When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns

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exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: exdeath
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: exdeath


Definitely on the 3850 fps. Hardly any recoil due to the weight of the rifle. Squeeze the 3 lb zero creep trigger and see a hole appear on your target, and hear a boom and a crack about 5 minutes later ;) First time I fired this rifle he had just finished it. Handed it over to me, said it was sighted in at zero @ 300 yds. I held about 2" low on a golf ball on the berm at 110 yards and hit it twice after finding where it went between shots :D He gave it to me for $800! The barrel is from a SEAL sniper rifle that only had 100 rds through it, powder coated.

I'll get you all the other stuff out of my log book when I get home :D

When I first got my 220 Swift I loaded up some 40 grain bullets to max load, 4400fps according to the book.

Anyway, I was driving around the farm doing some shooting and I noticed that when the sun was behind me a little I could "see" the bullet going to the target. So I got a good angle where the sun was right and was shooting at a big rock 300 to 400 yards away. I could see the bullet most of the way to the rock, but I never heard it hit it. After shooting it a half dozen times I went over and looked and there were NO marks on the rock?? The only explanation I could come up with is that the bullet was completley vaporizing itself before it got to the target.

I guess I don't know for sure if that was what the deal was, but I don't ever load anything hotter then 4000fps anymore.

Ok here we go.

The 125 gr are Nosler ballistic tip with 75 gr of H4350 @ 3800 fps. The 150 gr are Nosler Accubond with the same charge @ 3420 fps. Both with Federal 215 match magnum primers.

My bad, 'only' 3800 fps, not 3850 :p

I've never really tried any of the lighter grain bullets in my .300 mag, but one of the big reasons I picked it was because of all the various 30 caliber bullets that were available for it, though it looks like your taking advantage of that fact.

I had the time so I experimented this year and loaded a couple of boxes of 165 grain boat tails with the same 72.5 grains of 4350. That load didn't shoot as well as the 180 grain boattail. At 300 yards on a really windy day it had 2 to 3 more inches of wind drift and I had a hard time just hitting the 4'x4' backstop on the 800 yard target, let alone the 20" bullseye. For my gun the 200fps I picked up in speed wasn't even close to being worth it due to the loss in accuracy.

In my rifle, both those loads have the same point of impact at 300 yds I believe. I don't get to the bigger range as often as I like, most are only 100 yrds.

Ah forgot to add regarding shooting experiences with iron sights, don't remember if that was you or BoberFett. One time I was out with the guy who built my .300 wm and we were taking pot shots at a boulder about 3'x3' in size on the mountain side with iron sites, trying to hit each others previous shot (fresh rock showed up bright white against the weathered rust color of the outside). Clocked 247 yards on the laser range finder, I was nailing within a 1'x1' square with a Mosin Nagant 91/30 and some nasty ass corroded steel 1950s 7.62x54R :D

Of course he was beating my arse with one of his hand built custom jobs with hand loaded ammo, but fun to know I could hit a human breadbox that far with any $50 piece of corroded metal I pick up.

Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
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Originally posted by: exdeath
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

:D You know Memorial Day is one of the best times to go praire dog hunting.
 

Thorny

Golden Member
May 8, 2005
1,122
0
0
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: exdeath
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

:D You know Memorial Day is one of the best times to go praire dog hunting.

Someone needs to organize the first ATOT shooting match. I'd have it here but I live in the most socialist state in the midwest. I'd be willing to make a drive though.
 

FDF12389

Diamond Member
Sep 8, 2005
5,234
7
76
Originally posted by: 6000SUX
Originally posted by: FDF12389
NVM Im done.

You should be banned.

I apologize for the 22 caliber joke. It was a little out of line(and context), but in all fairness I have seen you threaten to smack/punch people in the face before, what the difference? Im sure your not serious, as neither am I. Your life is not in danger by any of my means.

Im choosing to leave this argument because it really has just become and jiber jabber fest. No one is taking a stand, just nit picking other posts.


 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: Thorny
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: exdeath
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

:D You know Memorial Day is one of the best times to go praire dog hunting.

Someone needs to organize the first ATOT shooting match. I'd have it here but I live in the most socialist state in the midwest. I'd be willing to make a drive though.

Kind of like a LAN party but without the computers!!
 

Rainsford

Lifer
Apr 25, 2001
17,515
0
0
Originally posted by: exdeath
...
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

Better idea, get some non-gun folks to go shooting with you and convince them that it's an all American hobby that doesn't turn you into a dangerous person or a militant wacko. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, you gun folks have serious PR problems on the other side of the issue...maybe some outreach is the answer.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: exdeath
...
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

Better idea, get some non-gun folks to go shooting with you and convince them that it's an all American hobby that doesn't turn you into a dangerous person or a militant wacko. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, you gun folks have serious PR problems on the other side of the issue...maybe some outreach is the answer.

I do just that every chance I get. I've turned everyone I've taken so far. :D

Hard to do over the internet though. If they don't at least know you through a friend of a friend of a friend IRL or something like that, you aren't a 'real' person they can trust, just some psycho on the internet that is likely to murder them and eat their children or something. :roll: Understandable I suppose given the number of psychos on the internet who aren't who they say they are.

If anyone here is anti-gun and would like to give it a try in the area of Tucson or Phoenix, look I'll be happy to take you, provide all the guns, and the ammo, on the house.

The Ben Avery range in Phoenix will really rub it in just how non threatening guns are in American culture. Must be 1000 people there all day every day. You literally take a number and wait until they call you to an open bench as someone leaves. Average wait is half hour to an hour. All those people and all those guns, amazing nobody gets hurt :laugh:

Ben Avery Shooting Range
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: exdeath
...
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

Better idea, get some non-gun folks to go shooting with you and convince them that it's an all American hobby that doesn't turn you into a dangerous person or a militant wacko. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, you gun folks have serious PR problems on the other side of the issue...maybe some outreach is the answer.

When my son was younger I used to take him and some of his hockey mates out to farm in the summer. We don't live there, but have an old 14 x 70 trailer there and we would "batch it", sometimes for up to a week. We'd fix some fence, plant/water some trees, paint, clean up, etc. Of course, I'd pay them for their work but none of them were exposed to guns and/or hunting before so (with their parents permission) we would shoot various rifles, shotguns, etc. We would have shooting matches and even shoot clay pigeons. When they got older I took them (one at a time) pheasant hunting with me and my son. They just loved it. Several of those kids have been or currently are in Iraq.

Exdeath, I can't imagine having to go to such a crowed range to shoot. When I go shooting it's just me, my gun, a couple of close friends, and Mother Nature.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Originally posted by: 1EZduzit
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: exdeath
...
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

Better idea, get some non-gun folks to go shooting with you and convince them that it's an all American hobby that doesn't turn you into a dangerous person or a militant wacko. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, you gun folks have serious PR problems on the other side of the issue...maybe some outreach is the answer.

When my son was younger I used to take him and some of his hockey mates out to farm in the summer. We don't live there, but have an old 14 x 70 trailer there and we would "batch it", sometimes for up to a week. We'd fix some fence, plant/water some trees, paint, clean up, etc. Of course, I'd pay them for their work but none of them were exposed to guns and/or hunting before so (with their parents permission) we would shoot various rifles, shotguns, etc. We would have shooting matches and even shoot clay pigeons. When they got older I took them (one at a time) pheasant hunting with me and my son. They just loved it. Several of those kids have been or currently are in Iraq.

Exdeath, I can't imagine having to go to such a crowed range to shoot. When I go shooting it's just me, my gun, a couple of close friends, and Mother Nature.

Yeah, I prefer the back road route myself, but if I expect to enlist new shooters, they might feel more comfortable meeting at a public facility with people :D

That, and I wanted to be sarcastic and emphasize the part about there being 1000 people with at least 3x that in guns laying around and amazingly enough nobody ever gets hurt *gasp*
 

BoberFett

Lifer
Oct 9, 1999
37,562
9
81
What exactly makes gun control common sense? Because it agrees with your personal opinion? I find gun control goes against common sense.
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: Ferocious
Shame on Virginia!

People do want common sense gun control laws.

DId you read the info?

http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/2007/images/04/18/cho.pdf


The order was signed Dec., 05. I imagine a lot happened between then and the incident.

At the time he was judged to be a danger to himself, not to others and he denied any sucicidal thoughts. He was not locked up but put in a outpaitient program. He wasn't even on any medication.

Obviously the mental health system of Virginia failed this individual, so the solution is to take guns away from anybody who might pose the slightest risk??

Some defender of civil liberties you are.
 

FDF12389

Diamond Member
Sep 8, 2005
5,234
7
76
Originally posted by: Rainsford
Originally posted by: exdeath
...
Hmm all this gun talk is making want to meet some of you guys, go shooting, and make new friends. I thought it was supposed to make us all blood thirsty murderers? Shhhh!!!

Better idea, get some non-gun folks to go shooting with you and convince them that it's an all American hobby that doesn't turn you into a dangerous person or a militant wacko. I've said it before, and I'll say it again, you gun folks have serious PR problems on the other side of the issue...maybe some outreach is the answer.

Ive taken alot of dates shooting, two 10/22s and a brick of rounds. Its good clean fun. And Im not even a redneck, imagine that.
 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,333
136
Originally posted by: JD50
LOL, another one.

6000SUX pwned for a 3rd time today

ERROR: Sorry, we were unable to locate the object requested.

Can we safely assume that 6000SUX finally succeeded in getting himself banned? He sure tried harder than most. But of course, he didn't deserve it, it's because we're all gun-toting NRA-card-carrying whackos, etc., and has nothing to do with the fact that he's a douchebag....

*sigh*
 

1EZduzit

Lifer
Feb 4, 2002
11,833
1
0
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: JD50
LOL, another one.

6000SUX pwned for a 3rd time today

ERROR: Sorry, we were unable to locate the object requested.

Can we safely assume that 6000SUX finally succeeded in getting himself banned? He sure tried harder than most. But of course, he didn't deserve it, it's because we'll gun-toting NRA-card-carrying whackos, etc., and has nothing to do with the fact that he's a douchebag....

*sigh*

With an attitude like his it's no wonder he doesn't want people carrying weapons. :laugh:

6000SUX -1000 for logic

 

Vic

Elite Member
Jun 12, 2001
50,422
14,333
136
Originally posted by: BoberFett
What exactly makes gun control common sense? Because it agrees with your personal opinion? I find gun control goes against common sense.

There is nothing "common sense" about outlawing/banning private gun ownership. Study after study, statistic after statistic proves that the legal status of gun ownership (whether legal or illegal) has NO effect on crime/murder rates PERIOD. Both extremist sides of this are argument are wrong. I've been saying this here for years. It's just like how our precious War on Drugs has done nothing to stop people from using drugs (and never will, vice versa nor would legalization increase drug use). There is NO justifiable reason for the people to sacrifice a Constitutional right, except to pander to the fearmongering lies of anti-civil liberties authoritarians, and I think it's long long past time we draw a line against those assholes.
 

exdeath

Lifer
Jan 29, 2004
13,679
10
81
Originally posted by: Vic
Originally posted by: BoberFett
What exactly makes gun control common sense? Because it agrees with your personal opinion? I find gun control goes against common sense.

There is nothing "common sense" about outlawing/banning private gun ownership. Study after study, statistic after statistic proves that the legal status of gun ownership (whether legal or illegal) has NO effect on crime/murder rates PERIOD. Both extremist sides of this are argument are wrong. I've been saying this here for years. It's just like how our precious War on Drugs has done nothing to stop people from using drugs (and never will, vice versa nor would legalization increase drug use). There is NO justifiable reason for the people to sacrifice a Constitutional right, except to pander to the fear mongering lies of anti-civil liberties authoritarians, and I think it's long long past time we draw a line against those assholes.

Agreed. We should not only draw the line, but start pushing it back the other way. I for one would be happy to see the 1986 'machine gun' ban repealed. There was no need for it as machine guns were already virtually banned since 1934 and heavily regulated to the point that they were not worth the effort for criminals. The few cases where criminals had automatic weapons had legal non-automatic that were illegally modified anyway. A particular bank robbery with two guys with full body armor and illegally modified full auto AK47s comes to mind.

All the 1986 ban did was make it so a normal civilian has to pay $20,000 for a 30 year old gun limited in supply by pre 1986 production numbers when the local police dept can get the same exact gun made in 2007 for $2,500. I want my brand new MP5SD. I'd even pay two tax stamps on it even though the suppressor is integral.

:D
 

Red Dawn

Elite Member
Jun 4, 2001
57,529
3
0
I want to have the right to own a gun so I can protect myself from the gun nuts. Remember when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns. Of course that means a lot of law abiding citizens will become outlaws when guns are outlawed. There are a lot of Dale Dribble types armed to the teeth and they won't be giving up their weapons for any reason. Do you really want to be at their mercy?
 

SarcasticDwarf

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2001
9,574
1
76
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I want to have the right to own a gun so I can protect myself from the gun nuts. Remember when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns. Of course that means a lot of law abiding citizens will become outlaws when guns are outlawed. There are a lot of Dale Dribble types armed to the teeth and they won't be giving up their weapons for any reason. Do you really want to be at their mercy?

Actually the only people likely to be at risk are cops and the ATF. When it came time for them to start knocking on doors I would make sure you were far out in the middle of nowhere so that you would not get caught by any stray rounds.
 

Soybomb

Diamond Member
Jun 30, 2000
9,506
2
81
Originally posted by: Red Dawn
I want to have the right to own a gun so I can protect myself from the gun nuts. Remember when guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns. Of course that means a lot of law abiding citizens will become outlaws when guns are outlawed. There are a lot of Dale Dribble types armed to the teeth and they won't be giving up their weapons for any reason. Do you really want to be at their mercy?
I think the whole problem we've had in the thread is that no one has showed how gun nuts are a problem or anyone winds up being at their mercy. They seem statistically remarkably harmless, more so than the rest of the population.

Actually the only people likely to be at risk are cops and the ATF. When it came time for them to start knocking on doors I would make sure you were far out in the middle of nowhere so that you would not get caught by any stray rounds.
The idea of door to door gun confiscation in the US is I believe incorrect. US citizens are losing their rights by a very gradual erosion. Righten restrictions on full auto and suppressors, tighten buying/shipping/selling requirements, ban post-86 machine guns, make a person pay hundreds of dollars and fees, get fingerprinted like a criminal, and wait months to be allowed to carry a firearm assuming their state even allows it, increased restrictions on private sales, bans on posession in large cities, registration. Gun owners are tough talkers about confiscation but its already happening and fighting it doesn't involve shooting at any cops.
 

SarcasticDwarf

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2001
9,574
1
76
Originally posted by: Soybomb

The idea of door to door gun confiscation in the US is I believe incorrect. US citizens are losing their rights by a very gradual erosion. Righten restrictions on full auto and suppressors, tighten buying/shipping/selling requirements, ban post-86 machine guns, make a person pay hundreds of dollars and fees, get fingerprinted like a criminal, and wait months to be allowed to carry a firearm assuming their state even allows it, increased restrictions on private sales, bans on posession in large cities, registration. Gun owners are tough talkers about confiscation but its already happening and fighting it doesn't involve shooting at any cops.


Int he immediate future you are almost certainly right. I was thinking about down the road (decades). It WILL come to the point where it is essentially impossible to purchase a firearm. Once they reach that stage the only other step is to take away the existing ones.