Why the Left Hates America by Daniel J. Flynn

[charrison]

Originally posted by: bizmark

Originally posted by: Ornery
It was a response. It was DOING something instead of wringing our hands and wondering what the next crisis would be. Again, I've yet to hear a damn thing offered from the left as far as a better solution. The most I heard was crap about understanding why we were attacked in the first place. That our foreign policy brought this on us. We apparently "deserved" it!

Look, I have no problem with going after the terrorists who planned the attack on the U.S., and if you'll look at my responses in this thread I don't think you'll find anything to contradict that! I'm all for a war on terrorism, if it's effective. However, I don't believe that the bulk of the current policies have the slightest chance of being sufficiently effective.

You've failed to realize that there might be reasons OTHER than "being an ignorant jackass knee-jerk liberal" for opposing the Bush administration's policies! Anyone who disagrees with you gets painted by this "liberal" brush, even though I personally hold very complex political beliefs, some of which might be seen as "liberal" but an equal number of which could be seen as "conservative". If you weren't so eager to lump all of the naysayers into one gigantic "jackass" category whose opinions you dismiss out of hand, maybe you'd learn something!

I have no problem with people disagreeing, but I am not seeing alternative solutions being offered. Without an alternative solution, it just looks like foolish partison whining.

 

[SuperTool]

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: bizmark

Originally posted by: Ornery
It was a response. It was DOING something instead of wringing our hands and wondering what the next crisis would be. Again, I've yet to hear a damn thing offered from the left as far as a better solution. The most I heard was crap about understanding why we were attacked in the first place. That our foreign policy brought this on us. We apparently "deserved" it!

Look, I have no problem with going after the terrorists who planned the attack on the U.S., and if you'll look at my responses in this thread I don't think you'll find anything to contradict that! I'm all for a war on terrorism, if it's effective. However, I don't believe that the bulk of the current policies have the slightest chance of being sufficiently effective.

You've failed to realize that there might be reasons OTHER than "being an ignorant jackass knee-jerk liberal" for opposing the Bush administration's policies! Anyone who disagrees with you gets painted by this "liberal" brush, even though I personally hold very complex political beliefs, some of which might be seen as "liberal" but an equal number of which could be seen as "conservative". If you weren't so eager to lump all of the naysayers into one gigantic "jackass" category whose opinions you dismiss out of hand, maybe you'd learn something!

I have no problem with people disagreeing, but I am not seeing alternative solutions being offered. Without an alternative solution, it just looks like foolish partison whining.

Solution is simple, go after the Saudis. Why do they get immunity if 15/19 were Saudis, and they continiue to fund Wahabbists around the world. We need to stop beating around the Bush, with this Islamists crap, and call this war what it is, war on Wahabbists, which is the radical brand of Islam supported by Saudi Arabia. Go around the world and see who pays to build Wahabbi Mosques. You guessed it, the Saudis. Bush has too many ties with the Saudis to objectively and firmly deal with them. That's what I am seeing so far.

 

[MinorityReport]

Originally posted by: SuperTool

Originally posted by: charrison

Originally posted by: bizmark

Originally posted by: Ornery
It was a response. It was DOING something instead of wringing our hands and wondering what the next crisis would be. Again, I've yet to hear a damn thing offered from the left as far as a better solution. The most I heard was crap about understanding why we were attacked in the first place. That our foreign policy brought this on us. We apparently "deserved" it!

Look, I have no problem with going after the terrorists who planned the attack on the U.S., and if you'll look at my responses in this thread I don't think you'll find anything to contradict that! I'm all for a war on terrorism, if it's effective. However, I don't believe that the bulk of the current policies have the slightest chance of being sufficiently effective.

You've failed to realize that there might be reasons OTHER than "being an ignorant jackass knee-jerk liberal" for opposing the Bush administration's policies! Anyone who disagrees with you gets painted by this "liberal" brush, even though I personally hold very complex political beliefs, some of which might be seen as "liberal" but an equal number of which could be seen as "conservative". If you weren't so eager to lump all of the naysayers into one gigantic "jackass" category whose opinions you dismiss out of hand, maybe you'd learn something!

I have no problem with people disagreeing, but I am not seeing alternative solutions being offered. Without an alternative solution, it just looks like foolish partison whining.

Solution is simple, go after the Saudis. Why do they get immunity if 15/19 were Saudis, and they continiue to fund Wahabbists around the world. We need to stop beating around the Bush, with this Islamists crap, and call this war what it is, war on Wahabbists, which is the radical brand of Islam supported by Saudi Arabia. Go around the world and see who pays to build Wahabbi Mosques. You guessed it, the Saudis. Bush has too many ties with the Saudis to objectively and firmly deal with them. That's what I am seeing so far.

Dear supertool, glad to know some one with real knowledge of world affairs exists in this crap of bigoted conservative religious right wings. Shame on them, they bring a bad name to what USA stands for in real.


The real war on terrorism will be a war on Saudi funding and support to terror. Next comes the brains, pakistan. As I mentioned before, the nuke that ( i hope never ever ) goes off in US will be "made in pakstan".
Eliminate KSA and Pakistan from the map or severly cripple their terror supporting infrasture.

Islamic Terrorism will be finished by 80%.

Saudi Royal family has real close ties with Bush and oil tycoons. SO the situation is real complicated for the current administration. On one hand control over Iraq's oil reserves would mean Saudi getting the boot from US soon but also mean unprepared consequences. So it is very ambiguous.

American leaders lick Saudi butt every day .. and this is what exactly has to stop. And god knows how and why Pakistan is manipulating US. Last I checked they lived on our aid and have millions starving and rioting.


To illustrate what power Saudi Royal family has over Bush adminstration here are some examples :

1) On Prince Abdullah's visit to US recently, he asked all FEMALE ATC controller's and airport staff to be put off from their duty as he is extrememly religious. Shameless Bush called up FAA Chairperson and called off all women workers from that airport. How come not a single SOB conservative raised his/her voice ?

2) Try posting any anti royal family or anti Saudi article on a reputed American newspaper. Before the Royalfamily lawyers, YOUR OWN GOVENMENT lobbyists will send you indirect warnings .. wonderful

3) As a former employee of Saudi ARAMCO and as a person who visited most of middle east from Amman to Damascus, Sharjah to Dahran, everywhere locale population is angered and the resentment against Saudi royal family high. It is red alert now in KSA ( those who do not know what KSA stands for, refrain from debate, plz ).
To them these pigs control the holy cities and act like heirs of Islam, where as they are the most unislamic of them all.

4) Saudia royal family has $750 billion of investments ( according to Morgan Stanley, report dated 2001) in western banks and assets. US fears a pullout or maybe ...god knows what

5) The hidden lobby for Saudi royal family is as strong as the jewish one on capitol hill. Most Americans rarely hear about this and majority conservatives refuse to acknowledge it. Well it is an omnipresent force to be recknowed with. As a former employee of Saudi ARAMCO and one of their lower republican American contacts , I can assure you money flows like water here. I cannot say or prove which govt official gets how much or who gets it from which party, but it is very much an intense lobby.

6) Any one of you ever been to Dubai ? It is a very modern cosmopolitan city in the UAE. Next time when you are at the airport wait for a Royal Saudia flight to arrive, especially from Europe. Watch from the windows what happens ...

When the plane lands ... a convoy of limos and bodyguards shows up near the craft. Royal family members get off first and even before the plane is in the vestibule, they get a ladder truck and off come the royales.
Along with them you will see a kabal of excesses .. mostly Ruski/Western prostitues or royal harems, young girls from Morocco/Lebanon/Syria ready to be de flowered, even young boys and various other evils that dissapered along with the Roman civilization. Slavery exists here and under US patronage.

Every time a saudi plane arrives, the local Dubai policeman, guards, employees in the airport curse like hell in their language ( which I am fluent in ) and get into a frenzy and when I asked why ... they say these are the people trusted as the guardians of Islam. And who allows all this > Uncle Sam. To them Saudia is evil as it is and add to that the US support of that evil..nothing worse than that.

The dilemma is this : Royal family is officially anti al queda and maybe pro american. Entire local polulation and most arab world anti Royal family so it means anti US in most cases.. So if you want to please one party, you get the wrath of the other. What side to choose ?

However I can say this with proof : The royal family is pro america only on paper.
Inside they are extremely anti American and ACTIVELY fund terror ... they are the snakes that sting the hands that feed them.
They are multiplying at an alarming rate and eating the oil wealth before it reaches the common citizens of their country.

KSA had a $24,400 per capita income in 1980's and now its below Mexico. Can you belive it > mexico richer than Saudia, both GDP and per capita wise.

Beware!! Bush seems to be lost in his own war .. however I am sure his administration knows better than any one of us here how to handle and what to do in the best interest of the nation first.

If they fail to do so, they will be punished and so will we, the common citizens. Pray that never happens.

 

[Zebo]

MR, but it's so much easier to bomb someone...anyone...plus it's the only thing keeping our econoomy affloat right now you dummy, the debt...ahhh forgetaboutit

 

[DanTMWTMP]

hmm...if americans within america hates america...simple...just leave...why bother to stay here then...am i wrong?

 

[Mrburns2007]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer
If recognizing what is wrong with your country and wanting to fix it is hatred, then yes, I hate America.

You know, I hate the errogance that we have. People who have never left Brazil are Americans, too. Yet we think that we're the only Americans in the world. It may not seem like much, but it's quite insulting to everybody else.

nik

People in Brazil don't refer to themselves as Americans, there brazilian.

 

[MinorityReport]

Originally posted by: Carbonyl
MR, but it's so much easier to bomb someone...anyone...plus it's the only thing keeping our econoomy affloat right now you dummy, the debt...ahhh forgetaboutit

Yes it is easier to bomb saddam and get his oil than getting rid of the royal family in KSA.

But this will be a short term game with risks involved as well.


I propose a long term solution and that will be destruction of Pakistan and KSA.

On the other hand, if you think bomibg Iraq will keep you safe, keep dreaming.

 

[BatmanNate]

Oh, sweet irony.

 

[Ornery]

Here was my response from yesterday at 11:00PM, but couldn't manage to post:

• "I still think your reply is empty and does NOTHING to disprove Daschle's statement that the War on Terror could validly be seen as a failure thus far, with evidence that OBL is still alive and the FBI warning of something major to happen very soon. Has there been some progress? Yes. Is it enough? Obviously not, if we're about to get attacked again and we're unable to prevent it."
  
  Thank you, I follow your thinking, but I honestly think Daschle is just being an ass. WTF would have to be accomplished inside of 14 months to make him happy? Again, what better path could we have chosen? All I hear is whining from the farthest left, right up to the center moderates, with no alternative plan.
  
  
  "So you saying 'YES' to this question?"
  
  Basically, we have to give up some freedom for more security, yes. It ain't rocket science, it's reality. Again, you got a better plan? Does anybody on your side of the isle?
  
  "You do know that KGB translates as Homeland Security Department?"
  
  Again, you got a better plan? Does anybody on your side of the isle?

"You've failed to realize that there might be reasons OTHER than "being an ignorant jackass knee-jerk liberal" for opposing the Bush administration's policies! Anyone who disagrees with you gets painted by this "liberal" brush..."

What makes you think I'm painting "all liberals" with a broad brush? I specifically quoted Helen Thomas, Tom Daschle and mentioned the Hollywood bleeding hearts. Our kids are being taught at institutions with a left leaning bent and the mainstream media is no better. It's only within the last decade that we've had the likes of Newt, Rush, Fox News and others like Daniel Flynn to somewhat balance it out.

I say, lead, follow or get out of the way! The trouble is, folks like Daschle, Gephardt and Senator Byrd have the power to gum up the works to the point where we make NO progress. Then their loyal followers on the left have the audacity to point fingers and say we're not getting anywhere! :disgust:


"Solution is simple, go after the Saudis."

Is that your final answer? I've yet to hear the Democratic leadership advocate confronting Saudi Arabia or Pakistan. Bush was condemned for going after Hussein without UN approval, can you imagine the backlash if he decided to... what? Bomb Saudi Arabia?

We're taking it one step at a time, albeit slowly thanks to the obstructionists on the left, France and Russia. Tightening security is step one. Afghanistan was step two. Hussein is just one more item on a larger agenda. Bad enough we have to fight with the likes of France to get anything done. You'd think we could get a little more cooperation here at home, ESPECIALLY after 9-11!

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Ornery
Here was my response from yesterday at 11:00PM, but couldn't manage to post:

• "I still think your reply is empty and does NOTHING to disprove Daschle's statement that the War on Terror could validly be seen as a failure thus far, with evidence that OBL is still alive and the FBI warning of something major to happen very soon. Has there been some progress? Yes. Is it enough? Obviously not, if we're about to get attacked again and we're unable to prevent it."
  
  Thank you, I follow your thinking, but I honestly think Daschle is just being an ass. WTF would have to be accomplished inside of 14 months to make him happy? Again, what better path could we have chosen? All I hear is whining from the farthest left, right up to the center moderates, with no alternative plan.
  
  
  "So you saying 'YES' to this question?"
  
  Basically, we have to give up some freedom for more security, yes. It ain't rocket science, it's reality. Again, you got a better plan? Does anybody on your side of the isle?
  
  "You do know that KGB translates as Homeland Security Department?"
  
  Again, you got a better plan? Does anybody on your side of the isle?

"You've failed to realize that there might be reasons OTHER than "being an ignorant jackass knee-jerk liberal" for opposing the Bush administration's policies! Anyone who disagrees with you gets painted by this "liberal" brush..."

What makes you think I'm painting "all liberals" with a broad brush? I specifically quoted Helen Thomas, Tom Daschle and mentioned the Hollywood bleeding hearts. Our kids are being taught at institutions with a left leaning bent and the mainstream media is no better. It's only within the last decade that we've had the likes of Newt, Rush, Fox News and others like Daniel Flynn to somewhat balance it out.

I say, lead, follow or get out of the way! The trouble is, folks like Daschle, Gephardt and Senator Byrd have the power to gum up the works to the point where we make NO progress. Then their loyal followers on the left have the audacity to point fingers and say we're not getting anywhere! :disgust:

Is this supposed to be a new phenomenon? Hollywood, the Ivory Towers of Academia and those on the left have always been around just like those who blow hot gas on the right. The difference is that today neither side spends much time defending their position compared to the time they spend labeling and demonizing those who they disagree with. The title of this thread is a perfect example of the lame ass labeling that is so prominent both sides.

If I didn't know any better Ornery I'd swear that you blame the Democrats for everything that's not perfect with American Society and that the Republicans are totally blameless for any of its faults. Frankly your rhetoric is becoming very predictable. Even Great Conservative minds like William F Buckley never hesitate to put the blame on the Republicans when they are deserving. I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you were to blame the Democrats for the cause and spread of Aids World Wide.

 

[NikPreviousAcct]

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer
If recognizing what is wrong with your country and wanting to fix it is hatred, then yes, I hate America.

You know, I hate the errogance that we have. People who have never left Brazil are Americans, too. Yet we think that we're the only Americans in the world. It may not seem like much, but it's quite insulting to everybody else.

nik

Well the name of our country is "The United States of America". When we call it "America" we are only abbreviating that, not claiming that we are America.

Ever seen someone get the sh|t beat out of them because when they went to Brazil, one of the Briazillians asked where they were from, and he answered "America"?

nik

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer

Originally posted by: ffmcobalt

Originally posted by: Jellomancer
If recognizing what is wrong with your country and wanting to fix it is hatred, then yes, I hate America.

You know, I hate the errogance that we have. People who have never left Brazil are Americans, too. Yet we think that we're the only Americans in the world. It may not seem like much, but it's quite insulting to everybody else.

nik

Well the name of our country is "The United States of America". When we call it "America" we are only abbreviating that, not claiming that we are America.

Ever seen someone get the sh|t beat out of them because when they went to Brazil, one of the Briazillians asked where they were from, and he answered "America"?

nik

No, have you?

 

[Tominator]

I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you were to blame the Democrats for the cause and spread of Aids World Wide.

Various Democrat leaders have indeed blamed Republicans for this.

Every time we get a one-sided diatribe about how the US stinks and will be the downfall of the world, it comes from the left. Every time!

The ONLY solution they ever give is to let THEM AND ONLY THEM make the decisions that THEY see fit!

Within the Republican Party you see bickering and namecalling. We are not afraid to discuss issues and try different approaches to solve problems.

Democrats stick together and EXCLUDE any and all ideas that are contrary to their agenda. Every time!

 

[Ornery]

"Is this supposed to be a new phenomenon? Hollywood, the Ivory Towers of Academia and those on the left have always been around just like those who blow hot gas on the right."

AGAIN, Daschel, Gephardt, Byrd and Helen Thomas are NOT on the far left fringe. They represent your average Democrat and are in a position to stop progress, cold! Yet, they are the first to whine and complain that we aren't making progress! It ain't funny, it's disgusting! :disgust:

 

[Red Dawn]

Originally posted by: Tominator

I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you were to blame the Democrats for the cause and spread of Aids World Wide.

Various Democrat leaders have indeed blamed Republicans for this.

Name one that has any credibility within the Democrative Party..and no, Jesse Jackson doesn't have credibility, he just has the black vote to strong arm the Democratic Party.

Every time we get a one-sided diatribe about how the US stinks and will be the downfall of the world, it comes from the left. Every time!

Yeah but not all Democrats are Left Wing Liberals and even those who are Liberal do not all take part in those one sided "America is Evil" diatribes. From my perspective it seems those who get the most attention for spouting such nonsense are the Streisand?s, Baldwin?s and the O?Donnell?s. The reason they are so well known for their whacky ideas and opinions is because they are constantly demonized time and time again by the Right as if their opinions were mainstream among the Democratic Party when in reality their views are actually only shared by a relatively small segment of the party.

 

[Moonbeam]

I think the bottom line is that Republicans better represent money interests and money has slowly but surely taken control of both parties, the media, the culture, and the agenda. Nobody is representing the real interests of the American people.

 

[glenn1]

Solution is simple, go after the Saudis. Why do they get immunity if 15/19 were Saudis, and they continiue to fund Wahabbists around the world. We need to stop beating around the Bush, with this Islamists crap, and call this war what it is, war on Wahabbists, which is the radical brand of Islam supported by Saudi Arabia.

Bravo, Super Tool. IMHO, the downfall of the Kingdom of Saud cannot arrive too soon.

 

[0roo0roo]

in the republican spirit of "those who disagree with you are unamerican".


why the right wing is unamerican

 

[Dudd]

Originally posted by: Tominator
Another absolute dumbass surfaces.....

Be specific or STFU!

Typical Liberal.....nothing but name calling...:|

The contradiction in this post is amazing.

 

[0roo0roo]

Originally posted by: Dudd

Originally posted by: Tominator
Another absolute dumbass surfaces.....

Be specific or STFU!

Typical Liberal.....nothing but name calling...:|

The contradiction in this post is amazing.

u should see ann coulters book. it should be called contradition, or hipocrisy

 

[Lonyo]

"The American flag stands for hatred, warmongering, and imperialism."

 

[Tominator]

Originally posted by: Dudd

Originally posted by: Tominator
Another absolute dumbass surfaces.....

Be specific or STFU!

Typical Liberal.....nothing but name calling...:|

The contradiction in this post is amazing.

I KNOW what and who a Liberal is! It's not a name, but a label. Some even claim the title. It actually means something. Calling someone a Nazi or Facist without backing it up IS name calling!

 

[0roo0roo]

always oversimplifying, demonizing and twisting definitions to suit their narrow intolerant views.


you know what a liberal is the same way a nut knows that black helicopters are after him. wonderful mythical enemies.


typical conservatives

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: Tominator

Originally posted by: Dudd

Originally posted by: Tominator
Another absolute dumbass surfaces.....

Be specific or STFU!

Typical Liberal.....nothing but name calling...:|

The contradiction in this post is amazing.

I KNOW what and who a Liberal is! It's not a name, but a label. Some even claim the title. It actually means something. Calling someone a Nazi or Facist without backing it up IS name calling!

Must resist cause I'm a nice guy.

Read it again.

 

[dolph]

Originally posted by: Tominator

Originally posted by: Dudd

Originally posted by: Tominator
Another absolute dumbass surfaces.....

Be specific or STFU!

Typical Liberal.....nothing but name calling...:|

The contradiction in this post is amazing.

I KNOW what and who a Liberal is! It's not a name, but a label. Some even claim the title. It actually means something. Calling someone a Nazi or Facist without backing it up IS name calling!

i'm a liberal. i don't hate america. am i a contradiction?