Why are users so upset about the Mass Effect 3 ending? (Spoilers)

[ramj70]

Not that Im in favor of how the ending went down but there are some things that I interpreted differently.

1. All the hate negativity over the “god boy”, am I the only one that thought that he was some entity (be it synthetic, synthesized, highly evolved organic) without a physical form so he manifested himself from an image that was ingrained into Shepards mind?

2. The cycle premise not making sence I may be mixing up with what the ending was and all the fan endings and debates I read. The way I see the cycle is that an ancient race made synthetic lifeforms (like the Geth) and were forced into war and to destroy them. Knowing that ultimately synthetic and organic life cannot coexist and synthetic life being ”better” (virtual immortal, nearly infinite growth potential) that eventually synthetic life would destroy ALL organic life (advanced to simple).

To prevent that from occurring they created/ascended into the reapers which are actually synthesized beings. Leaving behind the citadel and relay network so all future advanced species would naturally expand along a known path. Every 50k years they come back and harvest the advanced species before they can cause irreparable harm to the universe by creating synthetic life. When they are harvested and help them become part of the reapers (think of it like the many hundreds of Geth minds in Legion). They leave the fledgling species alone to progress normally until they too are a danger to ALL organic life and the cycle repeats.


3. The Normandy scene I agree is the most confusing not sure why they are running away. As for your squadmates being there maybe I didn’t look around during the race to the beam but I didn’t see them, besides after you hit you hear them saying it was a failure and to fall back and regroup maybe that’s what they did?


4. The relays were destroyed just as the “being” said they would, they were part of the reaper design and to mess with that design would break the system. Also without the “crutch” of the relays each species would have to develop at their own pace and not make quantum leap progress due to discovering functioning alien technology.


5. As for stranded starving aliens left behind after the assault I will give you that the stranded bit sucks but I imagine most thought they were going to die anyway. As for starving I would imagine existing food processing\technology would provide for those left behind. Its feasible to believe that human food could be modified in such a way that it was non-toxic to other races, at the time of the game it was likely just impractical given the ease of moving around cargo with the relay network but with real need Im sure it could have been done.

The thing is though everything at the end forces massive speculation on pretty much everything. There is no closure as the developers said there would be. Up until the end there seemed to be closure and clarity but it was all thrown out with the ending with some star child that comes out of left field. They said the end would not be like lost but it is in a way.

All through the series we have Shepard who is going to stop and destroy the reapers, nothing they say can change his mind. All of sudden this genocidal star child pops up and Shepard buys everything he says. So unlike Shepard. Also the Geth were not trying to destroy organics, they wanted to live in peace. But here comes the reapers to convince some of them to help wipe out organics. The ending is very poorly written compared to the rest of the game. This is why people are upset.

 

[TheKub]

Also the Geth were not trying to destroy organics, they wanted to live in peace.

Correct at the present time that is the case, will that be the case forever? Thats what the kid was talking about that that at some point one will turn on the other be it the Geth outnumber all organic life 5 to 1 and start taking over organic worlds for resources or the organics launching a preemptive strike.

I guess I can't comment on what the developers stated prior/during launch, as I didnt really follow any of that. As much as I like to have everything laid out for me, there is something to be said to leaving some detail open to interpretation (just maybe not at this scale). I can understand "the cycle", why the relay network needed to be destroyed, and the inclusion of the 3 choices (though I would have rather seen more cinematics of the battle for earth being directly related to your choices in the series).

 

[dighn]

Correct at the present time that is the case, will that be the case forever? Thats what the kid was talking about that that at some point one will turn on the other be it the Geth outnumber all organic life 5 to 1 and start taking over organic worlds for resources or the organics launching a preemptive strike.

I guess I can't comment on what the developers stated prior/during launch, as I didnt really follow any of that. As much as I like to have everything laid out for me, there is something to be said to leaving some detail open to interpretation (just maybe not at this scale). I can understand "the cycle", why the relay network needed to be destroyed, and the inclusion of the 3 choices (though I would have rather seen more cinematics of the battle for earth being directly related to your choices in the series).

I think the ideas of the endings are sound, they just need to be better fleshed out and executed. I like the idea behind synthesis, but its execution is laughable, with a magical wave of energy forming "new DNA" and giving everything from people to trees circuit tattoos. What does it even do? etc. More details on the outcomes of the other choices would also be welcome.

Endings are hard to get right, but for such an acclaimed and long standing series, it really did need a bit more.

 

[Zenoth]

I was checking the BioWare forums, saw that video (about the ending and related issues), pretty well done.

 

[ramj70]

I was checking the BioWare forums, saw that video (about the ending and related issues), pretty well done.

I was checking the BioWare forums, saw that video (about the ending and related issues), pretty well done.

Very long video but well done.

Also the ME3 endings are almost identical to the three choices you are given in Deus Ex at the end.

 

[surfsatwerk]

Very long video but well done.

Also the ME3 endings are almost identical to the three choices you are given in Deus Ex at the end.

Which were also bullshit.

 

[Madia]

I was checking the BioWare forums, saw that video (about the ending and related issues), pretty well done.

My favorite video reaction to the ending is still on of the earliest ones found here. Spoilers of course.

The ending speech from Shepard probably has the same throughts everyone had the first time they saw the ending. "I saw... I'm not sure what I saw. Death. Destruction. Nothing's really clear."

 

[Puffnstuff]

Well the ending left a lot to be desired IMHO. When Shepard left the Normandy it was supposed to rejoin sword which was in orbit of earth. Next we see Joker feverishly working the controls trying to outrun the wave which didn't make any sense to me. The choices were too limited and why did it have to kill all synthetics when we were led to believe that the crucible was specifically for the reapers. Why did all of the mass relays have to be destroyed? Just too many things wrong about this ending for me.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

IGN just put up an hour video of them discussing how stupid the ending is.

 

[RampantAndroid]

IGN just put up an hour video of them discussing how stupid the ending is.

Was Chobot cited as being a problem with the game too?

 

[AznAnarchy99]

Was Chobot cited as being a problem with the game too?

They never mentioned her once, even when they started going through all the romances lol.

 

[HarvardAce]

Have to agree with most of the posts here. I had heard the ending was disappointing, so I had very low expectations for it...and it still disappointed me.

I could even have been ok with how the choices at the end didn't affect the ending much if they wanted to go with some fatalistic/predetermination theme, but if you wanted to go that route you had to build up to it a bit more, and still tie up a few loose ends rather than opening up 100 more.

What we really wanted at the end was closure...and we got anything but that. A well-done cliffhanger would be like the one at the end of Inception,

Spoiler

where you don't know if the top is going to keep spinning or not

. People talked about the ending and gave their reasonings for one interpretation or the other. In ME3, the "indoctrination" interpretation is just wishful thinking on the part of people who want to try and explain away a crappy ending. If that was truly their intent, they would have needed to be a bit more conspicuous about it to hint at "there really is more to this story than meets the eye." The only reason people were thinking that at the end of ME3 was because the thought was really "this really can't be all there is to the story, can it?"

 

[Zenoth]

Have to agree with most of the posts here. I had heard the ending was disappointing, so I had very low expectations for it...and it still disappointed me.

I could even have been ok with how the choices at the end didn't affect the ending much if they wanted to go with some fatalistic/predetermination theme, but if you wanted to go that route you had to build up to it a bit more, and still tie up a few loose ends rather than opening up 100 more.

What we really wanted at the end was closure...and we got anything but that. A well-done cliffhanger would be like the one at the end of Inception,

Spoiler

where you don't know if the top is going to keep spinning or not

. People talked about the ending and gave their reasonings for one interpretation or the other. In ME3, the "indoctrination" interpretation is just wishful thinking on the part of people who want to try and explain away a crappy ending. If that was truly their intent, they would have needed to be a bit more conspicuous about it to hint at "there really is more to this story than meets the eye." The only reason people were thinking that at the end of ME3 was because the thought was really "this really can't be all there is to the story, can it?"

Yeah I agree.

When a fanbase (any extent of it) actually try to connect dots by themselves and come up with the idea that the ending happened in a dream, or was indoctrination, rather than any of it being "real" and intended to be the way it was, that's because you (as a writer) fucked up real good. And as far as story-telling goes, as a writer, it's common rule to never include a completely new theme or character out of nowhere.

There should have been foreshadowing about the Catalyst entity itself *and* the Crucible sometime during ME1 or ME2... and if not then at least in one of the various novels or even the short comics (but that wouldn't have helped much since... let's face it, the majority of the ME fans have never read any of them, heck, most ME fans haven't read most of the in-game Codex).

 

[RampantAndroid]

Yeah I agree.

When a fanbase (any extent of it) actually try to connect dots by themselves and come up with the idea that the ending happened in a dream, or was indoctrination, rather than any of it being "real" and intended to be the way it was, that's because you (as a writer) fucked up real good. And as far as story-telling goes, as a writer, it's common rule to never include a completely new theme or character out of nowhere.

There should have been foreshadowing about the Catalyst entity itself *and* the Crucible sometime during ME1 or ME2... and if not then at least in one of the various novels or even the short comics (but that wouldn't have helped much since... let's face it, the majority of the ME fans have never read any of them, heck, most ME fans haven't read most of the in-game Codex).

As bad as the endings for Deus Ex HR were, they didn't create some new enemy at the end...but really, the endings of ME3 tried to copy the endings of Deus Ex 1.

Control: Merge with Helios
Destroy: Nuke Area 51
Synthesis: take out Bob Page (head of the Illuminati, or whatever) and continue to run the world with an invisible hand.

How creative.

 

[QuantumPion]

Based on how well the Tuchanka and Rannoch missions ended I was expecting something similar for the end of the final game. I am disappoint.

 

[Beev]

Which ending is considered cannon?

I beat the game last night and I went with the one where I took control, and the ending wasn't "bad" per se, just extremely underwhelming. My major confusion is, the cycle ended yet Joker et al are still alive? How? Why?

 

[RampantAndroid]

Which ending is considered cannon?

I beat the game last night and I went with the one where I took control, and the ending wasn't "bad" per se, just extremely underwhelming. My major confusion is, the cycle ended yet Joker et al are still alive? How? Why?

Better: Why do the relays blow? If they blow, do they take all systems containing a relay with them like in Arrival? Why the eff did the normandy leave? Why does the catalyst exist?

So many unanswered questions.

As for canon, we don't know. We won't know until another game is made that builds on ME3, if another game is made. Given the outrage over ME3 right now, I seriously question the future of ME, and Bioware as a whole. ME3 was for me the final litmus test on whether EA killed the essence of Bioware - the answer seems to be a solid yes. Bioware was full of themselves, they thought the opinions of the consumer did not matter. Look at DA3 for example: everyone complained about DA2. Bioware acted surprised and continued down the same road for DA3. It wasn't until ME3 hit and people went nuts that they decided to seek "community feedback" on DA3. It took them a YEAR to figure out they needed to involve other people.

I don't care if it is Bioware, Microsoft, Apple or anyone else: you're making a product FOR the consumer, not telling the consumer what they want. You don't belittle them when they are unhappy with your product, you stop and reflect on why you missed the mark, fix it if you can, and learn from your misstep. If you don't, you should damn well go out of business.

 

[bebopulation]

Good video explaining indoctrination theory for those interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ythY_GkEBck

 

[dighn]

As bad as the endings for Deus Ex HR were, they didn't create some new enemy at the end...but really, the endings of ME3 tried to copy the endings of Deus Ex 1.

Control: Merge with Helios
Destroy: Nuke Area 51
Synthesis: take out Bob Page (head of the Illuminati, or whatever) and continue to run the world with an invisible hand.

How creative.

not sure how you get illuminate/invisible hand out of the synthesis option. to me it's more inline with the helios merge, while control is the illuminati option.

 

[AznAnarchy99]

Good video explaining indoctrination theory for those interested:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ythY_GkEBck

If any of that turns out to be true, then Bioware did a shitty job pushing it to us.

 

[RampantAndroid]

If any of that turns out to be true, then Bioware did a shitty job pushing it to us.

No they didn't. Go buy the DLC when it is released, you cheapskate!

DLC 1: Add ending scene for red ending: 1600 MS points
DLC 2: Add ending scene for blue ending: 1600 MS points
DLC 3: Add ending scene for green ending: 1600 MS points

not sure how you get illuminate/invisible hand out of the synthesis option. to me it's more inline with the helios merge, while control is the illuminati option.

Synthesis changes ALL people by merging them. Control is just Shepard becoming one with the reapers. Right?

Taking over the Illuminati is affecting everyone by changing/managing what they think. Control simply takes over/merges with an AI and controls it, and whatever the AI can have influence over.

That's my take.

 

[StinkyPinky]

I don't understand the ending. Can anyone take the time to explain the following...

1) Who is this ghost kid? Is he part of the first sentient species? Or a god? Is he some AI? It just screams Deus Ex Machina to me. Literally.

2) How did the Normandy get away? Did Joker cut and run? Seems to go against his personality.

3) Liara was on my assault team, yet in the ending she walks off the crashed ship. How...how did she get there???

4) Mass Relays destroy the entire system when they detonate do they not?? So Shepard effectively just destroyed half the galaxy??

Do people never do happy endings anymore?

 

[StinkyPinky]

Oh, and I don't understand the Deus Ex Machina's logic? He created/controls the Reapers to prevent organic life from creating AI that will consume the entire galaxy as organics lack the means to control AI?

But...he's done just that. He created the Reapers and yet he manages to control them just fine. So who is he to say other sentient species wont do the same?

 

[dighn]

Synthesis changes ALL people by merging them. Control is just Shepard becoming one with the reapers. Right?

Taking over the Illuminati is affecting everyone by changing/managing what they think. Control simply takes over/merges with an AI and controls it, and whatever the AI can have influence over.

That's my take.

I didn't get the sense that synthesis merged everyone, but then it didn't really show much at all besides people and trees getting circuit tattoos and a happy ending for joker + EDI.

anyway we all have our interpretations, but the similarities between the games are definitely there. the synthesis option reminds me the most about deus ex, whose primary theme imo is transhumanism. it's very similar to the universal augmentation choice in DE: IW.

 

[RampantAndroid]

I didn't get the sense that synthesis merged everyone, but then it didn't really show much at all besides people and trees getting circuit tattoos and a happy ending for joker + EDI.

anyway we all have our interpretations, but the similarities between the games are definitely there. the synthesis option reminds me the most about deus ex, whose primary theme imo is transhumanism. it's very similar to the universal augmentation choice in DE: IW.

Maybe I got this from the leaked script, but the synthesis ending means that in some way, all living things are merged. I guess they become cybernetic. Or everyone just enters the matrix.

I don't understand the ending. Can anyone take the time to explain the following...

1) Who is this ghost kid? Is he part of the first sentient species? Or a god? Is he some AI? It just screams Deus Ex Machina to me. Literally.

2) How did the Normandy get away? Did Joker cut and run? Seems to go against his personality.

3) Liara was on my assault team, yet in the ending she walks off the crashed ship. How...how did she get there???

4) Mass Relays destroy the entire system when they detonate do they not?? So Shepard effectively just destroyed half the galaxy??

Do people never do happy endings anymore?

Showing the entire galaxy just being decimated in a massive explosion would have been a better ending. It'd have no questions of "what happened to _____" because the answer would also be "booooom!"