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X1800XL v 7800GTX: My personal review

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Thanks for the feedback and offer for help 🙂

I made some screenshots with the X1800XL, I have yet to repeat them with the GTX.
Most were done inside WoW (built in screenshot) = .tga files, 9MB each (1920x1200). I think I have some made with the X800XT, but most likely at different places and resolution (before I got my 2405). Those pre-GTX era have around 5MB.

For BF2 and Fear I used Fraps (unregistered). Fraps made bitmaps, 5MB each (1920x1200).

I don't know if you will be able to see what I meant, but le's try and see if it works.

I will try first at Imageshack - if it doesn't work, I will contact one of you.

I ask you to be a bit patient, I will do it as soon as possible.

Take care and hope to post again soon....
 
Update:

I am currently making the screenshots with the GTX. It is hard to find the same spot on WoW - another issue is also the lighting conditions in the game: the X1800 shots were made near sunset, the GTX on mid morning. There will be different color temperatures, which has nothing to do with the cards IQ.

Fileshack only hosts 1024MB files. I will prepare the shots, make a copy into a separate folder and compress to 1024MB. If you don't like it, we can try and see if someone could host them.

I checked with my ISP and file/web hosting is not part of the package. I can sign up for one, but there is a 12 month minimum contract. This sucks completely....

Let's see if I can do something today. I have my normal stuff to attend also (house cleaning, sweep all leaves in front of home, Halloween Trunk or Treat at local pre-primary, etc
 
Mind if I put in my $0.02?

I just got an X1800XL. Had a 6600GT in my PC to hold me over until I could afford this card.. before that I had an X300SE (to play with) and a 9700NP...

there is definitely some shimmering on this card that wasn't apparent on any other (recent) card I've used. My Radeon64MB VIVO had this, back in the day.. Radeon8500 solved it. It's a huge annoyance and it's apparent in every game. Turning Catalyst AI OFF makes it better, using high quality AF makes it better.. but it doesn't solve the problem.

I think he's overreacting about the fan noise, it doesn't bother me that much. I'm using all 120mm fans and I can hear my HD over them, the X1800XL fan is no louder than the DFI chipset fan (which could be considered loud, I guess). It's not whiney, it's not high pitched.. I wonder if some people have faulty fans?

Temps are just fine. 55C idle and less than 70C full load when OCed to CCC's maximum.

hopefully the shimmering will be fixed with a driver update... just wanted to post that indeed it is there, this is coming from someone who went from a 6600GT to an X1800XL.. never been on a 7800gt so I can't compare them
 
it's heavily compressed because I only have a few MB space to host files but here is a video showing shimmering in Eve Online. Check out the lights and grill things on the station, it did NOT do this on any of my other cards.

This is with 6x Adaptive AA, 16X HQ AF and Catalyst AI to OFF.

It is much worse in the original video, compression sorta hides some of it.. but you can see that it is happening.

http://home.ma.rr.com/errors/shimmer.wmv

edit: those are textures, the grill things.. I can't imagine how bad this card is going to look in a game like Doom3 where bumpmaps are used everywhere. they seriously need to do something about the texture filtering.

Funny, back in the day I complained that ATi filtered their textures so heavily with the Radeon8500. I loved the look of SSAA with these sharp textures.. but now, FSAA doesn't filter all textures and it just doesn't work right. I really hope they can fix this..
 
Hi ErroSx,

It is a different type of game, but the shimmering on your video is similar to what I have experience (on the grills). This can be observed also on BF2 or Fear.

Thanks for posting and the video link🙂
 
Originally posted by: ErrorSx
, the X1800XL fan is no louder than the DFI chipset fan (which could be considered loud, I guess).
Click to expand...

The DFI chipset fan can be loud as hell, that is not a quiet fan.
Its loud enough when it spins up that I considered switching motherboard brands!
 
the chipset fan is at half-speed and I can hear it over the X1800XL.. does that matter?

it's not like it makes it hard to hear television or anything. It's not loud like some of the fans I use to use on my AXP system.. but I can see how it might be annoying to some people. One more thing, the ONLY time the fan has run at full speed or even close to full speed is when I start my PC. Even while gaming it's not nearly that loud.. i have a pretty cool case though.
 
Originally posted by: southpawuni
Originally posted by: ErrorSx
, the X1800XL fan is no louder than the DFI chipset fan (which could be considered loud, I guess).
Click to expand...

The DFI chipset fan can be loud as hell, that is not a quiet fan.
Its loud enough when it spins up that I considered switching motherboard brands!
Click to expand...

The DFI chipset is loud, but the XL was louder under load.

While returning the XL, I bought one Y-cable splitter that supplies 7V (similar to Zalman's) and plugged the chipset cooler there.

Now my box is very silent all times - even the GTX can't be heard under load (only during boot times).

For the ones with ATIs, I recommend downloading ATITOOL (with support to the X1800) and setting a fan profile.

In my case, the profile didn't help much, as the fan was noisy already at 72%.

 
Madellga,

Thanks for a great thread, and for remaining polite and on topic through some of the less useful posts.

I have an X800XL, play quite a bit of WoW, and haven't noticed shimmering (but now I don't even want to look for it because if I do notice it then it will bother me for quite some time).

One thing I wanted to mention on the fan noise, was that the X800XL is also very noisy (IMO), and when I'd play WoW the fan would cycle between the two fastest spees which made if very annoying. Furthermore, when summer started I began to get GPU resets, which I thought were temperature related - even though my temp never reached more than 75. Anyhow, I ended up getting a Zalman VF700 to stop the noise problem, and I have been very happy with the X800XL since. Ironically, I bought the X800XL because at the time it was much less expensive than the 6800GT, but then I bought the cooler which greatly reduced the cost differential (although I probably would have bought that for the NV card anyway). The GPU resets still occasionally occur, but are not as frequent, so I think the new cooler has helped with that as well.

So, my point is that IF the X1800XL becomes cost competitive with the 7800GT, then getting the aftermarket cooler would at least solve the noise problem and make the card reasonable competitor.

But, I agree that it seems there is no point to changing from the 7800GTX at this time.

I hope that both video card vendors start to take a more serious look at IQ now that raw performance seems to be sufficient for all but the highest resolutions.

Thanks again for a great post and review.

-D'oh!
 
Originally posted by: Pete
Madellga, try converting those .tga files to .png files.

Thanks for posting, ErrorSx.
Click to expand...

Any particular reason? Is jpg worse than png?

I made the shots but still had no time to edit them. I want to place some arrows and markers to show where to look for IQ issues.

 
Originally posted by: Madellga
The DFI chipset is loud, but the XL was louder under load.
Click to expand...

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

I'd hate to be the guy who buys a XT then as I'm sure its louder.

Sounds like this round of ATI cards should barely be considered unless you care nothing about volume levels.

Sounds like we have a new Dustbuster King.
 
Originally posted by: Madellga
Originally posted by: Pete
Madellga, try converting those .tga files to .png files.

Thanks for posting, ErrorSx.
Click to expand...

Any particular reason? Is jpg worse than png?

I made the shots but still had no time to edit them. I want to place some arrows and markers to show where to look for IQ issues.
Click to expand...

PNG might retain more subtle details, I'm guessing.

But regardless, once you convert it to something that shows less detail, you lose that information in compression ect.

Have to take new shots as theres no point in converting to a better format with those images.

It cant "re-add" lost data to the image by merely converting.
Its like converting a 128kb/sec MP3 to a 256kb MP3.
 
Originally posted by: southpawuni
Originally posted by: Madellga
The DFI chipset is loud, but the XL was louder under load.
Click to expand...

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

I'd hate to be the guy who buys a XT then as I'm sure its louder.

Sounds like this round of ATI cards should barely be considered unless you care nothing about volume levels.

Sounds like we have a new Dustbuster King.
Click to expand...

If that's the case then nobody should consider SLI either, since both 2x7800GT and 2x7800GTX soloutions are louder than a X1800XT. Text
 
Originally posted by: M0RPH
Originally posted by: southpawuni
Originally posted by: Madellga
The DFI chipset is loud, but the XL was louder under load.
Click to expand...

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

I'd hate to be the guy who buys a XT then as I'm sure its louder.

Sounds like this round of ATI cards should barely be considered unless you care nothing about volume levels.

Sounds like we have a new Dustbuster King.
Click to expand...

If that's the case then nobody should consider SLI either, since both 2x7800GT and 2x7800GTX soloutions are louder than a X1800XT. Text
Click to expand...

Yea besides the fact that SLI completely obliterates a slow X1800XT (at 1 decibal louder).
I think if you are going to have noise you might as well have it not be slow too?
 
i think that would make crossfire even more loud imo,but honestly both companies make great cards i like em both and own cards from both companies and they both have thier problems and superiority's dont you guys think? i just like nvidia more as a company,..but that doesnt mean ATI's card suck for being loud or not doing this or that because when it comes down to it,....in the end if ATI wasnt around,...we would all be paying a thousand bux a pop for a single top of the line card,....so i say appreciate what both companies do and just buy from the company you like or the card you liek because your gonna get somethin great from either one imo


BTW:that was really cool of you to post this thread of your opinions and go through all that to maybe give a few people some insight
 
Originally posted by: southpawuni

Yea besides the fact that SLI completely obliterates a slow X1800XT (at 1 decibal louder).
I think if you are going to have noise you might as well have it not be slow too?
Click to expand...

If you want a single card from Nvidia that will be as fast as the X1800XT, you'll have to wait for the 512MB version. Most likely it will have two-slot cooling and most likely it will be just as loud as the XT.
 
Originally posted by: southpawuni
Originally posted by: Madellga
The DFI chipset is loud, but the XL was louder under load.
Click to expand...

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

I'd hate to be the guy who buys a XT then as I'm sure its louder.

Sounds like this round of ATI cards should barely be considered unless you care nothing about volume levels.

Sounds like we have a new Dustbuster King.
Click to expand...

Absolutely ridiculous to see some of the reasons people give to "rip" on ATI. I'll be the first to admit that I prefer nVidia, but some of these attacks on the ATI cards are simply ridiculous.

That bolded statement is absolutely ridiculous. If you are someone who cares about volume levels, you will be installing an aftermarket cooler on it in the first place. Which, the way I see it, sound volume doesn't mean a thing when it comes to purchase, else you wouldn't be getting either a 7800 GTX or a 1800 XT.

Why can't people admit when ATI has a decent card? Sure, it was late and still is (for the XT model) but the card isn't that bad.

Sure, it isn't worth purchasing right now (XL) for price alone, but that doesn't mean it will be that way all the time. It also doesn't mean that the product is sub-par. It simply means the card was late, was too expensive and that the GT seems to be a better buy all around at this time.

These are good enough reasons that should leave nVidia fans at ease and shouldn't require them to bring up piddly things that don't really matter in the grand scheme of things, or for that matter, to the majority of the users.

 
Sound like you havent heard the original dustbuster. I didnt have one, but I listened to recorded sound, and not only was it loud, but the actual sound was not just the sound of air rushing through the heatsink but even the actual fan made this annoying whine. I cant see the XT being any louder than the x850xt pe, since they use a similar cooler, and the fan looks the same. And dont tell me the x850 was as bad as the 5800u.
 
Originally posted by: AnnoyedGrunt
Madellga,

Thanks for a great thread, and for remaining polite and on topic through some of the less useful posts.

I have an X800XL, play quite a bit of WoW, and haven't noticed shimmering (but now I don't even want to look for it because if I do notice it then it will bother me for quite some time).

One thing I wanted to mention on the fan noise, was that the X800XL is also very noisy (IMO), and when I'd play WoW the fan would cycle between the two fastest spees which made if very annoying. Furthermore, when summer started I began to get GPU resets, which I thought were temperature related - even though my temp never reached more than 75. Anyhow, I ended up getting a Zalman VF700 to stop the noise problem, and I have been very happy with the X800XL since. Ironically, I bought the X800XL because at the time it was much less expensive than the 6800GT, but then I bought the cooler which greatly reduced the cost differential (although I probably would have bought that for the NV card anyway). The GPU resets still occasionally occur, but are not as frequent, so I think the new cooler has helped with that as well.

So, my point is that IF the X1800XL becomes cost competitive with the 7800GT, then getting the aftermarket cooler would at least solve the noise problem and make the card reasonable competitor.

But, I agree that it seems there is no point to changing from the 7800GTX at this time.

I hope that both video card vendors start to take a more serious look at IQ now that raw performance seems to be sufficient for all but the highest resolutions.

Thanks again for a great post and review.

-D'oh!
Click to expand...

Hi Annoyed,
I only made the move from the X800 to the 7800GTX because I bought a Dell 2405 and needed a better card to run @1920x1200 with 4AA and 8AF.

If you are happy with the X800, don't upgrade now. I also never saw shimmering with the X800 and once I installed the 7800, I saw it right away - I just didn't know what was. I had to come to the forums to learn. Unfortunately, I sold the X800 quickly and I couldn't try it again. My advice: don't look for it. But if you somehow find it, let us know.

I thought the X1800 would not have the shimmering issue, but as I described it does have. Therefore the shimmering effect cannot be a decision factor for purchasing.

Regarding fan noise, I find ATITOOL very useful for setting a Fan Control profile to reduce noise. I used with the original cooler and later also with ATI Silencer.

About your GPU resets, are you overclocking? If positive, reduce clock speed 5 or 10MHz and see if it helps.
 
Originally posted by: Madellga
Originally posted by: Pete
Madellga, try converting those .tga files to .png files.
Click to expand...
Any particular reason? Is jpg worse than png?
Click to expand...
I believe png is compressed, whereas tga is not, so you could end up with smaller files.

jpg is lossy whereas png and tga are lossless, so you do lose some detail in converting to jpg. The much smaller file size is usually worth the tradeoff, but since this is an IQ comparison, you might want to stick with lossless compression. You can try converting to both png and jpg to see if jpg is good enough, if file size is an issue with free picture sites.

You can use IRFanView to convert your pictures if you don't have ACDSee or Photoshop or the like. It's a nice picture viewer in general, too, and it's freeware.
 
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