You have a teleportation device...

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: RichardE
I don't believe in a soul, but that is an ignorant statement.

IF we can not prove the soul yet, how do you know what type of energy the soul is and properties that energy has? Without knowing that how you actually say what will happen?

Do you believe in things we cannot explain? The supernatural?
Say, ghosts? Or voodoo magic?

No. Same as I do not believe in god, a supernatural being ect. Everything can be scientifically explained, it is only a matter of time until we can.

Then how do you explain the unexplainable? How do you explain peoples stories of ghosts, or peoples sightings of "UOF's" or experiences with magic?

As I just said....

Everything can be explained scientifically...

Can I explain it? No, but I have no doubt if someone spent the time and effort too, they could.

I *think* theres some things in quantum mechanics they cannot yet explain.
Aside from that, people have not yet come up with an explanation for the supernatural.
Whether thats due to lack of research or the fact it is truly unexplainable I'll leave up to you. I dont put much weight in the "scientific" experiments performed by the guys who are on TV with their fancy camcorder and electrowhatits tester.

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
The 'soul' by it's traditional and unreasonable biblical definition doesn't exist. Not anymore than a spaghetti monster or a mexican university graduate.

If it exists in another state of energy then we have a problem, but that's an unreasonable assumption to be made to begin with.

So if we cant see it or measure it now then it doesnt exist?
Arent mathematical formulas and scientific understandings changing daily? It seems unreasonable to me to assume because we cant measure it today that it means it doesnt exist. Look at how science has changed.
They used to use leaches on people.
They used to think the world was flat.
They used to think the world was the center of the universe.

Our understanding of the world around us is constantly changing.

Scientific understanding changes to develop an understanding of the unknown and conclusions are made to fit a working theory. We cannot test whether there is a man with a striking resemblance to Al Gore, yet one that has three penises and a working bit boys gaming system floating around in the free space of the Andromeda, but this is not something that has to be tested because it's absolutely ****** ridiculous. Likewise there is no well found biological theory in existence that can only be complete via a mythical force of god.

 

[DivideBYZero]

What happens if it's on a conveyor belt?

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
The 'soul' by it's traditional and unreasonable biblical definition doesn't exist. Not anymore than a spaghetti monster or a mexican university graduate.

If it exists in another state of energy then we have a problem, but that's an unreasonable assumption to be made to begin with.

So if we cant see it or measure it now then it doesnt exist?
Arent mathematical formulas and scientific understandings changing daily? It seems unreasonable to me to assume because we cant measure it today that it means it doesnt exist. Look at how science has changed.
They used to use leaches on people.
They used to think the world was flat.
They used to think the world was the center of the universe.

Our understanding of the world around us is constantly changing.

Scientific understanding changes to develop an understanding of the unknown and conclusions are made to fit a working theory. We cannot test whether there is a man with a striking resemblance to Al Gore, yet one that has three penises and a working bit boys gaming system floating around in the free space of the Andromeda, but this is not something that has to be tested because it's absolutely ****** ridiculous. Likewise there is no well found biological theory in existence that can only be complete via a mythical force of god.

Which is the same as saying since you cant test it you dont believe in it.
Which is incredibly narrowminded.
Be that as it may, to each their own beliefs.

 

[NanoStuff]

I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

 

[archiloco]

only way to transport person is thru wormholes....everybody knows that

hehe

 

[Vic]

Soul is irrelevant to this discussion. Under the method described by the OP, the person would be killed. That is, unless you believe that a person could be conscious of his own clone.

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

If you want a scientific explanation for the soul you should look into consiousness and how it is unique to each individual.

Cousiousness is the closet to a real soul that science is comming to explain.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

The concept of the "soul" does has a scientific explanation. It is your brain's software. Akin to your computer's software.

No worries though... I don't believe in you.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

If you want a scientific explanation for the soul you should look into consiousness and how it is unique to each individual.

Cousiousness is the closet to a real soul that science is comming to explain.

It's unique to each individual because each individual has neurons to call their own. I'd be interested to see what scientific explanation you can come up with, as there's really nothing that needs to be explained.

 

[OOBradm]

Now here is a little twist to your proposed situation...

What if once a person is mapped, they are NOT disintegrated, and also they are rebuilt
at their destination. Which one of them is "Them"? are there 2 now? just 1?

 

[RichardE]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

If you want a scientific explanation for the soul you should look into consiousness and how it is unique to each individual.

Cousiousness is the closet to a real soul that science is comming to explain.

It's unique to each individual because each individual has neurons to call their own. I'd be interested to see what scientific explanation you can come up with, as there's really nothing that needs to be explained.

Well, my spcialty is not consiousness, but I think if any end to the debate on whether a soul exists or not, it will be found in that research.

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

Well... in the future when we buid a teleporter we might have to account for a 'soul', but if we chose to build one today I don't think any respectable scientist/engineer would consider it in the design plans.

 

[Specop 007]

Originally posted by: OOBradm
Now here is a little twist to your proposed situation...

What if once a person is mapped, they are NOT disintegrated, and also they are rebuilt
at their destination. Which one of them is "Them"? are there 2 now? just 1?

I dunno, but its going to be my clone going to work every day while I sit at home I can damn well tell you that!

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: OOBradm
Now here is a little twist to your proposed situation...

What if once a person is mapped, they are NOT disintegrated, and also they are rebuilt
at their destination. Which one of them is "Them"? are there 2 now? just 1?

Both of them are them, there are two. No magic tricks here, now you have a copy of yourself that you can enslave and force to do your chores.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

Well... in the future when we buid a teleporter we might have to account for a 'soul', but if we chose to build one today I don't think any respectable scientist/engineer would consider it in the design plans.

If you're going to pretend to tout science, then you should know that we could not build a teleporting device today even if we chose to do so.
For one thing, the amount of energy required would exceed that of several high-yield nuclear bombs. For another, there's this little problem with the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.
This soul issue would be the least of our worries, so get over yourself.

 

[DaShen]

Originally posted by: NuclearNed
The teleportation device works like this:
You put an object in the device, and it makes a map of the object at a molecular/atomic level. It then completely disintegrates the object, putting the object's matter in a local "matter store". Then it transmits the information contained in the map to another teleportation device at a distant location. Based on that information, the remote device reintegrates the object, using available matter in its local "matter store".

If such a device is used to teleport a person, is the person killed?

Depends on your Philosophy about the soul and what life is. Do you believe that your body and "soul" are entwined?... same types of questions, just worded in a way to make the person not bias their answer.

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

Well... in the future when we buid a teleporter we might have to account for a 'soul', but if we chose to build one today I don't think any respectable scientist/engineer would consider it in the design plans.

If you're going to pretend to tout science, then you should know that we could not build a teleporting device today even if we chose to do so.
For one thing, the amount of energy required would exceed that of several high-yield nuclear bombs. For another, there's this little problem with the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.
This soul issue would be the least of our worries, so get over yourself.

Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

Oh no, I'm fine. I just don't like pseudo-scientific types like yourself who think that absence of evidence is evidence of absence and try to pass that off as science. That's a fallacy, and it's not even remotely scientific.

Isn't it time for your home room? :roll:

 

[NanoStuff]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

Oh no, I'm fine.

No you're not, you sound agitated. You're taking this to heart. Go easy, just a silly little discussion, no need to stress yourself over it.

 

[PlatinumGold]

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

Well... in the future when we buid a teleporter we might have to account for a 'soul', but if we chose to build one today I don't think any respectable scientist/engineer would consider it in the design plans.

If you're going to pretend to tout science, then you should know that we could not build a teleporting device today even if we chose to do so.
For one thing, the amount of energy required would exceed that of several high-yield nuclear bombs. For another, there's this little problem with the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.
This soul issue would be the least of our worries, so get over yourself.

Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

i love how this nanostuff person works. he gets all worked about something, makes claims that can't be substantiated, and then whe he is shot down he responds with "Easy boy. Take a deep breat. . ."

:roll:

that's pretty weak.

 

[Ciber]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: NanoStuff

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
I don't believe in it not because I can't test it but because there's no scientific reason to believe in it. If you want to believe in souls, santa and tooth fairies, you certainly have the right to do so however.

the point is, science is always limited.

at some point in time, there was no scientific reason to believe the world was not flat. at some point in time there was no scientific reason to believe that the earth orbited the sun and not the other way around. at some point in time . . .

the examples are endless, just goes to show, just because there is no "good" scientific reason TODAY does not mean that we might not discover something in the future.

Well... in the future when we buid a teleporter we might have to account for a 'soul', but if we chose to build one today I don't think any respectable scientist/engineer would consider it in the design plans.

If you're going to pretend to tout science, then you should know that we could not build a teleporting device today even if we chose to do so.
For one thing, the amount of energy required would exceed that of several high-yield nuclear bombs. For another, there's this little problem with the Heisenberg uncertainty principle.
This soul issue would be the least of our worries, so get over yourself.

Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

i love how this nanostuff person works. he gets all worked about something, makes claims that can't be substantiated, and then whe he is shot down he responds with "Easy boy. Take a deep breat. . ."

:roll:

that's pretty weak.

Yup, 0wn3d by Vic!

 

[batmanuel]

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: RichardE

Originally posted by: Specop 007

Originally posted by: RichardE
I don't believe in a soul, but that is an ignorant statement.

IF we can not prove the soul yet, how do you know what type of energy the soul is and properties that energy has? Without knowing that how you actually say what will happen?

Do you believe in things we cannot explain? The supernatural?
Say, ghosts? Or voodoo magic?

No. Same as I do not believe in god, a supernatural being ect. Everything can be scientifically explained, it is only a matter of time until we can.

Then how do you explain the unexplainable? How do you explain peoples stories of ghosts, or peoples sightings of "UOF's" or experiences with magic?

You're assuming that supernatural=unexplainable. Lightning and thunder used to be explained away by all sorts of mystical gobbelty-****** ranging from the anger of Zeus to the Thunderbird. After w few thousand years we figured out how electricity worked and this amazing phenomenon is no longer "supernatural."

If ghosts and UFOs exist, there is probably some sort of physical mechanism that causes them. We can't say for sure that they are impossible or beyond the realm of science, because we are always discovering new ways the world works. UFOs could be any number of things: aliens, interdimensional travellers, time travellers; none of which are "unexlainable".

Hell, even ghosts might be with the realm of science. If you subscribe to the Many Worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics then there are a very large number of alternate timelines. When people die an unexpected violent death, it is the end result of an chain of events that is statistically unlikely to be repeated across a large number of timelines. Therefore, there are probably a lot of timelines where those people instead had a close call and survived. Maybe the ghosts that "don't know they are dead" are simply just the still-living alternate versions of those people that are somehow interacting weakly with a timeline where they are missing. This is a far fetched theory, but it is better than throwing our hands up and saying that it is unexplainable.

 

[batmanuel]

Originally posted by: PlatinumGold

Originally posted by: NanoStuff
Easy boy. Take a deep breath, relax.

i love how this nanostuff person works. he gets all worked about something, makes claims that can't be substantiated, and then whe he is shot down he responds with "Easy boy. Take a deep breat. . ."

:roll:

that's pretty weak.

What he was trying to say is that we are trying to have a philosophical discussion about what would happen IF this magical technology was possible, and are not discussing how feasable is the said magical technology. It is an interesting question, because it could mean that the characters on Star Trek are dying over and over each episode and not knowing it because the new copy created by the transporter thinks it is the original person because it has all the memories. From the point of view of the person walking into the transporter it might be the end of their life, but there's no good way to prove what they are experiencing.