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Will Someone Please Shut The Gonzalez Family Up (Elian Is GONE-Get Over It)

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Vince, so because you think that he's Castro's puppet and he lives in a Communist country are you saying we should hold his child hostage??? There was never any substantial proof to prove that he wasn't a good father. However it is known fact that the Miami relatives had many strikes against them. That's public record and you can verify that.

So you're telling us you think he should stay with his Miami relatives because you think his father is a "bad guy" and Castro is a "meanie", right???
 
Can you show documentation of this threat from a reliable source?

It doesn't matter whether he contested it right away or not. He could have waited two years, and still have the right to take his son back. Thats the law and thank God its that way. Parents rights need to be protected.

I'm not defending the gov, I am defending the father's rights.😉
 
the reports i have refrenced were up atnewsmax.com

and at what point do you say that the father is under duress and his words cannot be taken seriously because there not his words which was obviously the case here.


HOSATAGE! are you kidding that kid never had it so good!
 
Hostage - The relatives would not release the child even thought there was a court order to do so. Yea, I would consider that hostage, kidnapping, whatever wording you wish you use.
 
Moonbeam - Good one. LOL.

Vince - Not to be lazy, but will you send me a direct link? I don't have time to search the whole site.

I did read one article about an illegal search warrant. I don't know the credibility of the site you posted, but I did notice that they did not list the reasons the search warrant was invalid. I would also like to say that when there is a search and seizure, the first thing the defendant usually does is question the validity of the search warrant, but the courts usually uphold the validity of the warrant.
 
I am continually mystified by the attitude of people like BigVince toward this case.

Why is Elian's mother portrayed as some kind of heroine for taking an innocent child on a horribly dangerous exploit like the one she undertook? It seems fairly clear to me this was a tremendously selfish act and one that was done not out of concern for Elian's well-being but in spite of it.

Why would anyone feel sorry for these totally self-serving convicted criminals (i.e., the family in Miami) because their nephew was returned to his father? They had no legal or moral right to hold him against his father's will and they CERTAINLY have no right to recover from the United States for retaking him.

I am VERY dubious of the reports of Elian's "beatings". The independent child-welfare authorities who visited him in Cuba found he was a loving, supportive father and that Elian would be in a supportive environment. IMO most of the "journalists" who are so negative toward him have their own naked agendas (much like the ones hiding out in the Miami Gonzales home who filmed the raid).

If people would just check their politics at the door I can see no reason a child like Elian should not have been returned to his father.
 
Vince do you know how easy it would be for a reporter to offer a few Cubans (who don't even know anyone involved in the case) a $100 bill in exchange for some information about his father for a story. Do you know how far American money goes in Cuba???
 
What about that video the relatives filmed, Vince. Wasn't that propaganda and exploitation??? How does that make the Miami relatives any better than Castro???
 
I forgot about that one Psycho. The family was brainwashing the child, and the doctor verified that. If you notice when the child was returned to the father he was happy. I wonder why?
 
Don't you remember Fetts, those "happy" pictures were faked??? Remember his hair was "too" long!!!!

It's okay Vince, you're around friends. You can admit you're wrong!! 🙂 😉
 
Actually, I wrote a argumentation paper over this subject supporting Elian staying in America. I'll see if I can find it and post it on the web if anyone is interested.
 
RED, RED, RED!


it's attitudes like yours that make our current situation as ripe as it is. history tells us that when the masses become complacent in there prosperity and good fortune they tend not to see or rather, ignore the problems at hand. such was the collapse of many civilisations (the roman empire just to name one) so just sit back and watch your 401k grow, go buy that new Prada suit and drive home in you r jaguar cause when the revolution comes none of those things will matter any more and YOU won't know what to do...


funny with a nick like RED DAWN you'd think you'd know these things...
 
You keep avoiding the questions Vince, don't you think the Miami relatives exploited Elian?? Come on get real they paraded him all over in front of the cameras. It was never about Elian, or Elian's rights to be with his father, it was about how they felt about Cuba.

Once again you have avoided the question of how fit were the Miami relatives. Their problems with the law are fact. How much of what you have on his father is documented proof, not a bunch of he said/she siad garbage. Don't you think the courts saw it this way too. If not, you are very naive and I wouldn't want you anywhere near our justice system. There's enough problems as it is, no need to go after them when they finally do something right.
 
dennilfloss, of course its for the money. You wouldn't believe the amount of money they got from wealthy Cuban supporters that live in Miami! They KNOW there is NO chance to win this case, however, it will get more money from those Cuban supporters (not supporters of Cuba, but Cubans who are supporting them, these supporters are ANTI-Cuba) so they can not only pay the lawyer for his waste of time, but also get some money on the side.

:|
 
The cause of the Roman Empire collapse was war, and weak leaders. When leaders were killed there was no one strong enough to take their place. At this point they were invaded due to their weakness that was sensed by surrounding civilizations.

I hardly think this is similar to the Elian chaos.

Vince - Can you explain to me why a father's rights should be violated just to live in a country with relatives who have broken the law repeatedly? This child has known communism all of his natural life and he doesn't understand a democracy. When he gets old enough to choose to float across the ocean own his own then I may think different. But I be damn if some gov. is going to take my child just because they don't feel I live in their form of gov. I hope you never take your kids to visit China. According to your policy you may never get them back. According to your policy China would be justified too!!

You need to realize that the US is not above the law and we can't take away parents rights that are from other countries. Why do you think this is right?

Red - I'm shocked-We AGREE!

 
My argument is this; the courts should have had the child's best interest in mind, now what was in the child's best interest? Leaving him in the most prosperous country in the world where he can receive the best education or sending him to a communist country where the schooling is sub-par the government crushes anything resembling free thought and there is very little to eat? Again, I am NOT making this stuff up I have family in Cuba it is not the tropical paradise some would make it out to be. People starve to death on a daily basis there because the government won't let them fend for themselves. Children run through the streets begging for money and food because their parents can't feed them or are in jail for speaking their minds.
I think that you guys don't get it I mean how many of you grew up hungry? how many!! I would bet that none of you know or can appreciate what it is like to be a child in Cuba...
 
The childs best interest is NOT living in Miami with non-law-abiding relatives. The child would probably grow up to be a common thug. Either that or killed. The child's best interest is always with the parent as long as those parents are fit. I have yet to see anything that would lead me to believe that the father was unfit.

If that parent chooses to live in Cuba then they have that right. You do not have the right to break the bond between a parent and a child.

I can also add one other additive to this argument: my father died when I was 8. I promise you before all 30000 members and God himself that I would rather starve on the streets of Cuba with my father than live without him in a "free" world. I guess your dad or mom has to be gone to appreciate that though. 🙁 Best interest does not equal money or opportunity!
 
<<The child would probably grow up to be a common thug.>>


thank you for showing your bias against Hispanics...


what you are doing is guessing at what elian was thinking you don't know what he wanted or who he loved and we will never know because he has been silenced by castro and the cuban goverment. I would ask you to ask any cuban american what there opinion of this is ...there is a reason people risk there lives to flee cuba...


P.S. castro is his father now...still think he's fit?
 
uh-oh.

This is getting ugly.

My grandfather left Cuba before things got bad. He came here in the early 1920's. I'm dang glad he did!

Can I just say that this situation is waaaaaaay too complicated and emotionally charged for anyone to fully comprehend it.

I sympathize with bigvince, because I understand the feelings towards Cuba. It may remind some people of what it might be like to be rescued from a concentration camp and then be sent right back! At the same time, it has been a mess, and believe me, I wish it had never happened. It's one big ugly can of worms...

What I hope is that Elian finds his way back when he is older and shines light on the subject as only he will be able to do. It is a true tragedy, no matter how you look at it.

Edit: I think there is a perspective that Hispanics have about this that others might not. Sort of like a collective Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome. And don't worry, bigvince, the hermanos y hermanas are coming into our own! We ruled the world once, and we can do it again. 😉

Okay, now let's all be friends! 😀
 
The law of the United States says that a child's parent, unless he has been found to be unfit, is entitled to make decisions about what will happen to the child and what is in the child's best interests. Period.

Can you imagine what would have happened if an American woman had taken her child to defect to Russia, China, et al, and died enroute, and that the Communist regime then refused to turn the child over to his American father because a distantly-related family abroad had asserted rights over the kid? We would be talking about a major international incident. No government has the right to be so paternalistic that it overrides the wishes of a parent for strictly political reasons.

Hell, for that matter, I guarantee you this case would have been viewed differently if it was the father, not the mother, who was foolish enough to take young Elian on the raft.

The fact that Cuba is no paradise does not change the analysis here one iota as far as I am concerned. A good dad in Cuba is better than a houseful of criminal uncles and cousins in Little Havana, and the bottom line is the choice is Dad's to make.
 
What does the fact that some of the family members have a criminal history have to do with any thing?! I have a criminal history, but I also make a very good living own my own home two cars and pay my taxes, are you gonna take my kid away too? These people should be judged on their character not their criminal record...
 
Vince


<< what you are doing is guessing at what elian was thinking you don't know what he wanted or who he loved >>


And exactly what are you doing????

The problem with your arguments is that you are letting your political view enter into the equation. This is not about politics, it's about a parent and their child. Maybe one day you'll understand, but right now you show you are no more mature to make a judgement than Elian was.
 
sheesh.

I had to edit that 4 times before I felt it the best expression of my opinion on this. If that isn't a sign that this is too hot to touch, I don't know what is!

That said, I hope this thread dies soon!!!!!!

BTW

Watching the whole mess play out on television, I don't know how things could have turned out any other way.
 
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