Xbox One and Forza's Shameless Micro transactions

[ProchargeMe]

The games as released are complete. The difference between then and now is developers dont make one game and stop. Once a game is gold they dont just drop the project. No, they continue making updates and new stuff. Some of that new stuff happens to be ready in time for release but NOT ready in time to get it into the game when it went gold.

Is this really that hard a concept?

And this is why games are 6 hours long instead of days worth of gameplay right out the box. Why is there 5 DLC packs for any call of duty title when the game is literally a reskin and repack? I'm not mad that there's DLC to download, the problem is most of it's not worth the price you pay. Have you never downloaded DLC then regretted it because it was fucking stupid? Are you the kid that pays actual money for an in game paint job on your gun? If so, you're the shining example of why this shit exists in the first place. If your whole game isn't ready by release, don't release it and then make me pay for access to what your lazy ass didn't finish.

 

[vshah]

And this is why games are 6 hours long instead of days worth of gameplay right out the box. Why is there 5 DLC packs for any call of duty title when the game is literally a reskin and repack? I'm not mad that there's DLC to download, the problem is most of it's not worth the price you pay. Have you never downloaded DLC then regretted it because it was fucking stupid? Are you the kid that pays actual money for an in game paint job on your gun? If so, you're the shining example of why this shit exists in the first place. If your whole game isn't ready by release, don't release it and then make me pay for access to what your lazy ass didn't finish.

i have 20 hours into forza 5 and I'm nowhere near finished. I got 300+ hours out of forza 4.

I agree DLC is an issue in games like the COD series. Forza 5 is not a valid target of this anger.

 

[smackababy]

And this is why games are 6 hours long instead of days worth of gameplay right out the box. Why is there 5 DLC packs for any call of duty title when the game is literally a reskin and repack? I'm not mad that there's DLC to download, the problem is most of it's not worth the price you pay. Have you never downloaded DLC then regretted it because it was fucking stupid? Are you the kid that pays actual money for an in game paint job on your gun? If so, you're the shining example of why this shit exists in the first place. If your whole game isn't ready by release, don't release it and then make me pay for access to what your lazy ass didn't finish.

Mario has how many hours exactly? Sonic? Metroid? Zelda?

These games aren't some vast time sink. There were some games in previous gens that were extraordinarily long, but most games weren't.

Top Gun had 4 levels, btw.

 

[Topweasel]

Mario has how many hours exactly? Sonic? Metroid? Zelda?

These games aren't some vast time sink. There were some games in previous gens that were extraordinarily long, but most games weren't.

Top Gun had 4 levels, btw.

Wow that explains a lot. So apparently I was very close to finishing it.

 

[cmdrdredd]

And this is why games are 6 hours long instead of days worth of gameplay right out the box. Why is there 5 DLC packs for any call of duty title when the game is literally a reskin and repack? I'm not mad that there's DLC to download, the problem is most of it's not worth the price you pay. Have you never downloaded DLC then regretted it because it was fucking stupid? Are you the kid that pays actual money for an in game paint job on your gun? If so, you're the shining example of why this shit exists in the first place. If your whole game isn't ready by release, don't release it and then make me pay for access to what your lazy ass didn't finish.

I could finish super Mario world in a couple hours by using the warps. Super metroid is barely 3 hours even when getting 100% items. Dont give me that excuse because games were not always multiple days long to completion by any stretch.

 

[purbeast0]

I could finish super Mario world in a couple hours by using the warps. Super metroid is barely 3 hours even when getting 100% items. Dont give me that excuse because games were not always multiple days long to completion by any stretch.

couple hours? you can beat super mario world in like 30 minutes. get the 2 whistles on the first 4 levels or so, then use the whistle while in the whistle stage, and you're on world 8 within like 5 minutes.

i remember i got actraiser at a grand opening of a toys r us and had it beat by the following day. awesome game though.

 

[cmdrdredd]

couple hours? you can beat super mario world in like 30 minutes. get the 2 whistles on the first 4 levels or so, then use the whistle while in the whistle stage, and you're on world 8 within like 5 minutes.

That is super Mario 3 with the racoon suit. Super Mario world used the star worlds for warps.

 

[ProchargeMe]

That is super Mario 3 with the racoon suit. Super Mario world used the star worlds for warps.

I wouldn't be surprised if they made you pay to "unlock" the warp in a new version. I never said those specific games were long, those were your choices for games to name. There are hundreds of games that are long and billions that are short but thats not what this is about. This thread is about microtransactions. Which are unnecessary. That is all.

 

[cmdrdredd]

I wouldn't be surprised if they made you pay to "unlock" the warp in a new version. I never said those specific games were long, those were your choices for games to name. There are hundreds of games that are long and billions that are short but thats not what this is about. This thread is about microtransactions. Which are unnecessary. That is all.

Ok...make up something else we can debunk.

 

[purbeast0]

That is super Mario 3 with the racoon suit. Super Mario world used the star worlds for warps.

hah damn you are right, that was even shorter then back in the day!

 

[cmdrdredd]

I know people complain about ryse being short but you have to go all the way through the entire 8 or so hours. You can't skip past it so it is really 8 hours long. Some other games like Mario allow you to skip 75% or more of the game to go right to the end boss or at the very least skip much of the gameplay. I think the first final fantasy game(may have been the second or third I forget) allowed you go to to the end boss in the first 20min. Granted it was unbeatable at that point without using a game genie or something because you would be so weak.

 

[Topweasel]

I wouldn't be surprised if they made you pay to "unlock" the warp in a new version. I never said those specific games were long, those were your choices for games to name. There are hundreds of games that are long and billions that are short but thats not what this is about. This thread is about microtransactions. Which are unnecessary. That is all.

But isn't that what started these comment Microtransactions=DLC=Unfinished games=Games are shorter now because they can rape us?

If any type of game has felt the hurt of current development process and therefore falls back on DLC to extend the game its FPS. The worlds have to have less borders, more interactivity, more detailed and so on. So those went from 20+ hours to ~10 on average. That said I have seen Quake 1 beat on Nightmare in like 7 minutes. But for what they lack in average play length they gain back in looks, production values, and story. Just look at HL1 (end of one era) and HL2 (the start of a new era). HL would probably be a 16 hour game for it's first play through and HL2 was ~9hrs if you were slow.

 

[ProchargeMe]

But isn't that what started these comment Microtransactions=DLC=Unfinished games=Games are shorter now because they can rape us?

If any type of game has felt the hurt of current development process and therefore falls back on DLC to extend the game its FPS. The worlds have to have less borders, more interactivity, more detailed and so on. So those went from 20+ hours to ~10 on average. That said I have seen Quake 1 beat on Nightmare in like 7 minutes. But for what they lack in average play length they gain back in looks, production values, and story. Just look at HL1 (end of one era) and HL2 (the start of a new era). HL would probably be a 16 hour game for it's first play through and HL2 was ~9hrs if you were slow.

The half life games are a shining example of how it should be. They may have dropped the ball with the production of HL3 given how long they've been making it, but they aren't adding meaningless things to the game that you have to pay for to play, and I'm willing to wait until it's complete to play it

 

[smackababy]

The half life games are a shining example of how it should be. They may have dropped the ball with the production of HL3 given how long they've been making it, but they aren't adding meaningless things to the game that you have to pay for to play, and I'm willing to wait until it's complete to play it

You're right. They are adding them to Dota 2 and TF2. Hats? Seriously?

But, I know, Valve is the golden child of gaming. They can do no wrong!

 

[ProchargeMe]

You're right. They are adding them to Dota 2 and TF2. Hats? Seriously?

But, I know, Valve is the golden child of gaming. They can do no wrong!

They provide the updates for free unless I'm wrong? I haven't played tf2 in years

 

[ImpulsE69]

Soo...you guys all beat SMB and Metroid and Zelda in 30mins and 3hours the first time you played them? YOU ARE GAME GODS! Why are you on the internet arguing with the noobs, you should be out playing games for profit!

Such bad comparisons. Now, assuming you had internet back then and coudl actually find out how to do that the first time you played through, MAYBE I could agree with what you are saying, but...it's not the same thing at all. Arguably todays games are easier by far with less "exploration".

Take the new Zelda LBTW for instance. While good, it doesn't have near the exploration fun or things to find that the original Zelda did, some of which you needed cheats to even be able to know about unless by some miracle you just happened to do it. Not the case with this one, or most newer generation games. Today, they would charge you as DLC to type in Zelda for the 2nd quest.

You can't compare someones 10th-100th time playing through a game that knows all the tricks etc to a persons first time playing a new game and beats it in 5-6 hours w/o looking for any help at all. I get what you are saying, it just isn't a good comparison. At the same time, FPS games really aren't a good comparison either if they are mainly for multiplayer.

I would assume Forza has MANY hours of campaign alone due to the nature of the game.

 

[smackababy]

Soo...you guys all beat SMB and Metroid and Zelda in 30mins and 3hours the first time you played them? YOU ARE GAME GODS! Why are you on the internet arguing with the noobs, you should be out playing games for profit!

Such bad comparisons. Now, assuming you had internet back then and coudl actually find out how to do that the first time you played through, MAYBE I could agree with what you are saying, but...it's not the same thing at all. Arguably todays games are easier by far with less "exploration".

Take the new Zelda LBTW for instance. While good, it doesn't have near the exploration fun or things to find that the original Zelda did, some of which you needed cheats to even be able to know about unless by some miracle you just happened to do it. Not the case with this one, or most newer generation games. Today, they would charge you as DLC to type in Zelda for the 2nd quest.

The first Zelda took me quite a long time, as I had never played a Zelda game and there was no real direction. I never finished Zelda 2. LTTP took a bit as well, but that was because I had to figure out how the game played. OoT? I read it took 50 hours in EGM, but I completed it in much less. Now, my first play through didn't consist of selling every mask and finding every grotto, nor did I catch the biggest fish possible. But, the dungeons and such were quite easy. I knew the Zelda format and I knew how the game played. Majora's Mask was much of the same.

Mario? After the first Mario, the rest were rather easy. Once you figured out how to platform, it really wasn't hard. Sonic was the same; except for those damn special stages. I did get Super Sonic in Sonic 2 though!

There were games that took awhile (both from artificially lengthening them; requiring grinding or have some silly start from the beginning because you didn't memorize the exact patterns of movements required), but the majority of games were just a short as today. In fact, they are probably even shorter. Go back and play some of those long games. The average gamer is far better at gaming than those of the NES days. Nintendo hard? Go back. Those games weren't that hard.

 

[ImpulsE69]

The first Zelda took me quite a long time, as I had never played a Zelda game and there was no real direction. I never finished Zelda 2. LTTP took a bit as well, but that was because I had to figure out how the game played. OoT? I read it took 50 hours in EGM, but I completed it in much less. Now, my first play through didn't consist of selling every mask and finding every grotto, nor did I catch the biggest fish possible. But, the dungeons and such were quite easy. I knew the Zelda format and I knew how the game played. Majora's Mask was much of the same.

Mario? After the first Mario, the rest were rather easy. Once you figured out how to platform, it really wasn't hard. Sonic was the same; except for those damn special stages. I did get Super Sonic in Sonic 2 though!

There were games that took awhile (both from artificially lengthening them; requiring grinding or have some silly start from the beginning because you didn't memorize the exact patterns of movements required), but the majority of games were just a short as today. In fact, they are probably even shorter. Go back and play some of those long games. The average gamer is far better at gaming than those of the NES days. Nintendo hard? Go back. Those games weren't that hard.

Don't disagree at all.

 

[KaOTiK]

Forza 5 economy update adds drag racing, makes cars cheaper, making money easier

Turn 10 Studios will release a Forza Motorsport 5 update this month -- as early as next week -- that adds Drag Racing and Tag multiplayer modes, in addition to a more balanced economy.

Car prices have been reduced significantly, with the on-disc cars reduced in price by 45%. So, the $6 million Ferrari 250 GTO you’ve been saving for is now a more accessible $2 million purchase. The rate at which racers earn money has more than doubled, as well. Turn 10 estimates Forza 5 players will be able to earn exotic cars in one-fifth of the time they earned them in Forza Motorsport 4.

“We based our economy largely on Forza Motorsport 4 data,” creative director Dan Greenwalt told IGN. That $6 million Ferrari? It cost $10 million in Forza 4.

“The earn rate [in Forza 5] should have been the same,” Greenwalt explained. Player patterns are different now, however, which meant racers were earning less. And so Turn 10 adapted based on telemetry. Based on that data, Turn 10 is "making updates pretty quickly and painlessly," and will continue to do so based on community feedback.

Kudos to Turn10 for addressing problems a lot of people have/had with the game.
Once again though, it shows with MS, if you don't bitch and make your voice heard, they will do as they please. This is why people complain and simply don't just ignore or it or don't buy it as solutions people tried to use.

 

[purbeast0]

Forza 5 economy update adds drag racing, makes cars cheaper, making money easier



Kudos to Turn10 for addressing problems a lot of people have/had with the game.
Once again though, it shows with MS, if you don't bitch and make your voice heard, they will do as they please. This is why people complain and simply don't just ignore or it or don't buy it as solutions people tried to use.

yay, now can we lock this thread?

100% guaranteed that people are now going to find something else to bitch about with ms.

 

[KaOTiK]

yay, now can we lock this thread?

100% guaranteed that people are now going to find something else to bitch about with ms.

Keep playing that victim card, go ahead.

 

[Topweasel]

The half life games are a shining example of how it should be. They may have dropped the ball with the production of HL3 given how long they've been making it, but they aren't adding meaningless things to the game that you have to pay for to play, and I'm willing to wait until it's complete to play it

No they used the mediums that were available at the time. They were the fathers of current day DLC when they launched the idea of episodic content with HL2 E1 and E2. It backfired on them horribly with E3 because they thought they had it mapped out enough and didn't start work on one episode until the previous was finished and didn't even start on EP1 till a year or two after the release of HL2.

Other companies learned from their and other companies failures. Hard clocks with several teams developing the games and extra content allow the development to flow more smoothly from game to game and keep a high mindshare.

Valve if they still were a regular development team that created HL1 and 2 would have had to close their doors a lot sooner than 3D Realms did. Steam is the only reason we even have a chance of seeing HL3 and it pushed the ability to create and distribute DLC just as much if not more than the 360 or PS3.

 

[Sonikku]

The games as released are complete. The difference between then and now is developers dont make one game and stop. Once a game is gold they dont just drop the project. No, they continue making updates and new stuff. Some of that new stuff happens to be ready in time for release but NOT ready in time to get it into the game when it went gold.

Is this really that hard a concept?

That must explain why people were playing as Blanka online in one of the recent street fighters, despite the character being a part of "yet to be released" dlc already loaded onto the disc.

 

[purbeast0]

Keep playing that victim card, go ahead.

i don't even know what that means.

 

[smackababy]

That must explain why people were playing as Blanka online in one of the recent street fighters, despite the character being a part of "yet to be released" dlc already loaded onto the disc.

It was SFxTekken that had DLC characters on the disc. However, I don't know if the characters were actually finished. Characters in fighting games are constantly tweaked for balance and it is pretty complex. The DLC characters could have not actually been ready and the DLC patch updated them to their correct, final forms.