Yet another fast food worker strike

[ivwshane]

I am a dumb ass because the only parts available to me are made overseas?



Do you really think I don't understand that it's my customers who paid for all my things. I am dumbfounded that you actually even implied that.

Lol! Which phones and game systems are made in the US? If you can use it as an excuse then why can't everyone else?

Now think about all the things that you do buy that is American made, your house for example, do you think you are the only one buying US made houses?

Lol! You say you get it but it sure doesn't sound like it.

 

[Matt1970]

Lol! Which phones and game systems are made in the US? If you can use it as an excuse then why can't everyone else?

Now think about all the things that you do buy that is American made, your house for example, do you think you are the only one buying US made houses?

Lol! You say you get it but it sure doesn't sound like it.

I get it that you tried to make me out to be a hypocrite because I believe American made products are better for the economy yet the only ones I buy for my business are made overseas. I really don't have an option.

 

[Veliko]

From the guy who thinks buying American made products is no better for the American economy than buying imports.

You're venturing into nehalem territory here; could you show where I've even hinted at saying this?

 

[Matt1970]

You're venturing into nehalem territory here; could you show where I've even hinted at saying this?

This is quite a bit more than a hint:

Good grief.

The economy is dependent on people spending money and if you think that it's on home-grown goods then there's really not much point discussing this any further.

werepossum gave you a good example of why keeping the money in America is good and followed up with:

Whether money leaves our economy and how quickly matters enormously in how much effect that money has on our economy. If you cannot understand that, then I certainly agree there's really not much point in discussing this any further. For everyone else, where goods are manufactured matters enormously.

your response to that was:

Sorry, what is the purpose of all this?

If you genuinely believe that the economy is built on people buying home grown products then you are utterly clueless.

 

[Veliko]

You've ventured completely into nehalem territory there.

 

[Matt1970]

You've ventured completely into nehalem territory there.

Your statements pal, not mine.

 

[Veliko]

Your statements pal, not mine.

Well yes, that goes without saying; the conclusions from those statements are all yours though, which is where things turn into nehalem nonsense.

 

[Matt1970]

Well yes, that goes without saying; the conclusions from those statements are all yours though, which is where things turn into nehalem nonsense.

I wasn't the only one to come to those conclusions, but I think it is more like 25 posts later you decide what you said was nonsense and you want to change it's meaning.

 

[ivwshane]

I get it that you tried to make me out to be a hypocrite because I believe American made products are better for the economy yet the only ones I buy for my business are made overseas. I really don't have an option.

No I get it, you don't have an option unlike the rest of America. /s You complain about people buying foreign goods and yet when I ask you to name some US made products such as game consoles, cellphones , and tv's you can't come up with any. Of course you are covered because you "don't have options", but everyone else? They have option, just don't expect you to name any.

Let's not ignore the fact that these same Americans you complain about are taking their electronic issues to an American who doesn't use American parts which makes people who buy goods from other US companies who also don't use American parts no different than you and what you do.

Let's also ignore the fact that just because something isn't made over here that it doesn't contribute to the economy because using yourself as an example, it clearly does. Which makes your point that businesses will spend more and buy American goods compared to the low wage earner, complete and utter bullshit! But I'm sure you knew this and it's why you dodged the question multiple times.

 

[Matt1970]

No I get it, you don't have an option unlike the rest of America. /s You complain about people buying foreign goods and yet when I ask you to name some US made products such as game consoles, cellphones , and tv's you can't come up with any. Of course you are covered because you "don't have options", but everyone else? They have option, just don't expect you to name any.

Let's not ignore the fact that these same Americans you complain about are taking their electronic issues to an American who doesn't use American parts which makes people who buy goods from other US companies who also don't use American parts no different than you and what you do.

Let's also ignore the fact that just because something isn't made over here that it doesn't contribute to the economy because using yourself as an example, it clearly does. Which makes your point that businesses will spend more and buy American goods compared to the low wage earner, complete and utter bullshit! But I'm sure you knew this and it's why you dodged the question multiple times.

You are confusing what businesses spend to service their customers with what business owners spend with their own money. I buy stuff for my business to fix computers. I don't have a lot of options when it comes to that. Do you know of many USA manufactured motherboards? When it comes to my personal items I buy American whenever I can. The general public? Not so much. The very existence of Walmart and Dollar stores is proof of that.

EDIT* And if you look back at what I said:

I know plenty of business owners and higher earners and they spend their money just like anyone else and they are more than likely to buy higher prices stuff made in the US.

I said business owners spending their money, not what they purchase for their business. Their personal money and business expenses are different. You either misunderstood me or you are just trying to misquote what I said as ammunition in argument.

 

[ivwshane]

You are confusing what businesses spend to service their customers with what business owners spend with their own money. I buy stuff for my business to fix computers. I don't have a lot of options when it comes to that. Do you know of many USA manufactured motherboards? When it comes to my personal items I buy American whenever I can. The general public? Not so much. The very existence of Walmart and Dollar stores is proof of that.

EDIT* And if you look back at what I said:


I said business owners spending their money, not what they purchase for their business. Their personal money and business expenses are different. You either misunderstood me or you are just trying to misquote what I said as ammunition in argument.

Great!

So now which group do you think is bigger, rich business owners or employees (hell, you can include just business owners if you want)?

Unless you want to be dishonest, you know the answer is that there are more employees (140 million) versus (30 million "businesses).

And the circle is complete.

Business owners and consumers buy goods that are both US and foreign made.

Businesses make money off of consumers.

There are more consumers than businesses.

Therefore...

More money in the hands of consumers equals more money in the economy.


Thanks for playing

 

[MongGrel]

It was always a pipe dream to begin with.

Even the place I work at hires pretty well trained people down here to make higher end avionics parts that can function at that level for barely more than 15 an hour.

Which is part of the problem of course, even people that can make huge profits for a company that does work like that are drastically underpaid these days.

It's corporate BS and even people above burger flippers have gotten hit with it a long time now.

 

[Tango]

From the guy who thinks buying American made products is no better for the American economy than buying imports.

It is not. If you are interested, pick up any manual on International Economics (a basic one suffices and might actually be better) and you'll learn why.

 

[Matt1970]

Great!

So now which group do you think is bigger, rich business owners or employees (hell, you can include just business owners if you want)?

Unless you want to be dishonest, you know the answers is that there are more employees (140 million) versus (30 million "businesses).

And the circle is complete.

Business owners and consumers buy goods that are both US and foreign made.

Businesses make money off of consumers.

There are more consumers than businesses.

Therefore...

More money in the hands of consumers equals more money in the economy.


Thanks for playing

Ahh, I see your problem. You fail at basic math. Take $10,000 from a business owner that normally would have it to spend and force him to pay it to his employees is the exact same amount of money in the economy, it's now just I different hands. And you already admitted "Business owners and consumers buy goods that are both US and foreign made." so according to you the economic boost would be zero.

 

[Matt1970]

It is not. If you are interested, pick up any manual on International Economics (a basic one suffices and might actually be better) and you'll learn why.

Sending the better part of a trillion dollars overseas every year is actually good for us? I am sure your manual on International Economics explains that it is great for the ones winning the trade imbalance, but we have some evidence here that it has had disastrous effects.

 

[werepossum]

Sorry, what is the purpose of all this?

If you genuinely believe that the economy is built on people buying home grown products then you are utterly clueless.

It was an admittedly hopeless attempt to expand your economic understanding beyond entitlement and appetite.

It was always a pipe dream to begin with.

Even the place I work at hires pretty well trained people down here to make higher end avionics parts that can function at that level for barely more than 15 an hour.

Which is part of the problem of course, even people that can make huge profits for a company that does work like that are drastically underpaid these days.

It's corporate BS and even people above burger flippers have gotten hit with it a long time now.

It's because we've drastically devalued American labor. We've imported tons of labor, especially illegals, at a time when demand for labor is quite soft. Maybe you are twice as good in your job as the next guy, but if I can pick up three of the next guys for what I'm paying you I have a strong incentive to do so. Thus the value of labor is forced down. And we've removed all barriers except shipping (and we're probably working on subsidizing that) to moving production to cheap labor countries, forcing American workers to compete with much cheaper labor under much less regulatory burden. Add that to automation and you've got the trifecta of labor devaluation.

It is not. If you are interested, pick up any manual on International Economics (a basic one suffices and might actually be better) and you'll learn why.

It is. There are two assumed explanations as to why common sense doesn't apply here. The first is that they will buy from us as they get money from us. Our huge trade deficits belie that assumption handily. The second is that some nations are more efficient at making some products. Clearly that's true as far as it goes in principle, but in practice it doesn't go far. Other nations like China can't match our productivity; they are not better at making consumer goods, they are simply cheaper. This is a boon in the short run as we can buy more stuff, but in the long run we're screwed because every year we bleed hundreds of billions and the jobs we retain are typically not wealth creating jobs. Our consumer goods break or become outdated, but our debt payments are eternal.

No nation can long withstand consuming more than it creates.

 

[Tango]

It is. There are two assumed explanations as to why common sense doesn't apply here. The first is that they will buy from us as they get money from us. Our huge trade deficits belie that assumption handily. The second is that some nations are more efficient at making some products. Clearly that's true as far as it goes in principle, but in practice it doesn't go far. Other nations like China can't match our productivity; they are not better at making consumer goods, they are simply cheaper. This is a boon in the short run as we can buy more stuff, but in the long run we're screwed because every year we bleed hundreds of billions and the jobs we retain are typically not wealth creating jobs. Our consumer goods break or become outdated, but our debt payments are eternal.

No nation can long withstand consuming more than it creates.

You do not need absolute advantage, just comparative. Each and every country has comparative advantage in the production of something. It's a mathematical necessity. And it can be easily shown that specialization in that (and trade) is what brings about the best equilibrium for both parts. Import substitution is always a failing policy, precisely because it forces a country to ignore its comparative advantage.

The products that the US imports from China are products the US has no comparative advantage in. China does. As China climbs the ladder of product complexity the production of the things we today associate with China will move somewhere else. Rich countries are those capable of having comparative advantages in the production of very complex goods. You do not want to be in China's place given that you can instead be where you are now.

Trade balances are short term metrics, what we are talking about here are (very) long term ones (business cycles are just a blip to those who study growth theory).

P.s. In fact a country can maintain a current account deficit forever. You'll find the proof of this (intuitively surprising) fact in most introductory macro books (most likely in appendix).

 

[Tango]

Sending the better part of a trillion dollars overseas every year is actually good for us? I am sure your manual on International Economics explains that it is great for the ones winning the trade imbalance, but we have some evidence here that it has had disastrous effects.

Try picking one up and spending some quality time with it, and you might be surprised.

 

[Matt1970]

Try picking one up and spending some quality time with it, and you might be surprised.

Incase you haven't noticed we are paying dearly for our trade imbalances.

 

[Orignal Earl]

I found this interesting

 

[Linux23]

that's quite interesting. not sure how much of that is accurate though.

 

[TheSlamma]

Where is the hamburger robot

 

[werepossum]

Where is the hamburger robot

He's not coming out of China until he gets $15 an hour.

 

[BoberFett]

Just got back from lunch, went for fast food today. The tile lobby had just been mopped, and somebody used way too much soap or something, because the floor was dangerously slippery. All of the customers were telling every employee they could find about it, and everyone was just met with dumb stares from every minimum wage dipshit. A lot of these morons in fast food are clearly overpaid as is. Raising minimum wage won't make these dumbasses any smarter.

 

[ivwshane]

Just got back from lunch, went for fast food today. The tile lobby had just been mopped, and somebody used way too much soap or something, because the floor was dangerously slippery. All of the customers were telling every employee they could find about it, and everyone was just met with dumb stares from every minimum wage dipshit. A lot of these morons in fast food are clearly overpaid as is. Raising minimum wage won't make these dumbasses any smarter.

Wait I thought you righties always said you have to pay well to get the best talent or to keep it? Now you are saying that these guys aren't worth what they make now? So paying them less will make them better employees?

Or does paying for good talent only apply to CEO's?


And you say they are the morons? Lol!