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Who'd win in a street fight? --(Lee vs. Norris vs. Van Damme)

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The best fighter (we're talking no holds barred, life or death) would have to be Musashi. No contest. He would dominate regardless of time, conditions, etc. The vast majority of his martial art was based on grabbing other people's body parts and tearing them off. :Q No joke. His hand and arm strength would probably be almost unparalleled today. Combine that with his will, and his quickness and you've got a deadly combination. He is probably the most brutal hand-to-hand combatant that ever lived.

Neat thing is... he also evolved into one of the most insightful philosophers of his generation.
 


All three were actors, not the best martial artists. The camera made them look like god's gift to martial arts, but in reality there really wasn't anything incredibly special about the three of them...


1) Bruce Lee introduced the west to Kung Fu and its mysticism, so we are brainwashed into believing he was the best.

2) Chuck Norris entered the US karate circles when it was very young and there was very little competition. He made his name before the field was flooded with numerous really good martial artists.

3) Van Damme is a Kata person, not a Kumite fighter. He is a pretty boy who brought the babes to see "B" karate flicks.


You know who the best martial artist is?




I'd like to know too, because it isn't any of the big names. There is just some dedicated bloke out there who could mop the floor with everybody (it could even be a coworker of yours, or some guy you see on a bus). That's just how it is, and that person will remain anonymous.
 
Actually, there are probably a few people I grew up with from Brooklyn or the South Bronx that could whoop all of them. In a ring w/ rules, it can be easy to beat someone. A street-brawl as the titles says has just one rule and that is "no rules". Like many people say, you have those people that do Ultimate Fighting that won't hesitate hit someone in the knee or deliver a bareknuckle shot to the jaw. Street fighting goes one step further, there are no rules against low-blows, eye-gouging, ear pulling, or simply pick up a bottle and cracking it over your opponent's head.
 

Windogg,


Once again you are right. You must be a Ventura supporter... 😉


I've been around martial arts for almost 18 years now. I wouldn't pick a fight because I know what I can do, and I know that there are even better martial artists than myself, and just plain better fighters.

So just keep that in mind when you guys have a few too many beers, and those beer muscles suddenly kick-in. That pedestrian looking guy over in the corner who looks like a wuss might just be that guy who could mop the floor with a Van Damme, Norris, or Lee. Trust me, they are out there, and that fact alone should keep you straight.

~Peace.
 
First, I took karate for about 3 years when I was younger. That doesn't mean jack, however
I can tell you first hand, how powerful/stronger someone is doesn't mean that much depending on what type of fight you are in or what style you are learning. For instance, things like judo where you use the person's weight against them. I mean geez, if it's no holds-barred, it's just like in "Road House", you crack someone in the side of the knee, and there are VERY few people in this world that aren't going to go down. Then, as Homer Simpson so amptly put it, "Kick 'em in the ribs, step on their neck, and run like hell". 🙂

That being said, I don't think you all realize just how strong Bruce Lee was for his size.
There were several articles in Ironman Magazine (bodybuilding mag) a few years back that detailed the training regimen that Lee used to do. The man was a freakin' animal for his size. He was about as ripped as a person can be hovering around 1-2% bodyfat ALL THE TIME. He would often workout with 135 lbs. on curls. That's a pretty descent feat for most people, but considering Lee himself only weighed in around 120, that is freakin' unbelievable.

A few of you stated that once a grappler like Karelin got a hold of him, that might be a different story. But like another guy said, I don't think that would ever happen. Lee's movements were like lightening. Have you ever seen that famous seen where he is twirling the numbchucks? The guy had the most unbelievalbe hand-eye coordination I've ever seen. Lee would be like a hummingbird flying in and out and landing strike after strike on an someone like Karelin. It's the same thing with the Muhammad Ali-Tyson debate I hear from time to time. People always say, well hell, if Tyson ever landed a few good punches or an uppercut, Ali would be down for the count. Well that's fine, but it would never happen. Ali was just like Bruce Lee, faster than shiznit. Tyson would have never touched him. What the hell does size and power do when you get hit 7 times before you know what is happening??!!! Ali would have destroyed Tyson. To tell you the truth, even if Tyson could hit him, I still think Ali would win. The man fought wars in the ring.

So to sum it up, Bruce Lee had some wicked, mad-azz skills and would have owned Norris or Van Damme's azz!!!!

Course, that's just my $.02, don't pay much attention to it 🙂
 
After reading the comments and arguements, I'd have to change my opinion to Norris as the winner because of his on-the-ground skills.
 
The Musashi i was refering to was Miyamoto Musashi, the Japanese swordsman born in 1584. I don't know much about his ripping body parts from people, but he survived many fights with his sword. He was equally known for his cunning, in situations where he was outnumbered he would ambush his opponents, maybe not noble, but effective.
In combat it was his belief that you should assume that you are already dead, because being concerned about being hurt or killed would adversely affect your reflexes.

Although i believe that Bruce Lee is a great Martial Artist, whether he is great in the sense of Musashi, Morihei Ueshiba, or many other Eastern or Western Martial Artists could be debated. He has developed an Elvis like Mystique that is hard to dispel
 

Damocles,

Hehe,

I thought you were talking about THE Musashi... The sister ship to the Yamato, the largest battleship ever built. I think her 18" guns would pretty much kick everybodies ass. Something about a 2 ton shell being dropped on bruce lee's head... well, he'd better be quick 😉
 
This is a little off topic from the whole Tyson, Norris and Van Damage debate.. but, modern day fighters do what is currently called "Cross Training". This entails taking a stand up art (usually muay Thai) and then taking some kind of ground fighting style (Brazilian Jiujitsu, Submission wrestling, Pancrase).

If you at most modern day fighters who are competitive and win, you will see that this is what they do.

- Ken Shamrock
- Frank Shamrock
- Maurice Smith
- Kazushi Sakuraba
- Marco Ruas
- Don Frye

Cross training is the way. Old school Brazilian Jiujitsu guys had to train in some kind of stand up before they were awarded their black belts. Even wrestling stalwarts like Mark Kerr and Mark Coleman have supplemented their freestyle / collegiate wrestling with submission holds (however basic) and stand up (mostly American boxing, tho).

I used to teach muay Thai at a school here in San Jose, CA. We actually sent one of our fighters to the UFC where he got runner up. His name was Paul Varelans, aka The Polarbear. He wasn't (well, isn't) the greatest fighter around (or even close), but he had size and strength and not much else.. which is probably why he lost so much. 🙂 But, he did the whole cross training thing for a while. And that is what I feel is important to being a good fighter. If you know what tools your opponent has (on the ground and standing up) and are prepared for them, you can do fairly well.

The problem with Bruce Lee is that his cross training primarily focused on other stand up arts. I doubt he ever trained to sprawl from a single or double leg shoot. And most wrestlers - even BJJ guys, train to shoot as soon as they see someone edging towards them or a hand come up. There was a point in my BJJ training where I could never hug my girlfriend. Every time she would raise her hands to hug me, I would shoot in instinctively. It didn't do wonders for our relationship, but it was great for sparring at the end of class.

Anyhow, I always thought that greatest martial artist in the world ever was .. Fred Ettish. Watch UFC 2 to see the master at work. KICK ASS.
 
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