Xbox 360 graphics to surpass PC game graphics!?!

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Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: malak
A video card that was high-end 3 years ago cannot run new games at highest details today
Patently false, the ti4600 came out in late '01, I bought it in mid '02. It can run FC in 10x7 v.high detail, Doom3 in 12x10 med detail or 10x7 high detail. I'm guessint it has another year before it can't play new games at (chronologically competing; ie. ps2, xbox1) console settings (low detail, 640x480).

The ti4600 is DX8, cannot show new eye candy. It is outdated, needed to be replaced in the last generation with a DX9 card. Even last generation cards can't play Doom 3 well, you certainly don't have everything showing in the games being a DX8 card. That's not high detail if it lacks details. Not to mention at 1024x768, you need AA, especially in an FPS. Even a 9800 Pro at that res with AA/AF on stutters in Doom 3, your ti probably crawls.
 

0roo0roo

No Lifer
Sep 21, 2002
64,795
84
91
ti4600? wonderful...at release how much did that cost alone...300+? 3 years ago that card still cost 300+ http://www.sharkyextreme.com/guides/MHGSBG/article.php/10707_1177851__5
you are an alpha geek.good for you.
i once bought cards costing that and more. thats what it takes to match consoles. but now i just trail the hardware market a bit and save a lot, in doing that you see how the consoles really compare with the general pc market. not how they do against alpha geeks and their tweaking and such


and now, 4 years down the line the whole xbox system is what? 150 dollars? 733mhz can do doa ultimate? http://media.xbox.ign.com/media/566/566556/imgs_1.html
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
I'm don't see why I should spend $300-400 for a video card and another $500 or more for the rest of the PC and I have to upgrade the entire system every 2 years just to fully enjoy the latest and greatest (graphically) FPS? Ridiculous. The whole situation will get even worse once R520 and G70 get released and each of them will probably rival a cost of a $599 Dell itself.

Next-gen consoles such as the Xbox 360 are of far better value. The Xbox 360 only costs $300 and will last for 3 to 4 years, and I don't have to worry about spending money for upgrading. Even if I add in a HDTV into the mix, consoles will still be better than PCs for gaming, value-wise.
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
StrangerGuy-

It is true, it's a lot cheaper to game on consoles. But 2 years after that console hit the market, PC gamers will be enjoying much better looking games, that's why hardware always needs upgrading. It's more espensive on the PC, but your games get upgraded too. You have to wait 4 years to buy a new console to catch up, whereas a PC person can upgrade their PC every 6 months if they really want to.
 

Gurck

Banned
Mar 16, 2004
12,963
1
0
Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
Originally posted by: Gurck
Originally posted by: malak
A video card that was high-end 3 years ago cannot run new games at highest details today
Patently false, the ti4600 came out in late '01, I bought it in mid '02. It can run FC in 10x7 v.high detail, Doom3 in 12x10 med detail or 10x7 high detail. I'm guessint it has another year before it can't play new games at (chronologically competing; ie. ps2, xbox1) console settings (low detail, 640x480).

The ti4600 is DX8, cannot show new eye candy. It is outdated, needed to be replaced in the last generation with a DX9 card. Even last generation cards can't play Doom 3 well, you certainly don't have everything showing in the games being a DX8 card. That's not high detail if it lacks details. Not to mention at 1024x768, you need AA, especially in an FPS. Even a 9800 Pro at that res with AA/AF on stutters in Doom 3, your ti probably crawls.

Now you're comparing apples & oranges. The xbox 1 & ps2 aren't capable of any new technology which was introduced after their release, why hold PCs to a different standard when comparing the two? 10x7 requires AA? ps2 & xbox don't do AA and they run in 640x480, again you have to hold PCs to a far higher standard to make consoles look good - why bother? My cards have no problem with Doom3, I prefer detail to resolution given the choice, so run it in 10x7, high detail on the 4600 (no aa/af) and 12x10 high detail, 4aa8af on the 9800p.
Originally posted by: 0roo0roo
ti4600? wonderful...at release how much did that cost alone...300+? 3 years ago that card still cost 300+ http://www.sharkyextreme.com/guides/MHGSBG/article.php/10707_1177851__5
you are an alpha geek.good for you.
i once bought cards costing that and more. thats what it takes to match consoles. but now i just trail the hardware market a bit and save a lot, in doing that you see how the consoles really compare with the general pc market. not how they do against alpha geeks and their tweaking and such


and now, 4 years down the line the whole xbox system is what? 150 dollars? 733mhz can do doa ultimate? http://media.xbox.ign.com/media/566/566556/imgs_1.html
English motherfscker, do you speak it? :confused:
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
That's the point Gurck, it's apples and oranges. You have good and bad parts to being a console gamer or PC gamer, neither is better. It's purely a matter of choice.
 

StrangerGuy

Diamond Member
May 9, 2004
8,443
124
106
Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
StrangerGuy-

It is true, it's a lot cheaper to game on consoles. But 2 years after that console hit the market, PC gamers will be enjoying much better looking games, that's why hardware always needs upgrading. It's more espensive on the PC, but your games get upgraded too. You have to wait 4 years to buy a new console to catch up, whereas a PC person can upgrade their PC every 6 months if they really want to.


Much better looking. Sure. But are they much better playing? Think not. It seems like the games which has the best graphics are always FPSes which follows the same old story-based "save-the-world" gameplay formula as the first Half-life 6 years ago. Some of the other PC genres such as RTSes, MMORPGs also didn't improved the gameplay factor much over these few years.

You can argue that console games also lacks innovation from the gameplay side, but at least consoles are much cheaper to play, and with next-gen consoles we may even see consoles overtaking PCs in the graphics sector.
 

SirPappy

Golden Member
Nov 13, 2002
1,067
0
0
Originally posted by: CVSiN

not even close...
PC still dominates... HL 2 looks that good already...

next gen cards and games will be much better..
btw for comparison.. XBOX360 only runs 4x aa and no AS.. 6800 GTs run at 1600x1280 at 8xaa and 8x AS or above...
yes, but what did it cost you to get it to look that good. card alone $300 or more, plus cpu,mem,hd,ect,ect. this is allready there and setup for the price of a card.(without windows thank god)

 

Acanthus

Lifer
Aug 28, 2001
19,915
2
76
ostif.org
Originally posted by: StrangerGuy
Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
StrangerGuy-

It is true, it's a lot cheaper to game on consoles. But 2 years after that console hit the market, PC gamers will be enjoying much better looking games, that's why hardware always needs upgrading. It's more espensive on the PC, but your games get upgraded too. You have to wait 4 years to buy a new console to catch up, whereas a PC person can upgrade their PC every 6 months if they really want to.


Much better looking. Sure. But are they much better playing? Think not. It seems like the games which has the best graphics are always FPSes which follows the same old story-based "save-the-world" gameplay formula as the first Half-life 6 years ago. Some of the other PC genres such as RTSes, MMORPGs also didn't improved the gameplay factor much over these few years.

You can argue that console games also lacks innovation from the gameplay side, but at least consoles are much cheaper to play, and with next-gen consoles we may even see consoles overtaking PCs in the graphics sector.

It is inevitable that consoles will be ahead of PCs until at least mid-2006. Triple core CPUs, Cell, and insane memory subsystems will be the brunt of the technology pulling consoles ahead. These technologies will come to the PC, but not in the optimised form you will see on consoles.
 
Mar 19, 2003
18,289
2
71
Originally posted by: Acanthus
Originally posted by: StrangerGuy
Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
StrangerGuy-

It is true, it's a lot cheaper to game on consoles. But 2 years after that console hit the market, PC gamers will be enjoying much better looking games, that's why hardware always needs upgrading. It's more espensive on the PC, but your games get upgraded too. You have to wait 4 years to buy a new console to catch up, whereas a PC person can upgrade their PC every 6 months if they really want to.


Much better looking. Sure. But are they much better playing? Think not. It seems like the games which has the best graphics are always FPSes which follows the same old story-based "save-the-world" gameplay formula as the first Half-life 6 years ago. Some of the other PC genres such as RTSes, MMORPGs also didn't improved the gameplay factor much over these few years.

You can argue that console games also lacks innovation from the gameplay side, but at least consoles are much cheaper to play, and with next-gen consoles we may even see consoles overtaking PCs in the graphics sector.

It is inevitable that consoles will be ahead of PCs until at least mid-2006. Triple core CPUs, Cell, and insane memory subsystems will be the brunt of the technology pulling consoles ahead. These technologies will come to the PC, but not in the optimised form you will see on consoles.

But the first of these consoles (Xbox360) is almost certainly not coming out until the holiday season this year...so mid 2006 would only be 6 months away from then :p
 

Malak

Lifer
Dec 4, 2004
14,696
2
0
Originally posted by: StrangerGuy
Much better looking. Sure. But are they much better playing? Think not. It seems like the games which has the best graphics are always FPSes which follows the same old story-based "save-the-world" gameplay formula as the first Half-life 6 years ago. Some of the other PC genres such as RTSes, MMORPGs also didn't improved the gameplay factor much over these few years.

You can argue that console games also lacks innovation from the gameplay side, but at least consoles are much cheaper to play, and with next-gen consoles we may even see consoles overtaking PCs in the graphics sector.

All shooters follow that forumula since the genre was born, that's the whole point. It's no different on a console, it's just a lot harder to play on a console. What the PC offers is better multiplayer games(and a lot more of them), better control in games like FPS's and RTS's, and better graphics. I wouldn't say there are better games on consoles at all, but I would say it's a lot easier to play the games on my PC. If I were playing Halo on my PC versus someone on an Xbox, I guarantee I'd win every time.
 

Malladine

Diamond Member
Mar 31, 2003
4,618
0
71
Originally posted by: StrangerGuy
Originally posted by: KruptosAngelos
StrangerGuy-

It is true, it's a lot cheaper to game on consoles. But 2 years after that console hit the market, PC gamers will be enjoying much better looking games, that's why hardware always needs upgrading. It's more espensive on the PC, but your games get upgraded too. You have to wait 4 years to buy a new console to catch up, whereas a PC person can upgrade their PC every 6 months if they really want to.
Much better looking. Sure. But are they much better playing? Think not. It seems like the games which has the best graphics are always FPSes which follows the same old story-based "save-the-world" gameplay formula as the first Half-life 6 years ago. Some of the other PC genres such as RTSes, MMORPGs also didn't improved the gameplay factor much over these few years.

You can argue that console games also lacks innovation from the gameplay side, but at least consoles are much cheaper to play, and with next-gen consoles we may even see consoles overtaking PCs in the graphics sector.
IMO the majority of console games are short lived affairs focusing almost entirely on graphics and fluid action oriented gameplay. They grab the attention at first but quickly become tiresome. Multiplayer counters the short lived part of course, but any decent mplayer game has its equal on pc. Besides that the entire strategy genre is the sole domain of the pc - a signifcant thing wouldn't you say?

I do see the point. Console is released @ $400, graphics are amazing and presumely there are several decent games available. A brand new pc capable of running the latest games will cost $1200-1400 ish (i build my own). In my experience however, this same pc will still be running the latest games in 3 years with just a few hundred in upgrades. My wife's, my own and my stepson's all fit into this category. So, after 3yrs the pc gamer has ~$1700 invested and the console gamer ~$400 (assuming the cdrom still works, which is far from guaranteed, correct?). Of course the pc fills more than just a few roles but I don't need to go into that.

Now come the games. Like someone said, that's where they make the money. In my experience console games are $10 more expensive each time and last a fraction of the time, less than half the gameplay of pc games and that's not counting the massive rts, tbs and world domination games that are so popular on pc and have no presence on consoles to speak of.

Obviously consolers spend overall somewhat less over a period of years, but imo the difference is much less than some think it to be. Once piles of games are added in, extra controllers, memory cards etc, hell even replacement units - xbox and ps2 under heavy use don't last more than 3yrs or so right? My ps1 certainly didn't.

Graphics might sell more games now than they used to, but gameplay is what counts. Personally, I love wasd and mouse for FPS, I feel the monitor offers far greater quality than the television (and if you get into other display options for consoles the cost rockets far beyond that of the pc), and i have no problems resolving the occasional technical problem associated with pcs but absent from consoles.

Speaking of which I think that's a major factor too...I know guys who would never have the patience to deal with drivers/patches/slow stuttering gameplay, etc. These ppl will never come to pc. That's the one downfall for the pc: consoles can attract long time pc users but pcs rarely attract long time consolers due to the extra effort and sometime annoyances that come with the territory along with the deeper and more complex gameplay that inevitably makes the game in question somewhat more difficult to "get into." Console games grab the attention from the word GO and are designed as such.

I agree with some others here. It's apples and oranges and there will always be a market and room to expand for both platforms.

Hurray for games! :D
 

fullgrip

Junior Member
Aug 14, 2004
10
0
0
Originally posted by: SonicIce
whats the point of wasting power an antialiasing if its not noticeable on a standard-definition tv? what percent of people have an hdtv right now?

in fact it's just the oposite, the more crappy the resolution, the more AA will belefit, try playing PCs Doom 3 in 640 lines with any AA level, then switch AA off, you will then conclude that was the most unbelievebly beautifull 640 picture you ever saw...
 

skace

Lifer
Jan 23, 2001
14,488
7
81
http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2005-05-23&res=l

I allowed myself to really get hyped up by the the game trailers / etc for PS3 and Xbox360. But now I've let reality hit. And that reality is that MS and Sony are fighting a war using a massive hype machine and I now refuse to believe anything until I see someone actually playing a game from the first person with a frame rate display somewhere on their view.
 

Queasy

Moderator<br>Console Gaming
Aug 24, 2001
31,796
2
0
Originally posted by: Looney
Not from what i saw on the MTV special... and by the time the xbox360 is released, we'll see games like Quake4 and FEAR on the PC.

The MTV special was running on alpha builds. That is not how the final game will look.

Also, Quake4 will be going to the Xbox360 and FEAR will be on the Xbox.

I thought I remember reading one time that FEAR was going to be on the Xbox as well but it looks like it is going to be PC only.