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whats going on in London???

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ShinGouki

Member
Jan 23, 2003
151
0
0
Originally posted by: BBond


:thumbsup:

(Other than the liberal lie down part. Liberals take the time to consider options rather than say, rush into an unnecessary war against the wrong nation. We're witnessing the results of the ill-conceived and even more ill-planned conservative reactionary stance in Iraq right now.)

I really have to phrase things more carefully. I didn't mean to imply that lying down and taking it is what liberals in fact do. I was merely trying to prevent accusations of being a whiney liberal *insert stereotype here*. I have a combination of liberal and conservative views but consider myself to be neither. Especially when it comes to US definitions of the words. I find that recently both sides far to often concentrate more on belitleing each other than actually standing by their own founding principles which is a shame because both sides have compelling belief systems in many ways.

Back on topic, I'm having trouble sleeping as it dawned on me that many of my friends use the effected routes regularly near the time of the incidents and I have no way of really contacting them right now. I'm fairly sure they'll be fine but it would be reassuring to have it confirmed.
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: MrPabulum
Originally posted by: BBond
According the the 9/11 Commission Report there were no ties between Saddam and terrorists.

I'm sure you can find someone to circumvent the facts on the matter. After all, your president did and continues to do so.


Sure, as far as 9/11 goes, Saddam didn't pull the trigger. That's not what we're talking about. Saddam harbored, protected and nourished those interested in launching terrorist attacks against the U.S. mainland and American interests abroad. It comes down to one assumption: is the reaction to 9/11 a law enforcement matter, or a military matter? I'm sure we'll always disagree about this.

But Dimkaumd is right. No point in bickering at this hour.

rose.gif

The 9/11 Commission Report found NO connection between Saddam and the 9/11 terrorists.

fixed...

Saddam had plenty of links to terrorists...


Of course it had no links with 9/11.. Saddam Hussein was actually one of the Osama Bin Laden's most hated arab leaders around. Iraq was a LAIC country, with women in the army. Many, many times Osama had gone public against the Iraq lifestyle.
Saddam tried to play the religious move after the first gulf war in a desperate effort to gain consensus from the Iraqi population, but his country has always been a centralized laic country based on the oligopolic power his tribe, his party and the army leaders.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
At least 33 dead - London Evening Standard
http://www.thisislondon.com/news/articles/19753070?source=PA&ct=5
More than 33 people were killed in a series of terrorist blasts in London today, police said.

Seven people died in the first blast in a Tube tunnel 100yds from Liverpool Street Station, 21 died in a blast at between King's Cross and Russell Square and five died at Edgware Road station in an explosion involving three trains.

There were also deaths in a bus blast in Upper Woburn Square but no figures are available, Deputy Assistant Commissioner Brian Paddick said.

Mr Paddick said no warnings were given and no claims of responsibility have been received by the police.

The co-ordinated blasts which happened over the space of 60 minutes in the rush hour were condemned by Tony Blair as "barbaric".

The terrorist onslaught was unleashed on the day that G8 world leaders met at Gleneagles.

A group calling itself the Secret Organization Group of al Qaida of Jihad Organization in Europe claimed responsibility for the attacks on an Islamic website.

The message said: "O nation of Islam and nation of Arabism: Rejoice for it is time to take revenge from the British Zionist Crusader Government in retaliation for the massacres Britain is committing in Iraq and Afghanistan.

"The heroic mujahidin have carried out a blessed raid in London. Britain is now burning with fear, terror, and panic in its northern, southern, eastern, and western quarters."

The outrage echoed the al Qaida assault on Madrid commuters in 2004 in which almost 200 people died.

In the wake of the London attacks, survivors gave harrowing accounts of the carnage, describing piles of bodies on wrecked Tube trains and a bus which was torn to pieces along with its passengers.

The day of death and chaos prompted the Prime Minister to vow that the terrorists would never win.

"Whatever they do it is our determination that they will never succeed in destroying what we hold dear in this country and other civilised nations in the world," he said.

Mr Blair left the G8 gathering for London in the wake of the attacks, but said the summit would go on.

Before he left, the G8 leaders appeared side-by-side with Mr Blair to condemn the "barbaric" attacks.

As the scale of the attack became clear, ministers attending the regular Thursday cabinet meeting convened an emergency Cobra committee to deal with the crisis.

The terror attacks began at 8.51am when the bomb exploded in the tunnel near Liverpool Street station, killing seven.

At 8.56am, 21 people died in a blast in a tunnel between King's Cross and Russell Square.

At 9.17am, five people died when a blast ripped through a tunnel wall at Edgware Road station, damaging three trains.

Exactly 30 minutes later at 9.47am a blast tore the roof off the red number 30 double decker bus, packed with commuters forced above ground after the Tube network had been shut down.

Police have not yet released the number of fatalities but eyewitnesses spoke of carnage at the scene.

Two hours later paramedics were still rushing to the scene of the King's Cross blast deep underground on the Piccadilly line.

At Liverpool Street Station in the City, the wounded were treated by medics as they lay on the concourse.

It was the same at King's Cross while the Hilton Metropole on the Edgware Road was used as a makeshift treatment centre.

The bus blast occurred only a few hundred yards from Russell Square station.
London was thrown into chaos in the wake of the blasts with shops, banks and offices closing and thousands of people left stranded on the streets as mainline stations were shut and Tube and bus services cancelled.

Metropolitan Police Commissioner Sir Ian Blair said there was evidence of explosives at at least one of the explosion sites.

Police said it was too early to say whether they had been caused by planted explosive devices, or whether they were the work of suicide bombers.

The blasts were initially blamed on a power surge but it soon became clear that it was a co-ordinated terrorist attack on the capital.

The G8 gathering had prompted fears of a terrorist spectacular.

Home Secretary Charles Clarke told a sombre House of Commons the blasts were "criminal and appalling acts".

Speaking at Gleneagles, US President George Bush vowed that the terrorists would be brought to justice.

The Queen spoke of her shock at the "dreadful events in London this morning".
Respect MP George Galloway said Londoners had "paid the price" for Tony Blair's decision to go to war in Iraq and Afghanistan.

He called on the Prime Minister to withdraw the British troops from Iraq in order to remove people in the UK from "harm's way".

All London hospitals were put on major incident alert after the explosions. Neighbouring counties also sent emergency aid to London.

Metropolitan Police officers in Scotland for the G8 summit were urgently redeployed to London.

Commissioner Sir Ian Blair said: "There is no doubt it is a terrorist incident."

He said the bomb which ripped through the bus in Tavistock Square had exploded in the "back of the upper part of the bus".

He refused to confirm or deny reports that the explosion was the work of a suicide bomber.

An eyewitness described seeing dead bodies lying in the street after the bus bomb.

The security guard at the nearby London School of Tropical Hygiene and Medicine said the blast completely blew the bus apart.

Mr Ayobami Bello, 46, said he had visited a bank nearby and was only 30 metres from the bus when it exploded.

He said: "It was terrible. The bus went to pieces. There were so many bodies on the floor.

"The back was completely gone, it was blown off completely and a dead body was hanging out and there were dead bodies on the road, it was a horrible thing."

He said other bodies sat slumped in their bus seats, some with arms and legs missing.

He said: "I can't believe it, I can't even believe I survived it.

"There was panic and everyone was running for their lives. I saw a lady coming towards me soaked in blood. Everyone was in confusion."

Survivors of the Tube blasts described scenes of total chaos.

Simon Corvett, 26, from Oxford, was on the eastbound train leaving Edgware Road Tube station when the explosion happened.

He said: "All of sudden there was this massive huge bang. It was absolutely deafening and all the windows shattered.

"The glass did not actually fall out of the windows, it just cracked.
"The train came to a grinding halt, everyone fell off their seats."
Mr Corvett, who works in public relations, said the commuter train was absolutely packed.

"There were just loads of people screaming and the carriages filled with smoke," he said.

"You couldn't really breathe and you couldn't see what was happening. The driver came on the Tannoy and said 'We have got a problem, don't panic'."

Mr Corvett, whose face was covered in soot, joined other passengers to force open the train doors with a fire extinguisher.

He said the carriage on the other track was destroyed.

"You could see the carriage opposite was completely gutted," he added.
"There were some people in real trouble."
 

rchiu

Diamond Member
Jun 8, 2002
3,846
0
0
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Forsythe
So you're basically just drawing a red lione from the fall of the ottoman empire to, today?
There've been fundies all over the world, and all through the time in every religion.
When you piss of people, you're gonna get burned. I might not agree on it, but for every act, there's a reaction. If you wan't to live with that, be my guest.
The fundies pissed us off numerous times. 9/11 was the final straw. Too bad for them and unfortunate for those in the ME who have to suffer because of the actions of their fringe idiots.

You're still ignoring THE FACT that there were no terrorists in Iraq. No WMD.

So how can the people of Iraq be forced "to suffer because of the actions of their fringe idiots" when they weren't their fringe idiots?
You still ignore that we are in Iraq to have an impact on the entire ME. Since we can't possibly invade the entire ME all at once we have to start somewhere and Iraq was the best place to start.

And there were terrorists in Iraq prior to the invasion. We've already been over that.

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=429987

Where are the WMD? Who knows. Maybe they're stashed in all those mass graves in Kosovo? You know, the mass graves containing a 100,000 that Clinton gave as the reason for going into Kosovo that were subsequently not found?

Yeah, what impact we have with this war in Iraq? Did we eliminated Al Qaeda with this war, or did we catch Bin Ladin with this war? Did we stop Al Qaeda's ability to carry out large scale coordinated attacks?

If anything, this war in Iraq wasted our resources, shifted our focus, and make more enemy for us in the ME.

Almost 4 years after 911, we still haven't eliminated Al Qaeda, still haven't capture Bin Ladin, and now they just carried out another large scale coordinated attack in the biggest city of our closest ally. What exactly has Bush achieved after one of the worst attack on America? Japen surrendered less then 4 years after Pearl Harbor, how many years are we going to wait before Bush has something, anything to show for his effort?
 

11thHour

Senior member
Feb 20, 2004
796
1
0
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: MrPabulum
Originally posted by: BBond
According the the 9/11 Commission Report there were no ties between Saddam and terrorists.

I'm sure you can find someone to circumvent the facts on the matter. After all, your president did and continues to do so.


Sure, as far as 9/11 goes, Saddam didn't pull the trigger. That's not what we're talking about. Saddam harbored, protected and nourished those interested in launching terrorist attacks against the U.S. mainland and American interests abroad. It comes down to one assumption: is the reaction to 9/11 a law enforcement matter, or a military matter? I'm sure we'll always disagree about this.

But Dimkaumd is right. No point in bickering at this hour.

rose.gif

The 9/11 Commission Report found NO connection between Saddam and the 9/11 terrorists.

fixed...

Saddam had absolutely NO links to terrorists...

Fixed it again for you. You just can't get it right. Maybe you should actually factcheck Rush Limbaugh before posting.

Abu Nidal...

Lookit up asshat

alqueda takes down the world trade centers so we invade iraq because of ties with abu nidal?? LOL! :D
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
6,423
0
0
**cough** CIA **cough** poor Bush approval ratings **cough** 9/11! 9/11! Freedumb!!
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
Originally posted by: conjur
Oh for the love of...

Originally posted by: Doboji
DO I really?... You know damn well at the very least Saddam was sending money to the families of suicide bombers in Israel
He offered money to the surviving members of a family who's husband/father killed himself as a suicide bomber. Where's the proof any money was actually sent?
Are you serious or are you just playing the blindered 'where's the proof' game again?

-----

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/03/25/1017004766310.html?oneclick=true

Saddam stokes war with suicide bomber cash
March 26 2002

The Iraqi leader's payments to the families of dead Palestinian terrorists means more trouble for Yasser Arafat, writes Paul McGeough in the West Bank.

The hall was packed and the intake of breath was audible as a special announcement was made to the war widows of the West Bank - Saddam Hussein would pay $US25,000 ($47,000) to the family of each suicide bomber as an enticement for others to volunteer for martyrdom in the name of the Palestinian people.

The men at the top table then opened Saddam's chequebook and, as the names of 47 martyrs were called, family representatives went up to sign for cheques written in US dollars.

Those of two suicide bombers were the first to be paid the new rate of $US25,000 and those whose relatives had died in other clashes with the Israeli military were given $US10,000 each.

The $US500,000 doled out in this impoverished community yesterday means that the besieged Iraqi leader now has contributed more than $US10 million to grieving Palestinian families since the new intifada began 18 months ago.

But the timing of this clear signal that Saddam is stoking the Middle East conflict with his new $US15,000 bonus to encourage more suicide bombers - and exclusive pictures from the distribution ceremony, which was attended by the Herald - could make it more difficult for the Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat, to manage his already strained relationship with the United States.

...

-----

there are plenty of other terrorists who have found shelter in Iraq under the Hussein regime
Ok, name ONE!
Omar Abdel Rahman

... was he directly connected to Al Queda or Osama Bin Laden? NO... was he connected to other terrorist organizations, and did he provide support for terrorists... yes he did.
Where's the beef?
You can probably consider the foot in your mouth as such.
 

BBond

Diamond Member
Oct 3, 2004
8,363
0
0
Originally posted by: ShinGouki
Originally posted by: BBond


:thumbsup:

(Other than the liberal lie down part. Liberals take the time to consider options rather than say, rush into an unnecessary war against the wrong nation. We're witnessing the results of the ill-conceived and even more ill-planned conservative reactionary stance in Iraq right now.)

I really have to phrase things more carefully. I didn't mean to imply that lying down and taking it is what liberals in fact do. I was merely trying to prevent accusations of being a whiney liberal *insert stereotype here*. I have a combination of liberal and conservative views but consider myself to be neither. Especially when it comes to US definitions of the words. I find that recently both sides far to often concentrate more on belitleing each other than actually standing by their own founding principles which is a shame because both sides have compelling belief systems in many ways.

Back on topic, I'm having trouble sleeping as it dawned on me that many of my friends use the effected routes regularly near the time of the incidents and I have no way of really contacting them right now. I'm fairly sure they'll be fine but it would be reassuring to have it confirmed.

We're living in a very highly charged polarized atmosphere in the U.S. at the moment. Thanks to traitors like KKKarl Rove making statements like the one he made last week.

I sincerely hope your friends are OK.

There are a few lines from a New Jersey para-medic who was in London and offered help after the blasts.

NJ heightens security after London attacks

In London, an emergency medical technician from New Jersey helped treat the wounded at a train station.

"One gentleman told me that the floor of the train he was on was blown out, it was just gone. I believe another gentleman was ejected from the train. Whether he fell or was blown by the force of the blast I don't know," said Sean Barron, 20, of Westfield.

"It was very well organized, we took down everybody's details and made a priority list as to who was the worst wounded," he said.

 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
6,423
0
0
Originally posted by: matstars
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: matstars


Wow conjur...

So we should just leave the middle east to be a breeding ground for hatred and harboring western terrorists.

wow... just wow...

No, we should make up lies to justify illegal unprovoked aggression that create a breeding ground for hatred.

WHAT!!??

Have you missed these Iraqi's who have BEHEADED American's, and other westerners on their TELEVISION STATIONS ???? THIS is NOT A BREEDING GROUND?

I don't even know what to say.

That wasn't happening before we invaded Iraq, genius. :roll:
 

Doboji

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
7,912
0
76
Originally posted by: 11thHour
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: MrPabulum
Originally posted by: BBond
According the the 9/11 Commission Report there were no ties between Saddam and terrorists.

I'm sure you can find someone to circumvent the facts on the matter. After all, your president did and continues to do so.


Sure, as far as 9/11 goes, Saddam didn't pull the trigger. That's not what we're talking about. Saddam harbored, protected and nourished those interested in launching terrorist attacks against the U.S. mainland and American interests abroad. It comes down to one assumption: is the reaction to 9/11 a law enforcement matter, or a military matter? I'm sure we'll always disagree about this.

But Dimkaumd is right. No point in bickering at this hour.

rose.gif

The 9/11 Commission Report found NO connection between Saddam and the 9/11 terrorists.

fixed...

Saddam had absolutely NO links to terrorists...

Fixed it again for you. You just can't get it right. Maybe you should actually factcheck Rush Limbaugh before posting.

Abu Nidal...

Lookit up asshat

alqueda takes down the world trade centers so we invade iraq because of ties with abu nidal?? LOL! :D

Why are people in P&N such stupid asshats incapable of following the logical process of a conversation.

Allow me to help your stupid mind comprehend some basics of talking to another human being.

MrPabulum asserted that while Iraq and Saddam did not attack on 9/11 they clearly had link to terrorists, and terrorist organizations interested in attacking the US and Allies.

BBond attempted to refute this report by saying that the 9/11 report said that Saddam had no ties to terrorists.

I corrected him by saying that the 9/11 report says Saddam/Iraq had no ties to the 9/11 terrorists, but certainly Iraq/Saddam had ties to terrorists.

Bunch of people: Nu uh... you're stupid... give me one example....

Me: Abu Nidal

You: So you're saying we attacked Iraq because of Abu Nidal?!?! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Me: Where the fck did you draw that conclusion from?

-Max
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
Originally posted by: rchiu
Yeah, what impact we have with this war in Iraq? Did we eliminated Al Qaeda with this war, or did we catch Bin Ladin with this war? Did we stop Al Qaeda's ability to carry out large scale coordinated attacks?

If anything, this war in Iraq wasted our resources, shifted our focus, and make more enemy for us in the ME.

Almost 4 years after 911, we still haven't eliminated Al Qaeda, still haven't capture Bin Ladin, and now they just carried out another large scale coordinated attack in the biggest city of our closest ally. What exactly has Bush achieved after one of the worst attack on America? Japen surrendered less then 4 years after Pearl Harbor, how many years are we going to wait before Bush has something, anything to show for his effort?
We nuked Japan to get them to finally capitulate. Are you suggesting we should do the same to the ME?

 

Doboji

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
7,912
0
76
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: matstars
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: matstars


Wow conjur...

So we should just leave the middle east to be a breeding ground for hatred and harboring western terrorists.

wow... just wow...

No, we should make up lies to justify illegal unprovoked aggression that create a breeding ground for hatred.

WHAT!!??

Have you missed these Iraqi's who have BEHEADED American's, and other westerners on their TELEVISION STATIONS ???? THIS is NOT A BREEDING GROUND?

I don't even know what to say.

That wasn't happening before we invaded Iraq, genius. :roll:

You're right Daniel Pearl was beheaded after he was already dead.... so it doesnt count.

 

Darkhawk28

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2000
6,759
0
0
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: matstars
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: matstars


Wow conjur...

So we should just leave the middle east to be a breeding ground for hatred and harboring western terrorists.

wow... just wow...

No, we should make up lies to justify illegal unprovoked aggression that create a breeding ground for hatred.

WHAT!!??

Have you missed these Iraqi's who have BEHEADED American's, and other westerners on their TELEVISION STATIONS ???? THIS is NOT A BREEDING GROUND?

I don't even know what to say.

That wasn't happening before we invaded Iraq, genius. :roll:

You're right Daniel Pearl was beheaded after he was already dead.... so it doesnt count.

Wasn't he beheaded in Pakistan?
 

11thHour

Senior member
Feb 20, 2004
796
1
0
Originally posted by: phillyTIM
Originally posted by: 11thHour
More evidence that our war on terror is successful, as terrorists are instead killing people abroad and not in our homeland.

Oh, I guess that makes us better than everyone else. FVCK the rest of the world, we're safe. FVCK you Tony Blair - sucks to be you - but thanks for helping us out and footing the bill!

You bastard, 11thHour. You are exactly what gives Americans a bad name, and why the rest of the World always thinks they end up with America's S#IT, at the end of everything. Because they do, end up with it.

Frightening, isn't it? That facetiousness as absurd as my comment could actually be believed to be someone's true opinion. I think it means someone could be a complete ascenine ignoramous asshat and yet still simply come across as a typical pro-bush supporter. :D
 

EatSpam

Diamond Member
May 1, 2005
6,423
0
0
Originally posted by: irwincur
You must fight terrorism by attacking the roots of terrorism.

So you are advocating the elimination of Islam?

That is the only way you could truely remove the threat of this brand of terror. When the very basis of a religion teaches you to kill those that are not like you - there will be issues.

Ah... just like Christianity... gotta love them Crusades and how many of them feel that this is a Holy War.
 

conjur

No Lifer
Jun 7, 2001
58,686
3
0
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: conjur
Oh for the love of...

Originally posted by: Doboji
DO I really?... You know damn well at the very least Saddam was sending money to the families of suicide bombers in Israel
He offered money to the surviving members of a family who's husband/father killed himself as a suicide bomber. Where's the proof any money was actually sent?
Are you serious or are you just playing the blindered 'where's the proof' game again?

-----

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2002/03/25/1017004766310.html?oneclick=true

Saddam stokes war with suicide bomber cash
March 26 2002

The Iraqi leader's payments to the families of dead Palestinian terrorists means more trouble for Yasser Arafat, writes Paul McGeough in the West Bank.

The hall was packed and the intake of breath was audible as a special announcement was made to the war widows of the West Bank - Saddam Hussein would pay $US25,000 ($47,000) to the family of each suicide bomber as an enticement for others to volunteer for martyrdom in the name of the Palestinian people.

The men at the top table then opened Saddam's chequebook and, as the names of 47 martyrs were called, family representatives went up to sign for cheques written in US dollars.

Those of two suicide bombers were the first to be paid the new rate of $US25,000 and those whose relatives had died in other clashes with the Israeli military were given $US10,000 each.

The $US500,000 doled out in this impoverished community yesterday means that the besieged Iraqi leader now has contributed more than $US10 million to grieving Palestinian families since the new intifada began 18 months ago.

But the timing of this clear signal that Saddam is stoking the Middle East conflict with his new $US15,000 bonus to encourage more suicide bombers - and exclusive pictures from the distribution ceremony, which was attended by the Herald - could make it more difficult for the Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat, to manage his already strained relationship with the United States.

...
Ah, so Saddam was directly involved funding suicide bombers. Yeah, right. Did you even read that? He was paying survivors as their source of income was now gone. He wasn't providing money to would-be bombers nor providing arms.


there are plenty of other terrorists who have found shelter in Iraq under the Hussein regime
Ok, name ONE!
Omar Abdel Rahman
Hunh? Oh, you mean the guy who was issued a US visa by the CIA for his help in Afghanistan?

BTW, he was arrested and sentenced to life in prison in 1996. How could he be a justification for invading Iraq in 2003?

... was he directly connected to Al Queda or Osama Bin Laden? NO... was he connected to other terrorist organizations, and did he provide support for terrorists... yes he did.
Where's the beef?
You can probably consider the foot in your mouth as such.
My feet are firmly planted on the ground.
 

Doboji

Diamond Member
May 18, 2001
7,912
0
76
Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: matstars
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: matstars


Wow conjur...

So we should just leave the middle east to be a breeding ground for hatred and harboring western terrorists.

wow... just wow...

No, we should make up lies to justify illegal unprovoked aggression that create a breeding ground for hatred.

WHAT!!??

Have you missed these Iraqi's who have BEHEADED American's, and other westerners on their TELEVISION STATIONS ???? THIS is NOT A BREEDING GROUND?

I don't even know what to say.

That wasn't happening before we invaded Iraq, genius. :roll:

You're right Daniel Pearl was beheaded after he was already dead.... so it doesnt count.

Wasn't he beheaded in Pakistan?

Yes he was... I read too quickly.... the OP said iraqis thus my post was ill placed... but it still shows that this problem existed before the Iraq War.

-Max
 

Darkhawk28

Diamond Member
Dec 22, 2000
6,759
0
0
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: Darkhawk28
Originally posted by: Doboji
Originally posted by: EatSpam
Originally posted by: matstars
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: matstars


Wow conjur...

So we should just leave the middle east to be a breeding ground for hatred and harboring western terrorists.

wow... just wow...

No, we should make up lies to justify illegal unprovoked aggression that create a breeding ground for hatred.

WHAT!!??

Have you missed these Iraqi's who have BEHEADED American's, and other westerners on their TELEVISION STATIONS ???? THIS is NOT A BREEDING GROUND?

I don't even know what to say.

That wasn't happening before we invaded Iraq, genius. :roll:

You're right Daniel Pearl was beheaded after he was already dead.... so it doesnt count.

Wasn't he beheaded in Pakistan?

Yes he was... I read too quickly.... the OP said iraqis thus my post was ill placed... but it still shows that this problem existed before the Iraq War.

-Max

Yes, in Afghanistan and Pakistan, but we got diverted to Bush's "excellent adventure" (copyright Red Dawn).
 
Sep 12, 2004
16,852
59
86
Originally posted by: BBond
Here's something a bit more recent, Chicken.

Thanks George for helping al Qaeda on their training mission by attacking the wrong godam country.

You moron.

Terrorists hone skills in Iraq, experts say

PS No credible link between Saddam and terrorists. 9/11 Commission Report.
Keep repeating your ignorance over and over and over, BBond. It's quite a display of fruit loop liberalism.
 

imported_Tango

Golden Member
Mar 8, 2005
1,623
0
0
Originally posted by: rchiu
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: BBond
Originally posted by: TastesLikeChicken
Originally posted by: Forsythe
So you're basically just drawing a red lione from the fall of the ottoman empire to, today?
There've been fundies all over the world, and all through the time in every religion.
When you piss of people, you're gonna get burned. I might not agree on it, but for every act, there's a reaction. If you wan't to live with that, be my guest.
The fundies pissed us off numerous times. 9/11 was the final straw. Too bad for them and unfortunate for those in the ME who have to suffer because of the actions of their fringe idiots.

You're still ignoring THE FACT that there were no terrorists in Iraq. No WMD.

So how can the people of Iraq be forced "to suffer because of the actions of their fringe idiots" when they weren't their fringe idiots?
You still ignore that we are in Iraq to have an impact on the entire ME. Since we can't possibly invade the entire ME all at once we have to start somewhere and Iraq was the best place to start.

And there were terrorists in Iraq prior to the invasion. We've already been over that.

http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=429987

Where are the WMD? Who knows. Maybe they're stashed in all those mass graves in Kosovo? You know, the mass graves containing a 100,000 that Clinton gave as the reason for going into Kosovo that were subsequently not found?

Yeah, what impact we have with this war in Iraq? Did we eliminated Al Qaeda with this war, or did we catch Bin Ladin with this war? Did we stop Al Qaeda's ability to carry out large scale coordinated attacks?

If anything, this war in Iraq wasted our resources, shifted our focus, and make more enemy for us in the ME.

Almost 4 years after 911, we still haven't eliminated Al Qaeda, still haven't capture Bin Ladin, and now they just carried out another large scale coordinated attack in the biggest city of our closest ally. What exactly has Bush achieved after one of the worst attack on America? Japen surrendered less then 4 years after Pearl Harbor, how many years are we going to wait before Bush has something, anything to show for his effort?


I don't want to defend Bush, but he is not the only one to blame for this US disaster in the so-called war on terrorism. The problem is the US don't have the resources necessary to win this war. The US intelligence was forged with a specific task: counter the huge, solid, centralized and culturally well known enemy that was the Soviet Union. Right now we face an enemy with no rigid structure to infiltrate, no controlled territory, no regular army. An enemy much harder to infiltrate because of cultural and logistical reasons, an enemy fast and flexible that doesn't get its strenght from firepower but from the ability to destabilize the public opinion and the financial markets by using media-friendly spectacular terror attacks made by civilians.

The reaction to 9/11, invading a country, represents the proof that the secret services are not equiped yet with the knowledge necessary to fight this enemy in the only effective way: intelligence, intelligence and more intelligence. So they have chosen to apply to old-school tactics, made of military display of power and territorial control.
The US secret services were tailor made to fight a Bear, and now they must go after a mouse... you'll need a lot of time before they master this new modus-operandi.

And by the way: there ARE mass graves in Kosovo. Take a flight an go see them if you don't believe the thousands of images you can see on the internet.