What is the NRA about?

[Bitek]

Can you imagine a black/latino urban gun rights group?
Instead of hillbilly motifs you get gansta imagery?

N.W.Assault rifles?

I would love the see the reaction of the peeps in the ad in OP when they lobby for concealed carry and silencers.

 

[zinfamous]

National Fireamrs Act of 1934 - Dem President, with a Dem majority House and Senate (73rd Congress)

Firearms act of 1938 - Dem President with a Dem majority House and Senate (75th Congress)

Gun Control Act of 1964 - Dem President with a Dem majority House and Senate (90th Congress)

Brady Bill 1994 - Dem President with a Dem majority House and Senate (103rd Congress - though this also has ties to anti-gun Ronald Reagan. A tax and spend debt-doubling president that was anti-2A, not sure why conservatives worship the guy so much to be honest... but I digress)

And people wonder why the NRA has become a right-leaning overly aggressive group? I hate what the NRA has become, but make no mistake, the left helped create that.

*edit - Do want to add that the right's hysteria over Obama was very much an overreaction. Agree there.

...and what organization sponsored those acts in 1938 and 1964, including drafting the Act in 1934 for Roosevelt, that was passed in 1938?

That's right, The NRA
http://time.com/4431356/nra-gun-control-history/

So, are we suggesting that today's NRA is glossing over their actual history of giving birth to gun control, blaming it all on the dems, and hoping the rubes will open wide and swallow (preferably cash only)?

No no, please not that NRA!

 

[Jhhnn]

...and what organization sponsored those acts in 1938 and 1964, including drafting the Act in 1934 for Roosevelt, that was passed in 1938?

That's right, The NRA
http://time.com/4431356/nra-gun-control-history/

So, are we suggesting that today's NRA is glossing over their actual history of giving birth to gun control, blaming it all on the dems, and hoping the rubes will open wide and swallow (preferably cash only)?

No no, please not that NRA!

Linked in that story-

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box...eader-clinton-court-means-your-right-to-own-a

Nobody fear mongers like the NRA.

 

[zinfamous]

Linked in that story-

http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box...eader-clinton-court-means-your-right-to-own-a

Nobody fear mongers like the NRA.

yeah, that kind of thing works on true idiots. Just look at this thread: plenty here believe that Cox was and is completely correct in that statement. LoL. It would be unimaginable if we were talking about people, but this is GOP voters. Some of the worst humans to populate this country.

 

[thraashman]

The NRA is the marketing and lobbying arm of the gun industry vis a vis redneck culture.

They don't actually give that much of a shit about the Constitution, other than using it to create markets for their products.

They don't care about non-rednecks otherwise they would cater towards urban and liberal gun owners, of which there are many.

It's rather a strange mission they have, constantly enflaming one set of customers by demonization of another.

If their primary mission is 2A, they are doing it wrong by being so partisan.

Your urban and liberal gun owners will buy one or two guns usually. Once they've bought them, it's hard to market to them to buy more. The rednecks and rightwing fanatics however are easy to convince they have to buy more and more and more or the evil left will take their guns and those dangerous minorities are someone you'll have to be armed to the teeth to fight off! It's like marketing a burger. You don't market the burger to the health nut who might eat one a month, you market it to the overweight glutton who'll buy 3 a day. You know he doesn't need it, you know it's probably not safe for him to have so much, and the odds are you'll contribute to his death, but it's making money! Same thing for the NRA. They don't care that their rhetoric contributes to gun violence and deaths, it sells more guns.

 

[TheVrolok]

I actually finally watched the video...Holy fuck.

 

[jackstar7]

yeah, that kind of thing works on true idiots. Just look at this thread: plenty here believe that Cox was and is completely correct in that statement. LoL. It would be unimaginable if we were talking about people, but this is GOP voters. Some of the worst humans to populate this country.

It's sad that Eric Trump lowered the level of debate to this back and forth de-humanization.

 

[imported_tajmahal]

Only a semi-related article by the Atlantic.
https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/07/liberal-fever-swamps/530736/

yeah, that kind of thing works on true idiots. Just look at this thread: plenty here believe that Cox was and is completely correct in that statement. LoL. It would be unimaginable if we were talking about people, but this is GOP voters. Some of the worst humans to populate this country.

 

[shortylickens]

It's sad that Eric Trump lowered the level of debate to this back and forth de-humanization.

It was NOT Eric Trump. The level of debate descended slowly since the fucking seventies. He's not even the finest example of our current status. His father and the White House staff are the real monsters.

 

[SlowSpyder]

No, I made my point succinctly and clearly. Show me where someone has taken a bottle of booze into a workplace and murdered people with that bottle of booze or into a crowded market. I completely understand what can happen to a person when they drink alcohol, and how their behaviour can become uncontrollable, and at times dangerous, but that's not really what we're discussing.
What if anything can be done to prevent these shootings?
No to a national background check
No to a registry of handguns
No to certain mentally ill people barred from owning a gun
etc..
What compromise are the gun owners willing to make? We've compromised our safety and security, it's your turn to compromise.

So again, you are holding guns to a different and higher standard than things that kill far more people. This is why the NRA exists and has become what it is today. I think even one homicide, gun or otherwise, is too much. What can we do to try and fix that while preserving our rights? That is what you are consistently missing here. Nothing happens in a vacuum. Examples I've given are rights we have that can cause harm if used without care or with evil intent in some cases. I don't think the answer in America is to keep whittling away the right to save lives. The more I hear some of you on this board, the standard you want guns to be held to and your desire for do-nothing feel good laws that don't help the problem, the more I understand why the NRA is what it is today. Stand proud, you've in no small part help earn the NRA we have currently.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Can you imagine a black/latino urban gun rights group?
Instead of hillbilly motifs you get gansta imagery?

N.W.Assault rifles?

I would love the see the reaction of the peeps in the ad in OP when they lobby for concealed carry and silencers.

Personally I think that'd be fantastic. I was happy to hear that after the Trump win and instances like the Pulse Nightclub shooting some minority demographics are embracing their right to bear arms more than in the past. That's great.

 

[SlowSpyder]

...and what organization sponsored those acts in 1938 and 1964, including drafting the Act in 1934 for Roosevelt, that was passed in 1938?

That's right, The NRA
http://time.com/4431356/nra-gun-control-history/

So, are we suggesting that today's NRA is glossing over their actual history of giving birth to gun control, blaming it all on the dems, and hoping the rubes will open wide and swallow (preferably cash only)?

No no, please not that NRA!

And again I'll say, as I have since the beginning of this thread, I'm not an NRA fan. They follow money more than principle. Wanting to preserve the 2A and supporting the NRA are not the same thing.

 

[soundforbjt]

So again, you are holding guns to a different and higher standard than things that kill far more people. This is why the NRA exists and has become what it is today. I think even one homicide, gun or otherwise, is too much. What can we do to try and fix that while preserving our rights? That is what you are consistently missing here. Nothing happens in a vacuum. Examples I've given are rights we have that can cause harm if used without care or with evil intent in some cases. I don't think the answer in America is to keep whittling away the right to save lives. The more I hear some of you on this board, the standard you want guns to be held to and your desire for do-nothing feel good laws that don't help the problem, the more I understand why the NRA is what it is today. Stand proud, you've in no small part help earn the NRA we have currently.

I believe you used cars as an example of an object/tool that kills more than guns. Cars are used everyday 24/7 by way more people. If the same amount of people were using guns everyday 24/7, we'd probably have way more deaths. A gun's sole purpose is to kill. A car's is to transport people and goods.

 

[SlowSpyder]

I believe you used cars as an example of an object/tool that kills more than guns. Cars are used everyday 24/7 by way more people. If the same amount of people were using guns everyday 24/7, we'd probably have way more deaths. A gun's sole purpose is to kill. A car's is to transport people and goods.

I didn't compare guns to cars-in-general for exactly the reason you cite, its not a good comparison. I did mention in the context of limiting freedom to save lives, the idea of limiting car horse power, liquor strength, skateboarding, etc.

 

[soundforbjt]

I didn't compare guns to cars-in-general for exactly the reason you cite, its not a good comparison. I did mention in the context of limiting freedom to save lives, the idea of limiting car horse power, liquor strength, skateboarding, etc.

Sorry, I was just skimming the post. You were referring about mag size in comparison to horsepower, etc ? I can see you point but just because a military version has a large mag doesn't mean their civilian counterparts should as well. The larger mag for military use was designed strictly as maximum killing capacity within the limits of the firearm without the jamming issues. Horsepower in a car is not for that purpose. Still a bad comparison.

 

[Jhhnn]

Personally I think that'd be fantastic. I was happy to hear that after the Trump win and instances like the Pulse Nightclub shooting some minority demographics are embracing their right to bear arms more than in the past. That's great.

Yeh, White Supremacists get a little closer to the Race war they've always wanted.

 

[jackstar7]

It was NOT Eric Trump. The level of debate descended slowly since the fucking seventies. He's not even the finest example of our current status. His father and the White House staff are the real monsters.

I guess I needed some kind of emoji in there...

 

[jackstar7]

So again, you are holding guns to a different and higher standard than things that kill far more people. This is why the NRA exists and has become what it is today. I think even one homicide, gun or otherwise, is too much. What can we do to try and fix that while preserving our rights? That is what you are consistently missing here. Nothing happens in a vacuum. Examples I've given are rights we have that can cause harm if used without care or with evil intent in some cases. I don't think the answer in America is to keep whittling away the right to save lives. The more I hear some of you on this board, the standard you want guns to be held to and your desire for do-nothing feel good laws that don't help the problem, the more I understand why the NRA is what it is today. Stand proud, you've in no small part help earn the NRA we have currently.

The standard should be higher. Guns are enumerated singularly in an amendment to the Constitution. I think that raises the bar right there.

 

[SlowSpyder]

Sorry, I was just skimming the post. You were referring about mag size in comparison to horsepower, etc ? I can see you point but just because a military version has a large mag doesn't mean their civilian counterparts should as well. The larger mag for military use was designed strictly as maximum killing capacity within the limits of the firearm without the jamming issues. Horsepower in a car is not for that purpose. Still a bad comparison.

Do you think those kids in Sandy Hook would have had a chance if the shooter had to reload once more? I get the above clip is an extreme, but still, capacity limits are a silly limitation that is easily overcome by carrying more magazines and weapons. Sure, that extra pause could in some rare situation help the outcome, but I bet you're about as likely to win $100 on a scratch off as often. How much of my (and your) 2A right should be whittled away for something that has consistently before, and will likely again, amount to no real tangible difference in shooting deaths? This is what I mean when I say a feel-good do-nothing law. And its why an overly reactive right sees it as an encroachment on something they value, and you know how they react to such things... depending on your point of view, directly or indirectly, the left has helped build the NRA we have today through their nonsensical pushes towards silly limits on the 2nd.

 

[Commodus]

Do you think those kids in Sandy Hook would have had a chance if the shooter had to reload once more? I get the above clip is an extreme, but still, capacity limits are a silly limitation that is easily overcome by carrying more magazines and weapons. Sure, that extra pause could in some rare situation help the outcome, but I bet you're about as likely to win $100 on a scratch off as often. How much of my (and your) 2A right should be whittled away for something that has consistently before, and will likely again, amount to no real tangible difference in shooting deaths? This is what I mean when I say a feel-good do-nothing law. And its why an overly reactive right sees it as an encroachment on something they value, and you know how they react to such things... depending on your point of view, directly or indirectly, the left has helped build the NRA we have today through their nonsensical pushes towards silly limits on the 2nd.

The question is: what's nonsensical? The big issue with the NRA and its apologists are that they believe virtually any gun is right, and any purchasing/ownership restriction is wrong. How do you reason with someone who has no qualms with selling firearms to people who are clearly mentally ill or have violent criminal histories? There's a common ground to be had, but it's hard to reach that middle space with people who think even basic regulation is the first step toward mass confiscation.

 

[Jhhnn]

I get the above clip is an extreme, but still, capacity limits are a silly limitation that is easily overcome by carrying more magazines and weapons.

The US military sees it differently.

 

[SlowSpyder]

The question is: what's nonsensical? The big issue with the NRA and its apologists are that they believe virtually any gun is right, and any purchasing/ownership restriction is wrong. How do you reason with someone who has no qualms with selling firearms to people who are clearly mentally ill or have violent criminal histories? There's a common ground to be had, but it's hard to reach that middle space with people who think even basic regulation is the first step toward mass confiscation.

I don't think anyone wants someone with a real mental illness or with violent histories to buy guns. But I understand why 2A supporters feel that due process needs to be followed before you limit someone one's constitutional rights.

Can you point to any real world practical benefit of magazine capacity limits having a tangible benefit in reducing gun deaths?

 

[SlowSpyder]

The US military sees it differently.

Of course the more you can shoot without reloading the better, its less time you spend having a non-operational gun. But the targets the military faces and a mass shooter face are very different, and it kind of minimizes the point of a magazine capacity limit. More often than not, the mass shooter's victims aren't firing back.

 

[zzyzxroad]

Are there a lot of people on this forum who think the second amendment should be revoked? I bet we could all agree on a basic national standard and then let each state/city come up with further regulations based on a consensus from that region.

 

[shortylickens]

The Virginia Tech shooter killed a fuckload of people, with a .22.

And it only holds 10 rounds.

Quit banning guns. Quit banning magazines. It doesnt matter. Its not why people die.
People die because theres a shitload of anger and fear in the world and sometimes one of them cracks like an egg. THATS what you need to deal with.