$35,000 Tesla Model III Is Coming In 2017

[Zorba]

Don't believe you can roll back, but you can defer updates for a good amount of time. Realistically, things will stop working like Supercharging or network services at some point. Many folks, like myself, opt in to the Advanced updates so we get this stuff right away. The complaints you are hearing are from the early adopters of the updates, but it's a good thing that folks are speaking up and giving input. Lot of the legacy automakers launch something and it's too late at that point to course correct. Either you live with the changes or buy a new model.

I've never received a software update to any car that affected it's operation in any noticeable way. I think I prefer my car continuing to operate the way it did when I bought it. I know there could be some benefits to updates down the line, but there could also be save large downsides.

 

[rstrohkirch]

I've never received a software update to any car that affected it's operation in any noticeable way. I think I prefer my car continuing to operate the way it did when I bought it. I know there could be some benefits to updates down the line, but there could also be save large downsides.

A lot of manufactures are either in the process or have transitioned to OTA updates.

 

[quikah]

None of the updates are random or on it's own. You have to opt into Advanced updates, you have to accept the updates and install time.

No. The car regularly does software updates. I never opted into any sort of advanced updates. These are the normal updates that happen all the time. I get a popup with install now or schedule. I always just tap schedule, which defaults to that night. The UI has changed on my Model Y 2x since I have owned it since early March 2021 (first change was fairly minor).

 

[KentState]

No. The car regularly does software updates. I never opted into any sort of advanced updates. These are the normal updates that happen all the time. I get a popup with install now or schedule. I always just tap schedule, which defaults to that night. The UI has changed on my Model Y 2x since I have owned it since early March 2021 (first change was fairly minor).

Did you set up wifi? Did you validate the update settings? Do you hit cancel when it asks to install? I'm not there when the updates come on your car so not sure why you are having issues.

 

[quikah]

Did you set up wifi? Did you validate the update settings? Do you hit cancel when it asks to install? I'm not there when the updates come on your car so not sure why you are having issues.

Yes, I said I tapped the schedule button, I don't want to be nagged everytime I get in the car to update it. You were implying that it was some special advanced opt-in process to get the update. It was generally released to everyone. None of this changes the fact that the update made the car worse.

 

[Aikouka]

Haven't ranted about Tesla in a while, and I figure I'm overdue!

I think I'm just going to remove my car from the FSD queue at this point. I'm at a 92-94 score, which is fine, but I have no idea how long it'll take to reach me... especially when last I heard, they were doling it out to 98's. Honestly... I'm just tired of feeling judged by Tesla. It frustrates me whenever I get dinged for a Forward Collision Warning when I'm in no danger of hitting the car in front of me. In most of those instances, I'm already slowing down, but it's just not fast enough for the car's Medium setting, which is what the Safety Score uses. (Of course, if you slow down too fast, you'll get dinged for hard braking!)

In regard to the latest UI update... it's what I expect from Tesla. I think it all comes back to one pervasive thought that I can't get out of my head in regard to the company... do any of their engineers/designers even drive the car? I can't imagine anyone from a UX team would be okay with how their system is becoming more user-unfriendly. One issue that I ran into was when I tried to dial into a meeting, and I was so confused as to where the call dialog was. Turns out that the garage door panel will hide the call dialog box. Also, when you hit the numpad button, the call buttons move up rather than staying in the same place at the bottom. As someone that works in software, it's just poor design all around.

2. The ugliest modern vehicle she's ever seen on the road, bar none.

I'm a bit mixed on it overall. I think the Model 3/Y really only looks bad when you look at it from a specific angle at the back. Albeit, this is all subjective and some may love the rear look of the car(s), where I think the front looks fine and they don't.

3. The frunk needed to be deeper for her needs, but it's still useful

I tend to use the frunk mostly for groceries, and it works well for that. Just be careful that nothing will hit the Open button while moving, or it will release the frunk. (Without mods, that just pops it up a tiny bit like a normal hood would.) I only ever had this issue happen once for me, and I think it was because a 2L soda bottle was positioned parallel with the car and the bottom was pushing the button.

4. TOUCHING THE SCREEN FOR EVERYTHING. It was a misty day and the "automatic" wipers couldn't adjust for crap. Having to learn the vehicle, drive, and keep looking over to the screen to adjust the wipers every 30 seconds is an absolutely stupid design.

I'll admit that I will never be a fan of this, and I'm certain that plenty of people on this sub-forum can recount how often I complain about it. Frankly, I'd be fine as long as I could adjust the headlights and wipers from a physical control. My issue with the headlights are that it's illegal for me to drive with the wipers on any highway or interstate and not have my lights on. The majority of the time, the car turns the lights on when the wipers are on, but sometimes... it doesn't. There are times where I've driven most of the way to work and realized that my lights were never on even though it was overcast and rainy.

Overall, my biggest problem -- and I saw someone reiterate this point in a recent article on Tesla -- is that Tesla thinks they know how I want to drive, and it really rubs me the wrong way. It's so asinine when you consider that Tesla's entire concept is a car that drives for you, but how in the world will automatic driving ever work in the rain when the rain occludes the cameras every time!? Heck, I get error messages on my car just from sunlight hitting the B-pillar sensors, which ends up blinding them.

6. Left out of the original post, I forgot. The sensors were absolutely crazy in town. Construction cones jumping everywhere, vehicles sliding around on the screen when we were stationary. She expected a perfect view of objects on the screen in digital form, but there was way too much moving around to trust that an object was where it said it was in gridlocked traffic. It could only estimate our rural 2 lane roads with no paint. The automatic cruise control worked fine enough, but it does in her current vehicle as well.

Similar to what I said above about how Tesla thinks they know how you want to drive, they don't let you turn traffic assist off on the cruise control. That can be even more frustrating due to traffic assist still having issues with phantom drops and slowdowns. I've been snapped forward in my seat from the car suddenly dropping out of cruise control on a highway with absolutely no cars in front of me.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

Curious ... as I have not yet tried the FSD feature that I paid for. Is this scoring system for beta versions?

 

[Aikouka]

Curious ... as I have not yet tried the FSD feature that I paid for. Is this scoring system for beta versions?

Yes, you add yourself to the FSD beta queue via the car's menu, and part of that process is for the car to evaluate your driving for at least three weeks. After that period, they will consider you able to get the update, but it depends upon what score Tesla is currently adding to the beta. As noted, the last I heard, they had added in people with a 98 out of 100.

As for the scoring, it pretty much will ding you for driving in any spirited manner. I don't mind some of the aspects of it, since I can argue that it keeps my tires in better shape. It's mostly the hard braking and forward collision warning that give me the most problems. To be clear, I am in the green on forward collision warnings, but I do still get them from time to time in situations that don't seem to warrant one. Last I recall, I was in the yellow for following too closely and hard turns. I also dropped from 94 to 92 when hard braking went from green to yellow. Following too closely can be a bit of a pain, because if I leave a decent enough gap to not get dinged, someone just merges into the gap.

Honestly, I just wanted to try it out a tiny bit, but in reality, I wouldn't use it much apart from testing interesting situations. I might be willing to try it more if my tests don't show any major issues that make me too safety-conscious to use it.

 

[Ferzerp]

Yes, you add yourself to the FSD beta queue via the car's menu, and part of that process is for the car to evaluate your driving for at least three weeks. After that period, they will consider you able to get the update, but it depends upon what score Tesla is currently adding to the beta. As noted, the last I heard, they had added in people with a 98 out of 100.

As for the scoring, it pretty much will ding you for driving in any spirited manner. I don't mind some of the aspects of it, since I can argue that it keeps my tires in better shape. It's mostly the hard braking and forward collision warning that give me the most problems. To be clear, I am in the green on forward collision warnings, but I do still get them from time to time in situations that don't seem to warrant one. Last I recall, I was in the yellow for following too closely and hard turns. I also dropped from 94 to 92 when hard braking went from green to yellow. Following too closely can be a bit of a pain, because if I leave a decent enough gap to not get dinged, someone just merges into the gap.

Honestly, I just wanted to try it out a tiny bit, but in reality, I wouldn't use it much apart from testing interesting situations. I might be willing to try it more if my tests don't show any major issues that make me too safety-conscious to use it.

If you want it, it sounds like you'll need to game it. Take yourself out of the queue to wipe your score (assuming this still works). Wait a week or so (or maybe not). Put yourself back in. Take a single 100+ mile drive on an empty interstate, be super careful, use AP pretty much the whole time. Get home, verify you have a 99-100 score and that over 100 mile drive and then... park the car until you get access (this is what you might not be able to do unless you have multiple cars).

Yeah. It's dumb. I wasn't driving much when I got the beta, so having a 99-100 score was trivial, but getting the 100 miles wasn't. I ended up just doing a 100 mile trip one evening just to make sure I had met every criteria.

That said, you probably won't want it anyway. It's a mess. I haven't even used the last version yet. I don't even know if they're still adding people. I've been in since 10.4 or so. It's more frustrating than anything to use.

 

[Aikouka]

If you want it, it sounds like you'll need to game it. Take yourself out of the queue to wipe your score (assuming this still works). Wait a week or so (or maybe not). Put yourself back in. Take a single 100+ mile drive on an empty interstate, be super careful, use AP pretty much the whole time. Get home, verify you have a 99-100 score and that over 100 mile drive and then... park the car until you get access (this is what you might not be able to do unless you have multiple cars).

Yeah. It's dumb. I wasn't driving much when I got the beta, so having a 99-100 score was trivial, but getting the 100 miles wasn't. I ended up just doing a 100 mile trip one evening just to make sure I had met every criteria.

That said, you probably won't want it anyway. It's a mess. I haven't even used the last version yet. I don't even know if they're still adding people. I've been in since 10.4 or so. It's more frustrating than anything to use.

Honestly, as someone that works in software and ruminates over things like AI, I just want to try it out. I'm kind of curious how it will handle certain situations; you know... more of the off-nominal situations. My worry is that Tesla seems to operate with a mentality defined in their own area, which I think is partly what drives their design ideals (the ones that I've spoken out about vehemently), and I wonder if that seeps into their AI training. I mean... at least from my understanding, the way the training works is that you subject your AI to scenarios using the same (or simulated) inputs. Success is essentially defined by the outcome of the decisions made by the AI, and it uses the successful scenarios to help define its decision-making routines. So, with that concept, I wonder if the majority of its decision-making data was based upon Californian datasets?

 

[BarkingGhostar]

It does seem illogical to consider your driving behavior to test that of an AI. I thought the job of AI-implemented driving (e.g. FSD) was to replace the driver, including the driver's driving behavior, so why judge the driver at all?

 

[Aikouka]

It does seem illogical to consider your driving behavior to test that of an AI. I thought the job of AI-implemented driving (e.g. FSD) was to replace the driver, including the driver's driving behavior, so why judge the driver at all?

I believe they consider it to be a method to test the responsibility of a driver to not abuse the AI. For example, one factor in your safety score is forced AutoPilot disengagements, which is actually somewhat relevant because you want someone that's properly paying attention while using AutoPilot. Albeit, Tesla's method for gauging attention isn't that great to begin with. I've had plenty of times where I'm focusing on the road while using AutoPilot but not putting enough force on the steering wheel, and the car yells at me. Although, I do agree that it's not the best factor.

I've pretty much decided to just remove myself from the queue after the car gave me another Forward Collision Warning today. What really irked me is that it doesn't even make sense why I got one. I was in a straight+right lane, and the vehicle further ahead of me was turning right. I saw that he was far enough through the turn that I had no need to slow down, so I didn't. However, the car still yelled at me because (I assume) it deemed the turning car a problem.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

I think Tesla has lost the idea of how people plan to use FSD. They want a pseudo-chauffeur and expect it to do everything for them. If this isn't what Tesla intends to provide then the whole idea is bonkers to me. Then again, I haven't even tried Autopilot yet.

 

[KentState]

I think Tesla has lost the idea of how people plan to use FSD. They want a pseudo-chauffeur and expect it to do everything for them. If this isn't what Tesla intends to provide then the whole idea is bonkers to me. Then again, I haven't even tried Autopilot yet.

At this point, I think they want your robot to carry you to the car and drive you to the space port to go to Mars. All products will release at about the same time as well. From the earnings call, I sense that they want to diversify their product line up in a bunch of different ways, but not sure that Elon and his attention span can keep all the plates spinning. Now we have rockets, robots, cars, AI, tunnels, solar, HVAC, super computers and probably 10 other ventures that I'm forgetting.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

You forgot his neural brain interface, which allows us to use the robot as our proxy. Why be driven when you can mentally drive your robot to drive somewhere?

 

[quikah]

I think Tesla has lost the idea of how people plan to use FSD. They want a pseudo-chauffeur and expect it to do everything for them. If this isn't what Tesla intends to provide then the whole idea is bonkers to me. Then again, I haven't even tried Autopilot yet.

I think it is more the fact that it doesn't work well enough.

 

[repoman0]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/02/02/tesla-phantom-braking/

I wonder when the general public is going to realize that Tesla lost the autonomous driving race as soon as Elon made the decision to nix lidar.

 

[Commodus]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/02/02/tesla-phantom-braking/

I wonder when the general public is going to realize that Tesla lost the autonomous driving race as soon as Elon made the decision to nix lidar.

That decision always baffles me... does Tesla understand this whole "snow" thing and that cameras can only see so much?

 

[repoman0]

That decision always baffles me... does Tesla understand this whole "snow" thing and that cameras can only see so much?

I am very sure that various autonomous systems teams within the company are quite aware of that, but the culture of the company isn’t conducive to questioning leadership’s incorrect decisions.

 

[KentState]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/02/02/tesla-phantom-braking/

I wonder when the general public is going to realize that Tesla lost the autonomous driving race as soon as Elon made the decision to nix lidar.

Lidar or radar? I don't believe that the cars every used lidar.

 

[repoman0]

Lidar or radar? I don't believe that the cars every used lidar.

Correct, that’s why it doesn’t currently work well and won’t be able to deliver all of what was promised to people who paid for it in advance. Cameras aren’t enough to guarantee safe operation of the system and no amount of software work will make them work in weather (including sun that’s too bright as at least one passenger death so far has proven), as Commodus pointed out.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

I do not doubt that electricity prices will rise due to the surge in petroleum but I just am enjoying the hell out of my M3P. Drove it into work and back. Nothing like spending $10 on a full charge and doing 93 MPH in the toll lane back home.

 

[KentState]

I do not doubt that electricity prices will rise due to the surge in petroleum but I just am enjoying the hell out of my M3P. Drove it into work and back. Nothing like spending $10 on a full charge and doing 93 MPH in the toll lane back home.

I've been somewhat oblivious to the gas prices myself since we only have electric cars. Was shocked to see that premium is getting close to the $5 mark here which is what my previous cars required. Our power is sourced heavily from nuclear and I believe two more reactors are going online in the near future. Still, the cost of nearly everything else will rise.

 

[ondma]

Cant really afford, or want, an all EV car, but I have always bought relatively efficient vehicles. I feel sorry for people who have older vehicles and have to drive a lot, but I cant say I really feel sorry for those who have bought 40-50 k vehicles that get 15 mpg.

 

[BarkingGhostar]

There was a tidbit last week from Iraq about their concerns that high petro prices would lead more people to buying electric cars. That is an understatement, but then yesterday Tesla increased prices again. This is twice since I picked up mine last November. I get the feeling that aluminum is gonna be expensive with Russian supplies out of the picture.