2 Abrams tanks vs. 10,000 Chinese cavalrymen: Who would win?

[imported_Baloo]

The tanks, easily and clearly. They have much greater range of fire, and could take out infantry without even being seen by them. Silly question.

 

[jdoggg12]

As long as the tanks keep moving, they're cool... especially if the troops are in a crowd. Shoot into the crowd and run them over - not much you can do against a 60ton tank traveling at you at 40mph

 

[TehMac]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother
cavalry. Eventually, they surround the tanks and kill the guys inside. aren't abrams tanks' rounds anti tank piercing rounds as opposed to explosive?

Uhmm, it's not just the tank barrels.

Have you seen a .50 Calibre round before??? Its 12.7mm...that's ***** huge!
Look it up on wikipedia, and then imagine the damn thing come out of a gun at around 600RPM.

And why Chinese cavalry? You mean modern Chinese cavalry? This phails.

Either way Abrams pwn all.

 

[jdoggg12]

I change my vote if its 10k Chinese with RPGs

 

[Phokus]

Wow, even after a former tank operator posts and says the 10k calvary would win and points out the limitations of the tank, people still post the same unrealistic scenarios with the tank

 

[PingSpike]

Originally posted by: sygyzy
Even if they couldn't open the hatch, what's to stop 10,000 calvary swarming the tank and just hitting the treads or wheels with the buts of their gun. Or constantly shooting it. With unlimited ammo, I am sure you can break the tank.

Probably the machine gun, filled with unlimited ammo, mounted on the tank, constantly firing and killing you as your approach to pound on the treads with the butt of a rifle. I suppose the gunner may have to take a break when his finger gets tired of holding the trigger down.

 

[Phokus]

Originally posted by: UpGrD
As someone that spent the better part of 5 yrs on a M1A1. I have some insight. As usual its all in the details.
- Will the tanks have the new Anti personnel canister rounds (M1028 canister round contains approximately 1,100 tungsten balls)
- Will all 40 rounds be the M1028 canister (42 for the M1A2)
- RANGE, the most important detail. The more the better. 1200m is about max for the M240 COAX, loaders M240 much less.
- How good is the loader at both M240 marksmanship (Not easy) , loading main gun, keeping 50cal loaded (only 100 rounds per box), and changing barrels.
- Speed of the Chinese, tactic's and how determined are they

Having said all this, if the attackers are determined, unless the tanks can make the attackers break and run, there is no way 2 tanks could fight them off.
A company of tanks (14) absolutely. For the most part the 50cal would have limited use, only 100 ready rounds and not easy to aim at moving personnel.
I was a gunner in the first gulf war and after the war in order to get the tank ready for shipment back, we had to fire off all unboxed ammo. It took all day to fire the ready load of COAX rounds (I want to say 10,000 ???). Most of that time was spent letting the barrels cool. It only took about 3 min of firing before the barrels were red hot. In about 5 min they would actually begin to melt. That would be a real problem in this situation.
You do have a spare barrel, maybe 2, but still.....
As for the issue of could infantry with only small arms take out a tank. With out a doubt. Give me access to an engine deck and in 15 seconds that tank would have no power and burning within minutes.
The crew can still engage targets pretty effectively manually but not well enough.
Not a situation I would want to be in.

Still the only worthwhile post in this thread. Everyone else's opinions are worthless.

 

[TehMac]

Originally posted by: jdoggg12
I change my vote if its 10k Chinese with RPGs

ROFL. Still, you'd be surprised. RPGs need to be pretty close range, so unless the Chinese ambushed, I dunno...

 

[PingSpike]

The chinese would have to be pretty determined...since a shit ton of them are going to die. If they had a plan and accepted death they could probably swarm the tank and disable it.

 

[jdoggg12]

Originally posted by: PingSpike
The chinese would have to be pretty determined...since a shit ton of them are going to die. If they had a plan and accepted death they could probably swarm the tank and disable it.

Its not exactly a new concept - lots of men sent in to overwhelm the enemy with sheer numbers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omaha_Beach

 

[olds]

Originally posted by: Phokus

Originally posted by: UpGrD
As someone that spent the better part of 5 yrs on a M1A1. I have some insight. As usual its all in the details.
- Will the tanks have the new Anti personnel canister rounds (M1028 canister round contains approximately 1,100 tungsten balls)
- Will all 40 rounds be the M1028 canister (42 for the M1A2)
- RANGE, the most important detail. The more the better. 1200m is about max for the M240 COAX, loaders M240 much less.
- How good is the loader at both M240 marksmanship (Not easy) , loading main gun, keeping 50cal loaded (only 100 rounds per box), and changing barrels.
- Speed of the Chinese, tactic's and how determined are they

Having said all this, if the attackers are determined, unless the tanks can make the attackers break and run, there is no way 2 tanks could fight them off.
A company of tanks (14) absolutely. For the most part the 50cal would have limited use, only 100 ready rounds and not easy to aim at moving personnel.
I was a gunner in the first gulf war and after the war in order to get the tank ready for shipment back, we had to fire off all unboxed ammo. It took all day to fire the ready load of COAX rounds (I want to say 10,000 ???). Most of that time was spent letting the barrels cool. It only took about 3 min of firing before the barrels were red hot. In about 5 min they would actually begin to melt. That would be a real problem in this situation.
You do have a spare barrel, maybe 2, but still.....
As for the issue of could infantry with only small arms take out a tank. With out a doubt. Give me access to an engine deck and in 15 seconds that tank would have no power and burning within minutes.
The crew can still engage targets pretty effectively manually but not well enough.
Not a situation I would want to be in.

Still the only worthwhile post in this thread. Everyone else's opinions are worthless.

Especially yours.

 

[BurnItDwn]

Cavalry would win.

Tanks would run out of fuel and ammo.
Tank crews would run out of food/water.

All the cavalry would need to do is outlast them, and since they are not stuck inside of tanks, they probably have some sort of access to supplies.


That said ... the Cavalry would have EXTREMELY MASSIVE losses unless they stayed very spread out, and only sent small numbers at a time to eventually wear the tankers down.

 

[NikolaeVarius]

As someone that spent the better part of 5 yrs on a M1A1. I have some insight. As usual its all in the details.
- Will the tanks have the new Anti personnel canister rounds (M1028 canister round contains approximately 1,100 tungsten balls)
- Will all 40 rounds be the M1028 canister (42 for the M1A2)
- RANGE, the most important detail. The more the better. 1200m is about max for the M240 COAX, loaders M240 much less.
- How good is the loader at both M240 marksmanship (Not easy) , loading main gun, keeping 50cal loaded (only 100 rounds per box), and changing barrels.
- Speed of the Chinese, tactic's and how determined are they

Having said all this, if the attackers are determined, unless the tanks can make the attackers break and run, there is no way 2 tanks could fight them off.
A company of tanks (14) absolutely. For the most part the 50cal would have limited use, only 100 ready rounds and not easy to aim at moving personnel.
I was a gunner in the first gulf war and after the war in order to get the tank ready for shipment back, we had to fire off all unboxed ammo. It took all day to fire the ready load of COAX rounds (I want to say 10,000 ???). Most of that time was spent letting the barrels cool. It only took about 3 min of firing before the barrels were red hot. In about 5 min they would actually begin to melt. That would be a real problem in this situation.
You do have a spare barrel, maybe 2, but still.....
As for the issue of could infantry with only small arms take out a tank. With out a doubt. Give me access to an engine deck and in 15 seconds that tank would have no power and burning within minutes.
The crew can still engage targets pretty effectively manually but not well enough.
Not a situation I would want to be in.

I'm siding with tanks

I'm assuming a full loadout of Anti personnel shells, especially if intelligence said that there is only calvary. Of course, without knowing, I do belive that the standard load i2 anti personnel sells. I could be wrong.

I'm also assuming fairly skilled gun crews.

I think even a unskilled crew could win. Considering that even a few shells would destroy the horses will to run.

 

[dwcal]

Originally posted by: mooglemania85
if we are assuming that gas and ammo are unlimited, should we also assume the horses are actually magical unicorns? or how about centaurs?

Yeah, that's an important consideration. Check the fuel consumption of an M1. How many cavalry does it take to capture the fuel truck?

If this is a deathmatch, the cavalry wins by outlasting the tank.

If it's defend the base, offense wins every time. Cavalry can't stop a charging tank. Tank can't stop all 10,000 from reaching the base.

 

[Noirish]

having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

 

[benzylic]

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: mxrider

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

And, as I mentioned before...if the rest of the guns are outfitted with CROWS, then the cavalry don't stand a chance.

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: mxrider

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

except that guy is limited to firing at whatever teh big gun is firing at. And since everyone who's exposed will be shot by virtue of the fact that there are 10,000 firing at you, the tank doesn't have a large field of fire. Of course, he'll kill a bunch, but while they're reloading, cavalry can keep moving in and then do crazy sh!t like fire their guns into the cannons and whatever. And enough can move in so that they can just sit on top of teh tank and chill.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: mxrider

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

except that guy is limited to firing at whatever teh big gun is firing at. And since everyone who's exposed will be shot by virtue of the fact that there are 10,000 firing at you, the tank doesn't have a large field of fire. Of course, he'll kill a bunch, but while they're reloading, cavalry can keep moving in and then do crazy sh!t like fire their guns into the cannons and whatever. And enough can move in so that they can just sit on top of teh tank and chill.

See my last post

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: mxrider

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

except that guy is limited to firing at whatever teh big gun is firing at. And since everyone who's exposed will be shot by virtue of the fact that there are 10,000 firing at you, the tank doesn't have a large field of fire. Of course, he'll kill a bunch, but while they're reloading, cavalry can keep moving in and then do crazy sh!t like fire their guns into the cannons and whatever. And enough can move in so that they can just sit on top of teh tank and chill.

See my last post

I wasn't aware it was standard for all guns on an Abrams to be CROWS operated, but even so, are we assuming that nothing overheats?

 

[Legendary]

What's so unrealistic about the tank running them all over?

 

[IAteYourMother]

Originally posted by: Legendary
What's so unrealistic about the tank running them all over?

because horses run

 

[Edgewardb]

What if the Chinese Use those Gundams? That will be a different story.

And hey if the Abram tank is so powerful, then probaly why won't we just use 2 tanks instead an army? Think about that.

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: PurdueRy

Originally posted by: IAteYourMother

Originally posted by: mxrider

Originally posted by: Noirish
having cavalries converge on the tanks from all direction and firing on the machine gunners at the same time.
it won't take too many attempts to kill the machine gunners.
once they are gone, just pile as much grenades as you can on the tanks, boom, it's over.

Yeah except, there is a coaxil machine gun, check out this picture, see that small tube next to the main gun, thats the coax, how do you expect to knock that gunner out. IMPOSSIBLE

except that guy is limited to firing at whatever teh big gun is firing at. And since everyone who's exposed will be shot by virtue of the fact that there are 10,000 firing at you, the tank doesn't have a large field of fire. Of course, he'll kill a bunch, but while they're reloading, cavalry can keep moving in and then do crazy sh!t like fire their guns into the cannons and whatever. And enough can move in so that they can just sit on top of teh tank and chill.

See my last post

I wasn't aware it was standard for all guns on an Abrams to be CROWS operated, but even so, are we assuming that nothing overheats?

It's not standard but is becoming the new thing. The army just ordered many more Humvee's, Stryker and Abrams tanks to be fitted with them

 

[PurdueRy]

Originally posted by: Edgewardb
What if the Chinese Use those Gundams? That will be a different story.

And hey if the Abram tank is so powerful, then probaly why won't we just use 2 tanks instead an army? Think about that.

Because a tank isn't good at picking single targets and avoiding unnecessary damage in urban warfare?