Wii U sales are still awful

[purbeast0]

You're speaking of a projector, correct? That does help, as typically they have modes where it's pixel to pixel accurate when using a compatible input. That helps avoid the issue of running 720p on a 1080p panel, where 720p can look .. off, depending on how well it does with non-native input. Hell my 360 with Forza is a blur AND jag-fest even at only 27" on my 1200p native screen. If I disable scaling and run it in a little box, it looks fantastic, but super tiny. Still jaggy, but at least not a muddy mess.

720p isn't exactly what I'd call HD per se, even though I know it's technically referred to as such by marketing. It's of course far, FAR better than 480.

All that said, I think 1080P is what people generally think of when they think of true HD, circa 2013. It's really hard to go buy a decent TV that's not 1080p these days.

yeah i'm talking about a projector.

if forza is a blur and jagfest on your 27" screen it sounds like your display is the problem. 360 and ps3 also look fantastic on my 60" panasonic plasma. there are some ps3 games that you can notice jaggies on, but that is due to it not having "free" AA.

 

[tential]

You're speaking of a projector, correct? That does help, as typically they have modes where it's pixel to pixel accurate when using a compatible input. That helps avoid the issue of running 720p on a 1080p panel, where 720p can look .. off, depending on how well it does with non-native input. Hell my 360 with Forza is a blur AND jag-fest even at only 27" on my 1200p native screen. If I disable scaling and run it in a little box, it looks fantastic, but super tiny. Still jaggy, but at least not a muddy mess.

720p isn't exactly what I'd call HD per se, even though I know it's technically referred to as such by marketing. It's of course far, FAR better than 480.

All that said, I think 1080P is what people generally think of when they think of true HD, circa 2013. It's really hard to go buy a decent TV that's not 1080p these days.

Thank you. This is 2013. The xbox 360 came out in 2005? I don't consider 2005 hardware to be new. You aren't using a computer from 2005 are you?

On a 70 inch LED display, and bigger, xbox 360 and ps3 just don't look good. Especially multiplayer.

 

[Arkaign]

yeah i'm talking about a projector.

if forza is a blur and jagfest on your 27" screen it sounds like your display is the problem. 360 and ps3 also look fantastic on my 60" panasonic plasma. there are some ps3 games that you can notice jaggies on, but that is due to it not having "free" AA.

That could be, which is my exact point. Most digital flatpanels are poor at rendering non-native resolutions. It's a Dell 27" Ultrasharp 1920x1200 IPS display, it looks ridiculously gorgeous when fed 1200p content, or even 1080p with scaling disabled (leaves little black bars at the top and bottom). However, unless I run an exact half-res (960x600, lol), you don't get pixel for pixel perfection.

Some people are pickier than others, I easily notice non-native content on these kinds of panels (text is the worst offender!). With a projector, you bypass that problem entirely (with most projectors that is).

Plasma is a bit different, as the way the pixels are presented is a bit blurry to begin with. My Panasonic 1080p 60" Kuro looks gorgeous from the couch, but if you walk up to it and examine the pixels, they're oddly mushy looking. Not in a horrendous way like running 480p on a 1080p LED/LCD, but just not hyper sharp and well defined. It's excellent for HD movie content and TV, a lot less so for computer and game console inputs.

It's just different preferences. I want to be able to walk up and see a tiny perfect pixel with no blurring, bleeding, or interpolation (the digital processing attempting to turn a non-native resolution into the native resolution, resulting in single pixel content being represented by multiple pixels).

 

[Arkaign]

A great article, in point of fact if you CAN'T see the jaggies on your screen with Forza 4, then your screen isn't sharp enough to display them. After all, this IS the raw image data coming from your 360.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-tech-analysis-forza-motorsport-4

It of course is a brilliant game, and the only reason I actually own a 360 at all. The series will probably be why I own an XB1 eventually.

In pointing out the jaggies on it, I'm not saying they did a bad job at all. For a current-gen title on relatively weak hardware, it looks and plays phenomenally well. Certainly there's no way they could honestly have done much better at all. They're not bad enough to make the game annoying or unplayable by even the wildest stretch of the imagination. Playing it on a 720p display with native 720p resolution is by far the best way to experience it though.

 

[purbeast0]

looking at jaggies on a still screen shot vs the game in motion is not really that fair.

also i think you are in the minority of people if you care about seeing pixels from 6 inches from the screen lol.

 

[Arkaign]

looking at jaggies on a still screen shot vs the game in motion is not really that fair.

also i think you are in the minority of people if you care about seeing pixels from 6 inches from the screen lol.

When they're in motion, they just kind of shimmer across the edges like that, it's hardly only visible in screenshots.

I do realize I'm a bit picky with things like that, but I also don't let it ruin my day 🙂 It's just the limitations of the technology we have right now. XB1 and PS4 will blow people away that haven't realized just how hobbled the current consoles are in capability.

 

[purbeast0]

When they're in motion, they just kind of shimmer across the edges like that, it's hardly only visible in screenshots.

I do realize I'm a bit picky with things like that, but I also don't let it ruin my day 🙂 It's just the limitations of the technology we have right now. XB1 and PS4 will blow people away that haven't realized just how hobbled the current consoles are in capability.

i'm not saying edges don't show in motion, i'm just saying they show up more in stills. levels of AA vary big time too among games as well.

and yeah, it's like 8 year old technology vs current technology, not really comparable heh. it should look better with stuff coming out in 2013 vs mid 2000's.

but to say that ps3 and xbox360 games look like "crap" on modern displays is just not true. even many wii games don't look bad. mario galaxy and donkey kong country looked great. although, i DID have it running through an HDMI adapter when i played them, which supposedly upscales.

obviously they don't look as good as pc games due to resolution and hardware, but that doesn't mean they look like crap.

EDIT:

holy crap, gonna drop this now totally forgot which thread this was lol. totally off topic with this discussion!

 

[Aikouka]

I do realize I'm a bit picky with things like that, but I also don't let it ruin my day 🙂 It's just the limitations of the technology we have right now. XB1 and PS4 will blow people away that haven't realized just how hobbled the current consoles are in capability.

I'm wondering if some people won't really notice because of the distance that they sit from their TV. I mean... for people to not complain about the ugly textures in a game like The Last of Us, they must be completely ignorant to what games can look like on a PC (or even the demos we've seen on the newer consoles). Higher resolution textures are probably the biggest change that I'm looking forward to.

 

[purbeast0]

I'm wondering if some people won't really notice because of the distance that they sit from their TV. I mean... for people to not complain about the ugly textures in a game like The Last of Us, they must be completely ignorant to what games can look like on a PC (or even the demos we've seen on the newer consoles). Higher resolution textures are probably the biggest change that I'm looking forward to.

i think it is due to it being "good enough" and not knowing about how good pc can look, nor do they care. i know that is how i am at least. i know pc can look a lot better than consoles, but i don't care about that at all because i won't find 99% of the games i play on pc.

 

[smackababy]

I'm wondering if some people won't really notice because of the distance that they sit from their TV. I mean... for people to not complain about the ugly textures in a game like The Last of Us, they must be completely ignorant to what games can look like on a PC (or even the demos we've seen on the newer consoles). Higher resolution textures are probably the biggest change that I'm looking forward to.

It is not always ignorance. I play console games and have a high end PC. I simply don't care that the console games "look worse" because having lower res textures aren't what I quantify as making a game enjoyable. As long as the animations are smooth and the production value is high, I really don't care if it runs at 600p or 1600p. Everyone hails Crysis as this looking so amazing, and it does, but it isn't a good game. It has a horrible story, some awful gameplay decisions (the zero G area...) and is not a great shooter. The multiplayer wasn't great and CoD4: MW either matched or exceeded it in every area except for graphics. I used that as an example because both were from 2007.

Console gamers don't care that their games have jaggies or that the texture resolution isn't 5000000 x 5000000 pixels. They care about gameplay. Nobody except for PC gamers complain CoD isn't running true 720p. Console gamers just care that it doesn't stutter. Nobody cared Dark Souls had low resolution textures, they cared about the slowdown in Blighttown.

 

[ImpulsE69]

I sit 12' from a 70" and while I can definitely tell the difference between HD input vs lower resolutions, yes, the distance does help to make things more tolerable at anything under 1080p to the point it's not really an issue. then again, jaggies in games has never been a point of distress for me like it seems to be with alot of people.

 

[KaOTiK]

I'm wondering if some people won't really notice because of the distance that they sit from their TV. I mean... for people to not complain about the ugly textures in a game like The Last of Us, they must be completely ignorant to what games can look like on a PC (or even the demos we've seen on the newer consoles). Higher resolution textures are probably the biggest change that I'm looking forward to.

When I play my consoles, I go in with a totally different expectation of technical limits next to my PC. So while yes, TLOU in reality next to a PC game looks pretty bad, on a console it is pretty damn amazing looking.

It is all about adjusting expectations.

 

[MetalMat]

I doubt that Nintendo even getting more 3rd party support is really the issue. Nintendo first party titles were by far the bread and butter of the Wii. I doubt anyone is really crying over Madden or GTA 5 not being released for the Wii U, Nintendo just needs to hurry up and push some Mario & Zelda games out the door so they can tell the 3rd party peeps to get steppin.

If Nintendo really wants to make some scratch they need to get Wii Fit U released before Christmas. They need to market the crap out of it on shows like "The View" or "Good Morning America". Soccer moms all over the place will be waiting to hand Nintendo money for the Console & Wii Fit U so they can use it for a week before it sits and collects dust until Wii Fit U II comes out.

 

[smackababy]

I don't think another Wii Fit will sell the console though. Everyone that bought Wii Fit either already got tired of their Wii calling them fat, or forgot about it.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Yea, that thing got used like 2 weeks at our place.... lol

The problem with all these gimmiks (3D TV's included) is that they are fun for a short period of time, but at the end of the day, people want to be lazy, sit on the couch and play a game w/o having to wave their arms around. That's what video gaming is.

 

[MetalMat]

I don't think another Wii Fit will sell the console though. Everyone that bought Wii Fit either already got tired of their Wii calling them fat, or forgot about it.

Wii Fit plus sold over 20 million. I still find it amazing that Wii Fit is the 3rd best selling console (not packaged with console) game in history. Nintendo should just pay Al Roker to show it off on "Good Morning America" and say that he uses it every day to keep the weight off.

 

[smackababy]

But did Wii Fit Plus move consoles or was it Wii owners buying it? Nintendo had a huge install base by the point Wii Fit Plus came out.

 

[MetalMat]

But did Wii Fit Plus move consoles or was it Wii owners buying it? Nintendo had a huge install base by the point Wii Fit Plus came out.

It's hard to say with Wii Fit Plus but the original did move consoles which is more in line with what I am suggesting. They will need to market the tablet interface features to make it stand out from the competition.

 

[ImpulsE69]

Just because people bought it doesn't mean they continued to use it. We only had a Wii and Fit because my wife wanted one. This is a women who has zero interest in games. I broke down and got it, and just as I thought, she was bored of it in a few weeks.

My prediction is MANY of the "casual" crowd were the same and they will have no interest in a new version on a new console. It won't do nearly as well this go around.

 

[iluvdeal]

The Wii Fit was a nice gimmick which moved a bunch of units but I'd bet for all the people that bought it, 80% didn't touch it again after the first month. I know I didn't. The sensitivity on it blew and there were no games which made creative use of it. I was hoping they'd release the Police 911 arcade game for the Wii which took advantage of the Fit but it never happened.

I like the idea behind the Fit, it just didn't get the games it needed. Anyone who has skate or snowboarded know how much slight changes in your weight distribution can affect your movement, it's not something camera technology like Kinect/Eye can capture. Maybe one day we'll get a balance board sensor and games which gets it right.

 

[Silver Prime]

Do I think that Nintendo absolutely must drop their price? No. However, that's also a really simplistic answer. Ultimately, it appears that people don't want Nintendo's latest console. In simplest terms, Nintendo needs to give them a reason to want it. A price drop is a legitimate reason; however, it's not the only way to drum up interest. You can also produce desirable games, or heck... a mix of the two could work as well.



I would be dollars to donuts that he's foreign. Either that or the U.S. education system failed if anyone thinks that there are one billion people here. 😛 I also picked up on this nature to try and push his opinion as something that applies to everyone. #1 advice on the Internet, your personal stance on a matter doesn't necessarily matter. Just because you're not willing to pay $500 for a console doesn't mean someone else isn't. Heck, I'm afraid it might blow his mind if I said I had both on pre-order with the intent to buy! 😛

Un-educated? Dude, if I never care'd to ask before then I wouldn't know, its the same thing with everything, I even stated I dident care, if it means anything I was just showing how much 25% of a large number can be, not to mention the other guy said world wide, while the next only showed america, I'm sure if we add up all the numbers his point is moot.

The problem with the insecerity level now days is through the roof, they google one thing for 5 minutes and jet back; and act like they knew for a 100 years, so what.

And also saying things like...Everyone...or only you...the only one on the planet is just silly, espcially when I've been around this topic before so I can link to others who agree with me, I dont play that silly game; but I dont like when people start getting all insulting and then contradicting them selves just to cross there opinion into acting like its a fact.

More games? Hell yeah.

Price cut? Hell no.

Even him saying no one was happy paying the 600...I remember heavy talk of guys who got it way earlier before its launch and were selling it for a 1,000 bucks to the people who couldn't wait...That I would think they'd be un-happy, yet they still bought it, so they must be idle or happy...contradicting his>>>NO ONE ON THE PLANET WAS HAPPY!

Huh!

 

[tential]

I sit 12' from a 70" and while I can definitely tell the difference between HD input vs lower resolutions, yes, the distance does help to make things more tolerable at anything under 1080p to the point it's not really an issue. then again, jaggies in games has never been a point of distress for me like it seems to be with alot of people.

I sit 8' to 10' from my 70" screen and Xbox 360 vs PC is night and day. I can't play Xbox 360 games anymore if there is a PC version available.

 

[Arkaign]

I sit 8' to 10' from my 70" screen and Xbox 360 vs PC is night and day. I can't play Xbox 360 games anymore if there is a PC version available.

Yup. I can understand the 360 / PS3 for the exclusives (and honestly, there are a lot of them), but at the same time, there are a TON of great PC games, and basically every single multi-platform game on PC is better than console.

That will change quite a bit with the PS4/XB1, as the typical midrange/entry level gaming box will suddenly become weaker than them.

 

[purbeast0]

Yup. I can understand the 360 / PS3 for the exclusives (and honestly, there are a lot of them), but at the same time, there are a TON of great PC games, and basically every single multi-platform game on PC is better than console.

That will change quite a bit with the PS4/XB1, as the typical midrange/entry level gaming box will suddenly become weaker than them.

"better" is 100% subjective. there isn't 1 game that is multiplatform that i would rather play on pc than xbox360. every multiplatform game is "better" to me on 360.

 

[pathos]

How can they be dead in the water? Dident they already make there money back?

I haven't read through the whole thread yet, so maybe this has already been pointed out, but I did want to note....

Sure, the wii u's are selling at a hardware profit. Each one sells for more than it costs to build it.

But, what you're not looking at is the cost of development. Until thats made up, it's not really selling at a profit. Not that it won't, eventually. But, I'm doubting that it's already happened. Of course, since I have no idea what the cost of development was, or how much of a profit each piece of hardware makes, I could very well be wrong about it.