Why is the US military budget like 350 billion dollars ?

[shiner]

I think you would have a hard time explaining why we arent effecient enough to be able to spend as much as the rest of the world combined

I wouldn't have a hard time explaining that at all. Our military is equipped with the most technologically advanced equipment in the world. Sure we could purchase cheaper equipment and spend less money on research costs, but what would that end up costing us in human terms when we have to fight? Comparing our military budget to the rest of the world is a little bit like apples and oranges. Yes most countries have a military budget, but how many of those countries are still marching around with old M1 rifles, 1950's era fighter jets, etc? Maintaining a modern military that is always trying to stay 2 steps ahead of the enemy is not an easy task and costs a lot of money. Personally I'm willing to pay whatever the cost in taxes. Better to pay now with massive amounts of dollars than to pay later in massive amounts of casualties.

 

[HendrixFan]

You seem to be contradicting yourself there. Are we 50 years ahead of everyone or arent we? If we are, why do we need to continue spending more than the rest of the world combined? Why not limit it until we see more of a need to arise? If we arent ahead of everyone, what have we been spending our money on and getting horrible returns with?

 

[shiner]

We are ahead and we must continue to stay ahead. Being content because we are ahead today would be foolish. Waiting around for people to catch up to us is dangerous and in the end would end up costing us 100 times more than continually developing new weapons. Being reactionary in warfare or preparing for warfare is the quickest way to get your head chopped off.

 

[Viper GTS]

Originally posted by: HendrixFan
You seem to be contradicting yourself there. Are we 50 years ahead of everyone or arent we? If we are, why do we need to continue spending more than the rest of the world combined? Why not limit it until we see more of a need to arise? If we arent ahead of everyone, what have we been spending our money on and getting horrible returns with?

If we sit around on our asses they WILL catch us.

We are on the bleeding edge, which is exactly where we need to be.

Yes, it's expensive.

But the alternative is worse.

Viper GTS

 

[da loser]

ok, so for you guys saying we spend more percentage of the world's gdp on the military, you're right we do. I compared numbers here Text then calculated percentage of total GDP. guess what a ton of countries do, especially poor ones.
country/%military/%GDP/%national gdp (from cia)
usa/36/27.5/3.2
russia/6/1.06
france/5/5.32/2.5
japan/5/16/0.96
uk/5/4/2.7
germany/5/8/1.5
china/3/3.2/1.2
saudi arabia/2/0.4/13
israel/1/0.3/9.4

but we have bases in japan and germany, so lets take their some of their additional gdp, 8+1.5, that's 9.5.
so usa/27.5/27.5. so we're really not that far off even if you dont agree with those numbers, since both those countries would have to increase their military spending. if you go further down the list, you will notice that poorer countries spend more % on their military, which is understandable, just like poor people spend more % on food. so our situation is not bad. considering the benefits. i couldn't find percentages based on government budget which would be something better to look at. either way you look at it (from a USA benefit standpoint) our GDP continues to rise as is our %world gdp, which would mean we're doing something right. Now for those complaining about what a military does against terrorism. Terrorism is caused by oppressed people or people who feel they are oppressed, which becomes reality to them. The only way we can solve that problem is take away their oppression or destroy them. the us is trying to do both. destroy those that see terrorism as an option, and remove oppression from those that need other options, yet fail to free themselves. Taking a proactive approach in the world means using force, I dont think we have come up with a more effective way. In that sense, you will spend more then just protection in the short term, but hopefully less in the long term.

For those talking about the poor in the US, get real; what they need is more opportunity which is only brought about by a proactive business community. The government could help a long way by ensuring opportunity for all through improved education and less welfare. Improved education would also drive down poverty and defense spending. The question is how far are we from utilizing all the manpower in the US efficiently. I dont agree with Amusedone, in that if you rearranged wealth it would go close to what we have now. I think overall wealth would increase substantially, through more efficiency. Perhaps what you mean with the wealth distribution, which I believe is not that important. If you make the assumption that we are close to steady state, then you assume we are not improving as a country, which is wrong, since gdp increases constantly.

 

[FoxHound23]

Ok, so what you're basically saying is this.... We drop funding in our military so that every Al Qaeda terrorist thug and their camels can ride into our country, get a Platinum Visa so they can buy terror in bulk while at the same time earning frequent flyer miles. Then give that money to a people who don't want to get a job and suck down our tax dollars so they can take it to the street corners and buy drugs. That is probably something Al Gore would do, OOOPS, I forgot, he DID do it. During the Clinton Administration (similar to a Alpha Beta fraternity kegger gone wild), Goreon cut military spending and increased public spending. Why do you think Sept 11th happened? This is perfect example of the criminal liberal media at work, their thinking, send the boys home, throw a party, and try to make peace with everyone. The problem here isn't too much military spending, its distributing the monies in the proper way. If we had enough military spending before 9/11, and if Clinton didn't tie the CIA's hands by passing a bunch of bureucratic and politically correct liberal bills perhaps we would still have two twin towers in NYC today.

 

[glen]

I think folks are making some great points
However, I don?t want anyone to miss the main point.
One of the explicit purposes of the US government is maintaining an Army.
Maintaining a welfare state never has been the purpose of the government.
As far as the fathers of our country are concerned, we should probably be spending close to ALL of our money on defense and nothing else.

 

[snooker]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: morkinva
Thats billion with a b - each year. This is where your tax dollars are going. An amount of money that is really quite incomprehensible. It dwarfs amounts spent on welfare, education and healthcare. We could eradicate poverty in this country. We could do so much more -- how stupid of us.

Did you not notice the ass-kicking we delivered in response to 3,000 of our civilians being killed?

We would be truly stupid if we were unwilling, or unable, to defend ourselves.

Pull your head out & see the real world, that money is well spent.

Viper GTS

Well said Viper!

I emailed The President yesterday and asked him to send in US troops to assist in the French troops already there in protecting the international population in Ivory Coast. What do I see today on cnn when I got home from work? The US sent 200 Special Forces to Ivory Coast Today to help the French

I was sooo amazed I was reading that, then I got to the part the the US Ambassador to Ivory Coast Requested it, and that is why the troops was sent. Bummed me out.


At least for a moment I was thinking "WOW!!! He actually ordered the deployment of troops because I asked"

 

[FoxHound23]

I agree with glen, our government is not designed for the purpose of our Commander In Chief to sit at a school and read Dr. Seuss to kindergarteners, it is to defend the homeland. Back in the day of Jefferson, Adams, and company, presidents were elected by their great accomplishments, not by kissing babies and flashing peace signs. President U. S. Grant was elected because he was a great General, one of the best ever, but when taking office, he went down in history as one of the worst presidents of all time.....he didn't know what he was doing, his place wasn't behind a desk, it was on the battlefield. Where I'm going with this is this, today the presidency is all about PR, electoral votes, and making sure you teach people in Florida how to vote (sorry to those in Florida, if you are a Floridian, I'm surprised you were able to get this far to read this post). So yea, our government is designed to protect the people of the United States, nothing more, consider all the extra stuff our government does as bonuses. In fact, the very title of the president is a military rank "Commander In Chief".

 

[HendrixFan]

Well, Im not saying we put off nearly all military spending until others catch up with us. You are right in saying we shouldnt allow others to catch up to us. This needs to be put in perspective though. We can wipe out the whole world right now, or any individual country we want, complete annihilation. Other countries are building up such capabilities, it will be inevitable that they eventually reach the same point. Right now only one country has been willing to turn such massive weaponry on citizens, and no one has done so in the past 55 years and counting. The fear of total annihilation is the protector for such advanced and powerful weaponry.

Right now we seem to be the only military capable of full assaults at night, something we started to deploy in the Gulf War. That gives us a huge advantage over any adversary. In sheer numbers we have a much larger army, air force and navy than anyone else; and the technology is far superior. This has been the case for quite sometime, and as I mentioned earlier, each year the gap grows and grows; even though we were clearly superior 10 years ago.

Instead of allowing the gap to grow and grow, we can be reasonable and spend money on balancing the budget and eliminating the national debt, which currently consumes 1/3 of our tax dollars (not including SS and Medicare, which are supposed to be allotted to their individual cause and are therefore seperate from FIT) and will shortly be at 40%. During a bad economy like we currently have, deficits are much more common and harder to escape as the tax base shrinks. With the impending implosion of SS, and national debt nearly out of control, those are far more important than INCREASING our dominance in the military. If we take care of the national debt, that is 1/3 of our tax dollars freed up, for ETERNITY (unless of course we go back into deficit spending). You can do a massive 33% across the board tax cut without touching spending at all. The military can continue to be massive, tax rolls will be like nothing anyone living has ever seen.

To sum up, spending on military is excessive. Yes its necessary to spend money on it, large amounts even. But there is indeed a limit as to what is wise to spend, especially when the country is in dire financial straits.

 

[shiner]

Right now only one country has been willing to turn such massive weaponry on citizens, and no one has done so in the past 55 years and counting.

Ahhh the old "The U.S. nuked Japan" argument. I'm hoping that you do realize that far more people on both sides would have died had their been an invasion of Japan. Let us also not forget the torture Japan unleashed on the Chinese or the biological and chemical warfare the Japanese practiced in China. Whole areas of that country were decimated by the Bubonic Plague unleashed by the Japanese. Hell they even had plans to hit California with a bomb carrying millions of Plague infected fleas in hopes of starting an epidemic here.

 

[ElFenix]

Right now only one country has been willing to turn such massive weaponry on citizens, and no one has done so in the past 55 years and counting.

yeah, its sooo much better to clear mine fields by marching prisoners into them, or load people into ovens and acid showers...

 

[Jugernot]

That is how we keep our way of life.... I don't think minute men would work in the modern day and age.

 

[HendrixFan]

yeah, its sooo much better to clear mine fields by marching prisoners into them, or load people into ovens and acid showers...

Its not any better, in fact that is my exact point. We sunk to a low level, and even though 50 years have passed, thankfully no country (including ourselves) have chosen to unleash such a weapon again.

And shinerburke, I assume since you only responed in the same manner to that one quote, you are in full agreement with the rest of my post?

 

[shiner]

Originally posted by: HendrixFan

And shinerburke, I assume since you only responed in the same manner to that one quote, you are in full agreement with the rest of my post?

No, that part just made me the most angry. You do realize that military spending as a part of the GDP is at nearly an all time low right now don't you? Can't respond much more right now....just got busy at work...

 

[BD231]

Originally posted by: shinerburke

Originally posted by: HendrixFan

And shinerburke, I assume since you only responed in the same manner to that one quote, you are in full agreement with the rest of my post?

No, that part just made me the most angry. You do realize that military spending as a part of the GDP is at nearly an all time low right now don't you? Can't respond much more right now....just got busy at work...

I remember hearing Clinton cut the military budget by more than 25% so I'd agree with the all time low statement. One wonders just WHERE someone would like to see all this "wasted money" go. My own grandmother, 78 years old, american since the day she was born, is stuck on a waiting list for wellfair and she has been for ever 10 years. Curently some imigrant is sitting on their ass getting paid by OUR government to live hear :disgust:. I'm all for a big budget military, but this wellfair sh*t needs an overhaul.

 

[NOX]

Why is the US military budget like 350 billion dollars ?

So they can pay for my education.

Curently some imigrant is sitting on their ass getting paid by OUR government to live hear.

Yep, I watch these people cross the streets almost everyday dodging cars because they are too stupid to use the damn crosswalk! Well, that's what happens when the US bombs their islands to sh*t, with high levels of radiation they can't live there anymore.

 

[PsychoAndy]

You know, if we were isolationists, we probably wouldn't have so many of the problems that we have now.

<---has been reading up on way too much u.s. history between 1783 and 1812

 

[GSOYF]

because we have the best and most expensive "toys" (aka weapons)....got to also consider that we have the most in terms of war machines....example...we have approximately double the carriers that the rest of the world does combined.

bascially, cuz we can go anywhere in the world and fvk up anyone within 24 hrs.
NICE!!!

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: morkinva
Thats billion with a b - each year. This is where your tax dollars are going. An amount of money that is really quite incomprehensible. It dwarfs amounts spent on welfare, education and healthcare. We could eradicate poverty in this country. We could do so much more -- how stupid of us.

It's a historically low amount. Bush promised to raise it considerably but has'nt yet . From the late forties until Bush I we averaged around 7% of GDP on defence but since Clinton and now Bush II we are averaging around 3%. This is an unacceptablebly low amount to act as a real mutlifacted deterent IMO.

 

[FoBoT]

Originally posted by: morkinva
Thats billion with a b - each year. This is where your tax dollars are going. An amount of money that is really quite incomprehensible. It dwarfs amounts spent on welfare, education and healthcare. We could eradicate poverty in this country. We could do so much more -- how stupid of us.

wow, i saw this thread title a day or so ago, i guess i shouldn't be shocked at this beginning post

yeah, you are right, it is a total waste of money, defending ourselves with a military is stupid. we should stop spending every nickle and put it into "welfare, education and healthcare" to "eradicate poverty in this country"

let me guess, young liberal?

 

[TheShiz]

the answer to this is obvious, to maintain the empire. The richer get richer the poorer get poorer. I heard somewhere that the 500 most wealthy people control half of the world's resources. Anyway a lot of those people are americans, where we have 5% of the population and 25% of the wealth. We maintain this by controling the world as we see fit, even if that results in innocent deaths that take place all the time by our blood stained hands as marginalized citizens in our country. It truely is a sad state of affairs and I wish more money would go to the people that actually need it, and that is other countries, not americans. We sit here in our SUVs when people all around the Earth are starving while Americans grow fatter and more wasteful, and we have the audiacity to whine about our economy and we have it so bad. At the same time there are millions upon millions of people somehow managing to live working 12+ hour days for 50 cents a day. This makes many of the things we buy really cheap, but at a serious cost to humanity.

Tim

 

[skibum827]

Originally posted by: morkinva
Thats billion with a b - each year. This is where your tax dollars are going. An amount of money that is really quite incomprehensible. It dwarfs amounts spent on welfare, education and healthcare. We could eradicate poverty in this country. We could do so much more -- how stupid of us.

Well, with the biggest army, we can tell the UN to go to h@!! if they don't agree with us on what to do with Iraq. Because we have the biggest army, who is going to stop us?

It costs a lot of money to be the biggest bully on the playground in this day and age.

I agree that we need an army, but do we really need an army that is so much bigger than everybody elses. Wouldn't it be better to use more diplomacy and get more help from other countries when dealing with world wide problems.

 

[Kadarin]

Originally posted by: skibum827

Originally posted by: morkinva
Thats billion with a b - each year. This is where your tax dollars are going. An amount of money that is really quite incomprehensible. It dwarfs amounts spent on welfare, education and healthcare. We could eradicate poverty in this country. We could do so much more -- how stupid of us.

Well, with the biggest army, we can tell the UN to go to h@!! if they don't agree with us on what to do with Iraq. Because we have the biggest army, who is going to stop us?

It costs a lot of money to be the biggest bully on the playground in this day and age.

I agree that we need an army, but do we really need an army that is so much bigger than everybody elses. Wouldn't it be better to use more diplomacy and get more help from other countries when dealing with world wide problems.

The US armed forces aren't necessarily "bigger"; they are, however, the most well-equipped and well-trained, and technologically advanced. And getting other countries to agree with the US point of view in dealing with world problems is, like the Iraq situation teaches us, akin to herding cats.

 

[smp]

Originally posted by: Viper GTS

Originally posted by: notfred

Originally posted by: Vortex Sure, we could erradicate poverty in the country. But how would we defend ourselves? Some other country sees us with no millitary and were done with.

Like they did to Canada, right?

Canada doesn't need to spend a lot on their military, they're sitting right on top of the world's most powerful nation. We have a good 30% of their borders covered for them, we're treaty members with them (NATO), and they're our neighbors. I don't mind them benefitting from our military presence, but the fact is they've got themselves a damn good deal. Viper GTS

YEAH THE ONLY REASON THAT NO ONE FVCKS WITH US IS BECAUSE OF THE ALMIGHTY U.S!!
Thank you!
Please bend over so I can kiss your ass now! Thanks!

Shut up!
There are plenty of countries, in Europe and elsewhere, believe it or not, that have even LESS of a military than Canada, and they don't get fvcked with either.
How the hell do you explain that?!?