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Why are teachers always complaining about being low paid?

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Originally posted by: Bibble
Originally posted by: OVerLoRDI
42k isn't that much for the amount of crap you have to put up with from annoying kids. Especially if you are working in an inner city school with our wonderful youth.
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Well said, sir.

One of my high school teachers ranted about this same thing in class. He claimed that what teachers make is "one step above the poverty line." He argued that since teachers aren't paid enough, really talented individuals who would make great teachers go into other fields. This leaves the jobs to be filled by people who are second-rate and do not perform as well as the more talented individuals would. This results in the detriment of students' educations. Ergo, paying teachers 80k+ would result in more talented individuals becoming teachers, which in turn would result in better educations for children.

I'm not sure if I agree with his logic, but I do feel teachers should be paid more. My mother has been an elementary school teacher in a city for 25 years and makes close to 90k now working from 7 to 4. She usually teaches summer school too, which gives her about another 8k (not sure how much exactly). She doesn't complain about being underpaid.
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Ironically, teachers who think 42k (or whatever they make) is one step above the poverty line can't be very good teachers... Your mom makes 90k? Basically teachers are upper class after 25 years then
 
Not to mention that in many districts they reach tenure after 2-3 years.

Pay equitable to a high end office position + quick tenure + summers off + lots of self-satisfaction = worthwhile job.

But remember, that the complaints might be initiated by the union which is a huge political lobby which is extremely well-funded. Here in CA the techers union pretty much gets their way every election time because who can say no to a sad-faced selfless teacher trying to save our childrens' future.....especially when they are on every other commercial.
 
Originally posted by: Mloot
Originally posted by: BarneyFife
...I don't even want to get into the benefits they get because they are the awesome.
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Really, because I haven't seen it. I work in a job that is tied to the oil industry, and my benefits are a damn site better than what my wife gets.

She is a 5th grade teacher and I know the kind of kids she puts up with on a daily basis. I couldn't do her job for a week, much less for an entire school year.
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Well your wife is teaching in the wrong district then.

 
I would probably want to be an elementary teacher since you don't have to grade papers and such. Other than that, I'd want to be a highschool (SENIOR classes preferably)/college teacher to get some of those hotties in my class that are willing to do "extra credit" for a better grade 😛
 
My wife is a high school English teacher, and trust me it's a very difficult and they don't get paid enough. True she works 8am to 3pm, but those are just the hours she has to be "the teacher." When she comes home she often puts in another 3-5 hours of grading papers, making lesson plans, communicating with students via the school loop site, etc. Many many nights she goes to bed at midnight or 1am after grading papers all night. Also at my wife's school they are required to do 30 hours every school year of extra activities. That includes chaperoning the dances, supervising sporting events or other activities, etc. She doesn't get paid extra for that, but she's required to do it (which often means I'm required to as well. I hate chaperoning dances). Also a few of the sections my wife teachers are the "sheltered" classes, which are typically advanced english learners, problem kids (gang kids at her school) or just dumbasses. She doesn't get extra over the English teachers who teach the "regular" kids for taking on these kids, but it is far more difficult than teaching the "regular" kids.

I'm not sure how it is in other states, but in California many school budgets are completely f'd up, and they don't spend the money in the right places for the kids. In the two years my wife has been a teacher she has spent over $12,000 of our money buying things for her students that the school just doesn't buy. Books, paper, learning materials, teaching aids. She's even provided two computers in her classroom since the school doesn't provide any. She doesn't get reimbursed at all for that. If you spent that kind of money buying things to use at your job, wouldn't you expect to be paid back?

The worst part about it is, there are no rewards for great teachers. Lousy teachers make the same that a great teacher makes. My wife is a great teacher, her kids do well, she is strict but fair and the kids love her for it, and she truly cares for her kids. She wants each and every one to excel, and takes time out of her personal time to help kids that need it.
 
Originally posted by: b0mbrman
Originally posted by: KLin
Already been said. I think good teachers are worth their weight in gold.
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You can't put a price on that!
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Current price of gold, per kilo:$20,756.

Average weight of American man (20-74) : 87 kilos
Average weight of American woman (20-74): 75 kilos

Let's say they work 30 years before retiring.

That means that a good male teacher should make $60,192 per year, whereas a good female teacher should make $51,890 a year. Adjust for inflation, changing cost of gold, and ever-increasing obesity rates as needed.

I guess they ARE underpaid! At least, the good ones are...the bad ones are still worth more than their weight in copper, silver, or palladium, according to the market.
 
42k is definitely not bad for a starting wage out of college, heck it is on par with most other undergrad majors except engineering.

The extra hours put into grading papers is made up by the fact that they only have to work 9 months, with almost every imaginable holiday off.

Plus, teachers shouldn't get into the profession with great compensation on their mind, they should know what they are getting into financially before deciding to set foot into the education field.
 
42k is definitely not bad for a starting wage out of college, heck it is on par with most other undergrad majors except engineering.
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Sure, but it definitely isn't as high as 42K everywhere in the country. Here in Charlotte, NC the first year teacher pay is significantly lower.
 
$42K to babysit a bunch of sniveling kids, many of whom think they're above the rules or that they don't have to do what the teacher says because Mommy said they're special?

NOT nearly enough $$ IMO..Teachers should get paid a starting wage of closer to $60K, and they should get hazardous duty and/or combat pay for working in the inner-city schools. The ones that have to be bi-lingual (or tri-lingual-or more) in order to communicate with their students should get paid more for learning the extra language(s).
Teachers get all the blame when Johnny doesn't learn to read, but they also get blamed for trying to instill some semblance of discipline into the spoiled brats or hoodlums in their classrooms.
Parents really don't want their children educated, that would require them to be more involved...they just want babysitters.

(no, I'm not a teacher, not related to any teachers, and AFAIK, I only know one person who is a teacher.)
 
I don't think 42K is normal. I guess it depends on the system and the teacher, but I think it's one of those labor of love things. That said, I'd like to see them paid more, but held to higher standards.

What baffles me is how cops make so little money.
 
Originally posted by: BoomerD
$42K to babysit a bunch of sniveling kids, many of whom think they're above the rules or that they don't have to do what the teacher says because Mommy said they're special?

NOT nearly enough $$ IMO..Teachers should get paid a starting wage of closer to $60K, and they should get hazardous duty and/or combat pay for working in the inner-city schools. The ones that have to be bi-lingual (or tri-lingual-or more) in order to communicate with their students should get paid more for learning the extra language(s).
Teachers get all the blame when Johnny doesn't learn to read, but they also get blamed for trying to instill some semblance of discipline into the spoiled brats or hoodlums in their classrooms.
Parents really don't want their children educated, that would require them to be more involved...they just want babysitters.

(no, I'm not a teacher, not related to any teachers, and AFAIK, I only know one person who is a teacher.)
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You pretty much nailed it. It's amazing how many parent's don't take an active role in their children's education. Out of the 160 kids my wife teaches she had SEVEN parents show up for parent-teacher night. SEVEN!! And then these frigging parents have the nerve to bitch when their kid fails at the end of the year. This is after my wife sends notices home, calls, e-mails etc and doesn't hear crap. Suddenly when they find out the kid can't pass the class no matter what, my wife is suddenly the debbil.
 
"What baffles me is how cops make so little money."

Oakland PD is offering something like $70,000 right out of the academy. But it's Oakland, so that's still not enough. 😀
 
I'd say that it depends mostly on what subject they teach. P.E. teachers that make that much would definately be paid VERY WELL in terms of what they actually do. Maybe the math, science, english teachers have A LOT more work to do for their money, but I still think they are not grossly underpaid. I had an economics teacher that actually showed her pay check stub to explain the various taxes and she made decent money. Probably in the 50k range and she was a pretty good teacher.
 
Originally posted by: Chaotic42
I don't think 42K is normal. I guess it depends on the system and the teacher, but I think it's one of those labor of love things. That said, I'd like to see them paid more, but held to higher standards.

What baffles me is how cops make so little money.
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42K is LOW for lots of places in CA. I know when I was looking it was $60K in a lot of the South Bay Area.

I'm about a year's worth of classes away from becoming a single subject teacher.....passed the SSAT and Praxis for English. I quit with that much to go because #1 everything I was learning was telling me the state was going to force me to teach a way I didn't a want to and #2 I wanted to be a litle older and experienced and callous before walking into a classroom. At this point, I couldn't care less how the kids act, everything is going to roll right off my back. I'm also redeveloping perspective on and a love for the subject.

As for people who find the kids too much to deal with, I have no sympathy. They should be doing something else that won't offend their delicate disposition.
 
Originally posted by: HeroOfPellinor

42K is LOW for lots of places in CA. I know when I was looking it was $60K in a lot of the South Bay Area.
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CA has some out of whack costs of living. $42K is darn good money in a lot of places.

 
This debate comes up so often because the salaries across the country from district to district vary so much. Then you have to keep in mind when you're talking about average salaries within one district, they vary greatly depending on years of experience and degree.

I don't know what the average starting salary in Houston city schools is, but I do know that the absolute maximum a teacher in my district can make with 35 years experience and a Doctorate is $51,422.

When you're talking about time off in the summer, you also have to keep in mind that there are some years when a teacher could have that time free, but every school system I know anything about requires teachers to renew their certification at least every three years for around 12 years which pretty much requires them to attend college during the summer to get those hours. After that here, we are required to get continuing education credit on our own time each year that usually requires a workshop or seminar somewhere in the state or nation during the summer and you have to pay for your tuition or registration, travel, and lodging, etc. You can get reimbursed for the cost of these requirements if you're lucky, in that there is a limited amount of funding for it and if it runs out before you get your paperwork approved by the state, you're out of luck. Then keep in mind that if you want to try to increase your salary through an advanced degree, you have to attend college during the summers for that as well.

I do get a decent benefits package, but it isn't free. Money is held out of each of my checks for my retirement, for my life insurance, and for my medical insurance and the premiums for that increase constantly.

If teachers in Houston city schools are starting out at 42K on average, I'm happy for them, but keep in mind that this is not the average for most teachers, and that most do not have summers free, or free benefits.
 
Originally posted by: montanafan
This debate comes up so often because the salaries across the country from district to district vary so much. Then you have to keep in mind when you're talking about average salaries within one district, they vary greatly depending on years of experience and degree.

I don't know what the average starting salary in Houston city schools is, but I do know that the absolute maximum a teacher in my district can make with 35 years experience and a Doctorate is $51,422.

When you're talking about time off in the summer, you also have to keep in mind that there are some years when a teacher could have that time free, but every school system I know anything about requires teachers to renew their certification at least every three years for around 12 years which pretty much requires them to attend college during the summer to get those hours. After that here, we are required to get continuing education credit on our own time each year that usually requires a workshop or seminar somewhere in the state or nation during the summer and you have to pay for your tuition or registration, travel, and lodging, etc. You can get reimbursed for the cost of these requirements if you're lucky, in that there is a limited amount of funding for it and if it runs out before you get your paperwork approved by the state, you're out of luck. Then keep in mind that if you want to try to increase your salary through an advanced degree, you have to attend college during the summers for that as well.

I do get a decent benefits package, but it isn't free. Money is held out of each of my checks for my retirement, for my life insurance, and for my medical insurance and the premiums for that increase constantly.

If teachers in Houston city schools are starting out at 42K on average, I'm happy for them, but keep in mind that this is not the average for most teachers, and that most do not have summers free, or free benefits.
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You make it sound like no other profession has extraneous expenses or requirements for certification or work spent outside ordinary work hours. At leaset teachers can write them all off.

And you ignored other benefits. What, for example, is the value of job security? How about mobility? Plus you have a personally satisfying job or you wouldn't be doing it right? There's a lot of pros right there and the only con is that you are only upper middle class. Well darn.....let me cry a river for you.
 
Don't forget about the benefits, sick days, vacation time, and retirement that add thousands and thousands to that a year.
 
The starting pay isn't too bad but the scaling SUCKS...

Depending on what career path your in you can easily double a teachers pay within 2-3+yrs with solid experience and moving to different companies.

I considered being a teacher but the pay takes ages to get decent imo. They are well under paid people. Sure job satisfaction is high but that doesn't pay the bills! And I don't even live a remotely lavish lifestyle.

Koing
 
My wife is a teacher, and while I'd love it her salary was more, I feel it is adequate. The salary number is not really the problem. The problem is that there is virtually no performance accountability. Bad teachers make good teachers work harder with no repercussions. There is nothing you can do to get a raise more than your union negotiated rate. Pay good teachers more, they are worth it!

As for the comment of "doing it for personal satisfaction", I'd like to just throw out there that after a few years, the parents and politics of a school district have removed almost all of that satisfaction.
 
Damn, as usual you AT guys are right !!! We should can all those high paid teachers now and see what shows up on the next bus !!! What a great money saving idea !!! We can have any illegal immigrants teach the kids (your kids, that is) English, ermmm Spanish, and any other important elements such as Ameri, ermmm ..... Mexican history.
They will make about 10k a year and LOVE IT !!! And I am sure they can take summer courses themselves to get up to speed on what they need to teach the kids, since an education is just overrated these days. Once those kids graduate, the mantra is simply this: 'We need more skilled laborers', its true, its true .. so that those kids can go on to provide us with a skilled low paying workforce and fix things for us old folk.

You guys may have stumbled upon how we can turn this economy around !!!!!! Dear God, the answer was so obvious and right there in front of our 'I-wish-I-was-a-teacher' faces !! I shall commence work on a rough draft that we will circulate and bring up country-wide at the next scheduled school board meeting !! We will write our congressman and make this world a better place for our children, and our children's children ...

And when we find those nasty old retired teachers that caused this mess .... we will ... BUUUUUURRRRNNNN THEMMMMM !!!!

*bow*
😉
 
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