Why does Windows suck so much?

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sandorski

No Lifer
Oct 10, 1999
70,779
6,339
126
There are tons of apps that use the VC++ libraries.

Disregarding how easy they are or aren't to install, is there really a compelling reason as to why they're not included in the OS?

From what I understand, it's because Software Developers make changes to the Libraries directly, to make them more suited to their Apps. So there is no single Library.
 

Spungo

Diamond Member
Jul 22, 2012
3,217
2
81
Because Microsoft is a sloppy company. Microsoft would be the equivalent of General Motors in the late 1970s

They are the #1 in volume sales for Operating Systems. This means they do not really care to improve the framework of the operating system.

Window OS is a sloppy crufty operating system compared to OS X.

MS is a weird company. It seems to have a lot of really smart people and a lot of really dumb people. They'll innovate then screw it up beyond belief. They were in the mobile market long before Google, but they somehow screwed that up. The original Xbox was awesome, but then they abandoned it. Xbox 360 was a great machine.... when it worked. Then they completely gave up the lead by releasing the Xbone. Windows 7 was a huge success. Then Windows 8 came. Internet browsing was IE vs Netscape at one point, but now nobody uses IE. Hotmail existed long before Gmail, but Hotmail is completely dead while Gmail lives on.
 

Ichinisan

Lifer
Oct 9, 2002
28,298
1,235
136
From what I understand, it's because Software Developers make changes to the Libraries directly, to make them more suited to their Apps. So there is no single Library.

From my brief experience with VS6, it's because some objects you kids use in the VS IDE might require a certain OCX / DLL type of file.

I remember playing with Visual Basic and being extremely disappointed when simply adding a number box with an up/down arrow (like you see in the Windows time/date dialog) required a MFC resource so my simple proggy needed to be distributed as an installer. :(
 

brianmanahan

Lifer
Sep 2, 2006
24,624
6,011
136
preemptive nomination for self-ownage thread of 2015

the app you're trying to install is not bundled correctly, blame the devs, not the OS

and deal with it
 

Puppies04

Diamond Member
Apr 25, 2011
5,909
17
76
I bought a TV and it didn't come with a plug. Now I can't watch TV. Whoever built this house is stupid!
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
From what I understand, it's because Software Developers make changes to the Libraries directly, to make them more suited to their Apps. So there is no single Library.

If the library is modified, then why does a stock download from Microsoft fix the problem? Why is it not installed with the rest of the app? And many apps don't have installers and assume you already have tge libraries from having installed other software.
 

88keys

Golden Member
Aug 24, 2012
1,854
12
81
This. Macs are great for some folks compared to Windows, others not so much. They are different.

That being said, updating Windows is not a difficult task, though OSX is better at this. I think generally if you don't like windows or don't like OSX, you are going to let yourself get frustrated more quickly at things. Trick is to know that, and then stop it.

OS's can improve a lot. OSX is in the lead IMO for home type users usability as well as flaire. I expect windows 10 to do good things, 8 was not a great sign though.

I agree. The way I look at is that if you want to have customization along with ease of use, then Windows is pretty much your only choice. It will require some effort or hassle on your part installing updates and dealing with malware and such, but if you do this you can have a fairly well secured system.
If you want Customization and Security, you go with Linux/Unix. This will require alot of effort on your part and you may need to make sacrifices in terms of hardware and software compatibility but if you're willing to take on a steep learning curve you can have a very secure OS running exactly how you want it.


If you want the security that Unix based OSes offer without all the hassle and hardware/software options that are comparable to Windows, then fork over the premium and buy a Mac.
They won't let you make alot of changes because they control the sandbox which allows the OS to be user friendly and secure at the same time.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
60,000
10,485
126
If the library is modified, then why does a stock download from Microsoft fix the problem?

Perhaps they aren't authorized to distribute MS software. If they included a subset, a later full install might confuse the system. They should tell you specifically what is needed as a dependency though. Generic errors are bullshit.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
60,000
10,485
126
How is Mac OS less customizable than Windows or Linux?

Really?! The differences between Windows and OSX aren't as great, but you can customize GNU/Linux into a whole new o/s. You can turn that into anything you want as long as it's technically possible.
 

lxskllr

No Lifer
Nov 30, 2004
60,000
10,485
126
But Microsoft is! That's my whole point.

I mean the original software. MS doesn't know what program X needs. Program X needs to state the exact library and revision in the error message. If Windows had decent package management, it would simply fetch the required packages. So far, that kind of innovation has eluded them...
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
I mean the original software. MS doesn't know what program X needs. Program X needs to state the exact library and revision in the error message. If Windows had decent package management, it would simply fetch the required packages. So far, that kind of innovation has eluded them...

So the libraries are independent of one another and not cross-compatible.

Including VC++ is as essential as Flash or Java (which are included) only this is a library is made by Microsoft themselves and not a third party.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
I mean the original software. MS doesn't know what program X needs. Program X needs to state the exact library and revision in the error message. If Windows had decent package management, it would simply fetch the required packages. So far, that kind of innovation has eluded them...

When you program an app for iOS or Mac, the recipient doesn't need to know what version of software the program was created with. It just works out of the box.
 

SolMiester

Diamond Member
Dec 19, 2004
5,330
17
76
You install a new program and you can't run it because of a cryptic error message. Turns out you need Visual C++ runtime libraries. Isn't that made by Microsoft? Why wouldn't they just include it with the OS?

Okay, let's hunt for that installer. Do I need 2008, 2010, 2012, or 2013? Because they're all completely different and not included in the same installer. No, that would make too much sense. Do you need 64-bit or 32-bit? Because they're also different, incompatible, and not included in the same archive or with the OS.

Oops, I downloaded the update for Visual Studio, not the runtime libraries. Let's go back to that website and hunt through a list longer than my arm. What's SP1? No, I do not want to install the Bing Bar, asshole.

Of course they couldn't just include it with Windows Update. That would be too convenient.

And Windows Update. Man, this piece of crap. You have to run it, download, install, restart, run it, download, install, restart, run it, download, install, restart. Repeat this 20 more times and just maybe you'll have all the necessary updates. Maybe.

meh, I hate apple O/S, no proper uninstaller!....how crap is that!
 

MongGrel

Lifer
Dec 3, 2013
38,466
3,067
121
2005 called. They want their complaint back.

Seriously, if you're having this issue, stop using shitty applications that don't properly package required redistributables with their application.



If by "most" you mean "virtually none except trivial applications or applications that DO have installers with the required dependencies but you're too elitist to use the installer so you're setting yourself up to look like an ignorant asshat in thread just like this..." :hmm:

Gets my vote.
 

Rakehellion

Lifer
Jan 15, 2013
12,181
35
91
A lot of butthurt nerds missing the point on purpose. Did Bill Gates give you a handy when you were feeling down?
 

brianmanahan

Lifer
Sep 2, 2006
24,624
6,011
136
A lot of butthurt nerds missing the point on purpose. Did Bill Gates give you a handy when you were feeling down?

nah, just poking fun at someone who thinks that installing VC++ libs is laborious enough to whine about it on a tech forum