Why don't people care what college costs?

[theApp]

Speaking of college costs, if you're a science/engineering major, I highly recommend looking into this fellowship...
http://www.asee.org/fellowships/smart/

I participated in it during the first year and it pays for basically everything, courses + stipend for housing, books, etc. We didn't get health insurance though, like now 🙁 You're required to do a 1:1 ratio of time for the government after you graduate, but you come in working like a regular full time civil service employee (exact same pay, same benefits like retirement and health insurance). It's great experience if you want to go into private industry and it's a great foot in the door if you want to work for the government for a longer time.

 

[Pollock]

Originally posted by: James3shin
Where you go does matter, as well as how well a student does at that school. If you had to pick between two graduates, both great students with exceptional grades, except one went to a Ivy league school and the other went to a state school, which would you choose? I know I would pick the Ivy league kid - Where you go to school counts.

That seems wrong to me.

It's never that simple.

 

[MagnusTheBrewer]

Originally posted by: Pollock

Originally posted by: James3shin
Where you go does matter, as well as how well a student does at that school. If you had to pick between two graduates, both great students with exceptional grades, except one went to a Ivy league school and the other went to a state school, which would you choose? I know I would pick the Ivy league kid - Where you go to school counts.

That seems wrong to me.

It's never that simple.

I'd pick the older married student.

Only a very few fields, and only a few places within those fields, give a rats ass about where you got your degree.

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: James3shin
Where you go does matter, as well as how well a student does at that school. If you had to pick between two graduates, both great students with exceptional grades, except one went to a Ivy league school and the other went to a state school, which would you choose? I know I would pick the Ivy league kid - Where you go to school counts.

If you read the article, it says the percentage of executives who went to elite schools has been declining over the years.

I'm not saying it doesn't matter, only that it doesn't matter as much as it used to.

In addition, the article also makes the point that while the cost of the college has increased, the starting salaries of the undergraduates has not increased in line with the cost of the college. This means the ROI of their education is steadily decreasing.

If the elite schools continued to raise their prices, there would have to be some point at which you would stop and think "Hmm, maybe this isn't worth the cost anymore", right?

 

[evident]

what a fucking FUD article. my college education is priceless

Originally posted by: Naustica

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman

Also, top schools will also have more companies that come to recruit/hire, have strong alumni networks and career resources.

Probably the best perk of going to a top school.

this x1000000000000000

 

[Slew Foot]

It seasy not to care about the cost of things that dont come out of your pocket right away. Houses, health care, you pay a little at a time or via 3rd parties so the impact of the total price doesnt enter into the minds of most people.

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: paulxcook

Originally posted by: Maleficus
financial aid that you still have to pay back... it's not like you are catching a price break here.

What are you talking about? Financial aid != loans. Think grants, scholarships, work-study programs, etc.

I think it depends on what the university considers "financial aid". Maybe it's a question of semantics, but my undergraduate university did count loans as "financial aid", along with grants and work study programs.

After you were accepted, they mailed you a packet of information that contained their offer of financial aid to you. For me, this consisted of grants, loans, and a work study program.

If the sticker price of the school goes up, and the financial aid offers increase by offering more loans to the students, then I would argue they really aren't any better off.

Also, a number of student loan lenders have cut back or eliminated their student loan programs after the credit crunch hit last August.

The maximum amount of subsidized Stafford loans a college student can take out has not increased since 1992, which seems kind of wrong to me.

Finally, does anyone else find it odd that you can finance a new car at a lower interest rate than an education? Stafford loans are currently at 6.8% fixed, and Grad Plus loans are at 8.5% fixed. The undergraduate Stafford loans' interest rate will be gradually phased down to 3.4% over the next few years, but will then jump back up to 6.8% for an indefinite period of time. Graduate Stafford loans will remain at 6.8%.

I just find it wrong that you can finance a new car for less than an education. You would think that the loans would have a low interest rate since they are guaranteed by the government.

 

[DanDaManJC]

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: paulxcook

Originally posted by: Maleficus
financial aid that you still have to pay back... it's not like you are catching a price break here.

What are you talking about? Financial aid != loans. Think grants, scholarships, work-study programs, etc.

I think it depends on what the university considers "financial aid". Maybe it's a question of semantics, but my undergraduate university did count loans as "financial aid", along with grants and work study programs.

After you were accepted, they mailed you a packet of information that contained their offer of financial aid to you. For me, this consisted of grants, loans, and a work study program.

If the sticker price of the school goes up, and the financial aid offers increase by offering more loans to the students, then I would argue they really aren't any better off.

Also, a number of student loan lenders have cut back or eliminated their student loan programs after the credit crunch hit last August.

The maximum amount of subsidized Stafford loans a college student can take out has not increased since 1992, which seems kind of wrong to me.

Finally, does anyone else find it odd that you can finance a new car at a lower interest rate than an education? Stafford loans are currently at 6.8% fixed, and Grad Plus loans are at 8.5% fixed. The undergraduate Stafford loans' interest rate will be gradually phased down to 3.4% over the next few years, but will then jump back up to 6.8% for an indefinite period of time. Graduate Stafford loans will remain at 6.8%.

I just find it wrong that you can finance a new car for less than an education. You would think that the loans would have a low interest rate since they are guaranteed by the government.

Yeah but a lot of kids out of high school don't really have any real credit history either.

 

[LS8]

My sister wanted to go to an acting school. The cost was around $65k for two years. I was shocked. She didn't go, thankfully. She would have happily bankrupted my father though and then done nothing with the schooling. She works as a hotel clerk now.

 

[Ronstang]

Originally posted by: LS8
My sister wanted to go to an acting school. The cost was around $65k for two years. I was shocked. She didn't go, thankfully. She would have happily bankrupted my father though and then done nothing with the schooling. She works as a hotel clerk now.

Luckily for her she always has a vagina to fall back on.

 

[Mo0o]

Dont go to a shitty expensive private school when you get the same from a mediocre state school.

It's only worth it to shell out the big bucks when you can get into a top20 elite school. If you're going into a really comeptitive field, it definitely helps to have an impressive diploma.

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: DanDaManJC

Originally posted by: Special K

Originally posted by: paulxcook

Originally posted by: Maleficus
financial aid that you still have to pay back... it's not like you are catching a price break here.

What are you talking about? Financial aid != loans. Think grants, scholarships, work-study programs, etc.

I think it depends on what the university considers "financial aid". Maybe it's a question of semantics, but my undergraduate university did count loans as "financial aid", along with grants and work study programs.

After you were accepted, they mailed you a packet of information that contained their offer of financial aid to you. For me, this consisted of grants, loans, and a work study program.

If the sticker price of the school goes up, and the financial aid offers increase by offering more loans to the students, then I would argue they really aren't any better off.

Also, a number of student loan lenders have cut back or eliminated their student loan programs after the credit crunch hit last August.

The maximum amount of subsidized Stafford loans a college student can take out has not increased since 1992, which seems kind of wrong to me.

Finally, does anyone else find it odd that you can finance a new car at a lower interest rate than an education? Stafford loans are currently at 6.8% fixed, and Grad Plus loans are at 8.5% fixed. The undergraduate Stafford loans' interest rate will be gradually phased down to 3.4% over the next few years, but will then jump back up to 6.8% for an indefinite period of time. Graduate Stafford loans will remain at 6.8%.

I just find it wrong that you can finance a new car for less than an education. You would think that the loans would have a low interest rate since they are guaranteed by the government.

Yeah but a lot of kids out of high school don't really have any real credit history either.

Credit history is not a factor for government-backed loans. They don't even look at it. Private loans do depend on your credit history, but the government has nothing to do with those.

 

[CottonRabbit]

Originally posted by: kranky

Originally posted by: James3shin
Where you go does matter, as well as how well a student does at that school. If you had to pick between two graduates, both great students with exceptional grades, except one went to a Ivy league school and the other went to a state school, which would you choose? I know I would pick the Ivy league kid - Where you go to school counts.

I would argue that there are going to be factors that differentiate the two, even if both have exceptional grades. And if everything is indeed equal, I would lean towards the state school grad. In my experience hiring new employees, the state school grads simply work harder. The Ivy Leaguers feel as though they are owed something.

All of the hardest working students in my high school class went on to top private schools. I don't know why some people here have an impression that students at private school didn't need to work hard to get there and do well.

 

[Fenixgoon]

Originally posted by: Farang
It baffles me why anyone would choose anything other than an in-state public school, unless you get into a few select schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton, maybe some others) it really isn't worth the cost. It is laughable how much more expensive private schools are, I think you're right that people don't even consider the cost.

in the case of UMD, my dad wouldn't let me apply there because of the annoyances he had with my two brothers 😛

i ended up going to drexel (i'm an engineer), and the cost isn't too bad since i have a nice scholarship

 

[Special K]

Originally posted by: CottonRabbit

Originally posted by: kranky

Originally posted by: James3shin
Where you go does matter, as well as how well a student does at that school. If you had to pick between two graduates, both great students with exceptional grades, except one went to a Ivy league school and the other went to a state school, which would you choose? I know I would pick the Ivy league kid - Where you go to school counts.

I would argue that there are going to be factors that differentiate the two, even if both have exceptional grades. And if everything is indeed equal, I would lean towards the state school grad. In my experience hiring new employees, the state school grads simply work harder. The Ivy Leaguers feel as though they are owed something.

All of the hardest working students in my high school class went on to top private schools. I don't know why some people here have an impression that students at private school didn't need to work hard to get there and do well.

The article is arguing whether or not an expensive private school is really worth the cost, and whether it will continue to be worth the cost in the future given that college costs are rising dramatically. As I said in a previous post, there would obviously be some price point at which students and parents would have to question whether or not going to an expensive private school is truly worth the cost.

Whether or not the person who attends such a school actually works hard isn't even part of the argument.

 

[Throwmeabone]

Wow the website with the article takes you to a full page flash ad that you can't skip. Fuck you CNN.

 

[EricMartello]

College is a great scam they got going on...I remember when I was in high school, the "you need college to succeed" propaganda started during my sophomore year and got more 'intense' for the remaining two years. They really shove that whole, "go to college or you'll end up pumping gas in NJ for the rest of your life" thing.

Bullshit.

Your success (or lack thereof) totally rests on your desire to identify goals in your life, pursue them, and achieve them. If your goals are academic in nature, such as being a mathematician, doctor, lawyer...then yes, college should be viewed as an investment, because those fields are "closed" in a sense and require formal education...but if you are choosing any of those professions because you think it's a good way to make money (and money is your only reason), expect to fail.

MOST people in college are simply taking up space. They are under the misconception that college = automatic success in life, that once they get out everything will be smooth sailng. No, it does not work like that. A degree is simply a document that says you spent 2-4 years at a given school, and it will not magically propel you to wealth upon graduation. Upon graduation, however, you will be jobless 23-24 yrs old and $20-$50K plus in debt. 🙂

The best bet for a lot of people, especially the fools who seriously buy into the scam, is to take a break from schooling after high school graduation and see what's out there. Experience is the best teacher, and it usually doesn't cost anything.

 

[Jeff7]

Originally posted by: Throwmeabone
Wow the website with the article takes you to a full page flash ad that you can't skip. Fuck you CNN.

Firefox + Adblock Plus = 🙂

If I accidentally start browsing on a college PC with IE, my god the Internet looks like a nightmare. Irritating, flashing ads everywhere.


Advertising dept: "Maybe if we make our ads really goddamned annoying, more people will buy from us!"

Maybe that works on some people. A lot of ads, such as the one you described, make me want to find the person responsible, and ship them to Antarctica, possibly with some supplies.


I'm at Penn State's Erie, PA campus. In my freshman year already, the Alumni Association was calling me, asking for donations. I just started at the damn place, and they're already asking for money? Yes, because college students typically have loads of spare cash lying around that they can use for unsolicited donations.

They recently built a new $30M business/engineering building - the idea was that the business and engineering students would just mingle in the halls constantly, and magically acquire each others skills somehow. Business students tend to think that engineers are stuck up and arrogant, and engineers think that business students are really goddamn lazy, and have a very easy major.

Some of the money was well-used - there are new machines in the ME labs, such as engine lathes and a few big CNC mills, and the plastics department has at least 10 different injection molding machines.
But some of it was spent (and continues to be wasted) on making the building look all snazzy. The aluminum railings are held up by sheets of thick tempered glass, instead of short walls of some composite material, or else aluminum columns. And a lot of the outer "walls" are all glass and aluminum. Erie gets quite cold and windy in the winter. Even dual-pane glass isn't really very good at retaining heat, and the aluminum supports between the panes are excellent at bleeding out heat. If you sit at one of the desks in the hallway that happens to be near a window, you can feel a bit of a breeze coming off the window, due to the natural convection of the cooled air sinking off of it.
The heating bills are insane.

 

[Kadarin]

As someone who has interviewed a lot of people for the tech industry, I can say that in my field (network engineering related), work experience matters a hell of a lot more than education. I'm concerned about your education insofar as how I feel about how well you can present yourself and effectively communicate with our customers. I don't care whether you went to Harvard, MIT, or San Jose State.

 

[Acanthus]

That is why i love good old Illinois.

It is law that all classes from community colleges that meet state accred. reqs. must transfer to 4 year programs at any school in the state.

If you cant control your costs, opportunists will take your customers.

 

[Acanthus]

Originally posted by: Jeff7

Originally posted by: Throwmeabone
Wow the website with the article takes you to a full page flash ad that you can't skip. Fuck you CNN.

Firefox + Adblock Plus = 🙂

If I accidentally start browsing on a college PC with IE, my god the Internet looks like a nightmare. Irritating, flashing ads everywhere.


Advertising dept: "Maybe if we make our ads really goddamned annoying, more people will buy from us!"

Maybe that works on some people. A lot of ads, such as the one you described, make me want to find the person responsible, and ship them to Antarctica, possibly with some supplies.


I'm at Penn State's Erie, PA campus. In my freshman year already, the Alumni Association was calling me, asking for donations. I just started at the damn place, and they're already asking for money? Yes, because college students typically have loads of spare cash lying around that they can use for unsolicited donations.

They recently built a new $30M business/engineering building - the idea was that the business and engineering students would just mingle in the halls constantly, and magically acquire each others skills somehow. Business students tend to think that engineers are stuck up and arrogant, and engineers think that business students are really goddamn lazy, and have a very easy major.

Some of the money was well-used - there are new machines in the ME labs, such as engine lathes and a few big CNC mills, and the plastics department has at least 10 different injection molding machines.
But some of it was spent (and continues to be wasted) on making the building look all snazzy. The aluminum railings are held up by sheets of thick tempered glass, instead of short walls of some composite material, or else aluminum columns. And a lot of the outer "walls" are all glass and aluminum. Erie gets quite cold and windy in the winter. Even dual-pane glass isn't really very good at retaining heat, and the aluminum supports between the panes are excellent at bleeding out heat. If you sit at one of the desks in the hallway that happens to be near a window, you can feel a bit of a breeze coming off the window, due to the natural convection of the cooled air sinking off of it.
The heating bills are insane.

I've lived in Erie and have been on the Behrend campus 🙂

The building is a bit flashy, but also remember that they moved the ENTIRE ENGINEERING PROGRAM for all PSU schools including from PSU main and all of the satellite schools to Behrend with that new building.

They are consolidating the entire engineering school to one campus to improve the student experience, and Behrend is very reasonably priced when you compare it to Main.

I was a prospective PSU Engineering student that went business... and i used to make fun of the guys that jumped ship.

Business is easier, as someone who did both... However pay is similar and i couldnt handle the stress of Engineering regardless of my desire to build and design things. I also spoke to a lot of engineers at GE who describe their jobs as "95% bullshit and 5% actually designing things".

Edit: I gots bad grammar.

 

[Jumpem]

$60k in student loans between the wife and I. Though we wouldn't have the jobs we have today without it.

 

[Jumpem]

Originally posted by: nonameo
That said, it seems to me like the 4 year degree is becoming more of a proof of social standing than anything to show you know your shit.

How so? My wife and I both graduated from RIT , but came from very poor backgrounds.

 

[Jumpem]

Originally posted by: Capt Caveman
😕 So, you'd rather owe money toward college loans than have that money to use for a car, house, etc?

I never would have been able to afford a house on the ~$8/hr I made before college. Three years out of college we are making $120k, and have a house a nd a new car.

 

[Jumpem]

Originally posted by: Farang
It baffles me why anyone would choose anything other than an in-state public school, unless you get into a few select schools (Harvard, Yale, Princeton, maybe some others) it really isn't worth the cost. It is laughable how much more expensive private schools are, I think you're right that people don't even consider the cost.

The private school we went to (RIT) has a mandatory co-op requirement of six to twelve months depending on major. Having paid experiences from employers in our field is what helped us obtain the positions we have now.