yact: TRIUMPH!

[Squisher]

Go to Autozone, they'll come out to parking lot and hook up a gizmo to the computer in the car and read out all the error codes for free.

They'll also sell you the parts to fix it. 😉

 

[MaluMan]

i thought mine was busted (have a 98 accord, 100k miles) according to the error corde but when i took it to the emissions test it passed 🙂

now i'm a little confused as to what the problem is/was ... local mechanic said it'd cost around 800 including labor

 

[NascarFool]

$109 direct fit replacement.

 

[TwoBills]

My '87 Mitsubishi, w/270K, still has the orig. cat. Food for thought. Any shop will try to sell you a new cat. That's where the profit is.

 

[Kipper]

Originally posted by: Mark R
The check engine light just means that something is wrong with the emissions system. It could be anything. More importantly, most cars, especially those before about 2000 don't have sensors to check the catalyst is operating correctly.

This means that the engine light can only be triggered by something 'before' the catalyst. This doesn't mean that the catalyst is fine, a lot of faults can destroy a catalyst in short order, but it doesn't mean it is bad either.

You need to find a garage that can read the error code from the ECU, and fix the problem. Then they need to test the catalyst once the problem is repaired, to make sure that it hasn't been damaged.

The check engine light comes on for thousands of reasons - not just emissions. It can be anything from "your gas cap is loose" to "oh crap your engine is ablaze."

 

[CrackRabbit]

Originally posted by: MadCowDisease

Originally posted by: Mark R
The check engine light just means that something is wrong with the emissions system. It could be anything. More importantly, most cars, especially those before about 2000 don't have sensors to check the catalyst is operating correctly.

This means that the engine light can only be triggered by something 'before' the catalyst. This doesn't mean that the catalyst is fine, a lot of faults can destroy a catalyst in short order, but it doesn't mean it is bad either.

You need to find a garage that can read the error code from the ECU, and fix the problem. Then they need to test the catalyst once the problem is repaired, to make sure that it hasn't been damaged.

The check engine light comes on for thousands of reasons - not just emissions. It can be anything from "your gas cap is loose" to "oh crap your engine is ablaze."

Most of them being emissions related, that includes "your gas cap is loose" and "oh crap your engine is ablaze".
The best advice I have seen so far is to take it to an Autozone and have them check the computer codes. Once you have the codes and know what is wrong you can get the parts that need replacing replaced and not just randomly replace things until its fixed.

 

[Vic]

Originally posted by: TwoBills
My '87 Mitsubishi, w/270K, still has the orig. cat. Food for thought. Any shop will try to sell you a new cat. That's where the profit is.

At 270k miles, the cat is your car is almost certainly gone. They rarely make it past 200k miles. I've pulled cats out of cars with only 100k miles and they were already completely blown out. You probably just don't know it because you never have to go through smog/emissions check. Note that the OP's problem is that he needs to pass smog. If he lived up north where I do, where a failed smog test is free, I'd say run it through to make sure. But as he lives in CA where he has to pay to find if there is a problem, the way to know if a cat is dead is (1) does the car's exhaust stink in the morning, and (2) has the exhaust tone changed for the noticeably louder and raspier in the last 50k miles?

Originally posted by: NascarFool
$109 direct fit replacement.

Part #15547 for $109.09 -- shouldn't take more than half an hour to do the swap yourself provided you have the tools.

 

[QuitBanningMe]

Originally posted by: Vic

Originally posted by: TwoBills
My '87 Mitsubishi, w/270K, still has the orig. cat. Food for thought. Any shop will try to sell you a new cat. That's where the profit is.

At 270k miles, the cat is your car is almost certainly gone. They rarely make it past 200k miles. I've pulled cats out of cars with only 100k miles and they were already completely blown out. You probably just don't know it because you never have to go through smog/emissions check. Note that the OP's problem is that he needs to pass smog. If he lived up north where I do, where a failed smog test is free, I'd say run it through to make sure. But as he lives in CA where he has to pay to find if there is a problem, the way to know if a cat is dead is (1) does the car's exhaust stink in the morning, and (2) has the exhaust tone changed for the noticeably louder and raspier in the last 50k miles?

Originally posted by: NascarFool
$109 direct fit replacement.

Part #15547 for $109.09 -- shouldn't take more than half an hour to do the swap yourself provided you have the tools.

1996 4 TOYOTA CELICA W/ 1.8L ST,GT (EXC. CA.) 15547

I was assuming he had CA emmissions.

 

[spacelord]

Originally posted by: Blieb
Dealership wanted like 700 ... I got it done at some small exhaust shop for 175 ...

Did you meet Ben Dover at the dealership?
wow, mechanics really rip you off at the dealerships..

 

[DougK62]

Your friend is probably dumb. Get the code read first and go from there.

 

[spacelord]

Or buy your own chip. reader.

 

[HomerJS]

I have a 97 Maxima that will need a cat in Aug. The Federal reg is set by the EPA. Just google "federal emissions warranty". The warranty is actually broken down in two parts. 2 yrs/24000 miles for performance. 8 yrs/80000 miles for major component defect. Called the office. Unfortunately I have 130K miles so I don't get squat.

 

[Mark R]

The check engine light comes on for thousands of reasons - not just emissions. It can be anything from "your gas cap is loose" to "oh crap your engine is ablaze."

The operation of the check engine light is mandated as part of the OBD-II standard, which was developed for the EPA. It is fundamentally an emissions control system.

The ECU can log many hundreds of different faults (indeed, I've got a list in front of me), but only those which may cause excessive emissions should cause the light to switch on. Non emissions problems should not illuminate the indicator, but should be logged in case of driveability problems.

Note that 'emissions' doesn't just mean tail-pipe emissions - vapours escaping from the tank are toxic and contribute heavily to smog formation. Because of this, there is a sophisticated set of valves, filters and absorbers connected to your gas tank to prevent vapours escaping. If you leave the cap loose, then the sensors looking after this system will detect it, and trigger the light.

Many serious engine faults will cause the check engine light to come on, because indirectly they effect emissions.

 

[TwoBills]

I go thru emissions every 2 years w/no problem. There are no unusual readings on the vacuum guage that I have stuck to my dash. 22psi at idle and a quick response when I goose it. It wasn't easy keeping that thing on there for 18years, but as long as I get thru emissions..........now you've probably jinkxed me, I have to go thru emissions in June.

..............Meant to quote VIC on this reply...........

 

[sharkeeper]

My brother in law calls it a Cadillac converter. I said to him "How about putting one on a Kia?" He doesn't get it.

 

[Gillbot]

I have tuned every one of my cars and they have all passed without a cat converter. It's all in how well they run and how efficient the combustion cycle is.

 

[andylawcc]

Originally posted by: Gillbot
I have tuned every one of my cars and they have all passed without a cat converter. It's all in how well they run and how efficient the combustion cycle is.

does it mean if I put in 91 Octane Shell and pour those fuel/oil addictive stuff, I would have a higher chance of passing?

 

[andylawcc]

bumpie! found out the real problem
now all i need is finding a cheap O2 sensor

 

[Evadman]

Originally posted by: QuitBanningMe

Originally posted by: Evadman
Here is a little hint: Emission controls have a 10 year federal mandated warranty. If your car was built after '95, then it is still under warranty with very very few exceptions.

Nope
8years/ 80000 miles

You're right. My bad. My memory is going. *smacks himself*

Which O2 sensor do you need? There are 2 of them on the 7AFE. One in front of the Cat, one behind it. Generaly, the one behind the cat is the one that goes bad first.

Rear: $55- $97. $97 for Bosch

Front: $139

 

[TwoBills]

Originally posted by: andylawcc
UPDATED

went to autozone today, used their tester thing and found out the problem was just one of the Oxygen sensor! yeah... anyway, so here's the following question, where to buy one?
Autozone said theirs are 180 bucks. Bosch.

Wouldn't hurt to see what the dealer wants for one. Also check out NAPA.

 

[andylawcc]

according to the OBDII reader it said "Sensor 1 Bank 1," so I am assuming its the pre-cat one.

On the toyota repair manual (which i finally get to use) said the second/after-cat one is called the "Heated Oxygen Sensor" and carries a different error code.


so would you highly recommend the Bosch over the NTK and Denso? i mean, one Bosch can almost buy two of the other.
meanwhile, does the NTK and Denso come with the connector or I will have to solder it???

 

[Vic]

There are always two O2 sensors in OBDII cars. Sensor 1 Bank 1 is the front O2 sensor. It's a narrowband O2 sensor that measures the efficiency of combustion and adjusts the fuel mixture accordingly. A bad front O2 sensor (or CEL code indicating it is bad) would usually mean that the car is running rough (or rich) or that the exhaust pre-cat is too cool (usually meaning damaged heatshielding, the exhuast must be hot for the cat to function properly and the front O2 sensor also measures this usually resulting in a "sensor 1 bank 1 lean" code). The rear O2 sensor is wideband, post-cat, and measures cat efficiency.
In your case, I would just buy the cheapest sensor and hope it makes the code go away.

 

[andylawcc]

Originally posted by: Vic
A bad front O2 sensor (or CEL code indicating it is bad) would usually mean that the car is running rough (or rich) or that the exhaust pre-cat is too cool (usually meaning damaged heatshielding, the exhuast must be hot for the cat to function properly.

humm.. interesting, my exhaust manifold is in fact damaged (a 1/2 inch crack at the "y"). I guess I will go ahead and fix that too....

In your case, I would just buy the cheapest sensor and hope it makes the code go away.

I just called another friend about those Universal sensors, he said stay away from them because they carry the wrong voltage and will be just a waste of money. He recommended OEM all the way.

these are the prices I found
Toyota dealer OEM: 140
Napa: 90
Bosch: 97 from Evadman's link
NTK or Denso (universal): 55

my friend also recommended buying used from junkyard.

 

[TwoBills]

Originally posted by: andylawcc


I just called another friend about those Universal sensors, he said stay away from them because they carry the wrong voltage and will be just a waste of money. He recommended OEM all the way.

these are the prices I found
Toyota dealer OEM: 140
Napa: 90
Bosch: 97 from Evadman's link
NTK or Denso (universal): 55

my friend also recommended buying used from junkyard.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I always tested an O2 sensor w/a digital vom. 1/2vdc at idle. 1vdc at 2500rpm. If it does this it's good. No volts = bad.
I wouldn't buy from a junk yard. Half the battle w/an O2 sensor is getting the old one out. Get the cheap one.
If you don't have the special socket you'll have to cut, splice, and solder.

 

[iamwiz82]

Most often the generic O2 sensors require that you splice your own connector.