Will shifting in to Neutral in my AT hurt the transmission?

[l0cke]

Fixed. Some can be towed. I know many automatic jeeps can be flat towed as long as you follow the directions in the owner's manual for where to set the transmission and transfer case. I bet there are some others that are similar.

Okay, unless you have a car that can be flat towed do not shift into N and turn off the engine for a long coast.

Seeing as probably 90% of cars on the road are FWD, that's not much of a problem and still not much of a problem with other cars either.

Unless you have a button to jack up the front of your car when you shift into N and turn the engine off then it is a problem. Yeah, not a problem with towing.

 

[Bignate603]

Anyways hypermilers don't always do anything in particular and since their behavior at the very least is an attempt to the save the environment while everyone else's unsafe behavior is just their being selfish, I think your anger is seriously misplaced.

He never said he wasn't angry at the other bad drivers.

IMHO, people driving too fast for conditions, distracted drivers, or people driving in a way that doesn't mesh with traffic around them (which many hypermilers do with pulse and glide or coasting) are all the same.

 

[fleabag]

He never said he wasn't angry at the other bad drivers.

IMHO, people driving too fast for conditions, distracted drivers, or people driving in a way that doesn't mesh with traffic around them (which many hypermilers do with pulse and glide or coasting) are all the same.

Yeah, and what if the "flow of traffic" is driving too fast for the conditions, then what? If the sheep are headed off a cliff, why should I have to be just like them? A lot of people drive far too fast for the conditions so with that statement, I too should be driving too fast for the conditions.

 

[Bignate603]

Yeah, and what if the "flow of traffic" is driving too fast for the conditions, then what? If the sheep are headed off a cliff, why should I have to be just like them? A lot of people drive far too fast for the conditions so with that statement, I too should be driving too fast for the conditions.

🙄 Driving a constant speed that may be lower than traffic over in the right lane is one thing, having your speed bounce up and down like crazy while people are behind you is another. If you're in the proper lane and other people want to go faster they can pass you. If your speed isn't steady it makes it significantly harder for other drivers to react to you.

After having to deal with a moron in the mountains coming home from Flagstaff I can't stand people that ignore traffic to try and save a gallon or two. This idiot was flying down the hills without using his brake and passing tons of people. He probably topped out over 80 and then coasted until he was under 50 before he hit the gas again. Everybody that he just passed then had to go and pass him, only to have him do it all again on the next hill. Whipping past people on the downhill only to cause traffic congestion (when you've suddenly got 10 cars stack up and have to pass a single one going incredibly slow it never goes perfectly smooth) while he coasted isn't being responsible.

 

[fleabag]

🙄 Driving a constant speed that may be lower than traffic over in the right lane is one thing, having your speed bounce up and down like crazy while people are behind you is another. If you're in the proper lane and other people want to go faster they can pass you. If your speed isn't steady it makes it significantly harder for other drivers to react to you.

After having to deal with a moron in the mountains coming home from Flagstaff I can't stand people that ignore traffic to try and save a gallon or two. This idiot was flying down the hills without using his brake and passing tons of people. He probably topped out over 80 and then coasted until he was under 50 before he hit the gas again. Everybody that he just passed then had to go and pass him, only to have him do it all again on the next hill. Whipping past people on the downhill only to cause traffic congestion (when you've suddenly got 10 cars stack up and have to pass a single one going incredibly slow it never goes perfectly smooth) while he coasted isn't being responsible.

Hmm.... This unique scenario you pointed out is perfect because not only does it illustrate what most any hypermiler would do but it also demonstrates what kind of problems they could cause. The only thing I can think of is, how many lane road was it? If it's a three lane road, don't people usually cruise in the right lanes, so if this guy is doing his thing in the left lanes, then when he slows down, he wouldn't really be stopping up all that much traffic, right?

 

[Bignate603]

Hmm.... This unique scenario you pointed out is perfect because not only does it illustrate what most any hypermiler would do but it also demonstrates what kind of problems they could cause. The only thing I can think of is, how many lane road was it? If it's a three lane road, don't people usually cruise in the right lanes, so if this guy is doing his thing in the left lanes, then when he slows down, he wouldn't really be stopping up all that much traffic, right?

It was a two lane road in each direction (rural divided highway) and he was moving into the right lane as he coasted and slowed down.

People cruise in the right lane because that's where they are supposed to cruise. Typically, you're expected to move out into the left lanes only when you're going faster than traffic on the right and move back when you can. On large multilane highways with many exits and entrances this doesn't always work out but on a rural highway with only 2 lanes in each direction you should definitely move over to the right when you're going slow.

This guy with the erratic driving was going to block up traffic no matter which lane he picked. Slowing down to well below traffic in the right lane would make everybody have to move over and pass him, most likely causing a bit of a blockage as they did it. Staying in the passing lane would cause issues if anyone in the right lane happened to choose to go slower than others (say 60 when everyone else wanted to cruise at 70) and they end up side by side with the hypermiler. This blocks everybody and they can't get past until the hypermiler coasts down enough to open a gap. Even then, rather than each car going 70 mph moving over and passing as it overtakes the driver going 60 mph without having to change their speeds they'll have to slow down to 60 mph, wait in line until the other cars ahead of them have passed the 60 mph car and then go.

Even if the hypermiler is saving gas for themself they are causing other people to slow down and then accelerate again. Overall I would think that the effect on all the cars around them would be a net drop in efficiency as compared to if they just cruised at a relatively constant speed and let people move around them if they wanted to go faster.

I'm all for people driving economically, choosing an efficient speed, not flooring it away from lights, and not accelerating up to a stop. But you need to be consistent when there are any other cars around you. You might know exactly what you are doing but the other cars can't read your mind. The easiest other cars on the road to adapt your driving to is one that is acting consistently (even speed and stays in the correct lane). You can understand what they're doing, how to stay out of their way and how to keep them out of yours.

 

[fleabag]

It was a two lane road in each direction (rural divided highway) and he was moving into the right lane as he coasted and slowed down.

People cruise in the right lane because that's where they are supposed to cruise. Typically, you're expected to move out into the left lanes only when you're going faster than traffic on the right and move back when you can. On large multilane highways with many exits and entrances this doesn't always work out but on a rural highway with only 2 lanes in each direction you should definitely move over to the right when you're going slow.

This guy with the erratic driving was going to block up traffic no matter which lane he picked. Slowing down to well below traffic in the right lane would make everybody have to move over and pass him, most likely causing a bit of a blockage as they did it. Staying in the passing lane would cause issues if anyone in the right lane happened to choose to go slower than others (say 60 when everyone else wanted to cruise at 70) and they end up side by side with the hypermiler. This blocks everybody and they can't get past until the hypermiler coasts down enough to open a gap. Even then, rather than each car going 70 mph moving over and passing as it overtakes the driver going 60 mph without having to change their speeds they'll have to slow down to 60 mph, wait in line until the other cars ahead of them have passed the 60 mph car and then go.

Even if the hypermiler is saving gas for themself they are causing other people to slow down and then accelerate again. Overall I would think that the effect on all the cars around them would be a net drop in efficiency as compared to if they just cruised at a relatively constant speed and let people move around them if they wanted to go faster.

I'm all for people driving economically, choosing an efficient speed, not flooring it away from lights, and not accelerating up to a stop. But you need to be consistent when there are any other cars around you. You might know exactly what you are doing but the other cars can't read your mind. The easiest other cars on the road to adapt your driving to is one that is acting consistently (even speed and stays in the correct lane). You can understand what they're doing, how to stay out of their way and how to keep them out of yours.

Well I guess the real question now is, would these people save more fuel cruising at 55/50mph or pulse and gliding with the average speed being 65mph? Since I drive an automatic at this time, I just cruise at 53mph which I believe can net me a highway mileage of 40mpg. The scan gauge at this speed says between 38mpg and 41mpg and since I've never gone 100% highway for a great distance in the vehicle, I don't really know. If only the car had a taller 5th gear..

 

[Bignate603]

Well I guess the real question now is, would these people save more fuel cruising at 55/50mph or pulse and gliding with the average speed being 65mph? Since I drive an automatic at this time, I just cruise at 53mph which I believe can net me a highway mileage of 40mpg. The scan gauge at this speed says between 38mpg and 41mpg and since I've never gone 100% highway for a great distance in the vehicle, I don't really know. If only the car had a taller 5th gear..

Forget the single car, what about everyone else? If other people have to constantly adjust their speeds to deal with someone changing their speeds overall I think they'll end up burning more gas than that single car saved. If you're worried about being environmentally conscious you need to think about the big picture. Saving 1 gallon of gas but making an effect on the cars around you that causes them collectively to burn more than a gallon more of gas than they would have otherwise is not a net gain for the environment.

Overall I think you'll save more gas going a constant speed in the slow lane, but not ridiculously slow. Even in the slow lane on a highway with 2 or 3 lanes in each direction you create a bottleneck if there are enough cars on the road. They'll be coming along, get up to you, hit the brakes and lose momentum, then hit the gas when they get past you. Whether you agree with their speed or not you're still making them burn more gas than you're probably saving. You'll save gas overall if you pick a responsible speed and get over to the correct lane. However, if you notice that there's starting to be a backup around you and it's safe to pickup your speed you should bump it up somewhat.

 

[Viperoni]

Technically every single time an automatic transmission shifts there is slight wear on the brake bands and the clutch packs. Adding additional shifting by going in and out of neutral will at the very least cause some additional wear simply due to the increased number of shifts.

What is more important, however, is that a shift from neutral into drive while at speed is harder on a transmission than a shift from one gear to the next or a shift from neutral to drive when stopped. While this isn't as harsh as a "neutral drop" (revving the engine while in neutral then engaging drive while your foot is on the throttle), it's still harder on the transmission than a normal shift.

Overall though, the biggest issue is control. In a situation in which you suddenly need to be able to apply power or use engine braking it's much better to have the car in gear. In my opinion, no increase in fuel economy is worth the loss of control that coasting in neutral causes.

Great reply.

There's also the issue of the transmission pump not pumping as much fluid due to lower input RPM because it's in idle as opposed to 2krpm+.