What's After Democracy?

[ElFenix]

Originally posted by: apoppin
Democracy - as visualized by America's founding fathers - had a lot of checks and balances to keep abuses in check. These are currently breaking down.

it was a representative republic. the checks and balances are still there. congress is just as jealous of the presidential powers as they always have been. if you want break down all you need to do is look at jackson's complete ignoring of the supreme court decision that the cherokee constitution was valid and recognized. we managed to survive that.

 

[Analog]

the united federation of planets. Kaplah!

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: ElFenix

Originally posted by: apoppin
Democracy - as visualized by America's founding fathers - had a lot of checks and balances to keep abuses in check. These are currently breaking down.

it was a representative republic. the checks and balances are still there. congress is just as jealous of the presidential powers as they always have been. if you want break down all you need to do is look at jackson's complete ignoring of the supreme court decision that the cherokee constitution was valid and recognized. we managed to survive that.

Do you really think it is going to last for another hundred years? five hundred?

In what form?

 

[WinkOsmosis]

Anarchy

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis
Anarchy

I doubt that "anarchy" is a "form" of government.

But it may be "next".

:Q

 

[Triumph]

Originally posted by: yellowfiero
the united federation of planets. Kaplah!

Well it's pretty obvious that the US started it all. First we took over Earth. Then moved on to space.

 

[Shade4ever]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis
Anarchy

I doubt that "anarchy" is a "form" of government.

But it may be "next".

:Q

Anarchy COULD be a viable form of government, in a well-educated and factionless (religionless, bigotless, etc.) society, although perhaps the only difference between the existence it would have and that of a true democracy is that of name...

 

[Spyro]

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

After democracy? Most likely it would be anarchy, and then some kind of dictatorship

 

[apoppin]

anarchy

1 Absence of any form of political authority.
2 Political disorder and confusion.
3 Absence of any cohesive principle, such as a common standard or purpose.

NOT a "form of Government" by definition

 

[BDawg]

Democracy -> Whiskey -> Sexy

It's the natural progression.

 

[sandorski]

Hard to say, perhaps Direct Democracy, assuming that things evolve in a more positive manner. I wouldn't rule out a form of Communism, but chances are that a regression will occur and humanity slips back into a Dark Age, then eventually to Democracy again, damn cycles!

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: sandorski
Hard to say, perhaps Direct Democracy, assuming that things evolve in a more positive manner. I wouldn't rule out a form of Communism, but chances are that a regression will occur and humanity slips back into a Dark Age, then eventually to Democracy again, damn cycles!

We never had to consider left-over radioactivity before.

So, this may be the LAST form of human government?!

:Q

 

[sandorski]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: sandorski
Hard to say, perhaps Direct Democracy, assuming that things evolve in a more positive manner. I wouldn't rule out a form of Communism, but chances are that a regression will occur and humanity slips back into a Dark Age, then eventually to Democracy again, damn cycles!

We never had to consider left-over radioactivity before.

So, this may be the LAST form of human government?!

:Q

Last form? Not sure, certainly the best form as far as human rights and such are concerned. The problem with our current Democracies are that it's too easy for the ambitious to simply lie and deceive their way into power then have the voter forget about it. Our Democracies need more input from the Electorate, the power of Recall or forced Referendum and the like.

 

[HombrePequeno]

True democracy is kind of stupid. It's basically just tyranny of the majority, which would be fine if the majority of people weren't so stupid.

Maybe our next step will be a government like the one in Starship Troopers...

Honestly though, I think representative democracy (or whatever you call what we have) is the last stop in forms of government. This doesn't mean that we won't turn into a welfare state or into a socialist one. Hell, look at the Scandinavian coutnries. They're nice and democratic but boy are they socialist.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

Read Plato... he had the answer. Though i don't agree with it (mostly at least).

 

[apoppin]

Originally posted by: Moralpanic

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

Read Plato... he had the answer. Though i don't agree with it (mostly at least).

I did read Plato . . . it's been close to 30 years ago and I don't remember anything specific from him that applies to this time.

I think even the "rules' are changin'.

 

[her209]

Star Trek is next.

 

[Dark4ng3l]

The way the world is going today, I think we will end up with a sort of corporate government like in the alien movies(a corporation controlls everything) even if that corporate has to go trough the curent system or be their own government(essentially the corporation is >50% of everything)

 

[Piano Man]

I'm not sure what it would be called, but it would probably consist of more socialism mixed with environmentalism. I believe that once everyone on the Earth is on equal footing (fingers crossed here) that money and belongings will go the way of the dodo. Sure, we'll still have stuff, but I'm just saying that we will be knowledgable enough to know what is good for us and what isn't. However, in order for those to work, the morals of society would have to change to something where people just don't think for themselves, but for all others on the planet. The reason socialism and communism failed was largely due to the fact that people who were in control were greedy and self-serving. I do believe that if we survive for a great deal longer, this is what eventually will happen. But I'm talking way down the road. At least 1000 years.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: apoppin

Originally posted by: Moralpanic

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

Read Plato... he had the answer. Though i don't agree with it (mostly at least).

I did read Plato . . . it's been close to 30 years ago and I don't remember anything specific from him that applies to this time.

I think even the "rules' are changin'.

Well, it's been awhile since i studied Plato too, so i'll try to give it a shot: He doesn't believe democracy will work, because there are 3 social classes: the poor, the working class, and the rich. Of course the rich is the smallest class. In a democracy, everybody has the same voting power, so the poor and working class outpower the rich. So the poor and working class use that political power to rob the rich. The rich, attempting to fight back from being robbed, will eventually be hated... so there will be a war between the classes. This will cause the poor and working class to elect a single individual to lead them in the fight, and this hero will win and plunder the rich. In time, with the corruption of power (power corrupts... absolute power corrupts absolutely), he will become a tyrant (Hitler rised to power the same way, so did Stalin).

So a democracy doesn't work, because the power comes from the largest group. The largest group is the poor and working class, so they will take advantage of the rich class. The poor and working class are normally less intelligent than the rich and higher classes (like philosophers), so democracy degenerates because decisions will be made from the power of the poor and working classes.

Plato proposed that the leaders of a society should be Guardians. These are people (philosophers), who are well educated, and thus can rule properly. They will have no wealth whatsoever, so that the common people would not want to be Guardians. Infact, Plato wanted a Guardian breeding program, where the Guardians breed their own kind, and raised them themselves. These children would be distinguished not by how intelligent they are, but by how much interest they have. If they have a lot of interest in material wealth and power, then they were not fit for Guardianship, and are made commoners. This way, the Guardians can rule the society properly. They cannot have wealth of their own, so they do not need to rob the rich. They are educated, so they can rule for the overall good of society, and not be swayed by what the poor/working class wants.

Of course, there are serious flaws in Plato's vision as well.

 

[tweakmm]

Originally posted by: WinkOsmosis
Anarchy

 

[Marshallj]

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

In an ideal world, people would be able to govern themselves and understand each other peacefully without an authority figure looking over their shoulders monitoring what they do.

But I doubt that will ever happen.


But the answer to your question, I believe, is Self-governance with diplomacy between individuals and groups.

 

[Looney]

Originally posted by: Marshallj

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

In an ideal world, people would be able to govern themselves and understand each other peacefully without an authority figure looking over their shoulders monitoring what they do.

But I doubt that will ever happen.


But the answer to your question, I believe, is Self-governance with diplomacy between individuals and groups.

Won't happen. Read Thomas Hobbes State of Nature to understand why (or at least that's why i believe it can't happen).

 

[apoppin]

Thanks for the Plato "refresher".

I guess it is also possible the rich will win (did he entertain that thought?) . . . that looks more likely in this day with a better shot then the Romans got from technology and advanced marketing (brainwashing) techniques. . . Didn't the Romans attempt to placate the masses with violent entertainment and welfare (bread and circuses)?

Plato seemed to think we will do what is "best" for ourselves . . . his guardians were a pretty utopian ideal - there is NO way to rid ourselves of inept "career politicians" today (through reformation; and revolution lets in other dangers).

What you bolded, makes little sense in view of today's world:

So a democracy doesn't work, because the power comes from the largest group. The largest group is the poor and working class, so they will take advantage of the rich class.

Isn't the wealthiest group taking advantage of everyone else? They have effectively eliminated all but two of the main "choices" in our society.

 

[TheShiz]

Originally posted by: apoppin
I have noticed that every form of government - so far - has been replaced by another.

So, what's likely after democracy?

the human race will most likely never see true democracy, so i don't know how you can go beyond that.