19 Year Old Girl Shot Looking for Help

[waggy]

Attempting to open the door and banging on it.

has to be more then banging on it. IF it was true we would have a LOT of Jehovah witness's!

 

[HomerJS]

Attempting to open the door and banging on it.

and the evidence of that is??

More likely that time of night she either knocked or rang the bell. Unless owner was near door that time of night not likely to hear someone attempting to open door.

So she wandered aroung down suffering a head injury and what comes to mind, I'll bang on a few doors and try to break in some houses.

Only in the mind of someone wanting to convict dead person.

 

[spidey07]

Don't want to get shot? Don't attempt to enter another's home illegally.

It's really that simple. If you attempt to do that or are in the process of attempting to enter the home of another, in the middle of the night, you are likely to get shot.

You fell for the lies the last time and obviously didn't learn your lesson. Because you're falling for the family's lies AGAIN!

 

[werepossum]

Really? How was she doing that? Kicking down door? Battering ram? Chanting open sesame?

I smell credibility stretch.

Probably just rattling the door knob and/or trying to make her key work in it, depending on how messed up she was. Or banging on the door and yelling, if she lived with someone else.

Mistakes will be made, and someone trying to open your door is not necessarily a home invasion. If the homeowner backed away from the door and accidentally shot, he goes on trial for negligent homicide in Werepossumworld. If she was backing away from the door, he goes on trial for murder 2 in Werepossumworld - but the werepossumcutor would be authorized to cop a plea for negligent homicide. Unless the werepolice found evidence indicating that murder 2 was the proper charge.

 

[nehalem256]

Lots of people who aren't drunk or high hit parked cars at high speeds...

No they don't.

Head injuries can certainly make you behave erratically. There can also be a time delay before someone with a head injury begins to behave erratically.

Do you know of another case where someone injured in an accident ran off after medical attention had been summoned for them?

 

[nehalem256]

Probably just rattling the door knob and/or trying to make her key work in it, depending on how messed up she was. Or banging on the door and yelling, if she lived with someone else.

Mistakes will be made, and someone trying to open your door is not necessarily a home invasion. If the homeowner backed away from the door and accidentally shot, he goes on trial for negligent homicide in Werepossumworld. If she was backing away from the door, he goes on trial for murder 2 in Werepossumworld - but the werepossumcutor would be authorized to cop a plea for negligent homicide. Unless the werepolice found evidence indicating that murder 2 was the proper charge.

Except per Geosurface's video the door does not appear to be damaged, implying it was open when she was shot.

Since she was shot in the face this would imply that he was actively aiming the gun toward her.

Does that sound like a situation where he would have been inviting her in?

 

[Zargon]

No they don't.

I used to work at a 911 center, most accidents called in are single vehilces hitting stationary objects. feel free to FOIA your local one Im sure it will reflect the same thing

 

[TreVader]

Don't want to get shot? Don't attempt to enter another's home illegally.

It's really that simple. If you attempt to do that or are in the process of attempting to enter the home of another, in the middle of the night, you are likely to get shot.

You fell for the lies the last time and obviously didn't learn your lesson. Because you're falling for the family's lies AGAIN!

Don't want to sound stupid? Stop talking.


It's really that simple. Everyone here arguing that you should be able to kill people for knocking on your door, just shut up. I would say you were just trolling, but sadly I think you don't really have the capacity to troll.

 

[Geosurface]

Everyone here arguing that you should be able to kill people for knocking on your door, just shut up.

I've yet to see anyone argue that.

I've also yet to see evidence of what she was doing at his doorstep.

It will be interesting to hear what he claims she was doing.

If you can't handle nuance perhaps it is you who should shut up.

 

[nehalem256]

I used to work at a 911 center, most accidents called in are single vehilces hitting stationary objects. feel free to FOIA your local one Im sure it will reflect the same thing

And were most of these accidents at high speed as I specified?

Or were they of the oh I backed up a bit too far at Walmart at low speed?

 

[Geosurface]

And were most of these accidents at high speed as I specified?

Or were they of the oh I backed up a bit too far at Walmart at low speed?

and of those who hit stationary objects at high speed, would the 911 operator be in a position to find out what percentage ended up being intoxicated in some way?

 

[HumblePie]

and the evidence of that is??

More likely that time of night she either knocked or rang the bell. Unless owner was near door that time of night not likely to hear someone attempting to open door.

So she wandered aroung down suffering a head injury and what comes to mind, I'll bang on a few doors and try to break in some houses.

Only in the mind of someone wanting to convict dead person.

If all she did was walk up to the door and either knock or ring the doorbell then the shooting is not justified under the law. If she tried to handle to open it, or attempted to peer into the windows or after the door was not answered then that can be construed as trying to obtain illegal entry which would justify the shooting under the law.

Things people take for granted because they do it and don't think there is nothing wrong with it.

 

[spidey07]

Title is incorrect and misleading with misinformation. Needs to be changed to "Woman shot while attempting to enter man's home illegally at 3 in the morning".

 

[HumblePie]

Title is incorrect and misleading with misinformation. Needs to be changed to "Woman shot while attempting to enter man's home illegally at 3 in the morning".

Wouldn't go that far yet. Don't know if she was attempting to enter at this point for a fact just yet. Until more evidence of the case surfaces it could go either way. Something the police I'm sure are still investigating.

 

[Geosurface]

I would wager every single person who has read or posted in this thread agrees with this statement:

If all she did was knock, or ring the doorbell, or any combination of the two, then she absolutely should not have been shot.

 

[echo4747]

I would wager every single person who has read or posted in this thread agrees with this statement:

If all she did was knock, or ring the doorbell, or any combination of the two, then she absolutely should not have been shot.

I agree.. simply knocking or ringing doorbell.. is not an attempt to enter the household, however; turning the doorknob/handle and opening the door is an attempt to enter... i guess it depends on what reallyhappened

 

[2timer]

Title is incorrect and misleading with misinformation. Needs to be changed to "Woman shot while attempting to enter man's home illegally at 3 in the morning".

What evidence do you know about that suggests she was attempting to enter the home?

 

[Geosurface]

I agree.. simply knocking or ringing doorbell.. is not an attempt to enter the household, however; turning the doorknob/handle and opening the door is an attempt to enter... i guess it depends on what reallyhappened

Agreed. Let me say that I would certainly prefer someone not end up shot because they tried a handle and found a door open, especially if their next move was going to be to call out "hello? is anyone home? the door was open, I need help" etc.

But there may be many situations that are tragic, unfortunate, not what we'd want to see happen, and yet nobody needs to be put in prison for decades due to them because no law was broken, or it can't be proven that one was.

As you say, it really depends on what exactly did happen at that door. What she did.

 

[spidey07]

What evidence do you know about that suggests she was attempting to enter the home?

Statements from the victim, that's evidence.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Here's an interesting video from ClickOnDetroit.com where they talk to the man whose car she hit, show pictures of the damage to her car, etc.

If anyone cares to see more details like that.

Her car looked pretty smashed on the front. Certainly looks like the kind of accident which could leave you with a concussion if your head hit the steering wheel or whatever. Would be interesting to know if her airbag deployed, I don't think that was visible in the picture.

The man whose car it was was apparently there with the woman we'd heard about before, though I don't think they were connected other than coming out to help. He said they were calling police and an ambulance, but she left because she was scared, having been in an accident. Sounds a bit like what I was saying before, she didn't want to interact with law enforcement.

That could be because she was out of it, or because she feared consequences. Or both. Who knows?

Ultimately the only thing that really matters on the question of what happens to the shooter, is what she was doing at his porch and to his door. How she was behaving there. The reason she was behaving that way matters less because he had no way of knowing it.

The pieces coming together seem to indicate he shot from within his dwelling, she was still facing the dwelling, and the door took no damage so it was open.

The key question becomes, did he open it, or did she?

When freezing the video where her car is shown, it looks like an airbag was release and is crumpled on the dash.

The amount of damage is not a 5-10 hit.

More like a 30+mph. She was more likely speeding.

 

[nehalem256]

Agreed. Let me say that I would certainly prefer someone not end up shot because they tried a handle and found a door open, especially if their next move was going to be to call out "hello? is anyone home? the door was open, I need help" etc.

But there may be many situations that are tragic, unfortunate, not what we'd want to see happen, and yet nobody needs to be put in prison for decades due to them because no law was broken, or it can't be proven that one was.

As you say, it really depends on what exactly did happen at that door. What she did.

Assume that the woman really was just wandering around confused from the accident. She starts messing with the guys door late at night. He is startled awake grabs his gun and sleepily goes to find out what is going on. He accidentally discharges his gun and kills the poor woman.

Does it really make sense to put the man in jail?

 

[Geosurface]

She was more likely speeding.

In one story I heard that she was speeding. Not sure what that was based on.

Assume that the woman really was just wandering around confused from the accident. She starts messing with the guys door late at night. He is startled awake grabs his gun and sleepily goes to find out what is going on. He accidentally discharges his gun and kills the poor woman.

Does it really make sense to put the man in jail?

I don't think so, no.

 

[2timer]

Statements from the victim, that's evidence.

In other words, the only evidence you have that she was attempting to enter the home is not physical evidence, but a verbal statement from the man accused of killing her?

Is that correct, or do you have something else I don't know about?

 

[2timer]

Assume that the woman really was just wandering around confused from the accident. She starts messing with the guys door late at night. He is startled awake grabs his gun and sleepily goes to find out what is going on. He accidentally discharges his gun and kills the poor woman.

Does it really make sense to put the man in jail?

Absolutely. Even if it was an accidental killing, it's still a killing.

 

[HumblePie]

Absolutely. Even if it was an accidental killing, it's still a killing.

Nope. That's why the law is practically all 50 states is the same on this issue. Basically, if it's after dark don't go screwing around on other people's property where they may have a hard time trying to figure out of you are just confused or up to no good.