White? Dont teach here. Op Updated to address false 'racist' labal

[WHAMPOM]

http://www.fresnobee.com/2014/07/28/4044162/southwest-fresno-leaders-criticize.html

Blacks and Hispanics complain a WHITE teacher was hired at a public school.

talk about racists.

They want to be taught 'their' history. Where they come from.

Well they are in America, and should learn American history.

Don't like it, go back to where you came from to get 'your' history.






"They?" The bolded by me above is unacceptable. Take your crude racism elsewhere, please.

Perknose
Forum Director

Another OP not reading his own(objection was to white teacher teaching "their" history which is the real meat of the story) source, then posting misleading drivel. Better not to post then prove yourself an idiot.

 

[alzan]

Why don't you tell us all about your burnt umber theory again.

I was looking forward to his "thuglife4eva" and similar comments.

 

[dank69]

you didn't stop while you were far behind.....

Notice everyone else here is smart enough to STFU. This makes you the weakest link. Go ahead and fill in the ??? if you can manage to follow along.

 

[dank69]

I was looking forward to his "thuglife4eva" and similar comments.

Yeah he forgot to mention hoodies.

 

[Darwin333]

http://www.fresnobee.com/2014/07/28/4044162/southwest-fresno-leaders-criticize.html

Blacks and Hispanics complain a WHITE teacher was hired at a public school.

talk about racists.

They want to be taught 'their' history. Where they come from.

Well they are in America, and should learn American history.

Don't like it, go back to where you came from to get 'your' history.

Umm, where did most of them come from?

I know lots and lots of black folk and most of them come from the same city as I do. Hell lots of them were born in the same hospital so where exactly are you saying they should go "back" to?

 

[fskimospy]

I was looking forward to his "thuglife4eva" and similar comments.

While SpatiallyAware is a huge racist (and you will notice he basically only weighs in on race-centric threads), the idea that only a black or hispanic person can teach black or hispanic history is wrong. While I understand the concern that people who have not shared that ancestry may not have the same lens, that's simply not a good reason to deny someone employment, especially since those who know him consider him to be excellent.

In fact, since my guess is that black and hispanic studies are probably (and understandably) dominated by non-white people, this guy might offer a valuable perspective of a truly informed individual who isn't looking at things through that lens. That could be hard to find elsewhere.

Academics is all about finding a wide range of perspectives. I think having a racially diverse black and hispanics study area is just as valuable as having a racially diverse basically-everything-else area.

 

[realibrad]

For clarity I will expand Waggy's full logic train:
Premise 1: If proper descent is a requirement for teaching African studies it is a requirement for teaching all history classes.
Premise 2: ???
Conclusion 1: Black people do not meet the requirement to teach anything but African studies

Waggy's reductio ad absurdum argument:
Premise 1: Following Conclusion 1, protester logic also leads to the conclusion that black people can only teach African American studies
Premise 2: This 2nd conclusion is stupid.
Conclusion: Therefore the protester's conclusion is also stupid.

Go ahead and fill in something for the ??? part that doesn't equal "black people are not the correct descent to teach American History"

The protester's logic is as follows.

White people should not be teaching the class. The reason is because white people cannot teach something "they" have not experienced as a minority. So the justification is first hand experience.

That is not Waggy's conclusion, that is the protester's view point. So if the idea is first hand experience, then how can anyone teach a minority class, unless they themselves are the minority? Further more, must the person need to have gone though the very things being taught?

Understanding this, Waggy said it seemed stupid to make that a qualification. Instead, a better qualification is knowledge.

 

[boomerang]

Report me, then.

If you have a problem with what I said, then quote me and directly address your angst.

Rather, I see you defending explicit xenophobic racism with a diversion for ungrounded personal attacks against me.

Report you - why? That's your thing. I only adopted the same tactics you've used. Alinsky's rules turned back towards you. I figure if you can dish it out, you should be able to take it.

 

[alzan]

While SpatiallyAware is a huge racist (and you will notice he basically only weighs in on race-centric threads), the idea that only a black or hispanic person can teach black or hispanic history is wrong. While I understand the concern that people who have not shared that ancestry may not have the same lens, that's simply not a good reason to deny someone employment, especially since those who know him consider him to be excellent.

In fact, since my guess is that black and hispanic studies are probably (and understandably) dominated by non-white people, this guy might offer a valuable perspective of a truly informed individual who isn't looking at things through that lens. That could be hard to find elsewhere.

Academics is all about finding a wide range of perspectives. I think having a racially diverse black and hispanics study area is just as valuable as having a racially diverse basically-everything-else area.

Agree 101%. Bringing up someone's ethnicity as a job qualification is a net-negative PR stunt. Getting children the best qualified instructor is the goal of any educational institution regardless of the student body makeup.

 

[dank69]

The protester's logic is as follows.

White people should not be teaching the class. The reason is because white people cannot teach something "they" have not experienced as a minority. So the justification is first hand experience.

That is not Waggy's conclusion, that is the protester's view point. So if the idea is first hand experience, then how can anyone teach a minority class, unless they themselves are the minority? Further more, must the person need to have gone though the very things being taught?

Understanding this, Waggy said it seemed stupid to make that a qualification. Instead, a better qualification is knowledge.

As we discuss this, please keep in mind that I have no problem with what Waggy was trying to say. I do not agree with the protesters. I am addressing a single part of the process he used. Rewording it like you did does not help. It just further illustrates my point. "The reason is because white people cannot teach [African Studies] because they have not experienced it" becomes "black people cannot teach American History because they have not experienced it" if we are to extend the logic. I don't see any mention of "minority" in the article as an explanation, though I only skimmed it.

 

[justoh]

The protester's logic is as follows.

White people should not be teaching the class. The reason is because white people cannot teach something "they" have not experienced as a minority. So the justification is first hand experience.

That is not Waggy's conclusion, that is the protester's view point. So if the idea is first hand experience, then how can anyone teach a minority class, unless they themselves are the minority? Further more, must the person need to have gone though the very things being taught?

Understanding this, Waggy said it seemed stupid to make that a qualification. Instead, a better qualification is knowledge.

tangential, but funny.

 

[realibrad]

As we discuss this, please keep in mind that I have no problem with what Waggy was trying to say. I do not agree with the protesters. I am addressing a single part of the process he used. Rewording it like you did does not help. It just further illustrates my point. "The reason is because white people cannot teach [African Studies] because they have not experienced it" becomes "black people cannot teach American History because they have not experienced it" if we are to extend the logic. I don't see any mention of "minority" in the article as an explanation, though I only skimmed it.

Rewording is just me simplifying because verbatim is not efficient.

Waggy does not believe white people cannot teach African studies. He also does not believe black people cannot teach Irish or French studies. The protesters are the ones who believe that white people should not teach African studies. And if the justification is first hand knowledge, then Blacks would not be qualified to teach non black studies.

I'm trying hard to understand where your confusion comes from, and I just cant find it man.

 

[justoh]

...and you don't know how to read.

...I'd be embarrassed for you.

This is almost as ironic as your signature, guy who ironically quotes einstein all the time

 

[dank69]

Rewording is just me simplifying because verbatim is not efficient.

Waggy does not believe white people cannot teach African studies. He also does not believe black people cannot teach Irish or French studies. The protesters are the ones who believe that white people should not teach African studies. And if the justification is first hand knowledge, then Blacks would not be qualified to teach non black studies.

I'm trying hard to understand where your confusion comes from, and I just cant find it man.

That's because I am not confused. You are. In his effort to show how stupid the protesters are he accidentally illustrated that he doesn't think black people experienced American History. He doesn't know he thinks this, it is subconscious or something, but it logically follows from his own train of thought.

 

[realibrad]

That's because I am not confused. You are. In his effort to show how stupid the protesters are he accidentally illustrated that he doesn't think black people experienced American History. He doesn't know he thinks this, it is subconscious or something, but it logically follows from his own train of thought.

So you think that Waggy believes that "Blacks" should not teach "White" history?

 

[dank69]

So you think that Waggy believes that "Blacks" should not teach "White" history?

NO. I'm trying to be patient with you here but you are making it very difficult.

 

[realibrad]

NO. Are you fucking stupid? I'm trying to be patient with you here but you are making it very difficult.

So, you are saying his logic if flawed then.

So protester says that a white teacher should not teach the class. The reason is this...

"In order for one to convey the messages and teach the real lessons, the authentic lesson, it has to be someone who lives it and has been there."

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So if a white person cannot effectively teach the class, based completely off the single issue that the teacher is white, then you can draw conclusions from that idea.

A white teacher is not qualified to teach black history, because the white teacher has not experienced black history. The central Idea is that to teach a race history, the teacher must be of that race to effectively teach the subject. Following that logic, a Black teacher would not be able to teach a white history. The idea that being the race is required is stupid to waggy, and thus wrong.

Am I still missing something?

 

[dank69]

So, you are saying his logic if flawed then.

So protester says that a white teacher should not teach the class. The reason is this...



So if a white person cannot effectively teach the class, based completely off the single issue that the teacher is white, then you can draw conclusions from that idea.

A white teacher is not qualified to teach black history, because the white teacher has not experienced black history. The central Idea is that to teach a race history, the teacher must be of that race to effectively teach the subject. Following that logic, a Black teacher would not be able to teach a white history. The idea that being the race is required is stupid to waggy, and thus wrong.

Am I still missing something?

I think this is at least the second time you are calling it "white history" now. American History. I honestly think you are just trolling at this point.

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

This is almost as ironic as your signature, guy who ironically quotes einstein all the time

The Einstein quote in my sig appears to be an unhealthy obsession with you. You know nothing about my beliefs, my understanding of his beliefs, or my motives for posting this particular quote...nothing. Yet you assume that you do. If you're looking for ...you might want to start there.

 

[realibrad]

I think this is at least the second time you are calling it "white history" now. American History. I honestly think you are just trolling at this point.

When I say "White History" I'm not talking about American history.

The people had been lobbying to get a cultural studies of "African-American, Latino and Southeast Asian studies there". The protesters then said that a white person should not teach those subjects, because they would not have first hand knowledge. So the classes are subjectively not white, and thus a white teacher should not fit. So, if the school had a history for western Europeans, a black person would not be qualified to teach it as well. The 2nd statement is used to show the "other side" of the argument to show its stupidity, because the only qualification should be if the teacher is knowledgeable and able to get the students to learn. My qualification was never in question by the protesters.

Protesters want teachers that are the same "race" as the subject they are teaching.

 

[SpatiallyAware]

<snip>

I think having a racially diverse black and hispanics study area is just as valuable as having a racially diverse basically-everything-else area.

That in itself is incredibly racist.


I place value on knowledge, capability to teach and provide insight.

You place value in race.



Very sad.

 

[realibrad]

That in itself is incredibly racist.


I place value on knowledge, capability to teach and provide insight.

You place value in race.



Very sad.

Jesus, now you and him are going at it.

His point is that all race history is important as any other. Its not racist. It might have been wrong to call you a racist, but his statement was not racist.

 

[Victorian Gray]

This is almost as ironic as your signature, guy who ironically quotes einstein all the time

Why it's Déjà vu all over again.

 

[justoh]

The Einstein quote in my sig appears to be an unhealthy obsession with you. You know nothing about my beliefs, my understanding of his beliefs, or my motives for posting this particular quote...nothing. Yet you assume that you do. If you're looking for ...you might want to start there.

We've been over this before. I don't remember exactly to what extent you're religious, but it's probably not in the vague, benign sense quoted. Therefore, probably ironic.

 

[fskimospy]

That in itself is incredibly racist.

I place value on knowledge, capability to teach and provide insight.

You place value in race.

Very sad.

lol. Hey look, the forum's biggest remaining racist thinks everyone else is a racist. Funny, all the people you always accuse of racism have never been sanctioned for it here while you have been repeatedly. I'm sure you just tell yourself that's because everyone's conspiring against you of course.

I wonder how long it will be until you go the way of Geosurface?