What? No government shutdown threads?

[brycejones]

Democrats didn't want any teamwork when passing it. They sure wouldn't want any teamwork to fix it.

Democrats also wouldn't want any teamwork to fix it because apparently they think there's nothing wrong with it.

I don't think you'll find many who think its a "perfect" bill as it stands today. However the GOP has consistently gone at trying to gut or repeal it instead of improving it. Until the GOP decides to act like grown ups your are correct there will not be any teamwork on fixing the ACA.

Hopefully after this current charade is over they will start to act like adults but my hopes are not high.

 

[kia75]

Strange these liability issues didn't seem to be a problem during the '95-'96 shutdown. And wouldn't signs indicating the gov is closed so has no liabaility be cheaper than barrycades and guards?

This exact same thing happened in the 95-96 shutdown and barricades were put up. The difference was that in the 95-96 shutdowns Republicans assumed they'd be called hyprocrites if they berated a ranger for closing a park after they caused a shutdown that forced all national parks to close. Remember, that Ranger is working for FREE right now and there's no guarantee that she'll get paid.

 

[Juddog]

I don't think you'll find many who think its a "perfect" bill as it stands today. However the GOP has consistently gone at trying to gut or repeal it instead of improving it. Until the GOP decides to act like grown ups your are correct there will not be any teamwork on fixing the ACA.

Hopefully after this current charade is over they will start to act like adults but my hopes are not high.

^^ Exactly - work on making the bill better instead of holding the entire country hostage in order to gut it.

 

[unokitty]

LOL!

Uno

 

[kia75]

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/10/04/us/politics/debt-limit-impasse.html?hp&_r=0

This may be a sign of the beginning of a Republican surrender.

If Boehner does this, I wonder what will happen to his speakership? It seems like the odds of an attempted coup from his right would be high. If such a thing happened, I wonder if Democrats would team up with moderate Republicans to keep Boehner or if something completely crazy would happen.

Interesting article but I'm not quite certain I understand what Boehner's plan is.

Does he a) Let a bill go through that removes the debt limit while keeping the shutdown in place?
or b) Both end the shutdown and raise the debt limit at once?


The debt limit is the most powerful weapons the Republicans have in a shut-down. Without the debt limit threat of Armegaddon the Republicans have nothing they can use to twist the Democrat's arm. The shutdown is a slow bleed for the Republicans, the question is just how much damage do the Republicans want to do to themselves before ending the shutdown. If Boehner conflates the Debt Limit and Shutdown that means we have an end date for these shennanigans (before the 17th). If he raises the debt limit but doesn't remove the shutdown he dooms the republicans to complete failure over the whole mess. Boehner is between a rock and a hard place. Either way his political career is over.

 

[fskimospy]

Interesting article but I'm not quite certain I understand what Boehner's plan is.

Does he a) Let a bill go through that removes the debt limit while keeping the shutdown in place?
or b) Both end the shutdown and raise the debt limit at once?


The debt limit is the most powerful weapons the Republicans have in a shut-down. Without the debt limit threat of Armegaddon the Republicans have nothing they can use to twist the Democrat's arm. The shutdown is a slow bleed for the Republicans, the question is just how much damage do the Republicans want to do to themselves before ending the shutdown. If Boehner conflates the Debt Limit and Shutdown that means we have an end date for these shennanigans (before the 17th). If he raises the debt limit but doesn't remove the shutdown he dooms the republicans to complete failure over the whole mess. Boehner is between a rock and a hard place. Either way his political career is over.

I can't see any way where the debt limit is raised without a CR being attached to it.

After a Republican defeat here I see a good chance of a coup attempt on Boehner, which could make things very interesting. As in: do Democrats and sane Republicans work together to keep Boehner as speaker?

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Just defend your media buddies.

Even they are starting to worry...

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...-house-bl/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/...secretary-obama-administration-new-york-times

just a snippet from one of the articles.

"at least 20 reporters and editors from mainstream news organizations have taken high-profile positions in the administration within the past five years."

You made a funny! You quoted the Washington Times!

 

[kia75]

I can't see any way where the debt limit is raised without a CR being attached to it.

After a Republican defeat here I see a good chance of a coup attempt on Boehner, which could make things very interesting. As in: do Democrats and sane Republicans work together to keep Boehner as speaker?

The problem is that there is No One Else. That's one of the reasons why the coup against Boehner earlier this year failed. You need a majority to replace the speaker of the house and there's nobody that has the full support of the majority of Congresscritters. The moderate Republicans wouldn't vote\support a Tea Party leader and the Tea Party is already fed up with Boenher enough as it is.

If the Democrats support Boehner then they would require an end of the Hastert rule and Democratic bills being brought to the floor. Which is political suicide for Boehner, he'd be primaried so hard his head would spin. If moderate Republicans did the same and sided with a Democratic Speaker then that'd be the end of them being Republicans.

I wouldn't be surprised if there is another Coup attempt but Heck if I know who would replace him or how it would shake up.

 

[MooseNSquirrel]

Republicans are willing to fund those employees. Obama and Senate Dems are not.

As for the park ranger, his "I'm not ashamed" is what gets me. He may be doing his job because someone higher up wanted to cause veterans pain out of spite, but you'd think he'd be ashamed of doing so.

Some people mentioned how Republicans are starting to cave or are fighting each other. There's 25 or so Democrats in the House that have been voting with the Republicans. I think the Democrats are cracking more than Republicans are. Harry Reid's temper tantrum at Dana Bash yesterday is one example.

I think the longer this goes on, the worse Democrats look. You can't be the leader of the free world but refuse to even pretend to lead without eventually taking some grief for it.

The House keeps passing funding bills and have given options to compromise, but Reid and Obama just say no no no while also doing and saying some very spiteful things. I don't think even the leftist media can defend them on that forever.


Democrats didn't want any teamwork when passing it. They sure wouldn't want any teamwork to fix it.

Democrats also wouldn't want any teamwork to fix it because apparently they think there's nothing wrong with it.

I love cognitive dissonance, it brings out the best mental gymnastics people go through to convince themselves they are right.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affordable_Care_Act#Legislative_history

A gentle reminder:

1. one party has lost two presidential elections and a Supreme Court case AND two Senate elections

2. Despite this, it believes it has the right to shut down the entire government and destroy the full faith and credit of the United States Treasury to get its way on universal healthcare

3. Thinks its representing the will of the people.

4. An important faction of said party is dedicated to the belief that no government is the best government and are unwilling to compromise on anything, in other words....govern.


Cheers

 

[Doc Savage Fan]

LOL

 

[nageov3t]

seems like no one really knows why some .gov websites were taken offline entirely while others are online but not being actively updated/managed. (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...rns-off-entire-website-claiming-shutdown-woes)

 

[fskimospy]

LOL

Jon Stewart had some pretty good insight on this:

If it turns out that President Barack Obama can make a deal with the most intransigent, hardline, unreasonable, totalitarian mullahs in the world, but not with Republicans, maybe he’s not the problem.

 

[First]

seems like no one really knows why some .gov websites were taken offline entirely while others are online but not being actively updated/managed. (http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-brief...rns-off-entire-website-claiming-shutdown-woes)

CoveredCa.com works great. I can apply and log on.

 

[TerryMathews]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/10/04/blue-ridge-parkway-pisgah-inn/2923169/

Anyone want to try to defend the government's actions here? Seems to be a pretty clear cut example of "Make it hurt." Amirite?

 

[Fern]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/10/04/blue-ridge-parkway-pisgah-inn/2923169/

Anyone want to try to defend the government's actions here? Seems to be a pretty clear cut example of "Make it hurt." Amirite?

This is where I live. The shutdown has been all over the news down here and people are angry.

Fern

 

[IronWing]

Maybe we can confiscate Eric Cantor's hair coloring until this is resolved.

 

[Bitek]

He's a classy guy and a birther to boot

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0310/34816.html

...and from Texas too...

 

[K1052]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/10/04/blue-ridge-parkway-pisgah-inn/2923169/

Anyone want to try to defend the government's actions here? Seems to be a pretty clear cut example of "Make it hurt." Amirite?

I would think such a contingency is clearly spelled out in the lease of said building that is on federal land.

 

[dainthomas]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/10/04/blue-ridge-parkway-pisgah-inn/2923169/

Anyone want to try to defend the government's actions here? Seems to be a pretty clear cut example of "Make it hurt." Amirite?

Maybe because contracted vendors in other parks (with gates) could bitch if they let this guy stay open and they couldn't. Or maybe they're being tools, who knows.

 

[Fern]

Maybe because contracted vendors in other parks (with gates) could bitch if they let this guy stay open and they couldn't. Or maybe they're being tools, who knows.

They're being tools; they want the shutdown to be as public and as disruptive as possible.

The odd thing to me is that the inn sits within the Blue Ridge Parkway which is a national park and does have gates.

But this is just but one example of the fed govt shutting down something where there is no legitimate need such as lack of funding etc.

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/l...wn-May-Halt-Fords-Theatre-Play-226107331.html

Ford's Theatre canceled its performances of "The Laramie Project'' at the historic site through Sunday because of the government shutdown but has found other sites for performances.

Theater officials had planned to go ahead with evening performances because the programing is funded privately and run by a nonprofit group. However, the theater where President Abraham Lincoln was assassinated is a National Park Service site.

On Tuesday, the park service notified theater officials they would not be able to hold evening performances in the theater.

Fern

 

[Bitek]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/10/04/blue-ridge-parkway-pisgah-inn/2923169/

Anyone want to try to defend the government's actions here? Seems to be a pretty clear cut example of "Make it hurt." Amirite?

This is on federal land? And the federal govt is shutdown? Seems pretty straight forward.

Does is suck? Yes, and for many others as well. It fine to bitch about little pet projects, but why should anyone get special treatment?

My cousins husband is furloughed and not receiving pay. He has 5 kids, one two weeks old. He doesn't have some vast savings to tap into. Not employed at some highly public dept, so no one is grandstanding for him.

I work in the medical industry. We need the FDA open. We are awaiting several key approvals for a major product launch. Our facility expansion is halted awaiting approval. Our lost capacity will quickly turn into delays.

Can someone come grandstand for us?

Lots of stories like this and the GOP wants to window dress. Fix all of it by opening the whole govt.

 

[TerryMathews]

I would think such a contingency is clearly spelled out in the lease of said building that is on federal land.

Thats not defending it. "They have a right to" isn't flying regarding Republicans and the budget, why are you willing to accept it here?

Maybe because contracted vendors in other parks (with gates) could bitch if they let this guy stay open and they couldn't. Or maybe they're being tools, who knows.

I would let them bitch. Different circumstances. There is no logistical reason for this guy to close.

 

[TerryMathews]

This is on federal land? And the federal govt is shutdown? Seems pretty straight forward.

Does is suck? Yes, and for many others as well. It fine to bitch about little pet projects, but why should anyone get special treatment?

My cousins husband is furloughed and not receiving pay. He has 5 kids, one two weeks old. He doesn't have some vast savings to tap into. Not employed at some highly public dept, so no one is grandstanding for him.

I work in the medical industry. We need the FDA open. We are awaiting several key approvals for a major product launch. Our facility expansion is halted awaiting approval. Our lost capacity will quickly turn into delays.

Can someone come grandstand for us?

Lots of stories like this and the GOP wants to window dress. Fix all of it by opening the whole govt.

Do you not see that the government, in all of these situations, is expending money to prove a point?

Glad to know you subscribe to the "my life sucks, yours needs to too" method of governance.

 

[Fern]

This is on federal land? And the federal govt is shutdown? Seems pretty straight forward.
-snip-

The so-called shutdown isn't an order or law requiring the govt to "shutdown". It's about a lack of funds that compels fed offices to send about 20% of workers home.

In these examples (Pisgah Inn and Ford Theater) there is no funding problem. They require no federal funds. Shutting them saves no money, leaving them open costs no money. So, there is no valid reason to force them to shutdown. They are being forced to shutdown because of political theater.

Fern

 

[First]

Thats not defending it. "They have a right to" isn't flying regarding Republicans and the budget, why are you willing to accept it here?

I would let them bitch. Different circumstances. There is no logistical reason for this guy to close.

Like a lot of things in life, you really don't know enough about the details. His deed could easily stipulate a condition for the land being conveyed to him, such as weather conditions or even specifically shutdowns themselves. Very typical of federal land grants.