Woot! 5800 Ultra lands in box, games cower....

[Ackmed]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: Ackmed
Some games "cower" with a GF2, so what? The 5800 Ultra isnt near as good as other cards in its price/performance catagory.

Try enabling AA/AF and see the 5800 Ultra cower to games. But Rollo thinks ATi's AA isnt better. Even nVidiots realize that it is..

You mean like in the links I posted where it's running 4X AA 8X AF as fast as a 9700Pro, the card it was meant to compete against Ackmed?

LOL some people can't seem to breathe if someone is apparently questioning whether or not their stuff was the best, even when the guy doing the questioning has already admitted their stuff has a slight edge.

I didnt say anything about being as fast (and its not in most games). I was talking about quality.

Originally posted by: Rollo
Don't buy that hype "ATI AA is superior" BS

Thats what you said. Only a fool would argue ATi's AA is not superior.

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.html?i=1779&p=14

The 9700 Pro is faster, and looks better.

Im not going to argue about your card, if you're happy thats all that matters. But your topic is a little... dumb. As I said before, most any newer card can make the games you tried "cower".

Im done with this thread, happy gaming.

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: i82lazyboy
Awsome, thnx.

As much as I'd like to get my gritty fingers on one, I'm saving my money for a NV40. For now I'll just settle for having a look @ some pics of "the beast" instead of going out and getting 1.

You seemed to take an interest in the 5800, so I sent you one of the mod I just did, putting a fan on the back heatsink as well.

 

[Pete]

(Dang, Rollo, you two didn't agree to mail it insured? Surely that would've made sense for a $200 purchase. Sorry to hear about what happened, but I'd be calling eBay and/or the police right now if I were in your shoes. A freaking envelope? Just in the retail box?)

 

[nRollo]

He didn't put it in the retail box Pete. He put it in one of those thick mail envelopes in the bubble wrap bag it came in. (not even thick bubble wrap) The package didn't look damaged, and the guy stopped responding to my emails.

I'm chalking it up to "lesson learned".

I did tell Ebay and PayPal of his antics, but as I stomped the card in frustration, I don't think I have any recourse. 😉

 

[modedepe]

WTH? Who mails a $200 video card in a envelope with a little bubble wrap? Sounds like the card might have already been dead and he just sent it out this way cause it didn't matter.

Enjoy the new card Rollo. What brand is this one? I wouldn't mind getting one to play with either, but at this point I can't really bring myself to spend the cash.

edit: lmao, you stomped the card? Hey I wouldn't mind getting a pic of that 😀

 

[Pete]

Yeah, I'm thinking he sent you a dead card--what a tool.

 

[MDE]

Cripes, you idiots participating in the flame war need to get lives for yourselves.

Rollo, you can use http://pics.bbzzdd.com to host your pics so we can all see them.

 

[nRollo]

Enjoy the new card Rollo. What brand is this one?

Thanks! It's a PNY.

edit: lmao, you stomped the card? Hey I wouldn't mind getting a pic of that

Well I had spent many hours trying to get it to work, even bought a new Antec PSU for my son's nForce board hoping against hope it might work on a nVidia motherboard even if not on my MSI K8T Neo. The guy had told me he wouldn't refund my money due to needing it for spring break, then ignored my requests for a a return address when I told him I could ship it back as proof of DOA. (after trying to get me to send it to Abit, and "guaranteeing the RMA will work")
When my wife started a (rare) argument with me over ordering another 5800 from a stranger before my deal with the first was for sure resolved, I stepped on it and said, "There. It's resolved."

Here's the stomped one

Front of card

Back after I put the cpu fan on it

 

[MichaelZ]

hehe, thnx for mailn' me those pics rollo. that stomped pic left me lost for words... 😕

 

[modedepe]

Thanks for posting those pictures Rollo.

that stomped pic left me lost for words

Hehe, me too. Poor card 🙁

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: modedepe
Thanks for posting those pictures Rollo.

that stomped pic left me lost for words

Hehe, me too. Poor card 🙁

Better stomped than fraudulently RMAd or argued about, says I.
Lovin' the 5800U so far, shipping DaPunisher one mint, never OCd 9800 Pro Monday. This project was worth it for the Zalman slot fan mod, and cpu fan on back of card mod alone. Am contemplating another case fan for good measure.

 

[BFG10K]

Wouldn't they all be the same, or the 9600Pro faster with a faster cpu if that were the case?

No. CPU limitation is directly related to how fast the card is. If the card is too slow then you won't have the same CPU limitation that you do on a faster card, even with the same CPU.

In the link I already posted, look how your theories seem untrue

Calculate the percentage change at each resolution between the fastest card and the slowest card. It's pretty easy to spot a trend.

Also you still don't seem to get what I'm saying:

I'm not telling you to run at 1600 x 1200 or any other resolution when gaming.
I'm not telling you what framerate is playable and what isn't.
I'm not telling you that you can't buy as many cards as you like.
I'm not saying a 5800 cannot play games.

All I am saying is that if you want to make a proper comparison of GPU strength between certain cards then you should use settings that are at least reasonably GPU limited.

That's it.

 

[Nebor]

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Why indeed. Why not 640 x 480? Or better yet 320 x 240?

are you just naturally pleasant, or does it take effort to be that way?

When you see a post about video cards or LCD monitors, just ignore everything BFG10K says in that thread. He's a decent guy in other threads, just something about those two things that make him unbearable.

Rollo rocks, he's one of my favorite posters here. Good job on the 5800 U Rollo!

 

[jim1976]

Originally posted by: BFG10K

Wouldn't they all be the same, or the 9600Pro faster with a faster cpu if that were the case?

No. CPU limitation is directly related to how fast the card is. If the card is too slow then you won't have the same CPU limitation that you do on a faster card, even with the same CPU.

In the link I already posted, look how your theories seem untrue

Calculate the percentage change at each resolution between the fastest card and the slowest card. It's pretty easy to spot a trend.

Also you still don't seem to get what I'm saying:

I'm not telling you to run at 1600 x 1200 or any other resolution when gaming.
I'm not telling you what framerate is playable and what isn't.
I'm not telling you that you can't buy as many cards as you like.
I'm not saying a 5800 cannot play games.

All I am saying is that if you want to make a proper comparison of GPU strength between certain cards then you should use settings that are at least reasonably GPU limited.

That's it.

Don't bother my friend... All you are achieving is to be a fanatic in their eyes... LOL ( if u care :beer: )

 

[nRollo]

Jim:

Don't bother my friend... All you are achieving is to be a fanatic in their eyes... LOL ( if u care

Actually that the first "non fanatic" post he's put in this thread.

Nebor:

Rollo rocks, he's one of my favorite posters here. Good job on the 5800 U Rollo!

🙂:beer: Thank you, glad you've been amused.

BFG:

All I am saying is that if you want to make a proper comparison of GPU strength between certain cards then you should use settings that are at least reasonably GPU limited.

Then can we agree the 5800 is approximately as useful as a 9700Pro, if you're willing to accept 4X8X as your setting? I've never said anything else, just that it's not worthy of the bad press it gets. Obviously the 9800 Pro was a better all around solution, but for me the 5800 Ultra will work fine until my next card.

Noteworthy:
The FlowFX is loud, no doubt about it. However, you get used to it fast, and hardly notice it while gaming. (especially if you work in an office with "white noise", that's what it reminds me of. (a hum in the background)

Just played UT2004 for over an hour. The 5800 performed like more of a champ than I did.

 

[CaiNaM]

Originally posted by: Nebor

Originally posted by: CaiNaM

Why indeed. Why not 640 x 480? Or better yet 320 x 240?

are you just naturally pleasant, or does it take effort to be that way?

When you see a post about video cards or LCD monitors, just ignore everything BFG10K says in that thread. He's a decent guy in other threads, just something about those two things that make him unbearable.

Rollo rocks, he's one of my favorite posters here. Good job on the 5800 U Rollo!

i liked the coment by acanthus, about a tool "tossing the ati salad".. heh.. original. laughed my ass off at that one 😀

 

[Pete]

Rollo, what do you think of the 5800's AF and AA quality? Was the texture filtering noticably better and the AA noticably worse than your 9800's?

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: Pete
Rollo, what do you think of the 5800's AF and AA quality? Was the texture filtering noticably better and the AA noticably worse than your 9800's?

That's a hard question for me to answer Pete. I've played 99% UT2003/2004 for a long time now. I didn't notice the image being any worse, but on the other hand, I didn't take any screenshots with the 9800Pro to scrutinize, and I never had to identical rigs to run them side by side.

What I have noticed, to me anyway, the movement in the game with nVidia cards has always seemed "smoother". I can't really quantify that, the feel of the game is just different. While the 9700P/9800P had stellar performance, it always felt like there was more fluctuation of fps happening than on nVidia cards. (maybe the highs/lows are further apart on ATI?)

To me, the nVidia colors seem a bit more vibrant.

I don't doubt that ATIs AA is better, I've seen the screenshots in reviews. I'm only running Quincunx AA and for me that is fine, in that game I'm constantly running, usually jumping as I do it.

Bottom line is I think online fps players are an easy sell for IQ. 😉 (how smooth the animation works is my top priority; have to be able to dodge incoming rockets and track opponents)

Sorry I don't have any useful info for you, if someone reading this is the kind of guy that plays a lot of slow "walk around" games and SIMs, you're probably better off with ATI.
If you're like me and just play online shooters, I doubt you'd notice any difference in ATI and nVidia, unless you're trying to run PS2.

 

[Regs]

nm

 

[CaiNaM]

i run a 5900 and 9800 side by side.. unfortunately the cpu's are different, so i can't directly compare performance, other than to say the the games i'm running now there's not noticeable difference in performance or IQ. i would imagine since the mem bus is different (but it's clocked higher) in some instances performance would not be directly comparable to the 5800u, tho they should be close in most cases, and IQ should be comparable.

there are some instances in NFS:U where, if you REALLY scrutinize, there's some lighting anamolies here and there with the nv card. i've also seen still shots when comparing side by side you can see where the ati aa works better, but when you're actually PLAYING, these are not noticeable, at least for me.

ut2k4, i can't say the nv feels "smoother", but they look and perform comparably sitting side by side, even tho the nv runs on a slower cpu. i did a direct comparison on the same pc w/ benchmarks a few weeks ago, and they showed miminal difference.

farcry the nv is on the avg about 15% slower, but hard to be more accurate with no benchmark util available for that game. this was also prior to the 1.1 patch, as i haven't bothered to comapre the 2 cars in the same machine in some time. IQ is again, comparable, tho in the areas where ps2 is used, the ati excels. i'll do some more comparisons on the retail version (where nv runs ps2 rather than ps1.1 or 1.3) and 1.1 patch later.. just haven't had time.

in a slower game like DAoC (an mmorpg), aa/af settings are quite comparable (there's some posts i made earlier comparing the two. the aa problem on the ati i believe is fixed since then when it wouldnt apply at 1280 res). the biggest difference is the nv bogs down a bit more when there's a huge battle of say, 25+ ppl, but using fraps, the 9800p shows 7fps and the nv shows 5fps lol (normally at the settings i run they both run about 30fps. i could run lower, but image qual is usually more important to me in this game).... perhaps an EQ player could do a better comparison, as i think it's the game causing this more than the cards - 3.2ghz p4c 9800pro 1ghz mem sata drives should not get 7fps imo heh.

colors are more vibrant across all games (no, DV is not used on the 5900 - i don't particularly like it myself), but you'll get many from ati camp saying the ati looks more "natural" (tho i wonder how something can look more "natural" in a game like ut heh) or that nv colors make it look more "cartoonish".. but i suppose color diff is quite subjective and hard to quantify.

as far as performance, keep in mind the 5900 runs at 450core 850 memory.. so what i describe doesn't reflect online benches comaring the 2 at default clock speeds 🙂 the radeon is clocked at 400/720 - any higher and eventually i get atrifacting/clipping problems after extended gaming. have an arctic cooler coming to see if that helps.

i'm thinking of putting the 5900 in my wifes pc (3200+) in place of her 9700pro, as it's probably more comparable in system speed to my 3.2p4c than the 2.0b it's currently running in... tho her system has a less capable crt, so image comparisons with mine would be a bit more difficult.

 

[Elcs]

In an ideal world where there were no errors and every piece of silicon forged into the same shape/size/use was identically the same, where each program repeated the sequence with 100% precision and there were no other factors to consider then we could draw up a reasonable result.

The best we can do is 'try' to minimize errors, by giving each card a 'fair' chance but in the end, its all about opinion. I personally cant see much difference between my Leadtek GF4 Ti4400's picture quality, my Radeon 9800P's quality or my Hercules Kyro II whilst playing. Ive played a few games on all platforms, such as Freespace2, and whilst playing (no screenies) I could not see any difference in picture quality.

Both sides of the equation produce outstanding graphics cards and Im currently on the side of ATI. The 9800Pro gave me the performance I wanted at an affordable price.... the comparable Nvidia solution at the time didnt. However previously I had a Geforce4 Ti4400... which gave me the performance I wanted within my budget. Out of the experience, I noticed that Nvidia's age showed.... maturity in drivers with more features and the superior multi-monitor support. Im sure if I had bought a Parhelia in between that Id be saying that Matrox's multi-monitor support was far superior to Nvidias but considering that Matrox is rather a specialist in that department, Id also have to say that Nvidia did a good job.

I should come up with a philosophical ending for such a post but I cant find something to say that will give me a fireproof cover.

 

[CaiNaM]

heh.. no, don't need a flameproof cover.. good post imo elcs 🙂

 

[rbV5]

Wow, you stomped your card!

Edit: Woah, dude you STOMPED your card!

 

[nRollo]

Originally posted by: rbV5
Wow, you stomped your card!

Edit: Woah, dude you STOMPED your card!

After spending 4-5 hours trying to get it to work, having the seller tell me he'd only try to defraud the maker, and then my wife hassle me about it.....
I can honestly say I would have shot that card if we were outdoors and I had one of my shotguns on me. 😉

 

[rbV5]

Originally posted by: Rollo

Originally posted by: rbV5
Wow, you stomped your card!

Edit: Woah, dude you STOMPED your card!

After spending 4-5 hours trying to get it to work, having the seller tell me he'd only try to defraud the maker, and then my wife hassle me about it.....
I can honestly say I would have shot that card if we were outdoors and I had one of my shotguns on me. 😉

LOL, probably not too late to shoot it though🙂