Who needs a draft when you can just kidnap kids to be soldiers??

[Jhhnn]

Dunno about the truth of the story, but I suspect recruiters are getting hammered, hard, by their superiors. So it seems likely that some may resort to tactics that are over the edge. In relative terms, being a recruiter is a nice job, obviously better than some of the other duty stations available.

Hell, the govt isn't exactly being honest with potential enlistees, anyway, offering alleged 15 month tours, even as they're stop-lossing the hell out of folks already on the hook, going so far as to activate some who haven't been in uniform for several years. 15 months? yer ass...

Something that the Bushies seem to have forgotten is that the all-volunteer military was adopted largely as an effort to prevent Vietnam type scenarios. Anybody with a lick of sense could tell that enlistments during a questionable and unpopular conflict would drop like a stone- it was a deliberate attempt to alter our military capabilites and foreign policy to better reflect the mood of the country, rather than the mood of the leadership.

Now that the "flowers in the street" scenario hasn't panned out, the issues of unanticipated consequences should serve to reinforce the look before you leap school of thought in future leaders.

With any luck at all, this recruitment shortfall will jump up and bite the Admin very hard. If forced to go to a Draft, it would totally discredit their adventurist policy, remind everybody that War is something best avoided, rather than embraced and promoted as has been the case post 9/11...

 

[BBond]

What do they do with sub-par recruiters?

Off to the front lines?

That would be some motivational tool. :roll:

Would everyone believe those recruiters would stoop to anything to avoid that consequence?

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: nutxo

Werent you banned?

If I was banned, you ignoramus, you wouldn't be able to ask me that question.

You dont know crap about the seattlepi. Its a freakin rag. I live here, I read the thing.

I live here. I read the SeattlePI too. Marvelous thing the internet. :roll:

 

[cjgallen]

At about 3:30 in the morning, Alex was awakened in the motel and fed a little something. Twelve hours later, without further sleep or food, he had taken a battery of tests and signed a lot of papers he hadn't gotten a chance to read. "Just formalities," he was told. "Sign here. And here. Nothing to worry about."

LOL, sounded like he went through MEPS. Battery of test == the ASVAB, peeing in a cup, getting blood drawn, and having an 80 year old retired Air Force colonel feel your jewels.

I must have talked to 20+ different people when I was at MEPS, every single one of them told me EXACTLY what I was signing. I rode the shuttle back to town with several guys who signed NOTHING. I seriously doubt the entire recruiting chain of command tricked him into joining.

You don't go through that entire process without knowing what's happening, and you don't go through it alone either. There was about 50 other people with me going through the same motions.

This story is hilarious.

 

[BBond]

So, as always, everyone is making up stories except for the U.S. military and George W. Bush. They always tell the truth.

:roll:

 

[miketheidiot]

Originally posted by: nutxo

Originally posted by: maluckey
I call BS on the whole story. I think the kid didn't have he guts to tell his overprotective mom that he had aready signed the DEP papers, and when he failed to show on the sssigned date and time, the recruiters reminded him that he already signed on the line. Cell Phones are routinely collected at MEPS and returned to the soldier after completion of boot camp.

:thumbsup:

Sounds a lot more plausible than what the rag implies.

ussually they don't ship you off right after signing the dotted line.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: miketheidiot

Originally posted by: nutxo

Originally posted by: maluckey
I call BS on the whole story. I think the kid didn't have he guts to tell his overprotective mom that he had aready signed the DEP papers, and when he failed to show on the sssigned date and time, the recruiters reminded him that he already signed on the line. Cell Phones are routinely collected at MEPS and returned to the soldier after completion of boot camp.

:thumbsup:

Sounds a lot more plausible than what the rag implies.

ussually they don't ship you off right after signing the dotted line.

Way back when, I took apptitude tests, signed on the dotted line, wa scheduled for a final physical battery of test at MEPS, signed fianl paperwork and was shipped via commercial plane to arrive at boot camp/OCS.

All in that order over a 6 month period. Other enlisteds were 2-3 weeks.

However, we all were given plenty of chances to back out.

Some people that live a distance away from MEPS may be put up a a motel prior to the final testing; most MEPS testing is schedule from early AM until noon; then people are shipped out so they can be processed into boot camp by evening.

As others stated, the kid signed a committment; and was at the MEPS facility waiting transportation to boot camp. As stated in the article, the phone was surrendered as so not to be a distraction, not to prevent him from being located.

The government is not going to spring for a gourmet breakfast and he would either get fed at the MEPS for lunch or get a food voucher prior to departing on a commercial carrier.

If he had explained to the recruiter about the grandparent, you would probably been granted a delay. Based on the mothers statement quoted below, the situation did not exist

Axel's grandfather was in the hospital dying, she told the people at the desk. He needed to come home right away. She would have said just about anything.

The grandfather may have been an excuse for the mother if true. After all she said that she would have said anything to keep her son from going - probably creating a story to create sympathy.

 

[maluckey]

Not to mention that the U.S. military does not respond to personal claims of emergencies while a soldier is in training. All emergenciy claims must be sent via Red Cross to the respective unit. It wouldn't matter what the mother said or did, the kid was staying without being notified. After all, he is an adult.

Also, I arranged my ship-out to Ft. Knox and my MEPS date to be one in the same to avoid having to return to my crappy apartment for even one more day.

 

[irwincur]

Sure, anything you guys invent is more believable than the story as told by the people who were there.

Yeah the story that was written by a third party (that was not there - the author) that includes direct quotes, verbatim. If this author was not there, there is not way she should include quotes like this. In short, it is a flaming pile of sh!t.

 

[BBond]

Originally posted by: irwincur

Sure, anything you guys invent is more believable than the story as told by the people who were there.

Yeah the story that was written by a third party (that was not there - the author) that includes direct quotes, verbatim. If this author was not there, there is not way she should include quotes like this. In short, it is a flaming pile of sh!t.

That is ridiculous even for you. A reporter using quotes in a story is a foreign idea to you?

Read much?

:roll:

 

[uethello]

Sounds like the kid needs some backbone. Christ, I hope he never breaks the law. They'd pass him around prison with a Hustler cum-glued to his back.

 

[Zebo]

Bottom line:

1. They need to pay a hell-of-a-lot more money, up until the point supply meets demand.

2. Stop the slavery e.g. "stop loss" and imprisonment for those who no longer want to be "volunteers" (misnomer if I ever heard one) Never seen a "volunteer" where you needed to hold a gun to their face or lenghthy prison term to make them work?

3. They need to stop lying and have full-disclosure. And if the retards they recuit can't read, they need the contract read and interpreted for them.

Right now outright fraud, contract signing under duress and psychological manipulation is happening in the USA by our own government.:thumbsdown:

 

[Starbuck1975]

Sure, anything you guys invent is more believable than the story as told by the people who were there.

The original article is hardly credible, nor does it provide anything more then a one sided account of what happened, which of course you are ready and willing to lick up because it fits into your already tainted worldview.

you people are eating it up like free hot dogs on the Fourth of July.

As you have seemingly done with this article...pot...kettle...black.

 

[fornax]

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
The original article is hardly credible, nor does it provide anything more then a one sided account of what happened, which of course you are ready and willing to lick up because it fits into your already tainted worldview.

You must have missed the sentence where the reporter said that she requested comment both from the recruiting office and asked to interview the sergeant. Noone contacted her. Apparently they have something to hide, otherwise it would have been easy to disprove the mother's version with witnesses, documents, and if all failed, with accusations of support for terrists and not being patriotic.

Quote from the article:

My request to speak with the sergeant who recruited Axel and with the Burlington office about recruitment procedures went unanswered.

 

[Citadel535]

My brother is a paramedic and contacted the marines about joining as they are in desparate needs of medics. He had gone to a local recruitment office near where we live and came back with some information and fliers. Around 4-5 days later they called asking to speak with him but he was at work. They called again the next day and spoke to him, but my brother after much thought, had decided not to join and told the recruited that he had changed his mind. It's been over 6 months since then and they haven't called back. Apparently, these extreme cases of kidnapping people for recruiting into the military only happen in the magic newspapers.

 

[EagleKeeper]

Originally posted by: fornax

Originally posted by: Starbuck1975
The original article is hardly credible, nor does it provide anything more then a one sided account of what happened, which of course you are ready and willing to lick up because it fits into your already tainted worldview.

You must have missed the sentence where the reporter said that she requested comment both from the recruiting office and asked to interview the sergeant. Noone contacted her. Apparently they have something to hide, otherwise it would have been easy to disprove the mother's version with witnesses, documents, and if all failed, with accusations of support for terrists and not being patriotic.

Quote from the article:

My request to speak with the sergeant who recruited Axel and with the Burlington office about recruitment procedures went unanswered.

Reporters looking for quotes to back up a story have a abit of selective sound bites to back up the slant of a story.

The offical policy is to refer all media to the PRO.

By it being stated ins the story that there was no comment, the slant again becomes obvious. The reporter could have gone a couple of steps futher had they chosen to. But it did not suit the story line to did for the complete story

 

[Starbuck1975]

You must have missed the sentence where the reporter said that she requested comment both from the recruiting office and asked to interview the sergeant. Noone contacted her. Apparently they have something to hide, otherwise it would have been easy to disprove the mother's version with witnesses, documents, and if all failed, with accusations of support for terrists and not being patriotic.

The military has a standard protocol in place for dealing with inquiries from the media...that she received no response makes me suspect she simply does not understand the process...the military tends to take public relations serious, particularly a story such as this that could prove harmful to recruiting efforts that are already struggling.

Unless of course this reporter has a habit of putting her foot in her mouth, or has a reputation of being hostile towards the military...in either case, the military would simply choose to blow her off as opposed to offering her any acknowledgement of credibility.

 

[dmcowen674]

They are recruiting kids that did not graduate High School like mad down here.

A blast of radio and TV ads everyday.

 

[XMan]

Consider the source, but here's another take on the story.

http://media.nationalreview.com/065818.asp

http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/spruiell200506141217.asp

 

[Zebo]

Originally posted by: dmcowen674
They are recruiting kids that did not graduate High School like mad down here.

A blast of radio and TV ads everyday.

they are the more desperate than ever..... gotta take bottom of the barrel, the super desperate, the super low-lifes -- if you're not to pay a decent wage. How long before they take ex-felons and other "jail" or "Army" judical options like in Veitnam?

This is bad policy period. I can't believe they are turning over sensitive info and weapons to people that could'nt even graduate high school.

 

[g8wayrebel]

Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Recuiters who try to pull stunts like this should be immediatley sent to the front!!

Front my ass! Try the hardest military labor camp you can find! The situation in Iraq will be long over before they should have the freedom to do anything more enjoyable than scrub a toilet. I'd say ten years hard labor should do it.

 

[Valkerie]

not fair to the youngsters, give them a chance to live

 

[BarneyFife]

The recruiters should just come to this board because we have a lot of war mongers just ready to go (from their computer of course).

 

[maluckey]

I don't normally have issues with you Zebo. Here however, you are speaking outside your lane of knowledge though.

1. They need to pay a hell-of-a-lot more money, up until the point supply meets demand.

Apparently 15000 cash reenlisment and 80 percent tuition reimbursement for college in most all case, along with 50000 thousand dollars for college loan repayment, and 3396 dollars per month for a Bi-lingual E-5 with 5 years service in a language slotted position is chicken feed. Add hazardous duty and separation pay to the mix along with FREE MEDICAL and average of 20 percent off groceries and FREE GYM USE, reduced gas, and NO SALES TAX on anything purchased on-base and you get about 50 grand for a high school education no Bachelors degree and only five years in.

2. Stop the slavery e.g. "stop loss" and imprisonment for those who no longer want to be "volunteers" (misnomer if I ever heard one) Never seen a "volunteer" where you needed to hold a gun to their face or lenghthy prison term to make them work?

There is no stop loss except to IRR in certain MOS (that I know of). It is authorized, but I don't know of many case where a soldier has been kept beyond their contract. Sure, they are kept active beyond their time, but the contract is still honored as far as the date of termination. All initial contracts are for eight years. Subsequent contracts may be shorter. The time agreed upon may be lengthend up to the maximum at the needs of Milatary.

3. They need to stop lying and have full-disclosure. And if the retards they recuit can't read, they need the contract read and interpreted for them.

Let's see......Soldiers are retards? If that's the case we need more of them. Try getting into one of the Military academies. West point, Annapolis ring a bell? As far as the contracts? The contracts ARE READ to them, and explained if there are any doubts. The Army MAKES you read and then sign that you read it. If not, they ORDER you to read it again until you do.

Right now outright fraud, contract signing under duress and psychological manipulation is happening in the USA by our own government

O.K. I'm almost with you.....High pressure sales are happening, and I'd wager that a lighter tone could be used as effectively. I won't argue that recruiters are hard assed, but they are recruiting for a tough job. They could be less pushy and still likely fill their quotas. I think that USAREC just drives the recruiters so hard that they take it out on the potential recruits. By toning down the quotas, they could relax the recruiters and in turn avoid high pressure sales.

 

[Zebo]

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