XFX Bilking the masses - replacing GDDR5 memory with DDR3

[Firestorm007]

It's up to the consumer to arm his or herself with knowledge before making a purchase.

 

[taltamir]

I can just imagine another thread like this in an alternate universe. In that universe, AMD calls the 6670 with gddr5 mem the 6690 and the gddr3 memory as the 6670... the op makes a thread, "OMGWTFBBQ, AMD is rebadging their cards. The 6670 and 6690 are the exact same cards just with different memory. Stop it, you're confusing us. Bait and Switch!"

Haha!
No need for alternate universe my friend... just look at the threads about nvidia ripping people off with their "rebadging "identical" cards"

 

[Firestorm007]

This thread is pure fail.

It clearly says gddr3 memory. Since the dawn of time, card companies have come out with the same model cards coming in 2 memory sizes.... 256 mb/512mb....1gb/2gb. And they've also come out with different memory types.

I can just imagine another thread like this in an alternate universe. In that universe, AMD calls the 6670 with gddr5 mem the 6690 and the gddr3 memory as the 6670... the op makes a thread, "OMGWTFBBQ, AMD is rebadging their cards. The 6670 and 6690 are the exact same cards just with different memory. Stop it, you're confusing us. Bait and Switch!"

At least someone gets it, good for you.:thumbsup:

 

[Rifter]

Haha!
No need for alternate universe my friend... just look at the threads about nvidia ripping people off with their "rebadging "identical" cards"

to be fair amd does it to, 5770->6770

I hate it though.

 

[taltamir]

to be fair amd does it to, 5770->6770

I hate it though.

yes, AMD does it too... but I haven't seen them receive much flak for it.

 

[LOL_Wut_Axel]

Why is this thread still alive? XFX isn't milking anyone. They clearly labeled the product, and it DOES have a Radeon HD 6670 GPU. The memory spec is not part of the GPU spec.

 

[bryanW1995]

like I said it can be just a mistake on neweggs part OR the manufacturers. do you really think Diamond is using TWICE the buswidth and still charging the same amount as everyone else's 64 bit cards? and again have you EVER seen 32 bit memory controller mentioned in a review?

heck ACER used to list their cheap 1440x900 monitors as being true 8 bit. I contacted them and even their "engineer" said it was true 8 bit which was BS.

Are you really still arguing about this? You've seen several pieces of evidence from independent 3rd parties, but every time somebody gives you something you say "I'm still not convinced". WTF?? Why don't you just ask us to prove to you that God doesn't exist?

 

[hdfxst]

the thread title implies that xfx is doing this with all their products,and isn't the 6670 made more for an htpc?

 

[bryanW1995]

I was responding to the post I quoted. Now it seems I have to consider what was said in a thread years ago?

I was using that as evidence that Apoppin is not wearing green-tinted glasses. If nothing else, the sheer dollar amount of AMD cards that he has purchased with his own money dwarfs that of 90% + of the AMD "fanbois" in here. You weren't a member back then so I thought that you might appreciate the link.

 

[toyota]

Are you really still arguing about this? You've seen several pieces of evidence from independent 3rd parties, but every time somebody gives you something you say "I'm still not convinced". WTF?? Why don't you just ask us to prove to you that God doesn't exist?

and do you really believe everything you read? AGAIN I gave you an example of how Acer claimed their cheap low end 19inch monitors were true 8 bit when anybody with sense knows damn well they were not. I also gave you another example where ASUS and Newegg originally claimed the 4670 I bought was 256 bit. it took 2 weeks for them to change that but they finally did BECAUSE PEOPLE CAN MAKE MISTAKES.

 

[happy medium]

Are you really still arguing about this? You've seen several pieces of evidence from independent 3rd parties, but every time somebody gives you something you say "I'm still not convinced". WTF?? Why don't you just ask us to prove to you that God doesn't exist?

Both companies emailed me and yes both product descriptions seem to be correct. Sucks for the unsuspecting consumer.

Now the consumer needs to know the diffrence between ddr memory types and how many bits the memory controller is, or get ripped off.

How far does are these companies gonna take this?

 

[bryanW1995]

I got a response from Diamond.......

Your ticket details:

Subject: Diamond Customer Inquiry [ORIGINAL]
Ticket ID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Department: TECHNICAL SUPPORT

New Update:


Hello,

The HD 6450 has a 128 bit memory interface.

And I noticed this on Newegg for the ASUS 32 bit card.
quote:
"Cons: 32 bit memory bus cripples the card's capabilities and buggy drivers kill it. I had the same experience with 7MC as another reviewer. Replaced with a GT430 and am loving my HTPC again"

So it seems it was not a error theses cards have a 32,64,or 128 bit memory.

uh huh...says you. For all we know, you could work at Diamond, newegg, and Asus all at the same time, and YOU handled those help desk requests YOURSELF. Clearly we cannot believe any of this information unless a certain member gives it to us himself. Well, either that or we could have moses bring it to us off Mt. Sinai in the form of 10 very heavy stone tablets...

 

[happy medium]

the thread title implies that xfx is doing this

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

The other people are saying because it has been done this way in the lower end market before, it some how makes it right.

I say thats bullsh!t.

So now the average Joe consumer needs to check
Model #
1.benchmarks
2. core speed
3, how many core
4. the difference between AMD cores and Nvidia cores
5. amount of memory
6. type of memory
7. memory bit style

So the average joe reads an Anandtech review and says ok im gonna buy a xxxx model with 512mb of memory, and he gets some 32 bit ,ddr3, slow ass card, that he paid a whole 5$ less for.

 

[bryanW1995]

[snip]
"Bilking the masses"...what does that even mean?!..

I'm not exactly sure what that is, but I AM pretty sure that XFX hasn't been doing too much bilking of anybody lately or their financials would look much better.

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

The other people are saying because it has been done this way in the lower end market before, it some how makes it right.

I say thats bullsh!t.

Sorry, but if XFX were still an NV exclusive you wouldn't be saying that. And it's not like they tried to hide it, they had both cards listed on the same page at newegg. The OP, if nothing else, should have wondered why there were 2 XFX models with such a price difference. I don't think that they did anything wrong at all here, and I probably own more nvidia cards than 99%+ of the posters on this forum (and not a single amd card).

 

[hdfxst]

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

The other people are saying because it has been done this way in the lower end market before, it some how makes it right.

I say thats bullsh!t.

I'm not saying it's right either,and if your going to quote me quote everything i said.where does it mention a 6670 in the title

 

[taltamir]

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

1. This a grossly distorted misrepresentation of the facts.
2. It seems to me that the vast majority of people posting here disagree with you.
3. Even if most people DID agree with you, that wouldn't make you right.

 

[happy medium]

I puposely used xxxx and never mentioned a specific company.
Not once in this thread have I said, Nvidia or AMD....

Look very closely at the quote below, you guys think that is right to do to customers? Argue the facts and not weather I'm right or wrong but whether what I typed below is the wrong thing to do or the right thing to do.

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

The other people are saying because it has been done this way in the lower end market before, it some how makes it right.

I say thats bullsh!t.

So now the average Joe consumer needs to check
Model #
1.benchmarks
2. core speed
3, how many core
4. the difference between AMD cores and Nvidia cores
5. amount of memory
6. type of memory
7. memory bit style

So the average joe reads an Anandtech review and says ok im gonna buy a xxxx model with 512mb of memory, and he gets some 32 bit ,ddr3, slow ass card, that he paid a whole 5$ less for.

 

[Madcatatlas]

Whats with taking it personal apoppin? "lifer" was a direct comment at your posting record and that you have been here for a long time, there was nothing you should have taken personally in that. And i never said YOUR reviews were worthless, infact i appreciate the work you and BFG put down and also your presence on this forum. I think its sad and downright childish that you took that personally AND trew me an insult. Thanks.

At least someone may have more information than before. That's a service. And it gave you and posters here something to do.
:whiste:

Is this what your here for now? to make snide comments at posters all the while trowing us bones about your next reviews/previews, in hopes of luring some of us over to your site?, this coupled with your insult..well i just dont know what to make of it.

 

[toyota]

I got a response from Diamond.......

Your ticket details:

Subject: Diamond Customer Inquiry [ORIGINAL]
Ticket ID: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Department: TECHNICAL SUPPORT

New Update:


Hello,

The HD 6450 has a 128 bit memory interface.

And I noticed this on Newegg for the ASUS 32 bit card.
quote:
"Cons: 32 bit memory bus cripples the card's capabilities and buggy drivers kill it. I had the same experience with 7MC as another reviewer. Replaced with a GT430 and am loving my HTPC again"

So it seems it was not a error theses cards have a 32,64,or 128 bit memory.

and again its just a mistake. I already said they will have to track down where the original mistake in information started. they are not going to put a 6450 gpu on 128 bit board and give it to for the 64 bit price.

and if you read the FIRST review there you will see that the card the user received was 64 bit NOT 128 bit as advertised.

plus someone that is knowledgeable can probably just look right at the pics and see its 64 bit.

 

[cusideabelincoln]

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

In this circumstance nothing has been switched out. The low end market has been supplemented with a product that is cheaper and, most likely, uses less power.

The card the OP bought was clearly marked and identified and the reference card alternatives were clearly marked and labeled, so there was no bait and switch.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

Having considered the "problem" or the issue at hand, and considered how hard it must be to pick the right type of card when the information is available in the first line of the product name/title,
I have no choice but to trow my lot in with the rest of the posters that criticize the thread starters lack of cognitive ability.

And for the love of God, FIX the thread title. Something in me dies each time i see "Bilking the masses"...what does that even mean?!..

Oh my God, are you seriously asking for the definition of words? Lack of cognitive ability? LOL. It had nothing to do with cognitive ability. Lack of understanding would have been a more reasonable statement. I think over 100 people now have made the same whiney argument to my post. "What's wrong? You didn't see DDR3 in the product title? Learn to read".

You computer nerds show no mercy to the average joes like me. I did see DDR3 in the title which didn't tell me anything because I didn't know there was a difference of 50% in terms of memory bandwidth between DDR3 and GDDR5 when I ordered the card. Thats the same idiotic assumption you nerd computer genius' keep making. The masses don't know the difference between the memory types. I also seen "6670" in the product title which according to AMD should follow these specifications:
http://www.amd.com/us/products/desk...6670/Pages/amd-radeon-hd-6670-overview.aspx#2

I think toyota said it best. The 6670 isn't a GPU, its a model number with specific attributes which videocard manufacturers should adhere, as closely as possible, to the official specifications recommended by AMD. You wanna diverage by kicking the memory clock by 10% and "exceeding" AMD recommendations, no problem. Substituing a different memory which cuts performance by 50% is just a little too damn much divergence from the original specifications for me not to feel like a little deception is being employed here. Especially as others have pointed out as well that there are hardly any hardware reviews which make the distinction between the two versions.

Edit: If someone can post links to reviews of the XFX 6670 DDR3 version I would enjoy reading them.

If XFX feels the need to use the same model number for such different products, in terms of performance, they could have had the courtesty to distinguish them a little better. Like NVidia did with their 8800GT, 8800GTS, 8800GTX. That would be fair play.

The masses don't have a clue about the difference in speed between DDR3 and GDDR5. I was part of the masses until now.

 

[SlowSpyder]

No, he said XFX did it to him.............

Most of us are saying thats its wrong for any company to send out a xxxx product for review and then switch it months later, make it much slower, and still brand it as xxxx.

The other people are saying because it has been done this way in the lower end market before, it some how makes it right.

I say thats bullsh!t.

So now the average Joe consumer needs to check
Model #
1.benchmarks
2. core speed
3, how many core
4. the difference between AMD cores and Nvidia cores
5. amount of memory
6. type of memory
7. memory bit style

So the average joe reads an Anandtech review and says ok im gonna buy a xxxx model with 512mb of memory, and he gets some 32 bit ,ddr3, slow ass card, that he paid a whole 5$ less for.

So tell me, do I have a valid complaint against Sapphire for making and selling the non-reference VaporX 5870's I have? Reference cards have a blower cooler that exhausts the hot air out of the case. Reference cards run at different clocks. Reference cards can have their voltage manipulated via software, mine cannot.

He was going to purchase a clearly labeled non-reference part that uses slower memory. My cards have different specs/components than reference also. Do we really need this thread to notify people that card makers make non-reference cards..? Sometimes they are slower cheaper cards, sometimes they bump up the speed.

This thread is a joke.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

So tell me, do I have a valid complaint against Sapphire for making and selling the non-reference VaporX 5870's I have? Reference cards have a blower cooler that exhausts the hot air out of the case. Reference cards run at different clocks. Reference cards can have their voltage manipulated via software, mine cannot.

He was going to purchase a clearly labeled non-reference part that uses slower memory. My cards have different specs/components than reference also. Do we really need this thread to notify people that card makers make non-reference cards..? Sometimes they are slower cheaper cards, sometimes they bump up the speed.

This thread is a joke.

Yes, the card was clearly labeled. "RADEON 6670".
What's that look like? Click link to see:http://www.amd.com/us/products/desk...6670/Pages/amd-radeon-hd-6670-overview.aspx#2
Is this thread a joke? No, its as serious as can be.

Edit: Model number suggestions for XFX in the future:

6670LT for videocards using DDR3 memory offering 50% less total memory bandwidth resulting in a possible 50% hit in overall graphics performance

6670 for videocards meeting official AMD specifications

6670GT for videocards exceeding official AMD specifications

So simple.

 

[smackababy]

Yes, the card was clearly labeled. "RADEON 6670".
What's that look like? Click link to see:http://www.amd.com/us/products/desk...6670/Pages/amd-radeon-hd-6670-overview.aspx#2
Is this thread a joke? No, its as serious as can be.

Edit: Model number suggestions for XFX in the future:

6670LT for videocards using DDR3 memory offering 50% less total memory bandwidth resulting in a possible 50% hit in overall graphics performance

6670 for videocards meeting official AMD specifications

6670GT for videocards exceeding official AMD specifications

So simple.

AMD does not sell cards, board vendors due. Here is some suggestions for the next time you spend money on a product: read the label, the title of it, the specifications. Do you buy a car because Ford says it comes with power seats and windows without confirming this in the actual car?

This ordeal is your fault, nobody else. YOU purchased the wrong product.

 

[happy medium]

So tell me, do I have a valid complaint against Sapphire for making and selling the non-reference VaporX 5870's I have? Reference cards have a blower cooler that exhausts the hot air out of the case. Reference cards run at different clocks. Reference cards can have their voltage manipulated via software, mine cannot.

If your 5870 card performed 50% slower and came out 4 months after the the original REAL 5870 reviews and had no updated reviews for your slower card, yes you would have evey right to complain and I would be right behind you ! .

If it was someone like Toyota or Apoppin , I would say you knew better but there are tens of thousands of other people that will not and do not know better, this is where it makes it wrong.

Again we are the minority, people (noobs) like the OP deserve better treatment than this is what I'm saying.

Its not about which vendor,company, sales person does it or how long it has been going on, or what segment of cards is affected, its about bad business practice that needs to be changed.