2011 F1 Season thread

[The-Noid]

I'm sure there is a "wet mode" for the car, but that probably doesn't turn on the rain light. The two blinking modes are normal, and pit lane, as far as I know.

We have seen cars in the rain where the driver forgot to turn the light on.

Why not just tell Vettel over the radio to put the car in "wet mode" to save it if it would help?

Pit turns on the light and wet mode turns on the light. BBC stated rbr told him to put car in wet via command. There are many conversations the tv doesn't air. Apparently there were some 50 conversations discussing the car and to let webber by. What makes the tv is what they chose to air.

Of all the people I think the one most disappointed was mark. I think he felt he had the pace and he knew everyone would second guess the win now.

Again, watch pitstops 2 , 3 and fourth section of race (after pitstop 3) on the wheel for Vettel and the downshifts. You can't fake a bad shift and there are multiple times he tries to get the car into gear and grabs neutral or the same gear. Driver of the day imo was Vettel because if you watch closely that gearbox definitely had problems but I don't think RBR did a Flavio and sabotaged the race. There is simply no reason. If there was a lap or two to go and they let Mark by that is a different story. With 30some odd laps or so it makes no sense. Mark was also like I said picking up time before the official announcement was made, either that was Mark being faster or more likely the gearbox was giving out already.

 

[LTC8K6]

The gearbox problems and the orders aren't necessarily exclusive. Vettel could probably have won the race, but the team may have chosen to let Webber win the race instead.

I haven't seen any indication from the team that the gearbox was giving out, just that it was low on oil and they took preventive measures to see that it didn't fail.

Of course, it may just be vanity that RB doesn't want to say officially that they put the gearbox back together wrong. :biggrin:

 

[The-Noid]

The gearbox problems and the orders aren't necessarily exclusive. Vettel could probably have won the race, but the team may have chosen to let Webber win the race instead.

I haven't seen any indication from the team that the gearbox was giving out, just that it was low on oil and they took preventive measures to see that it didn't fail.

Of course, it may just be vanity that RB doesn't want to say officially that they put the gearbox back together wrong. :biggrin:

I don't think they knew if it would make it or not. I believe Horner even said that.

Like I said I think the person who is the most mad about the whole situation is Webber. He finally had pace and it would have been nice to seen him bring the fight to Vettel.

 

[LTC8K6]

I don't think they knew if it would make it or not. I believe Horner even said that.

Like I said I think the person who is the most mad about the whole situation is Webber. He finally had pace and it would have been nice to seen him bring the fight to Vettel.

Vettel was leaving the field rapidly in the first laps. Webber had nothing were it not for whatever slowed down Vettel, imo.

 

[The-Noid]

Vettel was leaving the field rapidly in the first laps. Webber had nothing were it not for whatever slowed down Vettel, imo.

http://en.mclarenf-1.com/index.php?page=chart&gp=845&graf=3

TV Announcement to short shift came on lap 17 if memory serves me right, although he had already slowed at that point. At that point he was only ~3s ahead.

 

[LTC8K6]

Yes, Vettel is walking away pretty smartly, as usual, until lap 9. In the first 2 laps, he is more than 1 second per lap faster. There are only a couple laps in those first nine where Webber is close to Vettel's lap time.

 

[The-Noid]

Yes, Vettel is walking away pretty smartly, as usual, until lap 9. In the first 2 laps, he is more than 1 second per lap faster. There are only a couple laps in those first nine where Webber is close to Vettel's lap time.

Let me quote again because you apparently don't know what you said.

"Yeah, I think we saw orchestrated team orders there. I don't think anything was ever wrong with Vettel's transmission."

So now you are saying without talking to engineering Vettel simply started going slower or there really was a transmission problem? There are really only two solutions. A gigantic conspiracy that would cost a drinks company (that is in motor sports for the PR and ad campaign) a lot negative PR if it came out or there was a gear box problem.

I am confused because it sure seems like you are saying there was a gear box problem that started showing on lap 9.

Also again what are the point of orchestrated team orders, when team orders are legal?

 

[LTC8K6]

I didn't know it was illegal to change my mind during a discussion. At any rate, my initial reaction remains my strongest impression.

Why would a gear box problem mean there were no team orders? Vettel could possibly have won even with a problem, as many other drivers have done. A genuine gear box problem doesn't mean that Webber's win was not orchestrated.

Why do I care about team orders? Because I am a Ferrari fan, and I listened to endless crap about it forever, back in the day. Including some big penalties. :biggrin:

It's ironic that it was such a huge deal in F1, and now it's meh... :whiste:

"Oh my god, what a bunch of creeps! Asking a driver to move over! What a bunch of jerks, ruining the honor of racing! You are supposed to race to win, not race to lose! Bastards!"

Then

"Team orders? Sure, go ahead. Who would you like to place higher, #1 or #2 driver, and when would you like to make the switch?"

 

[RiDE]

The Iceman is back...

6 World Champions on the grid next year.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

ferrari leaves FOTA

red bull leaves FOTA

 

[busydude]

ferrari leaves FOTA

red bull leaves FOTA

So.. that means they get to have unlimited resources and no restrictions on testing?

 

[LTC8K6]

Good, F1 needs to be cutting edge again. F1 teams need to be let loose again.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

So.. that means they get to have unlimited resources and no restrictions on testing?

no, the resource restriction agreement is independent of FOTA, and the testing restrictions are FIA rules.

 

[The-Noid]

no, the resource restriction agreement is independent of FOTA, and the testing restrictions are FIA rules.

They will have unlimited wind tunnel time.

Ferrari and Red Bull have already skirted these rules anyway for a while. Under the "we were using the extra resources and times to supply parts to our sister teams." Red Bull using Kers and Gearbox (you really think RBR wants to give their gearbox or Kers to anyone?) and Ferrari using the engine manufacturing excuse.

Go to eight, three car teams anyway. The backfield is becoming stupid to watch. The Japanese want back in. Audi/Porsche wants in (and they definitely have the budget), BMW wants to build an engine. Mercedes is already contemplating taking money away from DTM and Le Mans(which is the majority of their Euro900M budget) and putting it to F1 (why it took two years I will have no idea) there is going to be a huge amount of sponsorship money coming from the Americas and also the Russian oil company support in the next three years as the new GP's come in.

Get rid of all the stupid rules to allow cheaper teams to participate and get down to eight manufacturer, huge funded teams. I like the years when you had three engine designs with three different cylinder configurations (V8, V10 and Ferrari running a V12). I mean I hate to say it this way but does anyone really want to watch HRT and Virgin battle it out for last place? Put a cap around 600-700M (in 2001 they were worried spending would get to a Billion a year) and make three car teams, imo.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

whoops, i was wrong. the resource restriction agreement was a fota arrangement which now appears dead.

FOTA trouble is good news for Bernie Ecclestone

track and wind tunnel time is allocated by the FIA. teams can exchange some of one for the other. they are still restricted to using double precision computers, giving rise to 1 of my favorite accusations:

"they're using infinite precision!"
flavio briatore, on ferrari and whoever else was in front of his team.

rather than fewer teams with 3 cars each, i'd rather see the top 6 supplying customer cars to the bottom 6.

 

[The-Noid]

whoops, i was wrong. the resource restriction agreement was a fota arrangement which now appears dead.

FOTA trouble is good news for Bernie Ecclestone

track and wind tunnel time is allocated by the FIA. teams can exchange some of one for the other. they are still restricted to using double precision computers, giving rise to 1 of my favorite accusations:

"they're using infinte precision!"
flavio briatore, on ferrari and whoever else was in front of his team.

rather than fewer teams with 3 cars each, i'd rather see the top 6 supplying customer cars to the bottom 6.

Oh yeah I forgot wind tunnel tome was now part of that as well, but how does this years in season testing change that?

I also agree that supplying last years car to the bottom would be fine. I do agree with ferrari however that all the aero work at this time is becoming dumb.

 

[The Boston Dangler]

very fun, great videos:

Top ten overtakes of 2011: Vote for Pass of the Year

 

[punjabiplaya]

apparently 2012 in Austin is on again: http://www.theaustingrandprix.com/news/2011/12/6/formula-1-re-signs-with-austin-for-2012.html

 

[The Boston Dangler]

yep, austin is confirmed for 2012.

also,new rules next year

The FIA will impose a maximum time limit of four hours on Grands Prix as of 2012

The FIA has also confirmed new rules on driving standards. When defending a position, drivers will not be allowed to move back onto the racing line after moving off-line.

Drivers have also been told they can no longer leave the track without a justifiable reason. Some drivers have been cutting chicanes during practice and qualifying sessions to save time and/or fuel

 

[punjabiplaya]

couple more that are noteworthy:

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2011/12/12876.html

- Before the safety car returns to the pits all lapped cars will be allowed to unlap themselves and then join the back of the pack, ensuring a clean re-start without slower cars impeding those racing for the leading positions.

- One three-day test will be carried out during the season, formerly there were none.