from time to time. While I would have enjoyed the extra performance benefits in the summer, I don't want to deal with it in the winter. If I lived in a state like California, Florida, New Mexico, etc., then it likely wouldn't have been an issue.
   
2. Ride Quality. I've dealt with 20" tires on my current car, and I just... kind of don't want that right now. Plus the Performance Upgrade Package also lowers the car slightly, and I don't need the car scraping on the driveway.
3. Price. Well, frankly, it was an extra $5k in an already pricey car.

I think if I could've optioned for the same acoustic Michelin tires that I'll get on the 18" rims, I would've strongly considered the package. I use the same tires on my current car (non-acoustic version), and I rather like them.

:thumbsup:
Congrats! Great choice! I'm actually considering the exact same configuration. I just haven't pulled the trigger yet.

Be sure to get the referral from someone so you can get the Free Supercharging for life promotion.

 

[Aikouka]

3. Although if you DO spring for FSD now, you'll get the Autopilot 3.0 chip for free in 6 months, which may be worth the money now for both the enhanced performance & future resale value. Although it is NOT required for EA:

I heard about the free upgrade to the 3.0 hardware, but I think I'm still a bit reserved because I'm not sure when full self driving will even be available. Although, software version 9 is supposed to start adding feature(s) to FSD, but I don't think there has been any indication as to what features. I'm not incredibly keen on having to spend an additional $2000 over the build-price for the upgrade when it becomes advantageous, but it also doesn't feel great to spend $3000 on promises. For example, if they decide to charge even more because you need the 3.0 chip, then I'd consider adding the package as I'm starting to see more value.

Speaking of EAP, when I was at Tesla, I was talking to them about features, and they tried to talk me out of EAP a bit since I have a relatively short commute (only ~12 miles). Although, I think I may end up using it more than even I would've thought. There are roads around here that I hate traveling on due to their traffic just being obnoxiously slow; however, if I can let the car deal with that (except for having to be the first to stop at a red light), it might not be so bad.

4. I agree with the tire & rim choice. I went with the smallest size (18" factory rims) on my Mustang for exactly that reason - more rubber, better ride, better in the snow.

I will admit that I did want the better handling though.

5. Make sure you get your free lifetime Supercharging pass with your Performance Model 3! (available until September 16th) I believe you need a referral: (we've got some owners here who can probably hook you up, if you haven't already gotten it)

Yup, I got that through my friend. The free supercharging perk is nice, but honestly, I wish I would've considered it more when premium connectivity was still a free option. (Although, I can't recall if Model 3 orders were open to the public at that point.) Premium connectivity is expected to cost about $100 a year, which isn't bad.

:thumbsup:
Congrats! Great choice! I'm actually considering the exact same configuration. I just haven't pulled the trigger yet.

I know what you mean. I sat there pondering it for a while, and my friends were probably tired of me talking to them about it ...mostly as my way of trying to "think aloud".

Is there anything in particular that's holding you back?

Awesome, congrats!
Waiting is (almost) the hardest part!

I keep checking for a VIN.

 

[Kaido]

I went and sat in a Model 3 last weekend as well as a Model S. Honestly, I didn't see much of a difference in driver room between the two, but I did think the Model 3's seats were slightly more comfortable. Overall, neither car was a bad fit, but I can say that going from a Model S, which looks like a hi-tech variant of a normal car, to a Model 3 is a huge change. I usually just describe the interior as "spartan" as it has a clean look to it. It's hard for that to not sound like a bad thing, but it really isn't a problem... it's just really strange if you've been driving "normal" cars for ages.

It's VERY weird when you get in the car - it feels like you're sitting in a prototype, with just a wheel & an iPad glued to the dash, haha. But, you also kind of quit noticing it when you actually start driving, which is nice.

The Model S & X are supposedly getting similar interior redesigns in Q3 2019, which will last as the refresh before a full redesign in 2021. I like the renderings, but a lot of people I've talked to hate it & prefer the current interior design:

 

[Kaido]

I heard about the free upgrade to the 3.0 hardware, but I think I'm still a bit reserved because I'm not sure when full self driving will even be available. Although, software version 9 is supposed to start adding feature(s) to FSD, but I don't think there has been any indication as to what features. I'm not incredibly keen on having to spend an additional $2000 over the build-price for the upgrade when it becomes advantageous, but it also doesn't feel great to spend $3000 on promises. For example, if they decide to charge even more because you need the 3.0 chip, then I'd consider adding the package as I'm starting to see more value.

Speaking of EAP, when I was at Tesla, I was talking to them about features, and they tried to talk me out of EAP a bit since I have a relatively short commute (only ~12 miles). Although, I think I may end up using it more than even I would've thought. There are roads around here that I hate traveling on due to their traffic just being obnoxiously slow; however, if I can let the car deal with that (except for having to be the first to stop at a red light), it might not be so bad.

I used it around Manhattan the other day & it did quite well in city traffic (aside from stop lights & stop signs, of course). With EAP, if there's not a car in front of you, you have to start driving from a dead stop & then double-click the stalk to get it going. Once you get it going, if there is a car ahead of you at a stop, it will automatically resume on city streets. Again, you have to watch out for stop signals, as it can't detect them yet, but the convenience is not only very nice but VERY usable. Most of my work customers are under 50 miles away, but Connecticut is laced with endless highways & side-highways & mini-highways, so there's always traffic jams & accidents & whatnot, and even EAP would be awfully convenient.

As far as wheels go, they have the 18" aero, the 19" sport, and the 20" performance. I wish that they offered the 19" sport as an option on the Performance pack, because then you could get the cooler-looking rims, but have a little bit more cushion in your ride, but also a little bit better handling. I wonder if the computer automatically figures out what tire size you have, in order to calculate things like the speedometer & EAP features correctly.

Probably my biggest problem right now is that I rent & I park outside, so I don't have access to a charger at home. Many of my work sites have charging available, but then I would be totally dependent on public & site charging, rather than home charging. Even with a 300+ mile range, that still means having to be careful about charging up as needed. Although the lower maintenance on the EV's is particularly appealing...the price tag is high up front, but there's that Model S that just hit 400,000 miles & is doing just fine. I currently drive an average of 2,000 miles a month, so that would last me like 20 years, haha.

 

[Aikouka]

The Model S & X are supposedly getting similar interior redesigns in Q3 2019, which will last as the refresh before a full redesign in 2021. I like the renderings, but a lot of people I've talked to hate it & prefer the current interior design

I think I could see people being alright with it if it also ends up costing them less or getting them more in return. I mean... when you sit in a Model S or Model X, you can understand why they cost more as there's just more there. With the 3, you do give up conveniences such as having an easier time adjusting lights (e.g. going from AUTO to ON when it's not dark enough for AUTO to turn them on, but you still want them on) or adjusting wiper sensitivity. I've actually seen complaints that the Tesla auto-sensing wiper system isn't sensitive enough, but in my experience, I don't think that's just a Tesla problem. My Ford has rain-sensitive automated wipers too, and I normally leave it on the first setting. However, when it really starts raining, I normally turn it up a setting or two, which usually puts it on the equivalent of HIGH in most cars.

Personally, I am of the opinion that important, safety-related features such as headlights and wipers should always have a physical control. Earlier Model 3 users reported that their screen would sometimes mess up and they had no access to anything on the screen. They've likely fixed this through software updates, but it shows how it's important to avoid important features being software-only. I'd also be fine if it can be controlled by both.

As far as wheels go, they have the 18" aero, the 19" sport, and the 20" performance. I wish that they offered the 19" sport as an option on the Performance pack, because then you could get the cooler-looking rims, but have a little bit more cushion in your ride, but also a little bit better handling. I wonder if the computer automatically figures out what tire size you have, in order to calculate things like the speedometer & EAP features correctly.

The wheels are usually all the same size when you take into account the rim diameter and the tire sidewall depth.

I wonder if they don't offer the 19" wheels because they're just a smaller variant of the 20" wheels. I'd be fine with the 20" if they just gave you a tire option. I realize that All-Seasons are not considered performance tires, and that does raise the configuration count, which I think Tesla is trying to avoid, but it would help some drivers avoid having to buy another set of tires. Keep in mind that the Tesla tires use the acoustic foam in them, so the tires are more expensive than usual. Even the 18" tires are $275 at Tire Rack.

Probably my biggest problem right now is that I rent & I park outside, so I don't have access to a charger at home. Many of my work sites have charging available, but then I would be totally dependent on public & site charging, rather than home charging.

That may not be the worst thing in an area like NYC as I'm guessing that NYC has a lot of superchargers. You could drive around until about 10-20% charge and then just fill up on the nearest supercharger. Is it as convenient as charging at home? No, but as long as the public (and free if Performance edition) chargers aren't inconvenient, that's not too bad.

I'm going to have to do some work to get a charger in at home. I do have open space on my panel, but I'm not sure how much actual open capacity that I have. I have one of those Z-Wave amperage detecting devices that are meant to clamp onto your service wires, so I was thinking about hooking that up. (It's the first-gen one that requires separate power, which is why I've never used it.) At worst, I'll need to pay a good $2-3k for a whole new panel and larger service line into the home (or a second panel), but since I've been considering going to a tankless water heater, that also gives me the option of going with an electric one, which is far, far cheaper than gas.

I also have to figure out how I'm going to run the line. Most people put their panels in the garage, but due to the layout of the house (tri-story), my service enters at the far side, goes through the crawl space, and goes to a panel that's in the bottom level of the two-story portion. The garage is maybe 10 feet away, but it would require it to be run through the ceiling. I think I know how to do it, and fortunately, it would be easy if I tear out a wall that I've been planning on replacing anyway (it's a rather ugly, old, 70s-style wood paneling wall).

Fortunately, there's an outlet right by where the charging port is. The only bad thing is that the outlets charge so slowly that I'd probably need to charge it every night rather than every few days with a larger amperage.

 

[PricklyPete]

I've read people with Model 3 Performance are getting 3.3 seconds 0-60 mph and quarter mile in 11.8 seconds. That's stock configuration real world numbers. That's insane for a midsize sedan for less than $80k. And this same car has 310 miles range and gets 126 MPGe.

Think about that. If someone told you there's ICE car capable of 3.3s 0-60 and 11.8s quarter mile and gets 126 mpg, you would tell them they're insane at any price point. Yet, Tesla Model 3 is less than $80k and does all this with electric motor and battery. This is the future and we're experiencing paradigm shift. It's going to be exciting next 20-30 years.

Agreed. I can’t imagine my next car will be anything other than electric. Unfortunately our garage isn’t quite big enough for two cars...so my car is parked on a city street making it difficult at this point. Fortunately I shouldn’t need a new car for 5+ years. If we are still living in this house by then, I may just upgrade the garage as well to make the electric option readily available (if we are in this house for 5+ years, we are planning major renovations anyway).

 

[Kaido]

Agreed. I can’t imagine my next car will be anything other than electric. Unfortunately our garage isn’t quite big enough for two cars...so my car is parked on a city street making it difficult at this point. Fortunately I shouldn’t need a new car for 5+ years. If we are still living in this house by then, I may just upgrade the garage as well to make the electric option readily available (if we are in this house for 5+ years, we are planning major renovations anyway).

Same. I just traded in my lemon Jeep for a stick-shift Mustang. It will be my last ICE vehicle, the last hurrah to gas, haha. I'm planning on going to the Model Y crossover in a couple years & then hopefully keeping it for a good 20 years. Or until we get flying cars

 

[Kaido]

I think I could see people being alright with it if it also ends up costing them less or getting them more in return. I mean... when you sit in a Model S or Model X, you can understand why they cost more as there's just more there. With the 3, you do give up conveniences such as having an easier time adjusting lights (e.g. going from AUTO to ON when it's not dark enough for AUTO to turn them on, but you still want them on) or adjusting wiper sensitivity. I've actually seen complaints that the Tesla auto-sensing wiper system isn't sensitive enough, but in my experience, I don't think that's just a Tesla problem. My Ford has rain-sensitive automated wipers too, and I normally leave it on the first setting. However, when it really starts raining, I normally turn it up a setting or two, which usually puts it on the equivalent of HIGH in most cars.

Personally, I am of the opinion that important, safety-related features such as headlights and wipers should always have a physical control. Earlier Model 3 users reported that their screen would sometimes mess up and they had no access to anything on the screen. They've likely fixed this through software updates, but it shows how it's important to avoid important features being software-only. I'd also be fine if it can be controlled by both.

Yeah...it was annoying that you could only open the glovebox via the touchscreen. I understand the efficiency in it, but I also appreciate the human element of physical touch controls. The Tivo peanut remote is still my go-to example for good human interface design...every button had a unique shape & the whole thing had a specific layout, so you could find your buttons even in the dark when you couldn't see what you were doing. Although I'd imagine that once they roll FSD out, you probably wouldn't care too much anymore, lol.

 

[ponyo]

I know what you mean. I sat there pondering it for a while, and my friends were probably tired of me talking to them about it ...mostly as my way of trying to "think aloud".

Is there anything in particular that's holding you back?

Well, I have 4 cars right now and not enough garage space so I would have to sell at least 1 car to make room. So Model 3 is a want and not a need. The only reason I'm considering it now is because of the $7,500 federal tax credit but that's kind of poor reason to spend $75k to save $7,500. My wife gave me the ok so the hold up is me and nothing else. I would pay cash so I wouldn't need a loan. I'm just having hard time convincing myself to make the poor financial decision and buy a car I don't need just so I can play with a new toy.

 

[Aikouka]

Well, I have 4 cars right now and not enough garage space so I would have to sell at least 1 car to make room. So Model 3 is a want and not a need. The only reason I'm considering it now is because of the $7,500 federal tax credit but that's kind of poor reason to spend $75k to save $7,500. My wife gave me the ok so the hold up is me and nothing else. I would pay cash so I wouldn't need a loan. I'm just having hard time convincing myself to make the poor financial decision and buy a car I don't need just so I can play with a new toy.

Hm, I had some of the same qualms.... I originally considered just getting AWD with no other extras, but it was the talk of the faster-than-advertised 0-60 speed that pushed me over the line. All in all, even with just the AWD model, it's still a lot for a car that I don't technically need. Heck, I could've just picked up a Nissan Leaf if I really just wanted a usable electric vehicle. (Although, I'd strongly prefer the upcoming longer range 2019 Leaf e-Plus if I wanted one of those.)

Although, it is worth noting that at $75k, you could also consider a used Model S. You may also prefer them as there are some luxury features that you cannot get on the Model 3 such as air suspension that you'll find on the used Model S. For example, here's a 2015 P85D for $71.9k. The only negative is that you won't be able to get FSD on a 2015 as EAP wasn't added until Oct 2016. A friend was showing me that if you venture off Tesla's site, you can find some really nice deals too, which are usually a bit cheaper.

EDIT:

Yeah...it was annoying that you could only open the glovebox via the touchscreen. ... Although I'd imagine that once they roll FSD out, you probably wouldn't care too much anymore, lol.

I'll admit that the glove box doesn't bother me much, but I also don't really use it all that often. Although, I would imagine that it could be annoying if you ask someone to grab something out of your glove box, and they'd need to be able to properly unlock the car (have fun with the goofy card) and then hit the button.

As for FSD, I still think we're quite a ways away from 95% effective self-driving. That's a sort of made-up percentage, but the idea is that it would cover most situations except maybe some weird ones like crazy construction, environmental hazards (rock slide blocking a road or something), etc.

 

[rstrohkirch]

The price going from the standard AWD to the performance model really is quite good. Most other manufacturers charge around $14-20,000 to step up to their top performance model. Tesla is doing it for only $10,000. Though I feel there is a large amount of diminishing returns on a vehicle that's faster than 4.5 seconds or so for normal road maneuvers. I'd be happy with the standard AWD model but I need towing capacity so no go for me anyway.

 

[Kaido]

My wife gave me the ok so the hold up is me and nothing else.

...

I'm just having hard time convincing myself to make the poor financial decision and buy a car I don't need just so I can play with a new toy.

I wouldn't necessarily say it's a poor financial decision, especially if your budget allows for it. It has the performance of a supercar performance from a decade ago for a fraction of the cost, it will probably last forever thanks to the lack of an engine, and you'll get continual cool updates over time as they roll out Atari games, FSD, and probably even Netflix at some point in the future. And if gas ever jumps up crazy-high again, you'll be able to drive around effectively for free if you get the lifetime Supercharging & use those for all of your charge-ups. Not to mention all of the bragging rights you'd have here on AT

 

[Aikouka]

The price going from the standard AWD to the performance model really is quite good. Most other manufacturers charge around $14-20,000 to step up to their top performance model. Tesla is doing it for only $10,000. Though I feel there is a large amount of diminishing returns on a vehicle that's faster than 4.5 seconds or so for normal road maneuvers. I'd be happy with the standard AWD model but I need towing capacity so no go for me anyway.

I think what makes it awkward in regard to pricing is really a matter of perspective. Essentially, when you buy an ICE-powered vehicle and you opt for a faster model, there's usually a really simple way to see performance not only in numbers but also physical objects. For example, my Taurus SHO has a twin-turbo V6 with intercooling and oil cooling and all that jazz, and if you compare that to the SEL or Limited variants that are just a standard V6, you think "Wow, the SHO model has all that extra stuff!" The same thing can apply going from a V6 to a V8.

What makes the AWD Performance upgrade awkward is that it does nothing more than tell you the performance stats. The visual appears to be the exact same (because the motors are the same), and that just makes you wonder "...what am I paying for exactly?" Some concepts of Tesla's business model are probably somewhat foreign to most people that have been dealing with cars. For example, Tesla allowing users to have a 14-day free trial of EAP wouldn't work for most manufacturers, because without getting a package, your car likely wouldn't get the requisite hardware. In the case of Tesla, you're effectively paying for a software license.

 

[Kaido]

I think what makes it awkward in regard to pricing is really a matter of perspective. Essentially, when you buy an ICE-powered vehicle and you opt for a faster model, there's usually a really simple way to see performance not only in numbers but also physical objects. For example, my Taurus SHO has a twin-turbo V6 with intercooling and oil cooling and all that jazz, and if you compare that to the SEL or Limited variants that are just a standard V6, you think "Wow, the SHO model has all that extra stuff!" The same thing can apply going from a V6 to a V8.

What makes the AWD Performance upgrade awkward is that it does nothing more than tell you the performance stats. The visual appears to be the exact same (because the motors are the same), and that just makes you wonder "...what am I paying for exactly?" Some concepts of Tesla's business model are probably somewhat foreign to most people that have been dealing with cars. For example, Tesla allowing users to have a 14-day free trial of EAP wouldn't work for most manufacturers, because without getting a package, your car likely wouldn't get the requisite hardware. In the case of Tesla, you're effectively paying for a software license.

Agreed, they should have done something aesthetically to make it look more awesome. On the flip side, you also have a sleeper! It looks like the only real visual differences are if you get the Performance Upgrade:

1. Lowered suspension
2. Bigger wheels with different design from the aero rims
3. Alloy pedals inside
4. Carbon fiber spoiler

No red calipers apparently...

 

[Kaido]

Tesla says 99% of the US population is now within 150 miles of a Supercharger:

https://electrek.co/2018/08/10/tesla-supercharger-cover-99-us-population-within-150-miles/

 

[Aikouka]

Agreed, they should have done something aesthetically to make it look more awesome. On the flip side, you also have a sleeper!

It's even more of a sleeper as I've heard that the decals have to be applied by the dealer, and apparently, Tesla hasn't given them the M3P decals ("DUAL MOTOR" with a red underline) yet. Someone was also saying that they'd have to go back for the spoiler to be put on.

 

[rstrohkirch]

I would have assumed they at least spec'd larger rotors/better calipers.

 

[Kaido]

 

[Kaido]

It's even more of a sleeper as I've heard that the decals have to be applied by the dealer, and apparently, Tesla hasn't given them the M3P decals ("DUAL MOTOR" with a red underline) yet. Someone was also saying that they'd have to go back for the spoiler to be put on.

Wow. I figured they'd at least use emblems instead of decals. On the flip side, people are getting better-than-advertised speeds, so that's pretty nice.

I am very curious as to what the resale value of the Performance versions will be down the road, as they look the same as the more basic models, you know?

 

[Aikouka]

Wow. I figured they'd at least use emblems instead of decals.

Oh, no... I'm pretty sure they are emblems (raised, metallic/plastic things) rather than just decals (fancy stickers). I was sort of using the terms interchangeably. This article has photos of what it looks like.

I would have assumed they at least spec'd larger rotors/better calipers.

The Performance Upgrade Package, which is an additional charge over the AWD Performance upgrade, does include larger calipers and better rotors. (The Performance AWD version is a pre-requisite for adding that Performance Upgrade Package too.) I can't complain too much about it not being baked in since my Taurus had the exact same sort of Performance Package extra (bigger rims, better brakes, stiffer suspension, etc.).

 

[JEDI]

Saw a graphic that showed 1/2 of small size cars sold in July was a Tesla 3

A company with production problems owned the small car category!

 

[teejee]

Saw a graphic that showed 1/2 of small size cars sold in July was a Tesla 3

A company with production problems owned the small car category!

You forgot/missed one important part. This sales figure was for small/mid luxury cars. Not small cars in general.

But even then that article had very strange sales number. For example it shows Volvo 60/90 sales as 1900 in July in US. But Volvos official numbers is around 6500. Very big difference.

I assume you mean this article:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallm...competition-in-july-infographic/#23e399541c90

 

[rstrohkirch]

For example it shows Volvo 60/90 sales as 1900 in July in US. But Volvos official numbers is around 6500. Very big difference.

What site did you find the 6500 number off? Volvo's own site says they sold 2250 for July in the US.

https://www.media.volvocars.com/us/en-us/corporate/sales-volumes

 

[teejee]

What site did you find the 6500 number off? Volvo's own site says they sold 2250 for July in the US.

https://www.media.volvocars.com/us/en-us/corporate/sales-volumes

strange I'm looking the same page... guess we include different models.