Yet another fast food worker strike

[werepossum]

This is completely and utterly irrelevant to the part that was being discussed:

Um, no. Your post was:

Lower earners spend more of their disposable income than higher earners do.

By paying the lower earners more they will go out and spend it on iPhones, consoles, clothes, and all the other luxuries associated with our consumer economy.

If low income earners spend more of their income than do high income earners, but that spending is also more biased toward foreign-made consumer goods, then this is utterly relevant because that percentage of the purchases which represent the cost of production (including profit for foreign manufacturing) leaves the economy.

 

[Veliko]

Um, no. Your post was:


If low income earners spend more of their income than do high income earners, but that spending is also more biased toward foreign-made consumer goods, then this is utterly relevant because that percentage of the purchases which represent the cost of production (including profit for foreign manufacturing) leaves the economy.

Good grief.

The economy is dependent on people spending money and if you think that it's on home-grown goods then there's really not much point discussing this any further.

 

[Greenman]

So how did the strike go? Did they get the raise or what?

 

[Matt1970]

That's not a business in any meaningful sense of the word ffs!

It's paid for a house, truck, 4-wheeler, numerous vacations and plenty of other toys.

 

[Matt1970]

Good grief.

The economy is dependent on people spending money and if you think that it's on home-grown goods then there's really not much point discussing this any further.

Good, come back when you learn the value of people buying American made products.

 

[ivwshane]

Exactly which parts are you using to fix things that were made in the US?

Did you miss this?

 

[werepossum]

Good grief.

The economy is dependent on people spending money and if you think that it's on home-grown goods then there's really not much point discussing this any further.

<sigh>
1a. Government forces employer to give employee an extra $100. Employer now has $100 less.
1b. Employee buys $100 Chinese-made tennis shoes from Walmart.
1c. Walmart spends $10 on labor, $2 on utilities, $.50 on advertising, $2.50 on trucking/shipping, and $70 to Chinese manufacturing company, leaving $15 profit.
1d. US economy now has $30 to recirculate for spending and investment, divided among Walmart ownership, Walmart employees, American advertising companies, electric/water/gas utilities, and trucking companies. Since the employer now has $100 less, the American economy as a whole now has $70 less than before the government intervention.

2a. Government forces employer to give employee an extra $100. Employer now has $100 less.
2b. Employee buys $100 American-made New Balance pair of sneakers from Walmart.
2c. Walmart spends $10 on labor, $2 on utilities, $.50 on advertising, $2.50 on trucking/shipping, and $70 to American manufacturing company, leaving $15 profit.
2d. US economy now has $100 to recirculate for spending and investment, divided among Walmart ownership, Walmart employees, American advertising companies, electric/water/gas utilities, trucking companies, and New Balance, including New Balance's employees, utilities, and stockholders. Since the employer now has $100 less, the American economy as a whole now has exactly the same amount of money as before the government intervention.

Whether money leaves our economy and how quickly matters enormously in how much effect that money has on our economy. If you cannot understand that, then I certainly agree there's really not much point in discussing this any further. For everyone else, where goods are manufactured matters enormously.

 

[Matt1970]

Did you miss this?

I have some test equipment that was made in America. What's your point?

 

[Fern]

That's definitely how it is done, although I don't think that was the intent of the law. ...

Not quite sure what you mean. Therefore I'll post the following the demonstrates the minimum wage for tipped employees is done per pay period, not shift (BTW Paychex is one of the largest US payroll companies):

The Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) allows restaurant employers to include the tips their employees earn toward meeting the minimum wage requirements. -snip-

Here's an example:

Sarah works at a restaurant downtown. She earns $2.13 an hour, works 40 hours a week, and reports $240 in tips in a given week. The federal minimum wage is $7.25 an hour, as is her state&#8217;s.

First we'll determine Sarah's weekly wages by multiplying her hourly wage ($2.13 an hour) by 40 hours worked. This totals $85.20. Add in the weekly reported tips of $240.00, and we have $325.20. Next we'll calculate the wages paid at minimum wage by multiplying $7.25 (the minimum hourly wage rate used for the purpose of calculating the FICA Tip Credit) by 40 hours worked, which equals $290.00. Subtract the first value ($325.20) by the second value ($290.00) to find the amount of tips in excess of minimum wage, which is $35.20. Multiply that by 7.65 percent (the employer's portion of the FICA tax) to determine the tax credit. We end up with $2.69. While that doesn't seem like a lot of money, if Sarah consistently works the same amount of hours earning the same amount of tips for 52 weeks, the potential annual savings could be $139.88. And that's just one employee!

- See more at: http://www.paychex.com/articles/payroll-taxes/fica-tip-credit-calculate-savings#sthash.8KoCKdHf.dpuf

I'm just arguing that it's not right to pay someone $3 or $4 or $5 an hour just because they make it up in subsequent hours.

What difference does it make?

My employer could calculate my pay at $7.25 an hour and pay me $290 at the end of the week or they could calculate the first 39 hrs at 0 and the 40th hour at $290; it's all still the same per pay period.

To calculate it your way will surely result in wait staff making more in minimum wages than anybody else, particularly those that work both 'slow' and 'good' shifts. Depending upon the mix of good and slow shifts everybody's "minimum wage" would be different. I don't see how that makes any sense.

You do have a good point about the added accounting overhead, although surely today's software makes that moot.

I know of no software that does that, and given the national payroll firm's info above none should.

And as far as cheating, wouldn't the employee just not report it ever? That way he'd get more money and wouldn't have to share at all.

After decades in accounting my personal experience is that if a restaurant/bar employee can figure out a way to cheat/steal they will. Or, to put it another way - there's nothing they haven't thought of or tried. Clever MoFo's really.

As to not reporting any of your tips (and I've seen this tried before) there is an old saying: Bulls make money, bears make money, pigs get slaughtered. Not reporting any of your tips will get your azz fired in a hurry.

Based upon what I've seen I think it's pretty standard for new wait staff to be (unofficially) taught to declare enough tips to meet min wage, maybe a tad more. I'm sure some declare all tips, but I think many don't. Frankly, I don't think employers care as long as they report enough to meet minimum wage. The only times I've seen under reporting of tips become a problem is when a tip pooling scheme is used. if that's the case the bus boys, bar backs and cooks will raise h3ll.

Fern

 

[werepossum]

Not quite sure what you mean. Therefore I'll post the following the demonstrates the minimum wage for tipped employees is done per pay period, not shift (BTW Paychex is one of the largest US payroll companies):

- See more at: http://www.paychex.com/articles/payroll-taxes/fica-tip-credit-calculate-savings#sthash.8KoCKdHf.dpuf

What difference does it make?

My employer could calculate my pay at $7.25 an hour and pay me $290 at the end of the week or they could calculate the first 39 hrs at 0 and the 40th hour at $290; it's all still the same per pay period.

To calculate it your way will surely result in wait staff making more in minimum wages than anybody else, particularly those that work both 'slow' and 'good' shifts. Depending upon the mix of good and slow shifts everybody's "minimum wage" would be different. I don't see how that makes any sense.

I know of no software that does that, and given the national payroll firm's info above none should.

After decades in accounting my personal experience is that if a restaurant/bar employee can figure out a way to cheat/steal they will. Or, to put it another way - there's nothing they haven't thought of or tried. Clever MoFo's really.

As to not reporting any of your tips (and I've seen this tried before) there is an old saying: Bulls make money, bears make money, pigs get slaughtered. Not reporting any of your tips will get your azz fired in a hurry.

Based upon what I've seen I think it's pretty standard for new wait staff to be (unofficially) taught to declare enough tips to meet min wage, maybe a tad more. I'm sure some declare all tips, but I think many don't. Frankly, I don't think employers care as long as they report enough to meet minimum wage. The only times I've seen under reporting of tips become a problem is when a tip pooling scheme is used. if that's the case the bus boys, bar backs and cooks will raise h3ll.

Fern

Ah, looks like I was just mistaken about the intent of the law. My bad. As to what difference it makes, the tipped employee would make more money if her wages were counted and adjusted per shift, since the law doesn't allow her to be paid zero no matter how well her other hours paid. But if my understanding of the minimum wage's intent was wrong it doesn't matter either way as she's not entitled to more pay, so I'll drop my objection.

 

[ivwshane]

I have some test equipment that was made in America. What's your point?

I didn't ask about test equipment, of which I'm sure you only bought one of, I asked about the replacement parts you use. Now do you want to answer the question or will you dodge the question again?

 

[Matt1970]

I didn't ask about test equipment, of which I'm sure you only bought one of, I asked about the replacement parts you use. Now do you want to answer the question or will you dodge the question again?

You don't know jack shit about what I have bought. And there aren't a lot of TVs and computers made in the US, much less their replacement so I am not even sure why you would ask that.

 

[ivwshane]

You don't know jack shit about what I have bought. And there aren't a lot of TVs and computers made in the US, much less their replacement so I am not even sure why you would ask that.

Dodging the question it is!

 

[Veliko]

<sigh>
1a. Government forces employer to give employee an extra $100. Employer now has $100 less.
1b. Employee buys $100 Chinese-made tennis shoes from Walmart.
1c. Walmart spends $10 on labor, $2 on utilities, $.50 on advertising, $2.50 on trucking/shipping, and $70 to Chinese manufacturing company, leaving $15 profit.
1d. US economy now has $30 to recirculate for spending and investment, divided among Walmart ownership, Walmart employees, American advertising companies, electric/water/gas utilities, and trucking companies. Since the employer now has $100 less, the American economy as a whole now has $70 less than before the government intervention.

2a. Government forces employer to give employee an extra $100. Employer now has $100 less.
2b. Employee buys $100 American-made New Balance pair of sneakers from Walmart.
2c. Walmart spends $10 on labor, $2 on utilities, $.50 on advertising, $2.50 on trucking/shipping, and $70 to American manufacturing company, leaving $15 profit.
2d. US economy now has $100 to recirculate for spending and investment, divided among Walmart ownership, Walmart employees, American advertising companies, electric/water/gas utilities, trucking companies, and New Balance, including New Balance's employees, utilities, and stockholders. Since the employer now has $100 less, the American economy as a whole now has exactly the same amount of money as before the government intervention.

Whether money leaves our economy and how quickly matters enormously in how much effect that money has on our economy. If you cannot understand that, then I certainly agree there's really not much point in discussing this any further. For everyone else, where goods are manufactured matters enormously.

Sorry, what is the purpose of all this?

If you genuinely believe that the economy is built on people buying home grown products then you are utterly clueless.

 

[Veliko]

Good, come back when you learn the value of people buying American made products.

Your response doesn't actually make any sense when you take into account what I actually said:

The economy is dependent on people spending money and if you think that it's on home-grown goods then there's really not much point discussing this any further.

So unless you genuinely think it is built on people buying home grown products I don't know what point you're trying to make.

 

[alcoholbob]

Yes, you don't need to maintain a balance of payments when you are the reserve currency, foreign central banks debase their own currencies to prevent the reserve currency from rising.

That is, until a new reserve currency replaces the old.

 

[Matt1970]

Your response doesn't actually make any sense when you take into account what I actually said:



So unless you genuinely think it is built on people buying home grown products I don't know what point you're trying to make.

You need to fix that, that's your quote, not mine.

 

[Matt1970]

Sorry, what is the purpose of all this?

If you genuinely believe that the economy is built on people buying home grown products then you are utterly clueless.

You don't know what the purpose of what he wrote was yet you want to call him clueless? It was pretty easy to follow. See if you can find the differences in his two scenarios and see which one you think is beneficial to the US economy.

 

[Matt1970]

Dodging the question it is!

Here is your original question.

Exactly which parts are you using to fix things that were made in the US?

I think you know damn well that TVs and computers are not made in America. As far as what parts I use it could vary form a simple capacitor in a TV power supply to and entire main board replacement. Or for computers or laptops it could be a screen replacement or motherboards. A lot of the parts I get are typically tear downs from TV sets with bad screens or laptops with bad motherboards. Is there a point to question?

 

[Veliko]

You don't know what the purpose of what he wrote was yet you want to call him clueless? It was pretty easy to follow. See if you can find the differences in his two scenarios and see which one you think is beneficial to the US economy.

The two scenarios have nothing to do with what was being discussed:

I will never understand how people think taking money from business owners and giving it to employees boosts the economy.

Lower earners spend more of their disposable income than higher earners do.

By paying the lower earners more they will go out and spend it on iPhones, consoles, clothes, and all the other luxuries associated with our consumer economy.

 

[Matt1970]

The two scenarios have nothing to do with what was being discussed:

They have everything to do with it. It proves that money in the pocket in low income earners is no better and may even be worse than the money in the pockets of higher income earners.

 

[ivwshane]

Here is your original question.



I think you know damn well that TVs and computers are not made in America. As far as what parts I use it could vary form a simple capacitor in a TV power supply to and entire main board replacement. Or for computers or laptops it could be a screen replacement or motherboards. A lot of the parts I get are typically tear downs from TV sets with bad screens or laptops with bad motherboards. Is there a point to question?

Yeah the point is you are a hypocrite and a dumb ass! For one you, just like a lot of Americans, buy non US made products. So according to your own standards how exactly how are you contributing?

Your answer is wrong pal. I know plenty of business owners and higher earners and they spend their money just like anyone else and they are more than likely to buy higher prices stuff made in the US. You came up with iPhones, consoles, and clothes as examples which are all made overseas in sweatshops. Ya, we need more of our money going there.

And this is where the dumb ass part comes in! You know that house you bought, the vehicles, the vacations that were all paid for from your business? Well they were paid for by your customers! So not only did they contribute to the economy but your spending of their money multiplied that affect!

And it's that failure, by you, to understand that simple concept of how consumers, of which you are one, drive the economy and it's why you are a dumb ass!

Your CBD tells me you will attempt to dismiss this fact with something lame, I can't wait

 

[Veliko]

They have everything to do with it. It proves that money in the pocket in low income earners is no better and may even be worse than the money in the pockets of higher income earners.

This is very amusing.

You really, really need to do some reading up on what a consumer economy is and what keeps it going.

 

[Matt1970]

This is very amusing.

You really, really need to do some reading up on what a consumer economy is and what keeps it going.

From the guy who thinks buying American made products is no better for the American economy than buying imports.

 

[Matt1970]

Yeah the point is you are a hypocrite and a dumb ass! For one you, just like a lot of Americans, buy non US made products. So according to your own standards how exactly how are you contributing?

I am a dumb ass because the only parts available to me are made overseas?

And this is where the dumb ass part comes in! You know that house you bought, the vehicles, the vacations that were all paid for from your business? Well they were paid for by your customers! So not only did they contribute to the economy but your spending of their money multiplied that affect!

And it's that failure, by you, to understand that simple concept of how consumers, of which you are one, drive the economy and it's why you are a dumb ass!

Your CBD tells me you will attempt to dismiss this fact with something lame, I can't wait

Do you really think I don't understand that it's my customers who paid for all my things. I am dumbfounded that you actually even implied that.