This is a big deal to me as well. I couldn't give two shits about the loot, I just want to see the cool fights.
This is a big deal to me as well. I couldn't give two shits about the loot, I just want to see the cool fights.
Aikouka
Lifer
- Nov 27, 2001
- 30,383
- 912
- 126
Funny how no one else sees this
. They even said that at the invitational that even though the Death Knight seems powerful, they haven't said what new goodies other classes will be getting yet in terms of abilities (such as how rogues got Cloak of Shadows in TBC) and talents (such as shammies dual-wieldin')I'm pretty 'cited overall, and it seems I'm not the only person that thinks the Death Knight sounds like a Sith
. I should name my Death Knight "DarthV" or some variation. Or perhaps something like Scorpion so whenever I use my taunt, I can be all "GET OVER HERE!" I already foresee people making a mod that'll say it whenever you use it .Although I think the Death Knight will require even more management of your class. It's kind of like how hybrids have to think about all of their forms/uses at once... a death knight will have to keep track of runes and runic power and manage both. I think you'll definitely see an insurgence of Death Knights after a couple weeks in Wrath of the Lich King (mostly because some will already make them and others will level to 80 then make them). But just like Space Cow Shammies and Girly Man Pallies, they'll balance out eventually.
I think the 10 man and 25 man raid thing is a great idea and those elitists and shove it (and they will bitch like usual). The gear isn't as good (this was already admitted by Chilton and Kaplan) and it's not necessarily easier... just less people. Raiders just have such a horrible false sense of accomplishment and they feel anyone "not worthy" of encroaching on their accomplishment is a blasphemous thing. It's actually quite sickening.
Reminds me of my old pre-BC raiding days... guilds that weren't high in progression were mocked like some sense of horrible elitism. Which all I can say to that is...
http://www.aikouka.com/1150920232901.jpg
Both sites said NO attunement and NO keys for the 10-man versions. That's all I needed to hear
I don't give a damn about the 25-man versions (I like 10-man raiding, 25-man raiding isn't nearly as much fun)If you just look at a Druid's list of abilities without context, they'd look overpowered too. They have tons of heals AND tons of DOT and ranged spells and a root?! OMG OVERPOWERED
Obviously that's not the case due to cooldowns, mana costs, etc.
The DK abilities will be reliant on rune recharge rates, so who knows how long that will be.
Originally posted by: Aikouka
Funny how no one else sees this
I'm pretty 'cited overall, and it seems I'm not the only person that thinks the Death Knight sounds like a Sith
Although I think the Death Knight will require even more management of your class. It's kind of like how hybrids have to think about all of their forms/uses at once... a death knight will have to keep track of runes and runic power and manage both. I think you'll definitely see an insurgence of Death Knights after a couple weeks in Wrath of the Lich King (mostly because some will already make them and others will level to 80 then make them). But just like Space Cow Shammies and Girly Man Pallies, they'll balance out eventually.
I think the 10 man and 25 man raid thing is a great idea and those elitists and shove it (and they will bitch like usual). The gear isn't as good (this was already admitted by Chilton and Kaplan) and it's not necessarily easier... just less people. Raiders just have such a horrible false sense of accomplishment and they feel anyone "not worthy" of encroaching on their accomplishment is a blasphemous thing. It's actually quite sickening.
Reminds me of my old pre-BC raiding days... guilds that weren't high in progression were mocked like some sense of horrible elitism. Which all I can say to that is...
http://www.aikouka.com/1150920232901.jpg
Guilds that aren't high in progression are still mocked. The whole end-game raiding scene is full of elitist assholes.
"What you can't get past TK? LOLOLOLOL your guildz are n00bz!"
Usually beating a raid is dependent entirely on whether the guild has been getting good loot drops.
Aikouka
Lifer
- Nov 27, 2001
- 30,383
- 912
- 126
Oh I know they are hehe. I just don't really raid anymore as I got out of that, so I talked about the old days.
A bit of an amusing tidbit from the other day. I tried to do a normal group run of Blackfathom Deeps and I was talking in party chat before we started. The warrior tank asked if he could tank DW'ing rather than using a shield. So I commented on how most bosses in BFD other than Kelris are fairly physical-based and not having mitigation would be worse off on the healer (although BFD isn't really srs business!) The healer, who supposedly had a couple 70's, asked me, "what's mitigation?"
Yeah, that run went super well :roll:. (The healer actually wasn't bad, but the rest of the party was pretty poor)Originally posted by: Aikouka
Oh I know they are hehe. I just don't really raid anymore as I got out of that, so I talked about the old days.
A bit of an amusing tidbit from the other day. I tried to do a normal group run of Blackfathom Deeps and I was talking in party chat before we started. The warrior tank asked if he could tank DW'ing rather than using a shield. So I commented on how most bosses in BFD other than Kelris are fairly physical-based and not having mitigation would be worse off on the healer (although BFD isn't really srs business!) The healer, who supposedly had a couple 70's, asked me, "what's mitigation?"
well, mitigation is a word not many high schoolers would know
How so? This honestly seems like a free HK class compared to a lot of others. We are already dealing with shield wall and spell reflect not to mention nub coil. Unless somone in character development at Blizz decides to have one as his main this class doesn't sound very strong in PVP.
Uhm, they are overpowered. I always play a mage class in every game- I enjoy being the glass cannon, it's just my thing. After watching druids for so long I rolled one myself- it is obnoxious how overpowered they are compared to mages. I can tank a 25 man boss and top the healing charts on the next fight without respeccing and swap over to dps and only trail a few classes- all without needing to so much as move talent points. In PVP it's worse, druids obliterate pretty much every other class. I'm the highest dps mage in my guild(no, can't beat the destro locks but meh
), it isn't like I can't handle him well, just playing a druid I get to look 1337 while watching a movie half falling asleep.As for the 25/10 man issue- seems to me to benefit the smaller guilds more then anything. 25 man still gets unique loot and tuned encounters, it will still be where all the really nasty stuff drops, just now instead of those who aren't in a hardcore 25 man raiding guild will be able to gear up in a raid instead of with badges and they will get to see fights that the hardcore raiding guilds do.
Anubis
No Lifer
Sweet awesome. They are doing what EQ1 and EQ2 have been doing for years! Woot! Awesome sauce.
/yawn
/yawn
i have 0% interest in the death knight. Sigh maybe one day blizz will release a barbarian class that can wield two 2hander swords/axe/mace while wearing leather. Or even an assassin class that wears only cloth but can wield a 2hander.
DangerAardvark
Diamond Member
- Oct 22, 2004
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Fingolfin269
Lifer
- Feb 28, 2003
- 17,948
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What I fail to understand about the mentality of a lot of bleeding edge raiders is why it matters what other people are doing? So what if they lifted attunements on MH/BT. The content will win out in the end, right? Let them bang their heads against the wall over and over and over before realizing that yes, maybe they should take down Gruul first.
IMHO, attunements are nothing but time sinks. I think most people see this. Rarely does an attunement actually mean anything since, as stated above, you'll either be able to do the content or you won't. The vast majority of the groups who attempt to bypass complete instances (TK/SSC) and hop straight in the MH/BT won't even make it past the trash.
Also, I don't see how it matters if people are seeing the 25-man content as a 10-man. What that guy over there is doing has absolutely no bearing on what I'm doing.
Aikouka
Lifer
- Nov 27, 2001
- 30,383
- 912
- 126
Well according to an interview with Chilton and Kaplan, the 10-man may not be immediately available until either a) someone beats the 25-man or b) a certain amount of time passes (so it's similar to the AQ gates).
Just hope you're on a server with some decent progressive guilds.
Just hope you're on a server with some decent progressive guilds
.Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
Uhm, they are overpowered. I always play a mage class in every game- I enjoy being the glass cannon, it's just my thing. After watching druids for so long I rolled one myself- it is obnoxious how overpowered they are compared to mages. I can tank a 25 man boss and top the healing charts on the next fight without respeccing and swap over to dps and only trail a few classes- all without needing to so much as move talent points. In PVP it's worse, druids obliterate pretty much every other class. I'm the highest dps mage in my guild(no, can't beat the destro locks but meh
As for the 25/10 man issue- seems to me to benefit the smaller guilds more then anything. 25 man still gets unique loot and tuned encounters, it will still be where all the really nasty stuff drops, just now instead of those who aren't in a hardcore 25 man raiding guild will be able to gear up in a raid instead of with badges and they will get to see fights that the hardcore raiding guilds do.
Well you can thank people like me then who played the druid class all the way to 60 when they were shit. I used to literally get tells from people saying "Why are you playing a druid?" A lot of people had preconceived notions about me just based on my class, some people didn't want to go on 6-man runs with me as the main healer because "I don't care how good you think you are, it is too risky". Blah blah blah.
So enjoy reaping the rewards, but be sure to remember the druids who paved the path when the class was all but written off as a bad joke.
Now if I can get some friends to play WoW for the first time, I might be able to roll up a Death Knight!
I still get that from people that don't know me, unless I'm rolling with a pally tank or a shad priests a lot of people don't want to run with a healer that can't rez. When I'm rolling bear I have no problem at all getting groups.
My main is a mage, try taking a class to 70 that was supposed to be the highest dps toon without question only to have Blizz decide they were going to nerf the hell out your class and give shockingly bad itemization to all of your tier gear so that locks could be as easy as huntards to play and dominate the damage meter. Then, they decide that rogues should also be able to smoke you on the dmg meter, and then further decide that the single most important stat to a mage in pvp, crit, was going to removed effectively relegating your class to the top tier cc in the game. You knew what you signed up with when you rolled a druid, I signed up for something very different and sunk a ton of effort into a class Blizz decided they were going to destroy after the fact.
I didn't like it, so I rolled a druid. It isn't like leveling to 70 is anything resembling difficult if you don't like your current toon.
Maybe not these days. But in the original roll out if you decided to roll a new toon you got left behind by a raid guild. I was the 2nd druid to 60, beaten out only because I was doing UBRS at 58 which slowed my exp gain.
I never regretted being a druid, but I scoff at them being overpowered. I remember when the biggest benefit of being a druid was "why the hell does all this shitty druid armor drop?!" Heh
Anubis
No Lifer
where did it ever say that?
Rogues and fury warriors on non threat capped fights at 60 were hands down the best pure DPS class that there was, nothing and i mean nothing could even come close to a T3 geared rogue & fury war. on fights with agro issues it was always rogues who were on top
and Locks and mages are about equal on a 1:1 basis in terms of DPS, shadow damage just happens to synergize with Shadow priests which puts us on top, we also sac all utility (pet) to acheive that
Actually Blizz themselves stated that prior to TBC launching(highest single target dps, we hope not by too much was their comment).
Rolling ignites could be beaten by rogues or fury warriors? I would love to see a video of that. Scroll down a bit to see the screen segment with Thaddius numbers. That mage is pushing about 7K dps, not 700, 7000. Now, maybe it's just me, but I can't recall any other class coming remotely close to that pre tbc.
Compare T6- Ours is crap with itemization blown for spirit- you get all dmg, int, stam and crit. With your superior itemization we must keep molten armor up to remain close to comparable for dmg output even without a shad priest assuring us of having 0 mp5 in either of the viable raid dps builds while casting.
On a side note, what utility do your pets really provide?
If we took a naked destro lock and a naked fire mage and ran a dps contest without support then they probably would be neck and neck. Then Blizz went out of their way to make it so the normal warlock scrub could beat an expertly played fire mage(making expertly played locks touchable only by rogues).
Anubis
No Lifer
thaddius is a gimic fight
patchwork was a better test for pure DPS, and yes withh full T3 and KT weps rogues/fury wars owned it, we at least in my guild were never beaten, normall went dagger rogue with KF/HOD - fury warr with the KT swords another rogue and then the casters /other mele
people forget this but seduce is an awsome CC when used properly, the rest are pretty useless, however feltard can tank in 5 mans
you have spirit based regen correct, we have none, 1:1 we are equal
its all about group synergy, we can get out BM huntards doing 2500+ DPS when we stack their group, mages can reach 2400ish with a perfect stacked group
i never get a stacked group as a lock, i get a SP and maybe a shaman for totems if we have an extra and am stuck doing 2100 DPS
patchwork was a better test for pure DPS, and yes withh full T3 and KT weps rogues/fury wars owned it, we at least in my guild were never beaten, normall went dagger rogue with KF/HOD - fury warr with the KT swords another rogue and then the casters /other mele
people forget this but seduce is an awsome CC when used properly, the rest are pretty useless, however feltard can tank in 5 mans
you have spirit based regen correct, we have none, 1:1 we are equal
its all about group synergy, we can get out BM huntards doing 2500+ DPS when we stack their group, mages can reach 2400ish with a perfect stacked group
i never get a stacked group as a lock, i get a SP and maybe a shaman for totems if we have an extra and am stuck doing 2100 DPS
I knew you would say that
Patchwerk another mage pushing a bit over 3K dps- already included in the above link.
I would love to see a rogue hit those numbers pre tbc, do you have any links to screenshots, any movies, wwx reports, anything?
Anubis
No Lifer
Originally posted by: BenSkywalker
I knew you would say that
Patchwerk another mage pushing a bit over 3K dps- already included in the above link.
I would love to see a rogue hit those numbers pre tbc, do you have any links to screenshots, any movies, wwx reports, anything?
not anymore, i deleted all of my old wow stuff when i quit for a while :/ we also never had mages pushing 3K on him
also didnt they fix that rolling ingnite thing not long after it was discovered
also after the 2.0 patch before the dot nerf Shadow priests and Locks just did stupid things on thaddius
Shouldn't take it that way, they destroyed the mage class, so I rolled a druid. WoTLK I would hope Blizz promotes the fact that they are phasing mages out, most people have already dropped the class. I am of the mindset that Blizz should either change the name of class to Shepherd and let us cast poly on friendly targets(to heal) or simply remove them from the game altogether. If not for arc int and free food/water and a sheep every now and then there would be no reason to bring a mage to a raid right now. Like I said, I rolled a druid because of this, my raid slot is VERY secure(guild MT refuses to raid if I'm not there
). Blizz may end up destroying the druid class too, have a lock and pally to play with if that is the case. I just really don't like the lock class in general, it's like a mage on ez mode now- more dps then a mage, lifetap, a pet and a soulstone.....If your guild was like most, mages were stuck in the frost mindset after Blizz forced mages into it for so much end game content. The rolling ignite wasn't 'fixed' for a while because it was supposed to work like that, the problem came because mages figured out if they stacked enough crit and spammed scorch the amount of dmg they could do significantly outdistanced what could be done by any of the rotations we used before or since then(not to mention your gear selection wasn't entirely built around getting the tier 2.5/3 gear). Fire mages built for rolling ignites were always threat limited- TF packing MTs would allow them to do absurd things to the dmg meters.
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