Win10 Creator's Update: The "welcome to Windows" setup spiel

[DigDog]

BUY WINDOWS 10 NAU !

i'm sorry but, what the hell? Do you get paid when people buy this OS?

1. FACT: most of the FUNDAMENTAL latency and mouseaccel fixes i use daily DO NOT EXIST for W10. Unlocker does not exist. I need these without this even being a discussion. No features, no buy.

2. FACT: W10 has a HUGE amount of telemetry that serves NO purpose to me, that cannot be removed. It FORCES updates to the extent of forcibly restarting my PC without giving me a choice, regardless of the amount of work i might lose.

i mean, i really could .. what am i saying, i SHOULD stop here. If these two things are acceptable to you, we cannot talk anymore.

Nobody should implicitly accept that a a piece of machinery should force ME to do anything. If i want to kill myself using my PC, Microsoft should help me do so, not stop me. if i want my computer to be a honeypot for the worst viruses ever made they should not in any way override MY decision which is final in everything where I AM THE OWNER OF THAT THING.

3. OMG W10 HAS SUCH GREAT IMPROVEMENTS
No; W10 has some tiny, extremely minor improvements, most of which do not apply to the work i do. It has DIFFERENCES, but practically no tangible difference. And we would expect you to know this, since, you know, this *is* Anandtech.

4. BUT I GOT PAINT !
And i have GIMP. And i have tons of 3rd party software created by companies which specialize in said softwares. Not a generic, often NOT REMOVABLE component whose sole purpose of existence is to be disabled immediately after install.

3. BUT I GOT ZE IMPROVEMENT
If this was the case, i would be demanding an update. There's a shitton of benchmarks everywhere that clearly say that W7 and W10 perform nearly identical. You simply cannot ignore these, like you cannot ignore situations where W10 performs WORSE.

1. I ALREADY TOLD YOU i need SPECIFIC W7 PROGRAMS
why are you even arguing. This is a behaviour i have seen ONLY SALESMEN use, "it doesn't do what i need" "BUT LOOK AT THE COLOR!". I do not consider your opinion more important than someone who makes a living out of eSports when they tell me "your mouse will not work correctly under W10" because my FIRST and MOST IMPORTANT DEMAND is that i get as close to raw input as possible, and W10 does not do this.

5. W10 IS MORE STABLE
My W7 has crashed 3 times since my first install. I run it 24/7, i so rarely turn it off that my default button is Restart instead of Shut Down. More stable than perfectly stable isn't actually possible.

6. I have invested work in W10
I have zero interest in the fact that W10 is good out of the box, assuming we ignore the horrid quasi-8 UI. As anyone who has owned PCs for a lifetime will know, i have invested many hours in tweaking the system as i require it. there is NO OS out there that can immediately suit my use, and all of them need tweaking. If W7 did not exist, i would consider W10 over XP, but if my choices were 8 and Vista, i would probably still be on my SP1-with-hacks.

7. This is Microsoft we are talking about.
i could write a book here, and i don't know the half of it.

anyone who actually knows stuff about computers should follow along these lines; if not, there's something wrong, and they belong in the "Apple, It Just Works!" crowd.
And they would know that 90% of the "improvements" that W10 has are marketing fluff, a 0.3% increase in handling memory tasks above 32Gb is absolutely irrelevant, to the point that the change in UI alone would be enough to not change between OS. And this genuinely requires people to flat out ignore that half of the IT articles written between 2015 and 2016 were about How To Stop W10 From Spying On You.

i'm sorry but we are done here.

 

[DigDog]

actually, silly me, i wasn't done. sorry for doublepost.

8. There is no demand.

i have absolutely ZERO demand for moving to W10. Let's ignore for a minute everything bad, and pretend W10 is really just as good as W7.

There is NOTHING W7 does not do. There is NOTHING W7 does not do as well as i want it to.

Sure, there's a couple of typical M$ bugs but don't tell me W10 doens't have them, because i would simply brand you a liar. And W7 has had more time to work out a 3rd party solution to them.

That is why there is no demand .. when i was on XP, i was hoping really really hard that M$ would come out with a complete rework of XP, where PNP actually worked, where the system didn't freak out if you deleted a mp3 while WinAMP still had it in library, and when 7 finally came out, i couldn't believe it. A system where everything worked.

I'm tired of people saying "uh troglodytes, luddites who refuse new technology", when the technology isn't new, it's just different. NEW means yours does something mine doesn't, or it does so measurably better. When in reality yours sometimes is actually worse. Like when M.E. was "the new tech" and it was vastly inferior to its predecessor, like straight razors STILL work better than modern multiblade.

But hey, this is the first time we see a company with a successful product trying to artificially generate demand, right?

 

[Paladin3]

Understand where you're going with that, but you are preaching to the wrong crowd on this site. Most here are not computer illiterate.

Then there should be zero rage in this thread because every version of Windows is fairly easy configure to do what you need it to with a little bit of knowledge. I don't even understand the rage over restarting to install updates and simple stuff like that.

 

[Paladin3]

...2. FACT: W10 has a HUGE amount of telemetry that serves NO purpose to me, that cannot be removed. It FORCES updates to the extent of forcibly restarting my PC without giving me a choice, regardless of the amount of work i might lose...

I support you using whatever OS works best for you. I've never upgraded OS on a system if it still did what I needed. That said, I don't understand the issue over forced updates. I've never had my Windows 10 system get anywhere near the point of interrupting and forcing me to do the updates. It quietly downloads the updates in the background then applies them the next time I restart. It doesn't come close to interrupting my work or gaming. I think you would have to delay the restart for days and days to actually have it interrupt your workflow. That's a user problem, IMHO.

 

[DigDog]

.. I don't understand the issue over forced updates.

because i might need to set up my system in a way which is not compatible with the updates.
I do not even take into consideration the forced restarts, but Microsoft ignores the fact that a power user might NOT want those updates, not out of stubbornness, ignorance, or caprice, but because they are detrimental to the user.

again, ignoring the pile of crap they try to pass as updates, but that's another story.

 

[Paladin3]

because i might need to set up my system in a way which is not compatible with the updates.
I do not even take into consideration the forced restarts, but Microsoft ignores the fact that a power user might NOT want those updates, not out of stubbornness, ignorance, or caprice, but because they are detrimental to the user.

again, ignoring the pile of crap they try to pass as updates, but that's another story.

When I say "forced updates" I mean the forced reboot to install said updates. Updates in Windows 10 can be turned off if you are doing something special they interfere with. But for 99% of users they are better left turned on and if you don't delay them over and over again you will never have your work interrupted by a forced restart to install them. Thus the reason I don't understand the issue and hate over updates.

And Windows updates being piles of crap is your opinion. I personally like when they plug security holes, and if they add new features I don't use I can turn them off.

 

[DigDog]

i .. don't think you do, understand.

explain to me this: there is a critical update. this update, according to microsoft, MUST be installed. this update will break a major feature on my PC.

what should i do?

 

[Paladin3]

i .. don't think you do, understand.

explain to me this: there is a critical update. this update, according to microsoft, MUST be installed. this update will break a major feature on my PC.

what should i do?

Turn off updates before it ever gets to that point! You can't have your cake and eat it too. You hate MS updates so I don't understand why you didn't do this long, long ago. Google is your friend.

 

[William Gaatjes]

When I say "forced updates" I mean the forced reboot to install said updates. Updates in Windows 10 can be turned off if you are doing something special they interfere with. But for 99% of users they are better left turned on and if you don't delay them over and over again you will never have your work interrupted by a forced restart to install them. Thus the reason I don't understand the issue and hate over updates.

And Windows updates being piles of crap is your opinion. I personally like when they plug security holes, and if they add new features I don't use I can turn them off.

Windows update procedure is a mess.
I had a nice surprise while gaming that my system suddenly restarted while gaming.
First i thought the game had crashed or my video driver had crashed.
When the pc started again, i was unpleasantly informed that windows 10 was installing updates.

All this time since i used windows 10, i get notifications that windows has updates or needs to restart and that i can delay it as long as i do not game.
But not when i am gaming and i just updated to 1709.
Why instead of making hideous menus and themes and telemetry services does microsoft not make a service that tracks if you are gaming to suspend any restart untill you are finished with gaming.
What is the use of a game mode if windows cannot detect if you are gaming with a full screen game.
And make an API function in DX12 and for vulcan that can implemented in future games that as soon as you go in the pause menu that a message appears in the game pause menu that your os has an important message with respect to for example critical security updates.
Of course, this should not be abused for bullshit notifications.


But no, we get 3d builder. We get ugly menus. We get deparate attempts to hide a perfectly functional control panel where everything that needs to be adjusted can be found.

 

[Paladin3]

Windows update procedure is a mess.
I had a nice surprise while gaming that my system suddenly restarted while gaming.
First i thought the game had crashed or my video driver had crashed.
When the pc started again, i was unpleasantly informed that windows 10 was installing updates.

All this time since i used windows 10, i get notifications that windows has updates or needs to restart and that i can delay it as long as i do not game.
But not when i am gaming and i just updated to 1709.
Why instead of making hideous menus and themes and telemetry services does microsoft not make a service that tracks if you are gaming to suspend any restart untill you are finished with gaming.
What is the use of a game mode if windows cannot detect if you are gaming with a full screen game.
And make an API function in DX12 and for vulcan that can implemented in future games that as soon as you go in the pause menu that a message appears in the game pause menu that your os has an important message with respect to for example critical security updates.
Of course, this should not be abused for bullshit notifications.


But no, we get 3d builder. We get ugly menus. We get deparate attempts to hide a perfectly functionasl control panel where everything that needs to be adjusted can be found.

Forced restarts would suck if you are in the middle of anything important. I game quite a lot, but I guess I've never had a marathon session right when an update needed a restart. In fact, I've can't remember the last time I got a update message asking to restart. They just apply when I restart my computer normally.

I'm sure it's completely different if you keep your system on for long period, but I don't think I've left my system on for more than a day or two at a time. If you are such a power user then it should be no problem to configure whatever OS you are using to update or function exactly how you want it.

More power to you guys if you are sticking to the OS that works for you. I'm not a champion for Windows 10, I only use it because it was the current OS when I built this particular computer and I have no issues with it after I got it configured to work as I want.

 

[DigDog]

Turn off updates before it ever gets to that point! You can't have your cake and eat it too. You hate MS updates so I don't understand why you didn't do this long, long ago. Google is your friend.

i already do this. or rather, i do "that kind of thing" but, because i've been doing it since XP was released, i know enough to know that deep inside, W7 is the better OS.
But don't you think that an OS that you MUST break in order to have it work properly, has something wrong with it?
Also i haven't really kept up with W10, but the last time i looked into it, you still could not fully tame it.

 

[Genx87]

Worried about telemetry, goes on Anandtech lol

 

[snoopy7548]

You can set your internet connection (even if it is wired) to "metered" under Windows 10 and updates won't automatically download until you tell it to. I don't think you can pick and choose updates, but you can just hold off on downloading them until you're ready. This doesn't affect anything else.

 

[Murloc]

today W10 had a forced restart to update on me, it just closed my shit and restarted.

You get a notice some time before and you can reschedule but you can't simply say "put it off until I restart the computer on my own the next time".

I think that's pretty bad and it's weird because I never had this happen before, it was always on me to shut down the computer to install updates.

 

[bbhaag]

Windows update procedure is a mess.
I had a nice surprise while gaming that my system suddenly restarted while gaming.
First i thought the game had crashed or my video driver had crashed.
When the pc started again, i was unpleasantly informed that windows 10 was installing updates.

All this time since i used windows 10, i get notifications that windows has updates or needs to restart and that i can delay it as long as i do not game.
But not when i am gaming and i just updated to 1709.
Why instead of making hideous menus and themes and telemetry services does microsoft not make a service that tracks if you are gaming to suspend any restart untill you are finished with gaming.
What is the use of a game mode if windows cannot detect if you are gaming with a full screen game.
And make an API function in DX12 and for vulcan that can implemented in future games that as soon as you go in the pause menu that a message appears in the game pause menu that your os has an important message with respect to for example critical security updates.
Of course, this should not be abused for bullshit notifications.


But no, we get 3d builder. We get ugly menus. We get deparate attempts to hide a perfectly functional control panel where everything that needs to be adjusted can be found.

Click start>settings>update and security>restart options>if you have a restart already queued up you can schedule a time to restart that is less intrusive. check the "show more notifications" option to receive more advanced notice before a restart.

To set a less intrusive time to install and restart click start>settings>update and security>change active hours.
This will allow you to set a time frame that is best suited to your schedule for downloading and installing updates.

 

[William Gaatjes]

Click start>settings>update and security>restart options>if you have a restart already queued up you can schedule a time to restart that is less intrusive. check the "show more notifications" option to receive more advanced notice before a restart.

To set a less intrusive time to install and restart click start>settings>update and security>change active hours.
This will allow you to set a time frame that is best suited to your schedule for downloading and installing updates.

Ah, thank you. Strange why this is not an option on the restart page itself.
It was turned off. I have turned it on now.
Also strange that this is not turned on by default.

 

[bbhaag]

You are welcome. Glad to be of assistance.