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When will we get transparency?

Lithium381

Lifer
May 12, 2001
12,464
2
0
Didn't OBAMA promise us more government transparency? More public records of what they're doing over there in DC? I think if the citizens actually knew what was going on we could make better decisions, or vote for the most appropriate candidate. We only know what's regurgitated to us through the media, which is selectively leaked and then spun with Bias one way or another.

Wasn't that one of Adams main complaints when forming the electoral college? That the average American would be so under-informed as to make a bad choice?

If they stopped playing games with the numbers when saying "we cut 1 billion" that really means only 100 million a year for 10 years, and it was a cut in "proposed spending" not actual spending.... some baseline new math BS.
 

Kadarin

Lifer
Nov 23, 2001
44,311
8
81
Never. The government has no incentive to provide transparency, and much incentive to avoid it.
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
"We might hope to see the finances of the Union as clear and intelligible as a merchant's books, so that every member of Congress and every man of any mind in the Union should be able to comprehend them, to investigate abuses, and consequently to control them."

--Thomas Jefferson, 1802

We have not been able to investigate abuses because of this lack of transparency.

Information has been purposely kept from Americans under the guise of Homeland Security.

Lack of transparency is why America is failing economically and politically.
 

werepossum

Elite Member
Jul 10, 2006
29,876
460
126
Never. The government has no incentive to provide transparency, and much incentive to avoid it.
Agreed. Both parties promise transparency and then try their best to avoid it.

"We might hope to see the finances of the Union as clear and intelligible as a merchant's books, so that every member of Congress and every man of any mind in the Union should be able to comprehend them, to investigate abuses, and consequently to control them."

--Thomas Jefferson, 1802

We have not been able to investigate abuses because of this lack of transparency.

Information has been purposely kept from Americans under the guise of Homeland Security.

Lack of transparency is why America is failing economically and politically.
Wow. Germaine, cohesive, with a projection at least based in fact.

Now was that so hard? ;)
 

MovingTarget

Diamond Member
Jun 22, 2003
8,990
84
91
Lets face it, transparency sounds nice, but once YOU are in the oval office, you tend to avoid it like the plague no matter who you are. Obama is no different. Neither are any of the current Republican "candidates" at this point.
 

robphelan

Diamond Member
Aug 28, 2003
4,085
16
81
i'm prefacing all my Obama critques with "I voted for him"....

it doesn't matter. he has double-backed on many, too many campaign promises (no, i don't care that every other freakin pol does the same).

he promised more transparency but the admin goes after whistleblowers tooth and nail.

we realize the gov't is bigger than just the presidency, but daylight is the best disinfectant.
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
i'm prefacing all my Obama critques with "I voted for him"....

it doesn't matter. he has double-backed on many, too many campaign promises (no, i don't care that every other freakin pol does the same).

he promised more transparency but the admin goes after whistleblowers tooth and nail.

we realize the gov't is bigger than just the presidency, but daylight is the best disinfectant.
I feel sorry for Obama.

He did not create the problems he now faces.

But Obama is still part of the problem as he participates in making our government less transparent to hide mistakes of previous generations.
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
I believe one of the biggest coverups in our country is our undemocratic voting system.

Error rates alone in voting can be so large as to nullify any winner.

Scientific American wrote a great article on this subject after the 2000 presidential election between Bush and Gore.

Turns out the error in the voting process was greater than the difference between votes.

When you combine the vote errors with dishonest candidates how can there be any representation at all?

This is why I have never voted since I turned 18 as the whole voting system is corrupt from errors and greed.
 
Jun 27, 2005
19,255
1
61
Yep, he realized that being the head of this joke we call a Government means that his best intentions were fool hardy
His best intentions were never good. Never for the best for the US. They were for his vision of what should be. Selfish.

He's a failure on many levels. First and foremost he had a socialist vision for this country that he can't execute. Beyond that he's failed to deliver on pretty much every promise he campaigned on with the exclusion of 'obama care'... But even that seems destined to fail in court.

He has no leadership ability. He's worthless without a teleprompter. He's the definition of an empty suit. This guy makes Bush look like a visionary.

He was elected on hope. That's not a great place to start from. He talked a good game but he was working against a low platform. His one term presidency was inevitable. When your platform is 'I'm not Bush' and your presidency is 'Let's see what we can pass' the odds of your reelection are pretty slim.

Whoever the next guy is, he better have a better plan than 'I'm not the last guy.'
 
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Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,551
2
0
His best intentions were never good. Never for the best for the US. They were for his vision of what should be. Selfish.

He's a failure on many levels. First and foremost he had a socialist vision for this country that he can't execute. Beyond that he's failed to deliver on pretty much every promise he campaigned on with the exclusion of 'obama care'... But even that seems destined to fail in court.

He has no leadership ability. He's worthless without a teleprompter. He's the definition of an empty suit. This guy makes Bush look like a visionary.

He was elected on hope. That's not a great place to start from. He talked a good game but he was working against a low platform. His one term presidency was inevitable. When your platform is 'I'm not Bush' and your presidency is 'Let's see what we can pass' the odds of your reelection are pretty slim.

Whoever the next guy is, he better have a better plan than 'I'm not the last guy.'
Well out of the likely candidates from the Republican Party the only one whose platform is not that of the Christian World View is Romney and most of the Wingnuts don't support him.
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
His best intentions were never good. Never for the best for the US. They were for his vision of what should be. Selfish.

He's a failure on many levels. First and foremost he had a socialist vision for this country that he can't execute. Beyond that he's failed to deliver on pretty much every promise he campaigned on with the exclusion of 'obama care'... But even that seems destined to fail in court.

He has no leadership ability. He's worthless without a teleprompter. He's the definition of an empty suit. This guy makes Bush look like a visionary.

He was elected on hope. That's not a great place to start from. He talked a good game but he was working against a low platform. His one term presidency was inevitable. When your platform is 'I'm not Bush' and your presidency is 'Let's see what we can pass' the odds of your reelection are pretty slim.

Whoever the next guy is, he better have a better plan than 'I'm not the last guy.'
Obama is a bad leader because he is selfish.

But isn't that how capitalism works?

People being motivated by their own selfish interest to capitalize on other peoples misfortune.

This is the essence of America.
 
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QuantumPion

Diamond Member
Jun 27, 2005
6,017
1
76
Obama is a bad leader because he is selfish.

But isn't that how capitalism works?

People being motivated by their own selfish interest to capitolize on other peoples misfortune.

This is the essence of America.
Capitalism works when private individuals, working for their own self interest, within the confines of the law, produce wealth. Obama is neither a private individual nor does he work within the confines of the law. Pointing a gun in your back and stealing your wallet is not a form of capitalism.
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
The theory of capitalism is unlike the reality of our past.

The net effect is that people resort to taking advantage of other people.

There is very little synergy in capitalism in that most workers do not like their job.

The only reason society grows is from the synergy of people working together in harmony.

Selfishness is the opposite of synergy so capitalism is inherently anti-synergistic.

United we stand, divided we fall.
 
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UberNeuman

Lifer
Nov 4, 1999
16,939
3,079
126
Didn't OBAMA promise us more government transparency? More public records of what they're doing over there in DC? I think if the citizens actually knew what was going on we could make better decisions, or vote for the most appropriate candidate. We only know what's regurgitated to us through the media, which is selectively leaked and then spun with Bias one way or another.

Wasn't that one of Adams main complaints when forming the electoral college? That the average American would be so under-informed as to make a bad choice?

If they stopped playing games with the numbers when saying "we cut 1 billion" that really means only 100 million a year for 10 years, and it was a cut in "proposed spending" not actual spending.... some baseline new math BS.
What information is it you want that you're not getting?
 

sarsipias1234

Senior member
Oct 12, 2004
312
0
0
"We might hope to see the finances of the Union as clear and intelligible as a merchant's books, so that every member of Congress and every man of any mind in the Union should be able to comprehend them, to investigate abuses, and consequently to control them."

--Thomas Jefferson, 1802

Democracy requires full disclosure of information regarding any criminal activity committed by officials in office.
 
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brandonbull

Diamond Member
May 3, 2005
5,669
630
126
Until we as voters get off out butts and start voting and rock the boat, we are going to continue having these scum run the country into the ground.
 

Regs

Lifer
Aug 9, 2002
16,665
21
81
Until we as voters get off out butts and start voting and rock the boat, we are going to continue having these scum run the country into the ground.
People would vote used cars sales men with the qualifications of a movie actor, more so someone with actual governance experience and education.

If a guy does not buy into the public’s hysteria, he does not get the vote.
 

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