YAGT - handgun for wife

[irishScott]

Guys, take it from someone who's gone multiple rounds with this guy in P&N, it all boils down to the quote in my sig. He's not going to change, knows he's not changing anyone and is just pissing people off.

 

[OCGuy]

A number which pales in comparison to automotive deaths, but we don't go around outlawing cars because you are scared to drive or because someone might hit you.

Exactly. You know what I'm afraid of? A 16 yr old on a cell-phone wiping out me or my family with her 5,000lb weapon moving 65 MPH. Or an old person. Or a drunk.

Someone randomly shooting me? Not so much.

 

[HAL9000]

Guys, take it from someone who's gone multiple rounds with this guy in P&N, it all boils down to the quote in my sig. He's not going to change, knows he's not changing anyone and is just pissing people off.

Thank you, this guy gets it.

Without a valid logical argument I'm not changing my mind.

I want criminals on a leash and fuck everyone else.

 

[Scotteq]

That's because cars weren't built to be weapons they serve another valuable purpose.

Hunting

Target and sporting usages.

This is well traveled ground, Hal. Continuing to go round and round isn't helping.

 

[HAL9000]

Exactly. You know what I'm afraid of? A 16 yr old on a cell-phone wiping out me or my family with her 5,000lb weapon moving 65 MPH. Or an old person. Or a drunk.

Someone randomly shooting me? Not so much.

Fair enough, everyone has their quirks.

 

[irishScott]

Thank you, this guy gets it.

Without a valid logical argument I'm not changing my mind.

I want criminals on a leash and fuck everyone else.

Well George Orwell certainly nailed you. Doublethink included.

 

[HAL9000]

Hunting

Target and sporting usages.

This is well traveled ground, Hal. Continuing to go round and round isn't helping.

Hunting is not a legitimate reason to owning a gun IMO, as it is an immoral practice.

Target and sporting uses does not override the number of people that die from personal gun ownership.

That is all.

 

[HAL9000]

Well George Orwell certainly nailed you. Doublethink included.

Not so, I don't want my privacy invaded.

I should add, that my "If it's immoral ban it" philosophy applies to smoking, abortion, gun ownership, murdering etc etc etc. If you wanna take a swing, feel free but I doubt you'll change my mind without changing my underlying morality.

 

[Scotteq]

Exactly. You know what I'm afraid of? A 16 yr old on a cell-phone wiping out me or my family with her 5,000lb weapon moving 65 MPH. Or an old person. Or a drunk.

Someone randomly shooting me? Not so much.

Not to mention you're 6 times more likely to be killed by a 16 year old then by any (legal or non~legal) firearm.

 

[corwin]

Ah so I do, yep I agree with myself the use of a gun is to kill, even though some people have forced them into doing things they weren't designed for.

Perhaps the bedrock of my point should be this:

Guns were designed to kill, built to kill and do kill on a daily basis, they have no right to be found in a kitchen next to the spoons.

WTF would keep it in the kitchen next to the spoons?

You obviously lack the capacity to understand, so I wish you well and truly hope you're never in a situation where your possesion and lawful use of a firearm could have saved your life, or one of your family, or any other innocent person who happens to be near you. The rest of us will take the responsibilty upon our shoulders to protect ourselves and those we love if need be. And should you ever find yourself considering visiting our great country, please don't...you wouldn't like the lack of control here.

 

[HAL9000]

WTF would keep it in the kitchen next to the spoons?

You obviously lack the capacity to understand, so I wish you well and truly hope you're never in a situation where your possesion and lawful use of a firearm could have saved your life, or one of your family, or any other innocent person who happens to be near you. The rest of us will take the responsibilty upon our shoulders to protect ourselves and those we love if need be. And should you ever find yourself considering visiting our great country, please don't...you wouldn't like the lack of control here.

Thankyou, I've been, it was fine. If something happened to my family it wouldn't change my mind.

 

[irishScott]

Not so, I don't want my privacy invaded.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink

The power of holding two contradictory beliefs in one's mind simultaneously, and accepting both of them....To tell deliberate lies while genuinely believing in them, to forget any fact that has become inconvenient, and then, when it becomes necessary again, to draw it back from oblivion for just so long as it is needed, to deny the existence of objective reality and all the while to take account of the reality which one denies — all this is indispensably necessary. Even in using the word doublethink it is necessary to exercise doublethink. For by using the word one admits that one is tampering with reality; by a fresh act of doublethink one erases this knowledge; and so on indefinitely, with the lie always one leap ahead of the truth.

You've said in previous threads (and possibly this one, haven't taken the time to read all of it) that you support the right to self defense, yet you refuse good people the tools to accomplish it. If every criminal in existence had an illegal gun, you would deny every lawful citizen a gun. Despite this, you claim righteousness.

You've also said (and are apparently proud of) the quote in my sig, of eliminating crime at all costs. Yet here you say you don't want your privacy invaded. Despite this apparent "cost", you stand by your statement with complete confidence.

I could go on, but dinner's starting here. Suffice to say both of the above fit the definition quoted quite nicely IMO.

 

[coxmaster]

Thank you, this guy gets it.

Without a valid logical argument I'm not changing my mind.

I want criminals on a leash and fuck everyone else.

You say that you hate all things immoral, but yet have no problem putting criminals on a leash?

To me it seems somewhat immoral to do something like that, even to a criminal.


Edit: This is just another example of doublethink (as proven by irishScott)

 

[HAL9000]

You say that you hate all things immoral, but yet have no problem putting criminals on a leash?

To me it seems somewhat immoral to do something like that, even to a criminal.


Edit: This is just another example of doublethink (as proven by irishScott)

Granted, however a leash was a metaphor and not meant to be taken literally.

 

[HAL9000]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublethink



You've said in previous threads (and possibly this one, haven't taken the time to read all of it) that you support the right to self defense, yet you refuse good people the tools to accomplish it. If every criminal in existence had an illegal gun, you would deny every lawful citizen a gun. Despite this, you claim righteousness.

You've also said (and are apparently proud of) the quote in my sig, of eliminating crime at all costs. Yet here you say you don't want your privacy invaded. Despite this apparent "cost", you stand by your statement with complete confidence.

I could go on, but dinner's starting here. Suffice to say both of the above fit the definition quoted quite nicely IMO.

What you having?

I stand by both of the above statements.

 

[irishScott]

Thankyou, I've been, it was fine. If something happened to my family it wouldn't change my mind.

To elaborate, he mentioned once that some guy "attempted to rob him outside of a pub with a knife", and that he wasn't stabbed. When asked for additional details, he refused to answer. So he's either lying or is hiding some detail that would downplay the encounter as he describes it. For all we know some street kid with a pen-knife asked for $5.

 

[HAL9000]

To elaborate, he mentioned once that some guy "attempted to rob him outside of a pub with a knife", and that he wasn't stabbed. When asked for additional details, he refused to answer. So he's either lying or is hiding some detail that would downplay the encounter as he describes it. For all we know some street kid with a pen-knife asked for $5.

Actually what I said was that once I got into a fight with a guy with a knife in a pub, hit him with a bottle and I didn't get stabbed.

I don't know where you got the rest from.

 

[corwin]

OP...sorry about feeding the trolls, please let us know what your wife decides on, I feel better knowing there will be another responsible law-abiding citizen carrying in this country.

Weird but I keep thinking of the line from Starship Troopers..

RASCZAK: You. Tell me the moral difference, if any, between the citizen and the civilian?

JOHNNY: The difference lies in the field of civic virtue. A citizen accepts personal responsibility for the safety of the body politic, of which he is a member, defending it, if need be, with his life. The civilian does not.

 

[irishScott]

Actually what I said was that once I got into a fight with a guy with a knife in a pub, hit him with a bottle and I didn't get stabbed.

I don't know where you got the rest from.

Oh you got in a fight and hit him with a bottle. This is new. So what about some other details? How big was the knife? How big was the guy relative to you? Was he drunk?

In any case a gun could have settled the situation quite nicely without resorting to and-to-hand combat or death. Simply displaying it probably would have scared him off. Speaking from my own and friend's experience here. That or the would-be mugger would have been killed in legitimate self defense upon assault with a deadly weapon.

But oh wait, knives are deadly weapons in your world either. Like I said, dinner time.

/logs off.

 

[corwin]

Thankyou, I've been, it was fine. If something happened to my family it wouldn't change my mind.

So you've really watched someone die which could have been prevented had you been carrying a firearm? Somehow I doubt that, and if it is true and as you say "it was fine"...you're a sick individual. And watching your family die you'd probably blame the gun too...I feel sorry for your family and you.

 

[HAL9000]

Oh you got in a fight and hit him with a bottle. This is new. So what about some other details? How big was the knife? How big was the guy relative to you? Was he drunk?

In any case a gun could have settled the situation quite nicely without resorting to and-to-hand combat or death. Simply displaying it probably would have scared him off. Speaking from my own and friend's experience here. That or the would-be mugger would have been killed in legitimate self defense upon assault with a deadly weapon.

But oh wait, knives are deadly weapons in your world either. Like I said, dinner time.

/logs off.

I was drunk, he was drunk. He was shorter than me, I didn't measure the knife.

So my way no one died. Win.

 

[HAL9000]

So you've really watched someone die which could have been prevented had you been carrying a firearm? Somehow I doubt that, and if it is true and as you say "it was fine"...you're a sick individual.

Would I want to? no.

But given the option between arming me and the criminals simultaneously or sticking as it is now, where the chances of either of us having guns is so remote it's not worth thinking about i'd stick with the latter.

 

[Kelvrick]

Can you guys just start ignoring him?

In an effort to change the topic, what do you guys think about this guy? I'm picking it up from 10 day jail this Friday. I stick to 9mm, but it was a deal I couldn't pass up.

Springfield 1911 lightweight loaded. The guy polished the frame, added night sights, a new trigger, egw sear, mainspring housing with magwell and an ed brown grip safety.

http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/008-2.jpg
http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/013-2.jpg
http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/012-2.jpg

Started the 10 day jail for this guy last Saturday and will be picking him up next week.
I'm a sucker for 9mm 1911's. Much to the detriment of my bank account.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57754_757752_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

 

[HAL9000]

Can you guys just start ignoring him?

In an effort to change the topic, what do you guys think about this guy? I'm picking it up from 10 day jail this Friday. I stick to 9mm, but it was a deal I couldn't pass up.

Springfield 1911 lightweight loaded. The guy polished the frame, added night sights, a new trigger, egw sear, mainspring housing with magwell and an ed brown grip safety.

http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/008-2.jpg
http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/013-2.jpg
http://i382.photobucket.com/albums/oo266/arnie772679/012-2.jpg

Started the 10 day jail for this guy last Saturday and will be picking him up next week.
I'm a sucker for 9mm 1911's. Much to the detriment of my bank account.

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...57754_757752_757751_ProductDisplayErrorView_Y

Now that's my kind of gun! Looks awesome, I imagine it's quite reliable from what i've heard of 1911's... Perfect. Good call.

 

[corwin]

Would I want to? no.

But given the option between arming me and the criminals simultaneously or sticking as it is now, where the chances of either of us having guns is so remote it's not worth thinking about i'd stick with the latter.

My chances are about the same as yours, but I'd rather rely on more than crossing my fingers and hoping...good luck with that.