Who is better British SAS or American Special Forces?

[Finality]

<< What are you talking about? Last time I checked, UK has been involved in this war from the beginning. They had SAS inside Afganistan as soon as possible. In the Gulf War, UK Army was there fighting the Iraqis. And they had SAS deep in Iraq taking out Scuds. >>



Thats true there where/are rumors about a group of men who ran off into the dessert as the British Airways plane landed in Iraq or Kuwait (cant remember now). They where rumored to be SAS and the British Government knew about the situation in Iraq but wanted to get there men in and thus did not send the plane back.

I believe the Seals took a good 24 hours after Iraq invaded to get into Kuwait.

 

[Nemesis77]

<< Thats true there where/are rumors about a group of men who ran off into the dessert... >>



I hate it when that happens. Espesially if it's tasty dessert.

 

[montanafan]

I have no idea how you could compare the different groups.

I do know that they take boys and turn them into absolutely amazing men. I have a few former students who are/were in different U.S. Special Forces (no SEALS though) and the evolution of those young men has been one of the most impressive and successful missions I have ever seen.

 

[BaDNaN0TH0N]

<< BaDNaN0TH0N, you don't know what you're talking about. The German counter-terrorist unit launched the rescue operation in Munich. The Israeli special force units, well, they launched one of the most successful hostage rescue ever in Uganda. >>



aparenty youre confused, im talking about when the plo took out a bunch of isreali olympic people, the isreali special ops, forgot the name went after and killed almost all of the plo people, except they killed one or 2 of the wrong people. they had a special on this the other day

 

[Kenazo]

that's the mossad for ya! they were using Canadian passports at the time when they got killed. they snuck into syria and killed a bunch of plo ppl in a refuge camp.

 

[jacklutz]

All the special operations forces listed do their job quite well. By the way, Army Special Forces are the "Green Berets," and it's "SEALs" as SEAL is (gasp!) an acronym. This is an amazingly stupid thread; the idea of becoming a hermit is more and more inviting...

 

[Mookow]

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Forgot the Rangers. They're in the Army, too

 

[jacklutz]

No. The 75th Ranger Regiment is not Special Forces. It is a special operations force, but it is not SF.

Edit: if your post is regarding his "American Special Forces" in the poll...

 

[ultimatebob]

Say what you want about the SAS or the Navy Seals, but the Canadian Mounties are still the worlds best dressed fighting force!

 

[scauffiel]

<< The best trained, and most exclusive special forces in the world are the USAF Combat Control/Pararescue troops. There are none better.

EDIT - Oh yeah, they also don't need toothpaste to survive, they are trained to survive with nothing....indefinately. >>



Uh huh.

This has got to be a joke. I worked with the CCT/PJ's overseas while at Team 2 - and they are a great bunch of guys who know their stuff. Would I want them to rescue me? No, I'd rather a SEAL CSAR platoon come get me. Do they look cool on their ATV's? Sure. Can they make satcom from a bubblegum wrapper, barbie doll arm, can of WD-40, a high powered rifle and some riggers tape? Probably. Can they set up a DZ like no ones business? Yep. Would I drink a beer with them and cover their backs in a bar fight? Uh huh. "Survive with nothing indefinitely?" Riiiiight.

These posts always degenerate into meaningless babble backed by ignorant opinion developed by heresay ("My uncles' friends' cousin's daughter said..."), hollywood (G.I. Jane), and sensationalized articles/novels (Marcinko). Each 'force' is very, very good in it's own right - when doing what they are trained to do. SEALs aren't trained to attack airfields. Rangers aren't trained to snatch and grab. Delta isn't trained to stick limpets on ships in port. Yada, yada, yada. Is Delta good? Hell yeah - they friggin better be. DevGru? Bet your sweet @$$. Recon? I'd rather they're out in the field for a month than me.

We have liaisons with each of the other country's specwar units. The Kampfschwimmers taught us how to be better combat divers. The SAS/SBS taught us better tactics for both air and sea. The french.... the french.... well, whatever with the french. We taught ourselves land warfare with some initial help from the Army - but we rewrote the book in SouthEast Asia. We work with all those guys, they work with us. Information is exchanged in order to increase the probability of killing the bad guys and bringing the good guys home. Are mistakes made? Hell yeah. I'm sure some of you guys have done some pretty stupid things with computer equipment where only your data and some components are at risk. And that's with plenty of sleep, plenty of food, no pressure, clean clothes, no timetable, no lives in the balance. Try being out in the field, in a hole in the ground for a week getting sh!t for sleep, eating the occasional 'chicken a la king' MRE, and then doing a hostage rescue perfectly. Every. Time. If you don't get your breaching charge just right, if you drop a round into a hostage being held by a bad guy, or shoot a hostage pointing a cell phone at you, or stand in the door/cone of death too long, or don't check the closet or under the desk or behind the couch, before moving on...

You knobs that spew crap like "XXXXX screwed up at YYYYYY" really piss me off. We're not getting our rocks off on power trips. We are doing the job the best that we can and if we drop a shot, if we twitch when we shouldn't have, if we forget any of hundreds of details - people can and do die. Do you think the guy that flubs up just forgets about it and goes home? Do you think it's over for him when the newscast ends? Do you think he goes to specforces.com/forums and discusses how, because he missed a shot, an innocent got killed?

Go back to your digital lives and leave this kind of 'story', and hence 'poll', where it belongs - in the trash. Journalists the world over are just a bunch of posers and wannabees that want to change the world without incurring any risk to themselves.

</soapbox>
Steve

 

[Tominator]

scauffiel..Are you a Recruiter?

The arguments are pointless.

 

[Migroo]

The problem with the kind of question that this thread poses is that the population of this board has a high US percentage.

Its like asking whats the better country or something.

 

[Migroo]

<< A Brittish SAS is one bad sumbitch, and don't believe any different.

I saw their training first hand. It makes Seal training look like Girl Scouts. >>






Either way. Each force is definately very good at what it does, lets not detract from that eh?

 

[Martin]

<<

<< Tominator, if you're refering to the Gulf War Blunder as Bravo Two Zero, that wasn't really their fault. The team of 8 was given faulty radio information (and they couldnt get into contact with the base). They tried to get across to Syria. 3 of them died, 1 escaped and the rest were captured and eventually freed and returned to service. They also took down about 300 iraqis down...not bad for 8 ppl.... >>



The radios would not function! That WAS the team's fault! They were sent to observe without contact and did not last 12 hours before a shepherd found them. The 300 killed is manfactured and is still being argued the claim never was verified and I suspect was made up to make it look better. After reading the complete story I see there could be no way they can claim any kills....unless you count civilians! They were on the run almost from the time of insertion. The whole thing was a major screwup.

That they were brave and the best at what they do, I'll not argue, but even the best make mistakes. It is an amazing story, but a cluster fck none the less. >>






Not, the radio was NOT their fault. The team was given the wrong frequencies and could not bounce the signal off the ionosphere. They were found by a shepherd, becasuse they couldnt move from their location because there were iraqis all around them.
I dont have the book with me, so I can't quote it, but I read it less than 2 months ago, so I still remember.

 

[silverpig]

The Canadian Airborne Regiment was pretty hardcore when they were around. I knew a guy in it and he trained with the SEALs, the SAS, the GIGN, and the GSG9 (and I think the other German one too... can't remember what it's called though).

JTF-2 is pretty sweet. No one ever hears anything about them though.

 

[snow patrol]

well, lots of interesting points here, but I think people are clearly basing their choices on rumours or things they've heard in the press. I doubt whether ANYONE here is actually in a good position to answer the question with any sort of authority.

 

[MistaTastyCakes]

Hey, the US has Ding Chavez....John Clark...

Tom Clancy thing...anyways...I'm not sure which is better. It's probably not in anyone's best interests to cross any one of em.

 

[Tominator]

MartyTheManiak

I read the same book. I also read the after action reports....over 5 years ago and I've no idea if they are on the web. Seal Team 6 had a fiasco in Panama where there was an attempt at a coverup as well. Oficers trying to get promotions at the expense of those doing the real job. The SAS soldiers told what they saw and not all the after action reviews verified their claims. They were scared and on the run...that does not lend itself to accuratate estimations. There was little to no evidence to backup any claims of kia by them and the reports could not verify their claims.

 

[Mitzi]

They drink a lot of tea. And they don't screw many people, so it's not important to them.

I did alright...well until I got engaged that is. You ass.

BTW - I do kinda like tea

 

[habib89]

they all rock.. they're not called special/elite forces for nothing...

 

[Supahfreak]

You guys gotta stop playing Counter-Strike already I'm sure all these Spec. Op. teams know what they're doing, just dont get on they're bad side:Q. What happened to AMD vs. INTEL or XBOX vs. GAMECUBE

FreAk

 

[dreben]

Don't forget about Canadas Special Forces

JTF2



<< From what we know of JTF2, it was set up in 1993, taking over counter-terrorist responsibilities from the RCMP. The Toronto Star quoted a military source that said JTF2 has about 350 members, with an average age of 28 and a budget of $25 million. JTF2 has trained with both elite U.S. units and the SAS in Britain. They are acknowledged to be specialists in cold-weather operations, having done extensive training in the Canadian arctic. >>



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But I still believe that you can't compare SF Units. To many variables.

 

[IndyRacing]

Has anyone here ever been in the military? Chance are allot of you NO! Quit believe what you read in the press, in books or see in movies.

Have you ever heard of the word Ego? The SAS is the equivalent of our Green Berets. Delta Force is 1st SF Group (Green Berets). The Rangers are Super GI Joes (Advanced Infantry Men). They make allot of noise anywhere they go.

The most over rated group in the US Military is Force Recon Marines. Whoo whoo talk about a bunch of dumb a*ses. Grunt work, Grunt work just like the Rangers.

If you have paid attention at all to the happenings in the world the Air force has been providing support for the US Green Berets. These guys have done the stealth work of finding the location of Bin Laden. Now the Marines will go kill everyone in this "Hot Zone". They are expendable not the Green Berets.

Now for the Seals they are bad as*es period. Again not an expendable group. They spend so much on training these guys that they will not send them in to get killed. They can do anything and have been trained for every type of situation.

One group left out is the Air Force Para Rescue. These guys go in to rescue pilots that have been shot down. Hello, your telling me no one is out looking for this downed pilot. Chances are that they are going into a huge fire fight. Also all of these units operate as a squad or a team.

Agian Sean Connery is not the perfect example of a member of the SAS.

My point is they all are highly trained killing machines. They are all elite. no one is better than another.

I have been through US Army Airborne, Air Assault, SFAS and on missions with 10th Group (attached to them for a while (US Division out of Ft. Carson, CO) ). Different SF unit have different Areas they specialize in such as desert, cold weather, jungles and mountainous terrains. I would be willing to bet that the Marines on the ground are from 29 Palms, Ca. I did my desert training there. Miserable place to be.

 

[Kosugi]

To be precise:

Each branch of so-called "US Special Forces" are specialized.

o Delta Force is basically a hostage rescue group. Highly trained with a decent amount of firepower.
o Navy Seals are killers. Widely regarded as some very efficient Assassins.
o Green Berets are a step up from Army Rangers, and are predominantly advisers and trainers. All Green Berets are multi-lingual, and spend a great deal of time studying foreign cultures and the psychology of their oponents.

o Rangers are called "Special Forces" only by the un-initiated. They are actually classed as "Raiders". They go in, hit a target, and get out. There are also more Rangers than the above three divisions combined. Rangers aren't supposed to hold ground either. Thats the job of Marines and regular army.

I can't speak for SAS troops. I don't know where they would fit in, but they would probably be more equivalent to the Delta Force.

As far as training goes, the best trained troops - bar none - for their particular specialized mission are the US Navy Seals. Their training is beyond brutal, and the end result is a hard-core killer.

There is a book simply title "Seal" that many of you would find interesting reading. I think the drop-out rate is above 95% for Seal wannabees. The highest of any special forces service in the world. I think its the freezing water training that breaks them the most.

Finally, from a strictly qualitative point of view, its like comparing apples and oranges. Like I said, you would have to compare missions performed, and then you would be comparing Delta Force to SAS to get some sense of qualitative difference.

 

[Teatowel]

Aquaman

James Bond was never in the SAS. He was a Commander in the Royal Navy before being recruited by MI6.